Mini 2237: Scarlet Witch Alternate Reality Mafia - Game Over

[mastina]

Hi folks! I was on my way to be a responsible adult and look up the information for my interview tomorrow but then I noticed a PM which said this game was starting which meant I got an excuse to procrastinate!

Quick! Let's put NM on E-1 so he will selfhammer!
VOTE: Not_Mafia

Town.

VOTE: Not_Mafia

Town?

Yay town PM, I get to actually enjoy the theme of the game this time.
VOTE: Cyrus

Scum?

this is scarlet witch alternate reality mafea
VOTE: roden
hi bb

Scum.

VOTE: Shrek.

[mastina]

Also, have a readslist.

Enchant

Not_Mafia

T3
cyrus62

CheekyTeeky
Guillotina
Galron

Zyla
MegAzumarill
Hiraki

Roden

Shrek

Town townread lean town nulltown null scumread/scumlean scum.

[mastina]

VOTE: Shrek
I hardclaim mason.

As a mason myself of a different kind I believe this.

Why is T3 null town?

Honestly? Pure gut. I just have a

feeling

.

Like.

I looked at the playerlist.

And just

felt

that T3 and cyrus would be town. Psychic reading. Instinct. Vision of the future. Prophecy. Call it whatever you like. I just had a

feeling

that T3 and cyrus would be town this game. I don't know why I have that feeling, but it is there INCREDIBLY strongly. Got no proof, no reason, nothing but pure sheer strong feelings that somehow some way T3 and cyrus will both be town here.

Plus I like to have bragging rights on calling people town correctly before they've even posted.
I feel I'll be able to read cyrus and T3 when they post so even if I didn't

feel

they were town, statistically speaking they're more likely to be town and I sound smarter if I call it before they even post.

Speaking of the readslist tho:
CheekyTeeky
Enchant

Not_Mafia

T3
cyrus62

Guillotina
Galron

Zyla
MegAzumarill
Hiraki

Roden

Shrek

Updated readslist.

[mastina]

Why NM is town for post he does every game?

Because gut.

I realize the post was NAI.

By my instincts, I felt that though it was NAI, Not_Mafia happens to be town this game. I don't really have a clue on what precisely gave me that feeling. General vibe, maybe. But it felt like this wasn't N_M as scum for some reason.

[mastina]

CheekyTeeky
Enchant

Not_Mafia

T3
cyrus62

Guillotina
Galron

Zyla
MegAzumarill
Hiraki

Roden
Shrek

Thinking about it, I'd actually put Roden on the same tier of scum as Shrek. Maybe, possibly, even more scum but not sure about that. I genuinely don't think this is the same Roden I've seen before when Roden was town. Admittedly, sample size is small, and game is in its infancy, so I could be wrong but for page two reads you gotta cut me at least

some

slack.

So I think I'm comfortable, with what I've seen, calling Roden a proper scumread here.

[mastina]

Oh, I think I get it >.>

Well I

am

town and I

have

already breadcrumbed my role but I would genuinely be legit impressed if you did in fact get it as whatever you think you got is like...98% likely to be wrong.

(Obviously best for you to not say what you think you got tho. I'm just letting you know that I'm giving ya only a 2% chance at having guessed it right since this is a role I don't feel the need to heavily breadcrumb.)

I don't really understand, because it's same message and how you feel differently from it.

I mean, neither do I. I don't understand why I get the gut vibes that I do, if I did I wouldn't call them gut vibes. They're obviously subject to change past the RVS but I'll take gut vibes in the rvs over nothing in the rvs, so. Is at least a decent way to get us beyond the rvs quickly. Ya take what you can get.

Shrek already giving off a totally different vibe from last game where he was a slimey scumbutt.

I mean I've not seen Shrek before but Shrek looks like a slimey scumbutt to me

here

. I'll take your word for it tho and do this though;
VOTE: Roden
For a similar single-game sample size in that Roden feels totally different in vibe to me already from Chrono Trigger where Roden was town.

[mastina]

Dammit I want to vote mastina again _-_ lol

I mean, I'd be happy to get voted. Makes for good content, I'm confident it won't stick (no threat of me being eliminated), but if people were suspicious of me, it'd mean scum were less likely to kill me (as much of an honor as being killed early is and how much I like being killed early when I'm not confident in my abilities to nail the scum, currently I feel like early deaths for me are a waste), allowing me to catch them more reliably. (I do my best work when scum think they can eliminate me and let me decimate them circa D3. )

Alas, I fear I may have gotten into the game too early and as a consequence, gotten too transparently town too soon.

