Open 857 | Frienemies | Postgame

[Aristeia]

Dats I miss you <3

Can we please just stop with this? It's actually getting annoying, I signed up to play mafia, not for this... who do you think the mafia are/why?

You can always read my posts where I explain why I think vp baltar is mafia and engage with them.

[fireisredsir]

your implication seems to be that it is supposed to LOOK like it's useful but actually isn't, when like, i think the fact that it isn't is p surface level already

No, not at all. The goal, fmpov, was to be funny. It's a social game type post.

Look at her now trying to spin it as useful because it generated discussion. The goal is to buy good will, not find scum.

I could just see that from a mile away as soon as she posted it.

thought 1: ok thank you this is much more reasonable

thought 2: maybe ari has a point

[Gamma Emerald]

Not Voting (4): hutmeil, Malakittens, Something_Smart, Vulture

Yikesville, USA.

Reminder that S_S being there is normal

[VP Baltar]

Not Voting (4): hutmeil, Malakittens, Something_Smart, Vulture

Yikesville, USA.

Reminder that S_S being there is normal

I'm aware. Doesn't mean I will stop thinking it's stupid!

[Something_Smart]

Why's it stupid?

[VP Baltar]

Why's it stupid?

Because it is not easy to read you. You play a fairly selfish game in that sense where it is on other players to drag thoughts and motivations out of you instead of you just being transparent and using the one concrete tool we have (our vote) to take positions.

[Datisi]

have you considered asking him about his reads

[VP Baltar]

have you considered asking him about his reads

I will if I feel like it. But I think generally it's not good policy to support that type of play by accommodating it. Same way I don't spend a lot of time asking Not_Mafia questions unless I am looking for something specific. I usually just end up getting annoyed that I have to do it if I feel compelled. If others want to spend their time doing that with SS, feel free, but I don't have time to be daddy and ask how his day at school was.

[Something_Smart]

Because it is not easy to read you. You play a fairly selfish game in that sense where it is on other players to drag thoughts and motivations out of you instead of you just being transparent and using the one concrete tool we have (our vote) to take positions.

In my experience, that doesn't make it easier for people to read me. It just makes it easier for people to

think

they've read me. Especially since if I were to vote more liberally, it would be more of a reflection of random noise/sheeping than of how I actually feel.

[Datisi]

comparing s_s to n_m is kinda lol

anyway - what towngames of andante were you thinking about when you said this wasn't it, and why did you find my vulture vote odd?

@vpb

[VP Baltar]

Especially since if I were to vote more liberally, it would be more of a reflection of random noise/sheeping than of how I actually feel.

You not voting at all would imply you don't feel a thing if you're following that process through.

I think you choose not to vote D1 because it is easier and I'm sure it helps obfuscate when you roll scum. I think it's lazy, but you can certainly play however you choose. Who am I to tell you different.

[VP Baltar]

anyway - what towngames of andante were you thinking about when you said this wasn't it, and why did you find my vulture vote odd?

I think as recently as Ktane you can look and see Andante arguing things (even if you think they are not good points) in much less bad faith, and at least being in tune with the game state. Here, she seems more uncomfortable and is poking me in particular on things that I didn't even say. That only happens after there was pressure existing as well. It's naked opportunism fmpov.

The tier list comes across as an act, as I've stated. I don't recall her trying to gain social favor in Ktane at all.

As far as your vulture vote, there are lots of people who are in that same space as vulture, so it felt a little name out of a hat to me, rather than something I could see your thought process working toward in game.

[Andante]

The tier list isn't a freaking act. it was my genuine reads mixed with some stuff to hopefully make people laugh, I was trying to see some reactions, the tiers from top to bottom: People I'm concerned about, People I think are scummy, Null, and People I TR

And literally your reaction to it had me going "ok so I'm right on something?"

I don't understand why you are so tunneled on me, you hate me saying every little thing on my mind, then you hate SS saying nothing, like, you hate me saying everything on my mind, so I've just been following along, now like, a few people have definitely shifted tiers on that list since I've posted it, but that's where I was at. I have no idea what you're talking about in KTANE, after N1 I was so over that game (sorry dats... loved it though!!!)

[Something_Smart]

You not voting at all would imply you don't feel a thing if you're following that process through.

It means there's nobody low enough in my readlist to be comfortable saying I want to end the day and kill them. (And I don't think "pressure voting" produces positive results most of the time.)

I think you choose not to vote D1 because it is easier and I'm sure it helps obfuscate when you roll scum. I think it's lazy, but you can certainly play however you choose. Who am I to tell you different.

It's easier? Surely it's less strain on my fingers to type out a vote than it is to type all this. (And I don't know if you're directly claiming I deliberately tank my towngame to help my scumgame, but I definitely don't; I play to win each game.)

[implosion]

Implo, what are your thoughts on Penguin so far?

I'm curious why you pick this specific question to ask me.

I don't think he's done much alignment-indicative yet, but I expect to be able to get a read on him over not too much time.

[VP Baltar]

You not voting at all would imply you don't feel a thing if you're following that process through.

