Large Normal 238 | Weiqi, Baduk, Go | Endgame

[Aristeia]

why wouldn't she let NKs sort out a mason claim? ~.~ seems kind of common sense to me.

That’s what she says she’s going to do.

But instead she’s taking a kind of passive aggressive stance.

It’s different.

Did you read it?

yes, I don't understand what you find scummy about it?

[skitter30]

Math your perception of the gamestate is skewed, and at least 4 different people are telling you that

If you're implying 'm passively shading you because i'm buddies with wu and trying to divert that wagon, that predicates wu is scum and that's still not something i'm particularly sold on

[skitter30]

There needs to be a catalyst why.

No, there doesnt, and the wagon movements were a lot more organic than how you're describing them

[MathBlade]

Math your perception of the gamestate is skewed, and at least 4 different people are telling you that

If you're implying 'm passively shading you because i'm buddies with wu and trying to divert that wagon, that predicates wu is scum and that's still not something i'm particularly sold on

And I think most are scum trying to save Wu.

I am working with Ari answering questions

But I KNOW a majority of the game was skewed to wagon both masons

Baseless crap like this doesn’t help me get where you are if that’s what you want.

[GeneralWu]

why wouldn't she let NKs sort out a mason claim? ~.~ seems kind of common sense to me.

I've played games as scum in this situation before. We sometimes left the PRs alive longer just to cause confusion. We also assumed there would be other PRs protecting them. During the day, we said things like "nightkills are wifom" to justify everything.

[fireisredsir]

This argument reinforces Wu scum even more. This isn’t the shining bullet you think it is.

how so? serious question, I'm curious for your reasoning. i don't think it's a shining bullet (? lol), i have no horse in this race, im just trying to show you why your interpretation of events is not necessarily the reality, and that therefore the assumptions your making based off of your interpretation are kinda useless to the rest of us

Datisi top wagon becomes
Wu top wagon
Back to Datisi followed with a rapid departure from Wu
Nordom (me) is being counter wagoned

Wu was abandoned hard

There needs to be a catalyst why.

i mean one possible catalyst is that nordom looked scummy? maybe I'm just too biased here bc I know that I'm town and I scumread both nordom and monkey, so i don't see why it has to be scum that led those wagons. but anyway, ignoring that, you think it's impossible that all 4 are town? why? why can't it just be natural evolution of town thought? why does everything day 1 have to be orchestrated and planned by scum? you've played enough games to know that there often isn't some grand plan for scum, especially on day 1 when everything is chaos and the lim is almost never gonna be maf, they just will want to blend in

[Nero Cain]

you know Math. It was mainly me _ fua that had driven the Wu wagon. if Wu were to flip town we get blamed. That back to back to back skitter-VP-Yet rapid voted on HEM is prob from scum.

can you expand on this, i am interested but i feel like I'm missing a step between the first half and the last half. if those two are supposed to be connected then i don't follow the logic

Nero naked voted me

VP joined HEM
Skitter joined HEM
Yeet joined HEM

im saying that there is scum here.

scum just lets my big ass push a Wu wagon while they comfortably sit on HEM. I also have a super-secret reason why VP/Skitter contains scum.

[Aristeia]

why can't the explanation simply be that HEM was p scummy and got votes because he was playing somewhat scummy?

you know just because someone has a town role PM doesn't mean it's impossible for them to play in a way that is scummy right?

[skitter30]

And monkey was painted to be scummy but wasn’t

why not

Because he’s a mason he can’t be scum
Naturally scum say town are scummy
But there’s nothing scummy in the ISO

Again that doesn't mean his play wasnt scummy or bad. Lots of townies are scummy, and even got misflipped for it, that's how scum win games ....

Its unreasonable to expect people to *at the time* see that hem was townie just because he has a mason role pm when he wasnt playing in a pro town fashion

At least 5 people were on that wagon. Unless you want to say there's 5 scum and they were all piling on him, some townies had to have been scumreading him. It isnt an unreasonable position from the pov of literally anyone else to take

[skitter30]

you know just because someone has a town role PM doesn't mean it's impossible for them to play in a way that is scummy right?

Yes, this...

[MathBlade]

why wouldn't she let NKs sort out a mason claim? ~.~ seems kind of common sense to me.

That’s what she says she’s going to do.

But instead she’s taking a kind of passive aggressive stance.

It’s different.

Did you read it?

yes, I don't understand what you find scummy about it?