Now I'll need to rely on, like, I dunno...later paranoia of me being scum who obvtowned early but fell off a cliff, in order to get that effect. (Who knows, I've got a lot of shit coming up in life and my current good mental health could take a nosedive. If I'm absent for like two days due to rl kicking my ass that might be enough to spur suspicion on my slot.)

[mastina]

So how are you going to believe me at the end of the game when I'm like, I knew it!

Write it down, PM the mod, have a notes PT, etc., and then you can point to it.

I would genuinely be massively impressed, respectful, and in awe of you if you managed to pull it off.

Are you really gonna reference the game where I dunked you after fighting off scum reads from an imploding town all game...?

I mean that's my baseline for you, soooo...yes?

[mastina]

T3 are you not town

Though possible from the somewhat-weak opening, I want to give it time, as 45 is a promising potential sign of T3 being town.

It's obviously very early. And T3 takes a fair amount of time to read, so it's too early to tell for sure. But what I've seen

so far

seems to be a promising trajectory towards T3 being town.

[mastina]

CheekyTeeky
T3

Enchant
Not_Mafia

cyrus62

Guillotina
Galron

Zyla
MegAzumarill
Hiraki

Shrek
Roden

I think I like this for a readslist better right now.

[mastina]

Are you really gonna reference the game where I dunked you after fighting off scum reads from an imploding town all game...?

I mean that's my baseline for you, soooo...yes?

I should be lock town then since I'm not playing any different.

Btw I realize two different games are different and the span of time for comparison is incredibly limited (I've got to compare like first 24 hours and first 3 pages, no more), but to my vibecheck this didn't pass as the play here

feels

different from the play in Chrono Trigger.

[mastina]

How so?

Well, 80% gut vibes but the 20% left I could provide an attempt at explaining, but respectfully, this early, if I explained what felt different, if I was right about you being scum, it'd be easier for you to try and fix it.

If you're town me holding my tongue does no harm since you'd show the townness eventually but if you're scum holding my tongue could make the differences more pronounced with time.

[mastina]

Not gonna lie, it only took a day and a half of me not posting here when I was active in the RVS for me to kinda disassociate with the game. So is a bit of a struggle to really lock things down.

i feel like mistina's reads are to bait out scums poor reactions to it tbh, not actually serious

My reads are always serious!
I have methodology for them, which is why I can even separate out players who haven't posted into different alignment tiers, based off of this methodology. It's an actual pseudoscience, one I've developed over my career and it is 100% dead serious.
I may on occasion exaggerate and all those reads are explicitly RVS reads subject to change after the RVS but I'm never outright lying about them. (Well, 95% of the time anyway. Some slots I may put as a policy-townread in spite of not townreading them, due to policy. Which is a lie of omission I guess, but that's legit the entirety of the remaining 5%.)

That said, yes, the goal of it is explicitly to get reactions.

The two are not mutually exclusive tho; it can be for reactions and still be serious.

Mastina knows how I like my hot chocolate. So she's town.

I shouldn't elaborate but I genuinely think this is town.

Thank you Mastina!

You're welcome, although I wish I could benefit from having done what I did with a clear idea of who's town/scum here--for instance, I think this is my third game with you and the third playstyle I've seen from you, when both prior games were scumgames with both having different styles from each other. So I can't tell if you're town yet. Sorry.

(I'll figure it out eventually, give me some time to reassociate, refocus, re-lock-in.)

VOTE: t3 I think t3 is scum here he's already making excuse to scum read people but enchant could also be scum. Hoping for a flash elemation.

I'm not 100% sure but btw I'm

pretty

sure cyrus is town here. I'm not absolutely positive but I think this is his towngame.

[mastina]

i also really like guillotina and potentially cheeky for town. neutral on enchant and t3 atm

For the record, while I'm struggling to lock down Shrek as town/scum here, I can say that Shrek at least is feeling better to me. No longer looks like scum, and is gun-to-my-head town.

I still feel like my townread on Cheeky holds as good, so given the Cheeky townread + cyrus townread + NM townread still holding + feeling Shrek is north of null, prolly can make another readslist.

Galron*
CheekyTeeky

cyrus62
Not_Mafia

T3
Enchant

Shrek

Guillotina
MegAzumarill

Zyla
Hiraki

Roden

*Relies on me being right about an assumption of mine that I don't want to elaborate on because I genuinely feel it'd be antitown to do so.

