Open 840 - Guardians of the Fortress [Game Over]

[Pavowski]

Fair. What do you need to hear from me to give me a chance at winning you over?

I mean if you're locking Luke in scum trying to shade you I don't see why it would be me voting you, wouldn't it make more sense for you to vote for me?

See there you go again trying to get me to rush to judgment, this is what keeps me thinking you could be scum here!

I've not locked him in as scum, I'm just leaning that way. Like, heavily, right now, but still. And don't discount the fact that he locked himself into this mini like, way early.

[numberQ]

Are we allowed to vote there, or is it strictly like a MeLo thing and only the people in the group can vote?

When I say this, I know our vote doesn't matter I guess, but is there a reason we can't vote just so that people not in the games are held accountable as well? Or will it not matter?

I don't see how fake voting makes for more accountability. We're all supposed to be giving reads about the other games anyway (which I've been bad about for the Gate to be fair). This feels like scum coming up with something that appears +town at first glance but really doesn't mean anything in the end. It'd be so so easy for scum to "vote" each other and look good without any real risk if we do this.

[snip]

That said, you (Luke) are SRing me pretty hard. I take it that means you'd rather vote Ari right now?

[snip]

Reading this surprised me. I don't remember Luke hard SRing you, Pav. Can you point out where this happened that I missed, or are you just feeling guilty?

[numberQ]

Gonna drop an edible and drop some spicy takes on the proper 1v1 tonight, buckle up

Really embodying your profile pic huh?

Actually did The Dude ever get high in that movie? I don't remember

[Pavowski]

I think for the third person in Keep we should make it someone Ari and Luke agree to vote for in advance. If we can lock them in to that plan it pretty much forces scum to swap the third person if they're town. Hence my questions to them to see who they can both agree on as town.

This hasn't happened, obviously, bit this is a big town ping

(I am working from phone so this might be a little messy but walls stress me out)

[Aristeia]

Fair. What do you need to hear from me to give me a chance at winning you over?

I mean if you're locking Luke in scum trying to shade you I don't see why it would be me voting you, wouldn't it make more sense for you to vote for me?

See there you go again trying to get me to rush to judgment, this is what keeps me thinking you could be scum here!

I've not locked him in as scum, I'm just leaning that way. Like, heavily, right now, but still. And don't discount the fact that he locked himself into this mini like, way early.

*twirls hair*

[Aristeia]

I know one of you and Luke are mafia.

I know both of you have embraced the strategy of shading each other while saying you tr me in order to make each other jealous.

I think it's a pretty good strategy given how much you both are familiar with each other.

At this point the dance between the two of you is like a game of chicken.

Two steps forward one step back.

I'm thinking the best ending would be if the scum between the two of you votes for me, and this causes the town player to panic vote the scum.

That would be quite a thrilling conclusion.

[Pavowski]

Gonna drop an edible and drop some spicy takes on the proper 1v1 tonight, buckle up

Really embodying your profile pic huh?

Actually did The Dude ever get high in that movie? I don't remember

Oh, multiple times lol

@Q, in the post I quoted there it is difficult to find an angle where he entertains me not being scum fmpov. Then again, anytime Luke comes for me I get my hackles up because I know he can make a case stick as either alignment. So I'll grant it's possible I'm reading too much into it.

We have a weird relationship, lol.

[numberQ]

I guess fair enough if you guys have history. Me SRing you now is giving me NEP flashbacks, so I'm definitely second guessing myself that our own history is coloring my read.

[Pavowski]

I know one of you and Luke are mafia.

I know both of you have embraced the strategy of shading each other while saying you tr me in order to make each other jealous.

I think it's a pretty good strategy given how much you both are familiar with each other.

At this point the dance between the two of you is like a game of chicken.

Two steps forward one step back.

I'm thinking the best ending would be if the scum between the two of you votes for me, and this causes the town player to panic vote the scum.

That would be quite a thrilling conclusion.

Did I say I TR you?

Your scenario at the end there is pretty unlikely, though it would be dramatic. The moment any person in our game votes somebody else, the voted party should immediately self-hammer. To do otherwise would be against wincon regardless of alignment

[numberQ]

Of course, you

were

scum in NEP, so maybe I should trust that feeling

[numberQ]

I know one of you and Luke are mafia.

I know both of you have embraced the strategy of shading each other while saying you tr me in order to make each other jealous.

I think it's a pretty good strategy given how much you both are familiar with each other.

At this point the dance between the two of you is like a game of chicken.

Two steps forward one step back.

I'm thinking the best ending would be if the scum between the two of you votes for me, and this causes the town player to panic vote the scum.

That would be quite a thrilling conclusion.

Did I say I TR you?

Your scenario at the end there is pretty unlikely, though it would be dramatic. The moment any person in our game votes somebody else, the voted party should immediately self-hammer. To do otherwise would be against wincon regardless of alignment

This is an insight I hadn't considered that kind of gives +town points to Pav. Maybe the self-vote thing was obvious to everyone else and I'm just dumb, but I don't know if scum points this out and in turn makes everyone even more cautious.