It means there's nobody low enough in my readlist to be comfortable saying I want to end the day and kill them. (And I don't think "pressure voting" produces positive results most of the time.)

I think you choose not to vote D1 because it is easier and I'm sure it helps obfuscate when you roll scum. I think it's lazy, but you can certainly play however you choose. Who am I to tell you different.

It's easier? Surely it's less strain on my fingers to type out a vote than it is to type all this. (And I don't know if you're directly claiming I deliberately tank my towngame to help my scumgame, but I definitely don't; I play to win each game.)

Let me put it this way, if we all took your approach to the game, I doubt town would ever win. I think that undermines this idea the pressure voting does nothing.

This is a boring line of discussion though. I'm not trying to change you.

On more interesting topics, do you think andante has been making good faith arguments this game?

[Something_Smart]

On more interesting topics, do you think andante has been making good faith arguments this game?

From an ISO skim, her arguments look like they're probably in good faith to me. Was there a particular argument you feel like she can't/probably doesn't actually believe?

[Datisi]

The tier list isn't a freaking act. it was my genuine reads mixed with some stuff to hopefully make people laugh, I was trying to see some reactions, the tiers from top to bottom: People I'm concerned about, People I think are scummy, Null, and People I TR

how did i go from maybe scummy, to being one of the two people you named as town (along with s_s), to then again you being concerned about me?

[VP Baltar]

Implo, what are your thoughts on Penguin so far?

I'm curious why you pick this specific question to ask me.

I don't think he's done much alignment-indicative yet, but I expect to be able to get a read on him over not too much time.

Feel like you have played with him more than me, which was why I asked. After a short appearance this game, which didn't help me read him much, he has just disappeared.

[Datisi]

I think as recently as Ktane you can look and see Andante arguing things (even if you think they are not good points) in much less bad faith, and at least being in tune with the game state.

---

As far as your vulture vote, there are lots of people who are in that same space as vulture, so it felt a little name out of a hat to me, rather than something I could see your thought process working toward in game.

thanks, i'll skim over her iso in that game once i get the time.

it kind of was. i think i saw someone say that vulture fell off, and it was a meh, good enough kinda vote

[Andante]

The tier list isn't a freaking act. it was my genuine reads mixed with some stuff to hopefully make people laugh, I was trying to see some reactions, the tiers from top to bottom: People I'm concerned about, People I think are scummy, Null, and People I TR

how did i go from maybe scummy, to being one of the two people you named as town (along with s_s), to then again you being concerned about me?

cause you're either definitely town or definitely maf, like, you're the only one I have like that. Like you're very towny yes. but it almost seems too towny to me. thus. you're in the concerned group for now - that probably made no sense, but basically I'm not gonna write you off as town and call it a day, I just don't think I'm fully sold on you being town yet.

Then again there's like 5 people I would LOVE more/some content from, not like these reads are set in stone yet. it's early d1

[Andante]

Implo, what are your thoughts on Penguin so far?

I'm curious why you pick this specific question to ask me.

I don't think he's done much alignment-indicative yet, but I expect to be able to get a read on him over not too much time.

Feel like you have played with him more than me, which was why I asked. After a short appearance this game, which didn't help me read him much, he has just disappeared.

how do you expect implosion to have a penguin read off nothing though? like even if implosion was a penguin expert... there's just nothing to read there?

[VP Baltar]

As far as quality of your scum game, wasn't it just in KTaNE that a bunch of people were going on about how your tone is similar between town and scum and that's not alignment indicative for you. I think it might have been Bell who said the best way to read you is to look at who you are pushing and why.

@Datisi he just said he's going off something "someone said" about my scum game... like, it wasn't even Bell, so he's like reaching for a reason to SR me? idk what he's doing, but like, it doesn't feel like town!VP is trying to read my slot at all... I am his STRONGEST SR so far. he's said that a bunch, and it's off "meta" that "bell said" I'm pretty sure it would've been catboi in ktane who said what he's referring to, but still like, using someone else's meta? when all VP's knowledge of me/meta should be saying I'm town... idk it's dumb, but I'm his number one SR for dumb reasons

@ss - this is very clearly not anywhere close to what I was saying, and I don't think if you're town you misread that badly. I think andante was skimming what I was saying to look for a point of defense, which is a fundamental misreading of the game.

She also claimed I asking her to case hutmeil when I asked a fairly straightforward question of if she had played with him before. Again, this is a case of bad faith arguing a defense that wasn't at all what was being said in the thread.

Those are just two off the top of my head.

[VP Baltar]

Implo, what are your thoughts on Penguin so far?

I'm curious why you pick this specific question to ask me.

I don't think he's done much alignment-indicative yet, but I expect to be able to get a read on him over not too much time.

Feel like you have played with him more than me, which was why I asked. After a short appearance this game, which didn't help me read him much, he has just disappeared.

how do you expect implosion to have a penguin read off nothing though? like even if implosion was a penguin expert... there's just nothing to read there?

What is the point of saying this? Do you think it was scummy I asked implo for a penguin take?

[Andante]

this is a case of bad faith arguing a defense that wasn't at all what was being said in the thread.

you sure it's not a case of misunderstanding?