This doesn't feel good to me, but is currently:
Strong-town
Town-but-not-absolute
Previously-strong-town-less-sure-now
Lean-town
Null-positive
Null-negative
Scum.

As of bottom of page 4. Still working on it tho.

[mastina]

I... don't really know what *counts* as town as far as characters go

Ditto. I feel like this might be a bit of a mistake to reveal but I'm actually not familiar with the source material as my family does not have access to any platform Wandavision is on. I'm familiar with

my

character as I looked her up before I even got my role PM for ~reasons~ (circa 2-3 days before I got my role PM due to [redacted to not give it away]), but I don't actually know much about the source material. I have watched almost every MCU film and watched Agents of Shield start to finish and got to see the first season of Agent Carter as well as like half of season 2 for that show and I periodically look up things about other MCU things I don't have the knowledge on but I don't know as much about Wandavision as I should. (I only joined the game because I was invited to join the game.)

Also, scum probably have town-sounding fakeclaims anyway.

RE: Zyla: not getting a lock on alignment either way yet.

ego post - how are we at 5 pages?

I will say that Hiraki has a decent chance of being scum here though. (This is an easier post to quote than 111 but the sentiment remains.)

[mastina]

I feel like scum Galron would ask more questions to appear like he's posting content from looking at his ISO in Radio Buzz [towngame] and Calculasia [scumgame].

Weirdly enough my vibes from T3 is that he's telling the truth about all his reads and that they are mostly good regardless of his alignment but in spite of him having truthful, good reads, I'm not sure he's town.

[mastina]

It's because he's third party and he knows you're scum.

This is probably scum btw.

Yup

Wait that actually makes so much sense, then.

Galron*
CheekyTeeky

cyrus62
Not_Mafia

T3
Enchant

Shrek

Guillotina
MegAzumarill

Zyla
Hiraki

Roden

*Relies on me being right about an assumption of mine that I don't want to elaborate on because I genuinely feel it'd be antitown to do so.

Galron*, CheekyTeeky, cyrus, and Not_Mafia would remain as town, here, with Shrek having a decent chance of being town as well.

Which would leave 2:2 (presumably) or small chance of 2:3/3:3 (less likely) within:
{T3, Enchant, Guillotina, MegAzumarill, Zyla, Hiraki, Roden}.
7 names is 1-3 too many but by weak vibes I don't feel like Meg's scum here with anyone so that'd be 4-6 scum in the 6 names remaining:
{T3, Enchant, Guillotina, Zyla, Hiraki, Roden}.

We can even work it further down.

Roden:

Guillotina, T3

Guillotina and T3 wouldn't be partnered with Roden.

IF RODEN IS SCUM: that limits Roden-buddies to {Zyla, Hiraki, Enchant}.
IF RODEN IS SCUM: the other team PROBABALY has AT LEAST one of {Guillotina, T3} on it but this is not definitive, with the second likely from the above. (The other scumteam COULD be Zyla+Hiraki with Enchant as Roden's scumbuddy, or Zyla+Enchant with Hiraki as Roden's scumbuddy, but I find these less likely than at least one of Guillotina/T3 being scum.)
IF RODEN IS NOT SCUM: give me time, still working on it.

IF HIRAKI IS SCUM: Hiraki's buddies are limited to {Roden, Zyla, Guillotina, T3} due to Hiraki's Enchant push.
IF HIRAKI IS NOT SCUM: give me time, still working on it.

Given the Roden-Hiraki stuff, I feel like we've got:
1-2 scum of one team in {Roden, Hiraki}
1-2 scum of the other team in {Guillotina, T3}
Enchant can be scum with any of Roden/Guillotina/T3;
Zyla can be scum with anyone right now;
Guillotina/T3 can be scum with any of {each other, Enchant, Hiraki, Zyla}.

But these are just from where I am in the thread right now; I can probably narrow it down even further once caught up.

I feel like the game's actually a lot more makes-sense with this reveal. And is actually easier to solve.

Sure, scum can genuinely scumhunt but I feel like there are slots that are just town and by looking at the slots that aren't just town, we can have a workable poe as to who is likely scum and with who.

[mastina]

VOTE: T3

For the record, this pushes me to:
RODEN IS NOT SCUM WITH: T3, Guillotina
GUILLOTINA IS NOT SCUM WITH: T3, Roden
T3 IS NOT SCUM WITH: Guillotina, Roden

Given this, at least one of them is town no matter what but I can see any of them being scum and I still think 2/3 of them are. (It's possible it's only 1/3 but that requires the scumteams to be {Hiraki + 1} {Enchant +1} with one of the +1s being the 1 scum and the other being Zyla.)

