Mini 2273: Science Diagrams That Look Like Shitposts 2 [END]

[Alexcellent]

We (me and Clidd) did interact earlier on the policy thing. And adding a vote to Owen seemed right since (again) we're in the final day so I was getting a wagon on my scumread.

I was NOT expecting whatever Corwin did. So uh. Guess I may vote there. Still don't know why they didn't just stay on Owen. Isn't it more of a scum benefit to just not do anything there instead of make a stupid argument? Or am I just giving scum Corwin to much credit?

Do agree with this. Which is what I mean. Don't see why scum!Corwin votes town!Vivax there when scum can do literally anything else. Could have kept his vote on NM or on Unowen with no probs. Feels more likely town with bad argument than scum pushing something.

Why does town have no reaction whatsoever to two people voting for the same person they're voting for?

I don't understand this sentence

[Alexcellent]

Speaking of Gibus, I do find it interesting that Gibus' only chiming in on this was a vote ok Corwin with no words.

Would like to see something of his own argument instead of just plopping down vote #4 silently.

Agree

[Crescent]

How in the hell do you go from me asking someone to make a plain point so we're on the same page and now things, to me suggest we "keep knowing nothing"?

Because you still didn't post a read on GeorgeBayley.

Your main goal seems to dismiss arguments, not build them.

If you are town and the wagon next to you is GeorgeBayley, and you don't know the alignment of GeorgeBayley, you can save yourself by getting him voted, which is the correct play 100% of the time.

And this is the biggest issue I have from him. Right there.

Oh and don't get me wrong. It's not all about that progression. It's been a sweeping problem all game.

This is ultimately where my scum vibes from Corwin were originally coming from, and nothing has changed. Yet again his only response was weak shade on someone who called him scum. I mentioned a while before this that Corwin had some scum equity. I've waited for a single genuine attempt at game solving, and it just never happened. All we got instead was countershade.

[Eiralox]

Hmmm both Crescent and Alex make fair points here.

Alex says: Why would Scum! Corwin vote on such a flimsy pretext and draw attention?

Crescent says: Why would Town! Corwin have no reaction to two people voting OWEN after one another?

Possibly Corwin felt more green about Owen, and took the argument with Vivax personally.

Why would Scum! Corwin change their vote after two people hopped on a wagon? This can go either way, the only logical reason I would see was Scum! Corwin protecting Scum! Owen with a diversionary attack after the wagon got too hot.

[Eiralox]

I mean. Have they both really done anything good? At least when I saw George interact with Alex earlier I got a good feeling. The most I remember from Gibus is a naked vote on me after copying my post, the VC, and now hopping onto Corwin.

It's not an important question to me since they're both low and can change spots. But sorry if me not responding makes it seem like I'm avoiding it cuz I don't wanna answer it.

ok but other unanswered question: why did you state you were going with the majority on Geraintm when only three people have been pushing for it?

[Elsa Jay]

I mean I made that point Eira but whatever. The hard bus thing seems a little pretentious since for whatever reason Owen has focused on Corwin to a weird degree. Are you saying Owen never really wanted Corwin dead too? Doesn't seem like they both agree on this so it's not SvS to me.

If anything if Corwin flips town here I'm more willing to hard tunnel Owen here.

Edit: Majority on that page or something? I dunno. I exaggerate alot in my speech to make it sound better. It was also awhile ago now.

[Vivax]

Hmmm both Crescent and Alex make fair points here.

Alex says: Why would Scum! Corwin vote on such a flimsy pretext and draw attention?

Crescent says: Why would Town! Corwin have no reaction to two people voting OWEN after one another?

Possibly Corwin felt more green about Owen, and took the argument with Vivax personally.

Why would Scum! Corwin change their vote after two people hopped on a wagon? This can go either way, the only logical reason I would see was Scum! Corwin protecting Scum! Owen with a diversionary attack after the wagon got too hot.

