Newbie 2093 | New Wave | Postgame

[Val89]

I don't think after that is it necessary for me to think too hard over which of the two is the best place to start, on a D1 lim.

Eliminate All Liars.

VOTE: Takemikazuchi02

[Takemikazuchi02]

Dude, she literally said "good evening fam"
How is that not a greeting?

[Val89]

Are you for real?

I'm going to ask a simple yes or no question now. I know it's probably going to be a tricky one for you, but please think hard.

Did you read ANY of the linked post in 78???

Please, PLEASE, don't tell me we've come all this way with you ignoring every correction issued believing the tell TTTT might have believed in was literally any "greeting"?

[Takemikazuchi02]

I might have been prepared, once upon a time, to believe you just didn't understand what the newbie greeting 'tell' was, but

A 24 game sample size is meaningless. I see you're still using the same complete garbage arguments as last game.

VOTE: Abdbla

suggests to me you know full well the argument was never "people who say hi can't be town".

Just in case the wall of quotes previously hasn't made it obvious by now, I am inclined to agree with you that there is no value to it, but you have continued to misrepresent me, despite all those corrections, that I believed it could reliably deduce scum, and you implied as much again 2 posts ago.

I ask myself again why you continue to expend as much effort, even devoting one third of your response to my case on the You/Aspho being the scum team as "your point on the greeting tell is wrong", if there is no fear as you claim?

This is your worse argument yet.
My point that me and Aspho greeted the thread while being town last game still stands regardless of how you define your newbie greet "tell"

[Val89]

My point that me and Aspho greeted the thread while being town last game still stands regardless of how you define your newbie greet "tell"

[Val89]

How about the "simple inability to answer a yes or no question" tell?

Do you believe in that one?

How about the "continual re-framing of the argument" one?

[Takemikazuchi02]

You're confusing me now. I've read the OP and some replies

I originally saw the tell as an "enthusiastic greeting" but URAP says it's "greets the game" and I've come around to his way of thinking on this, and the data I pulled is based on his definition of a player giving a generic greeting to the entire game, rather than just a greeting to specific players.

For Newbie games 1900-1923 I found the following:
26 out of 100 Newbtown players greeted the game in their opening post (26%).
20 of 35 Newbscum players greeted the game in their opening post (57.1%).

This is how the "tell" is defined.

[Takemikazuchi02]

Also re-framing the argument? You're the one who has been doing that everytime I shut down one of your arguments.

[Val89]

"Nah ah! You are doing that, not me!"

Is this the logical continuation of "No fair! We scumread you first!"??

I'm going to go ahead take catbois advice in 396 and log off for the night.

[Takemikazuchi02]

Why am I even trying? God this game sucks.

[CornPuffBuddha]

@Mod (and everyone) I will be unexpectedly V/LA for most of tomorrow, April 19th. I may be able to make a brief post in the morning or very late at night but probably not. My only request is that we wait to elim. I want to see how the TTTT replacement affects my reads, and we have quite a bit of time left to deliberate in general anyways.

[ItalianoVD]

Sorry to see TTTT go. He was the one I felt understood me the most lol. Hope everything’s alright with him.

[BigTerp]

MAN!!! I'm going to attempt a reads list, but my head is spinning/hurts after catching up this morning. The game, so far, has been dominated by just a few players. With the holiday and weekend that's understandable. But the context of most of the game so far is what has my head hurting. Arguing over intro posts, mysterious/clever type posts, agitation/irritation and long drawn out lecturing type posts. I'm far from a seasoned or good mafia player, but those type of posts, IMO, are not really helping the game along.

Val89 - With only 6 posts so far, probably the most unremarkable player for me thus far into the game.

Null read.

Takemikazuchi02 - FAR from unremarkable so far, LOL. The intense irritation/agitation gives me pause, but I can't see mafia wanting to stick out so much so early in the game.

Town lean.

CornPuffBuddha - Another unremarkable player for me for whatever reason. A few have scum reads here, but I honestly don't have much to go on. Need to go back and read this one in ISO.

Null read

ItalianoVD - Some weird, mysterious type posts that seem rather anti-town. They've frustrated a few players and seem to have stalled the game a bit. Similar to Take though, I can't see mafia being this brazen and sticking their neck out so much early on in the game. However, it still feels pretty scummy to me the way they are playing.

Null to scum read here.

TTTT - I've played with TTTT in my only previous game here. He was town and worked hard to ask relevant questions and move the game along productively. Some don't seem to like his style, so far this game, but he playing very similar to that previous game.

Town read here.

Asphodelus - Another one with not much context. ZERO feeling here either way.

Null read

abdbla - Minimal posts, but they seem rather fluffy and lacking much context.

Null to scum read.

furtiveglance - Only other player I've previously played with (same game at TTTT). I misread them several times throughout the game and they ended town. Seem to be playing very similar this game. Decent conversation and questions, much of which has so far aligned with my own thoughts.

Town read here.

After catching up this morning, below is where I currently stand with everyone. Color coded even for Furtive's pleasure!!