[mastina]

Who else doesn't know this is multiball? Legitimate question.

I didn't. I didn't read the signup because I signed up due to being invited and I didn't read the OP, I just kinda assumed it was a standard mini theme.

I believe I saw aa9 ask somewhere about 9:2:2 multiballs.

I also vaguely recall that, tho I wouldn't know from where.

[mastina]

what if i told you that i wouldn't mind a roden elim?

Well I'll believe it when I see a very obvious push on Roden that is committed to which you don't back out of--now that it's known that it's multiball and it's known who I have in my POE pool, I can't trust votes/pushes as much as I could prior to these, meaning distancing and even bussing is possible so long as it doesn't actually kill the partner.

However, I'll acknowledge there's a few less-likely scum pairings which aren't absolute but still less likely. I should've noted them at the time since refinding them is a bit harder but from a quick iso skim:
You-Roden is among them (the less likely but still possible teams).

Guillotina-You is one of the more probable ones.
T3-You is also one of the more probable ones.

So at this stage, I'd say:

Roden + Element, OR:
Roden + Zyla, OR:
Roden is town;

IF RODEN IS SCUM, OTHER TEAM:
T3 + Hiraki, OR:
T3 + Element (not possible if it's Roden + Element), OR:
T3 + Zyla (not possible if it's Roden + Zyla), OR:
Guillotina + Hiraki, OR:
Guillotina + Element (not possible if it's Roden + Element), OR:
Guillotina + Zyla (not possible if it's Roden + Zyla)

IF RODEN IS TOWN, FIRST TEAM:
T3 + Hiraki, OR:
T3 + Element, OR:
T3 + Zyra, OR:
Hiraki + Zyra

IF RODEN IS SCUM, SECOND TEAM:
Guillotina + Hiraki, OR:
Guillotina + Element, OR:
Guillotina + Zyra, OR:
Hiraki + Zyra

Pretty sure the key players this game whose flips blow the game wide open are {Roden, T3, Guillotina} with a side of Hiraki.

[mastina]

Guillo has no problem hard bussing team mates. You saw this first hand, Mastina.

Sure but that wasn't multiball.
This is.

Pre-multiball-reveal, I don't think scum bussed.
Post-multiball-reveal, they could, which is why future interactions are a lot less reliable than past ones pre-reveal of multiball, so long as they didn't actually end up on a final elimination wagon.

So I have fairly high faith that I'm in the right ballpark here.

[mastina]

At this stage I would unironically be okay with all of the main 3 and maybe Hiraki fullclaiming today.
Being all of {Roden, T3, Guillotina} fullciaming.

I realize that having three slots (maybe 4) fullclaim on D1 is unusual but this is a game with unusual circumstances. The multiball nature of the game + the prominence of those three (with the side of Hiraki) + the players who I feel are town no matter what narrows down things significantly enough that I genuinely feel it's worth it.

[mastina]

Wtf? HEY! In what world do you believe that im scum with Roden?

I don't? You're mutually exclusive with both Roden and T3.

I'm not following your progression on some of your reads mastina. Like, yes you're amazing, but I'm not as confident that we're at the stage we can PoE like that yet.

Well basically:

You are very very clearly town, here.

I have a suspicion on Galron which would make them town here if true--even without it being true, Galron looks town enough, doesn't look like scum with anyone, doesn't look like scum, so is probably town even if I wasn't right with my suspicion.

cyrus is very easy to read. There's one, maybe MAYBE two POSSIBLE flags to him POTENTIALLY being scum but I'm like 90% sure that this is him as town because he's not showing the markers I'd expect from him if he were scum and he IS showing the markers I'd expect if he were town. Beyond that, most slots in the game don't work well as scumbuddies with him, making it quite likely that he's town.

Not_Mafia in spite of what people seem to think about him isn't actually impossible to read; this actually

does

look like N_M's towngame here and N_M has similar vibes to cyrus and Galron: someone who doesn't look like scum with TMI, doesn't look like scum, doesn't have good scumbuddies, etc. It's not impossible for him to be scum but it's quite unlikely for him to be scum.

Shrek, wasn't it you who said this doesn't look like his scumgame? I wouldn't know that for sure, but his content looks town, it doesn't look like he's scum with TMI, and it doesn't look like he's scum with anyone as I struggle to make a scumteam with him on it.