This post doesn't reflect that narrative:

471 This is such an incredibly bad look I can't believe you're even serious. I have 3 finished games, the last was 6 years ago, and I'm open they were my only ones and I bailed because the IC/SEs in my last game decided to metafuck each other instead of playing their game and you're like "I dunno if Corwin is high tier."

Dumb ass play because you've been on my ass for nothing almost almost as bad as UNOwen is, and now it's seriously starting to look like team play.

He's suggesting me and Owen are a team, so how is he protecting Owen?

[Crescent]

Corwin has some scum motive to bail off of town Owen, too, if he notices those votes, though it would require a bit of forethought in the moment.

A. Those votes were arguably bad, and would reflect poorly on them later, meanwhile his unvote could be taken as disagreeing with the turn the train made, thus looking better. Corwin only had 2 votes himself at this time.
B. Newbie scum is often shy about leading actual train on town rather than just a "vote".
C. Newbie scum is often nervous about being on an early town voteoff because they are afraid it will blow back on them.

I have seen end of day vote spreads a few times where two town were tied, and a newbie scum was hiding as a splinter vote because they were afraid to be on either one and get caught in a green flip.

[Crescent]

Oh I forgot D. He already felt committed to pushing Vivax and felt dropping it would make him look worse than pursuing it.

[Alexcellent]

Here's where I'm at. I'm not vibing with the Corwin train. The jester thing is weak but it doesn't scream scum to me. Only thing is most of the people on it (sans Owen) I'm kinda town reading.
If it were between Corwin and Owen, I'd rather get rid of Owen. but I don't like the look of who's pushing the wagon (no offence).

I'd be open to an Elsa or Goldfish elim today, but with 24hrs left doubt that's likely.

VOTE: George Bailey

Not a super strong scum read, but nothing he's done has particularly struck me as town. Dislike that he sort of tried to discredit my townread on Eiralox (back in 183). If NM stops trolling the game, George's flip gives info there.

Think I prefer this over Corwin or Unowen at the moment.

[Eiralox]

Hmmm both Crescent and Alex make fair points here.

Alex says: Why would Scum! Corwin vote on such a flimsy pretext and draw attention?

Crescent says: Why would Town! Corwin have no reaction to two people voting OWEN after one another?

Possibly Corwin felt more green about Owen, and took the argument with Vivax personally.

Why would Scum! Corwin change their vote after two people hopped on a wagon? This can go either way, the only logical reason I would see was Scum! Corwin protecting Scum! Owen with a diversionary attack after the wagon got too hot.

This post doesn't reflect that narrative:

471 This is such an incredibly bad look I can't believe you're even serious. I have 3 finished games, the last was 6 years ago, and I'm open they were my only ones and I bailed because the IC/SEs in my last game decided to metafuck each other instead of playing their game and you're like "I dunno if Corwin is high tier."

Dumb ass play because you've been on my ass for nothing almost almost as bad as UNOwen is, and now it's seriously starting to look like team play.

He's suggesting me and Owen are a team, so how is he protecting Owen?

Yeah good point, my post was in the theoretical vein.

I'm not saying they are a team, only saying that scum hopping

off

a wagon on town

after

two others have joined it doesn't make much sense to me, thus why Alex's read of frustrated town has merit.

I haven't gone over the entire corwin thing yet, don't know if i'll even post something comprehensive about it today as well as my other stated POI's, but i'm not fully on board with the corwin push yet. Something's fishy somewhere, and I'm getting strange vibes from a number of corners.

[Eiralox]

I mean I made that point Eira but whatever. The hard bus thing seems a little pretentious since for whatever reason Owen has focused on Corwin to a weird degree. Are you saying Owen never really wanted Corwin dead too? Doesn't seem like they both agree on this so it's not SvS to me.

If anything if Corwin flips town here I'm more willing to hard tunnel Owen here.

Edit: Majority on that page or something? I dunno. I exaggerate alot in my speech to make it sound better. It was also awhile ago now.