Val89

- Has gone from a null (mostly due to inactivity) to a pretty solid town read. They've caught up with the game and have provide some very productive posts. This 298 and previous post about trying to keep up with the game and being busy seem genuine. 339 Is VERY interesting. They seem to be really trying to figure things out. Subsequent posts could be seen as tunneling a bit (on Take), but I think Val has really figured something out (even if only in their own head) and continues to work through their thought process with each post.

CornPuffBuddha

- Another town read. They have many of the same thoughts and progressions as I've had myself so far. This 212 is a very unrated townish type post that didn't stick out much until now, for whatever reason. Much of the same as Val in regards to subsequent posts. Pretty strong town read here.

TTTT

- Still a fairly solid town read for the same reasons mentioned in my reads list quoted above. Not much has changed here, other than the fact they are being replaced.

Furtive

- Has gone from a town to null read. Something in the back of my head just keeps telling me I gotta watch out here. He was a REALLY tough read for me the only game we played together, and I kept going back and forth. He ended up being town, and I even protected him as the town doctor twice, but I questioned myself the whole time. Same feelings here for whatever reason.

Asphodelus

- Going to keep them null, for now. Still a tough read for me. They've been really focused/tunneling TTTT, who've I've got as town. The OMGUS vote is not helpful and they seem to be back and forth between it being an actual OMGUS vote and that TTTT is scum, like here 316. They say

"My vote on TTTT is more OMGUS than it is a real vote."

. Yet in the same post have TTTT as their top scum read. Which is it? Not much context besides the TTTT stuff and a few posts that get rather long and rambling.

abdbla

- Null to slightly scummy read. My vote is currently here, but I'm questioning that now. Their lack of participation and seemingly "fluffy" type posts early on gave me a lot of pause. However, they've come back since and provided some decent content. Specifically here 271 and here 312. BUT, there was no reaction to me putting my vote on them, which seems odd. I expected at least some sort of comment on that if they were town.

Takemikazuchi02

- Now a null to scum read. The first part of the game was just odd to me. I still don't understand the frustration and irritation, but at least they explained why it happened. Fair enough there. Val's post here 339 gave me some pause and got me thinking more about Take. But the subsequent defensiveness on Take's part is really evident starting with 342 and is really starting to look like scum squirming to me.

ItalianoVD

- Scum!! Their drastic shift from their early play has me thinking they are scum trying to shift tactics after being called out for the mysterious type posts. 281 feels like scum trying to make excuses for their early play. This 314 was conveniently not addressed. Again, feels like scum trying to dismiss their early scum play hoping it'll be forgotten about.

With all of that said, I could be convinced on any of the bottom 4 on my list. Would love to see a dueling wagon on 2 of them though. The solo wagons haven't garnered much discussion/movement. Getting 2 together might give us more and better information.

[catboi]

Malakittens replaces TTTT.

[BigTerp]

Malakittens replaces TTTT.

Interested to hearing your thoughts Malakittens.

Where is everyone at? We need to get some discussion going!!!

Any thoughts on my reads list? How about my idea of getting 2 dueling wagons going?

[Takemikazuchi02]

@Bigterp

Let's imagine I get eliminated today and I flip town. What would you do?

[BigTerp]

@Bigterp

Let's imagine I get eliminated today and I flip town. What would you do?

Excellent question.

If you flipped town, I would go back and look to see who didn't have much to say about your irritation/aggression and rather harsh play early on (no offense). Of that pool, anyone who had their vote on you at some point I would be suspicious of. I would also look hard at Italiano, who seemed to egg you on (as you pointed out). Considering I'm already highly suspicious of Italiano, I would ultimately push for an elimination of him as I would see his play as just lighting your fire, in the wrong way, to get you miselim'd.

[furtiveglance]

After catching up this morning, below is where I currently stand with everyone. Color coded even for Furtive's pleasure!!

Thanks

Val89

- Has gone from a null (mostly due to inactivity) to a pretty solid town read. They've caught up with the game and have provide some very productive posts. This 298 and previous post about trying to keep up with the game and being busy seem genuine. 339 Is VERY interesting. They seem to be really trying to figure things out. Subsequent posts could be seen as tunneling a bit (on Take), but I think Val has really figured something out (even if only in their own head) and continues to work through their thought process with each post.

Val is your top townread. Are we playing the same game? Val has gone from coasting to peddling an Aspho/T02 solve which makes no sense to me. All of Val's latest posting is tunneling T02, he isn't commenting on most of the playerlist or explaining why he townreads literally everyone other than Aspho and T02 (apparently).

CornPuffBuddha

- Another town read. They have many of the same thoughts and progressions as I've had myself so far. This 212 is a very unrated townish type post that didn't stick out much until now, for whatever reason. Much of the same as Val in regards to subsequent posts. Pretty strong town read here.

I have Corn as my top townread. Agree that they seem pretty sensible and well-intentioned.

TTTT

- Still a fairly solid town read for the same reasons mentioned in my reads list quoted above. Not much has changed here, other than the fact they are being replaced.

Also agree.