MegAzumarill is a much weaker read, but vibewise overall feels more like town than not, and also doesn't seem to mesh well with being scum with anyone else. I can't really find a scumteam with Meg on it that makes a lot of sense.

And given that I am town, that gives us 7 names that aren't scum, which leaves us with 6 names who could be scum, in a setup that is likely 2:2 meaning 4/6 are scum and 2/6 are town.

T3-Guillotina interactions are clearly not partners.
T3-Roden interactions are clearly not partners.
Roden-Guillotina interactions are clearly not partners.
Roden-Hiraki, while not impossible, don't look like likely partners.
Hiraki pushed fairly hard on Element, and is thus not partners with Element.

Given the above, and given that the pool of possible scum is:
{Roden, T3, Guillotina, Hiraki, Element, Zyla}.

You can begin to extrapolate possible scumteams.

Each scumteam likely has precisely two members on it.

From there you factor in the interactions.

There cannot be 0 scum in {T3, Guillotina, Roden} because there's 6 scum candidates meaning in a 2:2 game we need 4 scum and thus there needs to be a minimum of 1 scum in that trio.

There cannot be 3 scum in {T3, Guillotina, Roden} because there's only going to be two scumteams (barring it being like 2:2:1 or 2:2:2 but if it's that much multiball we may as well just vote out everyone and hope/pray that they don't kill town and crosskill each other).

Meaning that {T3, Guillotina, Roden} has 1-2 scum.

If it is 1 scum in them, then with the other two as town, the scumteams must, by necessity, contain all of {Hiraki, Element, Zyla} with Hiraki and Element on opposite scumteams, with it being Hiraki + Zyla vs Element + the 1 scum in {T3, Guillotina, Roden}, OR: Hiraki + the 1 scum in {T3, Guillotina, Roden} vs. {Element, Zyla}.

If it is 2 scum in them, then with the third as town, the two scum by necessity are on opposite teams.
That's how you get:
{T3, Hiraki} vs. {Roden, Element}
{T3, Hiraki} vs. {Roden, Zyla}
{T3, Hiraki} vs. {Guillotina, Element}
{T3, Hiraki} vs. {Gullotina, Zyla}
{Guillotina, Hiraki} vs. {Roden, Element}
{Guillotina, Hiraki} vs. {Roden, Zyla}
{Gullotina, Hiraki} vs. {T3, Element}
{Guillotina, Hiraki} vs. {T3, Zyla}

Add in the earlier 1 scum instead of 2 scum combos:
{Hiraki, Zyla} vs. {Element, Guillotina}
{Hiraki, Zyla} vs. {Element, T3}
{Hiraki, Zyla} vs. {Element, Roden}
{Hiraki, Guillotina} vs. {Element, Zyla}
{Hiraki, T3} vs. {Element, Zyla}

That leaves us with 13 plausible-probable scumteam combinations.

Does that help?

[mastina]

What if you're scum?

Well I'm pretty damn transparently not since this is fairly obviously my towngame and it should be pretty damn apparently that, no, I did not know this was multiball (which I obviously would if I was on a scumteam without 3 members), but even if I faked that and even if it wasn't my towngame the moment I show my role off I'll be universally townread. (I shouldn't need to, as that's redundant given that this is my towngame and it should be apparent I didn't know it was multiball, but I DO have the, albeit should-be-redundant, trump card of my role which if the reasons for me being town aren't good enough would bail me out by proving that I'm town.)

[mastina]

Assuming you're town the best vote based on your teams would be Hiraki, I'm getting some aggro vibes from them which I think come from town.
The logic checks out but depends both on you being town and on your town reads being accurate. I think it's a good strat after N1 because we'll have a better idea on the set up and will have hopefully had some informative flips.

Oh wait I think I forgot a few teams, there's more than 13.
I realize every combo I listed had Hiraki in it but I forgot to include the ones which have him not there.