[Pavowski]

I guess fair enough if you guys have history. Me SRing you now is giving me NEP flashbacks, so I'm definitely second guessing myself that our own history is coloring my read.

I'd press you on that but I repped into the slot I repped into, it is what it is.

[Pavowski]

Of course, you

were

scum in NEP, so maybe I should trust that feeling

Oh yeah, oops

[Pavowski]

I know one of you and Luke are mafia.

I know both of you have embraced the strategy of shading each other while saying you tr me in order to make each other jealous.

I think it's a pretty good strategy given how much you both are familiar with each other.

At this point the dance between the two of you is like a game of chicken.

Two steps forward one step back.

I'm thinking the best ending would be if the scum between the two of you votes for me, and this causes the town player to panic vote the scum.

That would be quite a thrilling conclusion.

Did I say I TR you?

Your scenario at the end there is pretty unlikely, though it would be dramatic. The moment any person in our game votes somebody else, the voted party should immediately self-hammer. To do otherwise would be against wincon regardless of alignment

This is an insight I hadn't considered that kind of gives +town points to Pav. Maybe the self-vote thing was obvious to everyone else and I'm just dumb, but I don't know if scum points this out and in turn makes everyone even more cautious.

I mean, I thought this was pretty self-evident but Ari's post made me think maybe it wasn't? Which is probably +town points there to be fair

[Aristeia]

Did I say I TR you?

Your scenario at the end there is pretty unlikely, though it would be dramatic. The moment any person in our game votes somebody else, the voted party should immediately self-hammer. To do otherwise would be against wincon regardless of alignment

You said you heavily SR'd Luke which is basically the same thing.

I don't think it's that unlikely.

I wouldn't self-hammer immediately just to get my own thoughts out. I would post to show I'm online and capable of self-hammering to remove any doubts that could linger about being scum and then post everything I'd want to post about the other games first.

The gambit works best if the person being voted is not online as it puts extreme time pressure on the other side.

[Pavowski]

@Tanner: you not wanting to go with numberQ and DArby makes me slightly suspicious that VP and I are both town and you're scum trying to get in with us so there's one scum among us. You saying DArby should be with VP and me if you're not doesn't do much to dissuade me from that concern.

That said, I kind of like the idea of you going to Gate with us because I think if you are town and get IC'ed you'd be a useful voice. And I think the same of VP and me, whereas DArby if town seems less useful if IC'ed.
For the same reason if VP and I are at the Wall I'd rather DArby is with us than you.

This also pings me as towny. The fact that the 2nd paragraph is exactly what happened kinda gives wifom-y vibes but I said I'd keep my takes spicy so I'll stick with townvibes

[Pavowski]

I wouldn't self-hammer immediately just to get my own thoughts out. I would post to show I'm online and capable of self-hammering to remove any doubts that could linger about being scum and then post everything I'd want to post about the other games first.

The gambit works best if the person being voted is not online as it puts extreme time pressure on the other side.

Self-hammer first, expound later.

Seriously, if you're town and you get the vote for you, delaying only gives scum time to talk the voter out of their vote. And if you're scum and you delay, well that's just... I'll say suboptimal.

As either alignment, the move is to secure the win for your minigame.
Posting that you wouldn't do this kinda sorta reads like trying to score town points for a move that's at best dubious and at worst anti-wincon.

You could be right about the gambit timing but that's a big, big risk to take. Obviously if I get voted I'll self-hammer for the win and if Luke is not thinking the same, then I don't know Jack.

I mean Luke.

[Pavowski]

Imaginality's posts here on D2 seem pretty fair. Going spelunking into VP's iso to contrast and compare

[Pavowski]

I should reiterate (or did I ever iterate this in the first place?) I have zero knowledge of imaginality or VP outside this game, unless there are alts involved

That's not me alt-hunting, I just say it for the sake of saying my reads here are zero-meta while my Luke read is (pretty obviously) heavy meta

(Heavy meta lol *air guitar*)

[Pavowski]

I am not sure if it's been said in thread but I think there is scum equity between VP/Ari. I'm not done reading the VP iso but I feel much more murky on it than I did on imaginality's.

[Pavowski]

Another thing. I think it's a mistake to TR Baltar for the derp slip on the gate. Scum can miss setup details too. It may not be as likely, but it happens.

[Pavowski]

Ooooooook I think I may be reaching the limit of my ability to brain tonight. If it's me I'm voting Baltar as scum in that matchup right now. I had a passing vague SR on Q from skimming the thread which I'll reevaluate soon, and then I'll smoke-test Baltar/Q/Luke vs Baltar/Q/Ari, unless the Q sr changes, in which case, whee.

[VP Baltar]

My drive was very snowy and took longer than I had planned. I'll get to this game tomorrow.

[Pavowski]

(summoning 100)

[VP Baltar]

(summoning 100)

You talking about me?