Townist:
Eiralox (definitely way better the before)
Vivax (seems to care enough about town to look into everything)
Alex (felt townie when fighting me)
Clidd (most gut but I think I played with them 2 years ago? Just feels good)

Null:
Crescent (down from before but definitely not killing today)
Corwin (Middle of the pack now so way better)
George (townier then the 3 below)
Goldfish (feels just... Like I haven't actually noticed a game changing post and feels like a wallflower))

Scummy:

Gera (don't know but they haven't rung townie immediately to me either so I'll trust the majority.)

Owen (hasn't responded well to anything really. Too obsessed)

Wouldn't care if dead but not for being evil. Just apathetic to it:
NotMaf (he is who he is)
Gibus (the guy I feel we should compromise on if we don't have a conclusion like my original plan stated)

That's my list. The big 3 I wanna focus on day 2 will probably be what's up with Goldfish Alex or Cres. Getting the alignment of those 3 solved will definitely help us solve whatever partners we can find.

Town investigative would be good on one of those 3 or maybe me/Eira. Checking a lower tier slot feels like a waste so definitely one of us 5.

at this point in time only Crescent, George and Clidd were gunning for Gera.

[Alexcellent]

Corwin has some scum motive to bail off of town Owen, too, if he notices those votes, though it would require a bit of forethought in the moment.

A. Those votes were arguably bad, and would reflect poorly on them later, meanwhile his unvote could be taken as disagreeing with the turn the train made, thus looking better. Corwin only had 2 votes himself at this time.
B. Newbie scum is often shy about leading actual train on town rather than just a "vote".
C. Newbie scum is often nervous about being on an early town voteoff because they are afraid it will blow back on them.

I have seen end of day vote spreads a few times where two town were tied, and a newbie scum was hiding as a splinter vote because they were afraid to be on either one and get caught in a green flip.

I mean I guess these are all possible.

Maybe worth noting Corwin's initial post about the jester thing towards Vivax 542 does come before Elsa and Clidd jumped onto the Owen wagon (literally like 2 mins after he posted). But he doesn't actually move his vote to Vivax til a little while after.

[Elsa Jay]

I liked Crescent and Clidd at the time. Re-liking Crescent again after realizing that her mindset was townie against you but frustrated. Sometimes when I say majority I guess I mean "majority of people I trust". Or I inflated Cres saying it alot to more people saying it then actual people.

[Crescent]

Elsa is fascinating to me right now. I can see the arguments and I can see her seeming to avoid half of them. The attempts to get me to vote Owen and their reaction to the Corwin train certainly didn't town vibe me.

I can see independent reasons for both Elsa and Corwin being scum, but based on their interactions, I don't feel it's both. An exchange like 611 especially only happens if scum plans it out beforehand. At the moment, I think Vivax is town regardless.

I won't say no to killing George, though. Almost every point I've made about him in this game has ultimately stood. I was briefly distracted by his vote and that's really about it.

[Crescent]

Corwin has some scum motive to bail off of town Owen, too, if he notices those votes, though it would require a bit of forethought in the moment.

A. Those votes were arguably bad, and would reflect poorly on them later, meanwhile his unvote could be taken as disagreeing with the turn the train made, thus looking better. Corwin only had 2 votes himself at this time.
B. Newbie scum is often shy about leading actual train on town rather than just a "vote".
C. Newbie scum is often nervous about being on an early town voteoff because they are afraid it will blow back on them.

I have seen end of day vote spreads a few times where two town were tied, and a newbie scum was hiding as a splinter vote because they were afraid to be on either one and get caught in a green flip.

I mean I guess these are all possible.

Maybe worth noting Corwin's initial post about the jester thing towards Vivax 542 does come before Elsa and Clidd jumped onto the Owen wagon (literally like 2 mins after he posted). But he doesn't actually move his vote to Vivax til a little while after.

Yep. I went over this. Jester post is 542. Owen votes are 544 and 545.
Corwin does not respond to the Owen votes or to anything happening in the game at this time.

When Vivax returns, he quickly responds to Vivax.