{T3, Hiraki} vs. {Roden, Element}
{T3, Hiraki} vs. {Roden, Zyla}
{T3, Hiraki} vs. {Guillotina, Element}
{T3, Hiraki} vs. {Gullotina, Zyla}
{T3, Zyla} vs. {Roden, Element}
{T3, Element} vs. {Roden, Zyla}
{T3, Zyla} vs. {Guillotina, Element}
{T3, Element} vs. {Gullotina, Zyla}
{Guillotina, Hiraki} vs. {Roden, Element}
{Guillotina, Hiraki} vs. {Roden, Zyla}
{Gullotina, Hiraki} vs. {T3, Element}
{Guillotina, Hiraki} vs. {T3, Zyla}
{Guillotina, Zyla} vs. {Roden, Element}
{Guillotina, Element} vs. {Roden, Zyla}

{Hiraki, Zyla} vs. {Element, Guillotina}
{Hiraki, Zyla} vs. {Element, T3}
{Hiraki, Zyla} vs. {Element, Roden}
{Hiraki, Guillotina} vs. {Element, Zyla}
{Hiraki, T3} vs. {Element, Zyla}

I think this is all of the non-redundant ones which brings it up to 19 total, if I'm not missing any or making a scumteam appear twice.

[mastina]

(Btw another reason you don't need to worry about me, CheekyTeeky: I am town here but even were I not I'd still be a juicy NK target. Given I AM town, that's doubly so. There's TWO teams that can shoot me rather than just one so I'm almost assuredly dead sooner rather than later because I'm probably one of the only players capable of doing that sort of extensive team breakdowns to solve the multiball equation.)

[mastina]

Wtf? HEY! In what world do you believe that im scum with Roden?

I don't? You're mutually exclusive with both Roden and T3.

That is even worse, I think both of them could be scum, associating me with them implies that I'm bussing my partners for no reason whatsoever. I've scum read them based on interactions with you and now YOU think I'm scum with them.

The Audacity!

Realtalk; are you reading what I am saying???

I said that you cannot be scum with T3.
I said that you cannot be scum with Roden.
You cannot be scum with either.
One of them being scum means that you cannot be on their scumteam.
One of them being scum means that you cannot be their partner.

However, this is multiball. Just because you're not scum with T3, and just because you're not scum with Roden, doesn't mean that you can't be scum.

You can be town!

If T3 and Roden both flipped scum, in fact, you'd be the hardest of hard clears.
But until such a time, you can still be scum. Just not WITH T3 or Roden.

(BTW phoneposting so forgive my slowness and bad formatting.)

[mastina]

Roden's claim feels believable? But also he's such a minor character, I could see that as one of scum's fakeclaims.

Ditto this.
Is more or less what I thought.

[mastina]

VOTE: mastina[/b]

answer my question and elaborate on your townread of galron

Respectfully, no.

Galron looks town enough to me even without my assumption. I see no need to out my assumption today.

[mastina]

Mastina what do you think about the role though?

Worthless if Wanda and Vision are town (why does a town role need to find town?), too OP if Wanda and Vision are scum (why would a town role be able to out an entire scumteam?).

So either way, makes nominally more sense as a scum role. I can SEE Rodens claim being town, but I think scum is overall more likely.

BTW, current feels:
2/3 scum in {Roden, T3, Guillotina},
Element scum,
Zyla scum.

[mastina]

I would have day vigged Roden after that self vote because that is a blatant manipulation action but then i remembered ive done it as town too, so i didnt pull the trigger.

is this a claim

What do you think?

I'm a LITTLE skeptical of a dayvig claim actually being town but I'm not above utilizing it.

If there is a Day Vig they 100% should shoot me here. I'd take that over a mis-elim.

I'm down for this as resolving how many scum and what type in Roden-Guillo-T3 is 100% the best possible thing which we could do in this game right now.

[mastina]

It does not end the day.

Well this would be a great way to resolve the Roden-T3-Guillotina trio.

Shoot Roden, eliminate T3, and that's 2/3 gone and flipped D1.

VOTE: T3

[mastina]

Mastina can you confirm whether 3p exists or is it 2 groupscum?

I've got no information about that in my role. Just the wincon of 'threats to the town eliminated', AA9 stating the game is multiball, and vague memory of AA asking about balancing a 9:2:2 multiball at some reasonably recent point in the past. All things available to everyone.

[mastina]

VOTE: Roden
I retract my claim, im not a vig.

Siiiiighhhh.
VOTE: Roden

[mastina]

VOTE: cyrus
Enchant is town. I will elaborate on this later but we should not lim Enchant.

Color me skeptical.

VOTE: T3

And wanting this instead.

Roden wanted this;
Guillotina wanted this;
T3's opening this day phase was incredibly sketchy;
I'm incredibly skeptical of this "do not lim Enchant" claim.

So I prefer doing this.

[mastina]

tbh why dont we look at galron? only reason nobody is looking at him is because mastina has a "HUNCH" she never explained on him

Well my explanation for this, is:

I have an inno on mastina.