Furtive

- Has gone from a town to null read. Something in the back of my head just keeps telling me I gotta watch out here. He was a REALLY tough read for me the only game we played together, and I kept going back and forth. He ended up being town, and I even protected him as the town doctor twice, but I questioned myself the whole time. Same feelings here for whatever reason.

Asphodelus

- Going to keep them null, for now. Still a tough read for me. They've been really focused/tunneling TTTT, who've I've got as town. The OMGUS vote is not helpful and they seem to be back and forth between it being an actual OMGUS vote and that TTTT is scum, like here 316. They say

"My vote on TTTT is more OMGUS than it is a real vote."

. Yet in the same post have TTTT as their top scum read. Which is it? Not much context besides the TTTT stuff and a few posts that get rather long and rambling.

Aspho has been playing very strangely. It's one of those where I'm not sure mafia would play like this on day 1.

abdbla

- Null to slightly scummy read. My vote is currently here, but I'm questioning that now. Their lack of participation and seemingly "fluffy" type posts early on gave me a lot of pause. However, they've come back since and provided some decent content. Specifically here 271 and here 312. BUT, there was no reaction to me putting my vote on them, which seems odd. I expected at least some sort of comment on that if they were town.

What did you townread about the reactions?

Takemikazuchi02

- Now a null to scum read. The first part of the game was just odd to me. I still don't understand the frustration and irritation, but at least they explained why it happened. Fair enough there. Val's post here 339 gave me some pause and got me thinking more about Take. But the subsequent defensiveness on Take's part is really evident starting with 342 and is really starting to look like scum squirming to me.

Disagree, I've gone back and forth but I land town with Take - especially as Val and Italiano are the ones hard pushing him.

ItalianoVD

- Scum!! Their drastic shift from their early play has me thinking they are scum trying to shift tactics after being called out for the mysterious type posts. 281 feels like scum trying to make excuses for their early play. This 314 was conveniently not addressed. Again, feels like scum trying to dismiss their early scum play hoping it'll be forgotten about.

They have changed their style drastically since early game. Definitely high chance of being scum, after their reaction to being pushed early.

[furtiveglance]

Ok I failed to strip quote. Hopefully it's still readable

[BigTerp]

Ok I failed to strip quote. Hopefully it's still readable

All good. Give me a minute.....

[furtiveglance]

Part of the reason this game feels so chaotic is we can't agree on townreads. We both townread Corn for instance, but half the players seem to be scumreading them.

[furtiveglance]

I think a functional townblock is me, Terp, Corn and TTTT's replacement. For day 1 at least

[BigTerp]

Val is your top townread. Are we playing the same game? Val has gone from coasting to peddling an Aspho/T02 solve which makes no sense to me. All of Val's latest posting is tunneling T02, he isn't commenting on most of the playerlist or explaining why he townreads literally everyone other than Aspho and T02 (apparently).

Yep. And pretty solid at that. I addressed the tunneling on Take in my list. The post just really seemed like logical progression from a town player working through the thread. I feel like scum would be more calculated, for lack of a better word, with their posts. While I agree that Val's are heavy on Take and light on most everyone else, they just felt extremely towny to me.

Aspho has been playing very strangely. It's one of those where I'm not sure mafia would play like this on day 1.

Agreed. But the thing about this game in particular, is much the same can be said for several other players. So play style/behavior in general that would normally stick out as either alignment is tough, for me at least, to pick up on this game.

What did you townread about the reactions?

The above is in reference to abdbla. And is a good question. Honestly, I can't pick out anything specific that screams town from the reactions. I think I got caught up in the fact that they were participating with well worded responses and seemed to be thinking through things. When compared to my previous read here of "Minimal posts, but they seem rather fluffy and lacking much context" it was a positive change. But it could in fact just be "busy" posts to increase participation. Hence why I've still got them on a slight scummy read.

Disagree, I've gone back and forth but I land town with Take - especially as Val and Italiano are the ones hard pushing him.

I can't completely commit to a scum read here, but also cannot clear them as town for reasons already explained above. Maybe the defensiveness is their play style, but it seems scummy to me. Agreed Val is pushing hard here and Italiano has been there for most of the game. I think we get the most info. out of an Italiano elim here though versus Val or Take.

They have changed their style drastically since early game. Definitely high chance of being scum, after their reaction to being pushed early.

Yep, and may very well move my vote back here.

Furtive - You're currently on abdbla, along with myself. Do you prefer a abdbla elim or Italiano elim? As I've mentioned earlier, the non reaction from abdbla to me putting them to E-2 is interesting.

[ItalianoVD]

I think a functional townblock is me, Terp, Corn and TTTT's replacement. For day 1 at least

That’s the block I’ve been working with, which leaves Val, Aspho, Take, and Abd. I’m working with whom I think is the most likely Take partner.

[BigTerp]

I think a functional townblock is me, Terp, Corn and TTTT's replacement. For day 1 at least

Replace yourself with Val, and I can get down with this. You still give me the willy's for reasons I cannot articulate. It might just be your play style because, like I said, I had the same issue last game and I feel like you're playing pretty similarly.