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=88600&user_select%5B%5D=29653

This is town her ISO.
She gets “pings” and uses that terminology a lot

viewtopic.php?p=13233396#p13233396

This post specifically she’s aggressive when I call her out

Now she’s all “whatever, NKs can sort it out” but trying to back door shade/scum

[MathBlade]

why can't the explanation simply be that HEM was p scummy and got votes because he was playing somewhat scummy?

you know just because someone has a town role PM doesn't mean it's impossible for them to play in a way that is scummy right?

He didn’t though.
I disagree with that assertion seeing the mason Pt and some of his posts
HEM just wasnt

[skitter30]

Baseless crap like this doesn’t help me get where you are if that’s what you want.

Ok and bickering with me abt this isnt going to make me do what you want either

[Aristeia]

a claimed inno from an investigative role is not the same thing as a mason claim tho

[MathBlade]

This argument reinforces Wu scum even more. This isn’t the shining bullet you think it is.

how so? serious question, I'm curious for your reasoning. i don't think it's a shining bullet (? lol), i have no horse in this race, im just trying to show you why your interpretation of events is not necessarily the reality, and that therefore the assumptions your making based off of your interpretation are kinda useless to the rest of us

Datisi top wagon becomes
Wu top wagon
Back to Datisi followed with a rapid departure from Wu
Nordom (me) is being counter wagoned

Wu was abandoned hard

There needs to be a catalyst why.

i mean one possible catalyst is that nordom looked scummy? maybe I'm just too biased here bc I know that I'm town and I scumread both nordom and monkey, so i don't see why it has to be scum that led those wagons. but anyway, ignoring that, you think it's impossible that all 4 are town? why? why can't it just be natural evolution of town thought? why does everything day 1 have to be orchestrated and planned by scum? you've played enough games to know that there often isn't some grand plan for scum, especially on day 1 when everything is chaos and the lim is almost never gonna be maf, they just will want to blend in

Nordom was being mean not scummy though.
Scum were poisoning the thread HEM and Monkey were scummy.
The only reason to alter the gamestate is if they don’t like where it is.

[skitter30]

Right cuz bickering with you worked so well for me last time

[fireisredsir]

why can't the explanation simply be that HEM was p scummy and got votes because he was playing somewhat scummy?

you know just because someone has a town role PM doesn't mean it's impossible for them to play in a way that is scummy right?

He didn’t though.
I disagree with that assertion seeing the mason Pt and some of his posts
HEM just wasnt

what makes you (someone coming in with prior info about his alignment, therefore making you completely unable to honestly gauge how suspicious he looks) the arbiter of what is scummy and what is not? you can't just declare that someone wasn't scummy when there was, by definition, town voting for them

[MathBlade]

Baseless crap like this doesn’t help me get where you are if that’s what you want.

Ok and bickering with me abt this isnt going to make me do what you want either

It’s why I said I am ignoring you.

That post was made to reach you and others

I have been told I have skewed beliefs without checking the splinter in your eyes

The game wagoned two masons.

That’s scum motivated or encouraged

[Datisi]

UNVOTE:

unsurprisingly, i have a lot of problems with math's view on the game, but i do not have the time right now to argue with him

[GeneralWu]

There needs to be a catalyst why.

A catalyst lowers the activation energy of a reaction so that the reaction can proceed faster. For example, enzymes are biological catalysts. Carbonic anhydrase is an enzyme that catalyzes the reaction H2O + CO2 -> H2CO3. It works by using zinc to stabilize the transition state of the reaction. What sort of catalyst do you think is in this game?

[MathBlade]

why can't the explanation simply be that HEM was p scummy and got votes because he was playing somewhat scummy?

you know just because someone has a town role PM doesn't mean it's impossible for them to play in a way that is scummy right?

He didn’t though.
I disagree with that assertion seeing the mason Pt and some of his posts
HEM just wasnt

what makes you (someone coming in with prior info about his alignment, therefore making you completely unable to honestly gauge how suspicious he looks) the arbiter of what is scummy and what is not? you can't just declare that someone wasn't scummy when there was, by definition, town voting for them

Because there was a wagon of 6 on monkey and a wagon of 4 on me.
These all can’t be town
Therefore scum
Therefore point proven

[Datisi]

The game wagoned two masons.

considering both of you were unclaimed, this isn't really any different than the game wagoning any to random townies but ok

[fireisredsir]

i can't believe that you seriously can't comprehend the possibility that you knowing two alignments is affecting your ability to accurately assess whether those slots look scummy to an outside perspective or not. is everyone who votes town either scum or blind to you? you know that happens, like, all the time. right?

[GeneralWu]

a claimed inno from an investigative role is not the same thing as a mason claim tho

Yeah, but then why would we use an investigative role on one of the claimed masons?

[Datisi]

any two random townies*