I believe this.

OHHH you shouldve said masons from the start

We're not masons tho. Heck I don't even have a PT with Galron. But I believe that, given my role, it is actually incredibly likely that there could be a role who knows I am town and that the player holding that role is more likely to be town.

Galron is not locktown for this; whatever Galron's role is, it

could

be scum, but I think it

more likely

that Galron is town, here, who legitimately/genuinely knows me to be town.

[mastina]

@zyla who do you think is scum besides cyrus? so far all youve done is pick on him

Top 3 apart from Cyrus would probably be NM, Enchant, and T3

Add in Zyla and you get mine, as at this point I think all four scum should be in those five. (I no longer think Hiraki is scum here.)

[mastina]

actually wait what am i saying t3 is just lurking out of pressure which is his classic scumtell
VOTE: T3

This is very valid. Add to it this:

T3 are you not town

That does nothing to convince me you're making actual reads lol

VOTE: Roden
From an objective standpoint what mastina is doing makes no sense. The way you're gunning for mastina feels like you want to get an ez mislim.

You've seen my scum games more than anyone else, you should know I don't push ez mis-elims D1, I save them for later lol.

The way Roden is playing rn and actively gunning for people for shit reasons means he's probably scum. I also get why mastina says Roden feels different to Yakra.

You're playing

very

differently this game.

I'm fairly certain my tone is very different since I'm way more reckless and aggressive as town, while more passive and pocket happy as scum. It's why I'm also heavily suspicious of T3 since he knows this yet thinks scum!me openly and pointlessly puts a target on my back early Day 1.

Roden's claim feels believable? But also he's such a minor character, I could see that as one of scum's fakeclaims.

I really just want to lim Roden here.

I'm Abilash Tandon/Norm. VT

This is such a confusing line of posts? You think I could be fake claiming because my role is a minor character, yet you're claiming Norm who has zero plot relevance? Mine actually has plot relevance in the first episode and could easily be Masons with the character who plays his wife, so it would be so unnecessarily risky to fake claim this guy.
I have no idea why you still want to elim me here if you believe my claim anyway.

To add to this, why haven't you tried to meta me yet? You usually love using meta and dumping meta analysis posts in the game.

The way Roden is playing rn and actively gunning for people for shit reasons means he's probably scum. I also get why mastina says Roden feels different to Yakra.

You're playing

very

differently this game.

I am.

I'm Abilash Tandon/Norm. VT

These two posts feel a lot less congruent now that you're claiming VT.

T3 is playing super scummy, giving zero content, and refusing to use meta even though he always does that as town, also no outrageous gambits either. His partner probably threatened to bus him if he tried to pull any dumb stunts.

I would advise to shoot me later in the game. If it doesn't end the day then it may be best to shoot lurking slots like Enchant or Zyla so we don't have to waste lims on people scum won't shoot. I get full credit if T3 flips scum BTW VOTE: T3

you are scumreading me because 'i have no fire'
what a dumb case

Aren't you scum reading me because I didn't get mad and throw a fit on page 2?

T3 could be scum, you cant scum read someone arriving at the same conclusion that you did, about the same player, when that someone concluded it before you. It does not make sense, it's a fake push.

On top of this, you've got even more, too.

T3's play here has been incredibly lackluster even when present and not been very solvey.

But beyond that, there's also the fact that T3 explicitly claimed VT on D1, but is trying, repeatedly, to backtrack out of that VT claim and claim a PR. This is the sort of thing I would, explicitly, expect him to pull as scum.

[mastina]

We don't need a scumcase on t3 he got hammered.

Well I didn't know that when I wrote it.

[mastina]

Flavor gives me names of 2 other sword agents that I am working with -Jimmy, Monika. I assume the players With these roles are town (One of which appears to be Enchant)

Given that I am Monika (insert Doki Doki memes here), and my role makes zero mention of SWORD agents (it mentions I am a former SWORD agent), I'm somewhat skeptical of this.

However, a guilty is a guilty and given multiball I'm inclined to trust the result even IF you're scum.

[mastina]

@mastina tell me how a jail keep gets a inno on n1

Simple; I was wrong about Galron. I thought Galron was breadcrumbing an entirely different type of role altogether. Informed or a very specific form of investigative, knowing me to be town from knowing what my role is.

I had no clue Galron was a jailkeeper or protective of any kind.

[mastina]

We also need one more vote so NM not hammering makes me wonder.

I AM tempted to cast the hammer vote but nah, I can wait.