[Eiralox]

I liked Crescent and Clidd at the time. Re-liking Crescent again after realizing that her mindset was townie against you but frustrated. Sometimes when I say majority I guess I mean "majority of people I trust". Or I inflated Cres saying it alot to more people saying it then actual people.

ok noted

Elsa is fascinating to me right now. I can see the arguments and I can see her seeming to avoid half of them. The attempts to get me to vote Owen and their reaction to the Corwin train certainly didn't town vibe me.

I can see independent reasons for both Elsa and Corwin being scum, but based on their interactions, I don't feel it's both. An exchange like 611 especially only happens if scum plans it out beforehand. At the moment, I think Vivax is town regardless.

I won't say no to killing George, though. Almost every point I've made about him in this game has ultimately stood. I was briefly distracted by his vote and that's really about it.

I like this post.

[Elsa Jay]

Elsa is fascinating to me right now. I can see the arguments and I can see her seeming to avoid half of them. The attempts to get me to vote Owen and their reaction to the Corwin train certainly didn't town vibe me.

I can see independent reasons for both Elsa and Corwin being scum, but based on their interactions, I don't feel it's both. An exchange like 611 especially only happens if scum plans it out beforehand. At the moment, I think Vivax is town regardless.

I mean if by trying you mean "hey join us it'll be fun" then I guess I did try. Not really hard tho.

[Crescent]

Anyways I'm off to Synagogue. This feels like by far the most constructive banter we've had in the game so far, but again I feel like half the game is missing from it.

[Eiralox]

I don't know how I feel about #611. I told Corwin to vote George. No response. Maybe they're busy lol.

[Eiralox]

Timeline:

#611 tells Elsa "I'll vote whoever you want me to"

Not town. Not town progression. Not at all.

Because I don't understand what you and Eira were playing at earlier. I'll go for either one if you want to make a case for which one you think is better for me when I get back.

@Crescent

OH just want to point out that Corwinoid mentions me and not Elsa here.
Don't know how this affects your Elsa/Corwin read.

i've made the same mistake reading elsa's name as mine lol.

[Elsa Jay]

He was directly quoting me in that post so I still think it's better to assume he meant me.
Elsa
Eira

Yeah i and l look similar enough and s and r are next to each other in the alphabet. Very easy mistake.

[Elsa Jay]

Oh wait wait. He was quoting me and mentioning you at the same time. He meant our little back and forth before that moment. I thought he was just talking about me and Clidd's vote.

[Eiralox]

I liked Crescent and Clidd at the time. Re-liking Crescent again after realizing that her mindset was townie against you but frustrated. Sometimes when I say majority I guess I mean "majority of people I trust". Or I inflated Cres saying it alot to more people saying it then actual people.

This may sound stupid but I'm tired and it's been on my mind and re-reading added to it. I was siding with Eira more from that argument they were having with Cres. I didn't wanna interrupt it either, so now I feel less better Cres but not enough for her to be my target today in the slightest. Day 2 though after we see some flips I'll add this and my previous list and see something happen.

Remaking my list now.

Townist:
Eiralox (definitely way better the before)
Vivax (seems to care enough about town to look into everything)
Alex (felt townie when fighting me)
Clidd (most gut but I think I played with them 2 years ago? Just feels good)

Null:
Crescent (down from before but definitely not killing today)
Corwin (Middle of the pack now so way better)
George (townier then the 3 below)
Goldfish (feels just... Like I haven't actually noticed a game changing post and feels like a wallflower))

Scummy:
Gera (don't know but they haven't rung townie immediately to me either so I'll trust the majority.)
Owen (hasn't responded well to anything really. Too obsessed)

Wouldn't care if dead but not for being evil. Just apathetic to it:
NotMaf (he is who he is)
Gibus (the guy I feel we should compromise on if we don't have a conclusion like my original plan stated)

For the record you were pretty null on Crescent. Clidd was the only one you greened who was going after Gera at the time.

[Eiralox]

@Crescent

OH just want to point out that Corwinoid mentions me and not Elsa here.
Don't know how this affects your Elsa/Corwin read.

i've made the same mistake reading elsa's name as mine lol.

@Crescent oh apologies lol both Elsa and I. I haven't been reading, assumed he was quoting you XD