[mastina]

@mastina tell me how a jail keep gets a inno on n1

Simple; I was wrong about Galron. I thought Galron was breadcrumbing an entirely different type of role altogether. Informed or a very specific form of investigative, knowing me to be town from knowing what my role is.

I had no clue Galron was a jailkeeper or protective of any kind.

that doesn't answer my question

It does. Galron did not have a role-based innocent on me N1.

I am provably town, and I thought Galron had a role that let him know about how I am provably town. But he didn't--so he didn't have an innocent on me.

[mastina]

i am vision, an odd night alignment cop! night 1 i checked hiraki,

night 3 i checked mastina

.

I TOLD y'all not to investigate me. It was an absolute waste.

Still tho.

To me, pretty damn clear; N_M, Enchant, and cyrus, altho I do suppose we owe the due diligence of not just writing Cheeky off as town.

[mastina]

Or it's a fake claim and mistina and shriek are scum.

I'm literally an IC. I can become conftown at any time. (I was saving it for if scum wanted to fake a guilty on me so that I could promptly and immediately prove them to be a liar.) I was excited at daystart since I thought Shrek might be setting up for a scum fakeclaim of "I investigated mastina N3 and she's scum" so that I could immediately reveal that wrong, but no, Shrek just wasted an inno investigation on the slot that needed no investigation at all.

[mastina]

VOTE: Not_Mafia

Yeah I'm pretty comfortable doing this.

cyrus is pretty scum here fairly clearly.
Element looks pretty damn scum.
Cheeky doesn't look like scum.

So while we don't need to rush every elimination.

I'm comfortable enough with this.

[mastina]

mastina - you're better at setup spec here. does cyrus have a point that shrek's claim makes the game overpowered on the town side? we would have a watcher, JK, cop & IC based off of the current claims.

If the game were singleball sure, but multiball, depends on 50:25:25 vs. 33:33:33. Town power fits with the former, but not the latter.

[mastina]

Siiiiiiiiighhhh.

VOTE: cyrus62

Just on policy I'll vote cyrus here as cyrus is the scum from the faction that has two left + is a player who I don't really want to let win the game as scum. (Admittedly, I don't want Enchant to win the game as scum, either, but if I vote Enchant here then cyrus+Cheeky win.)

We had a 3/4 chance yesterday of having the game be basically autowin and we blew it.

Nothing we can do about it now tho.

[mastina]

Huh. Didn't knew you dislike me.

I don't dislike you, it's just that you've done jackshit as far as effort goes so you absolutely don't deserve to win this game.

cyrus is similar, in that while he's efforted, he's still been obviously scum so he also doesn't deserve to win the game.

@mastina if we have to play kingmaker who do you want to win

Well Zyla was only eliminated due to a guilty result but was otherwise quite town this game so deserves the win, but CheekyTeeky has ALSO been quite town this game and deserves the win...

...But per the above, neither of their partners deserves the win.

However, if I WERE forced to choose, I DO have a choice.

It's just that our one chance at winning the game relies on me not saying this choice out loud and forcing the remaining scum after today to guess.
I'd strongly recommend you do the same; develop your thoughts but NOT give or even hint at them.

(I DO have a plan tho.)

Encant broke a major rule. It is okay to claim scum by your self . It is forbidden to claim scum with some one else. He not only claimd scum with some one else he also throw the game, so yes town may win, but only due to encant breaking two major rules.

Rules of claiming scum go out the window in multiball when you need to hunt for a

specific

faction of scum.

If you're the last surviving member of your scumteam, you're not a scumteam; you're more of a serial killer, and serial killers have every right to truthfully claim serial killer if they believe that doing so is their best chance at fulfilling their wincon by avoiding being the town's elimination and forcing the town to eliminate scum. (Granted, most towns do not adhere to leashing serial killers, but some DO. And the chance of the town leashing you > a guarantee of your elimination if you stay silent. The former gives you a chance to live; the latter guarantees your faction loses.)

So Element was not making any bad play; Element was making the smartest, most correct, play to make.

Plus, it's not like Element's claim was going to change my vote anyway. I was planning on voting you, cyrus, today, regardless, because I didn't want to vote Cheeky here and with the choice between voting Element and voting cyrus, you seemed like the smarter/better vote.

[mastina]

Well that was fun

To be honest had you not voted me I was gonna vote for no-elimination, activate my IC during the night, and hope/pray for crosskills, but joint scum win threw a bit of a wrench in that plan.