Like keep in mind - the point of view of scum is that things are bleaker than they actually are when townies are converging on you. It seems like you need to do something big when in reality townies will more often than not just reeval in a weird way sometimes(see: my fred 180) and defy expectations.
retired
"1 thing I will give you Dk, I think you are very good at manipulating. I don't mean that in a bad way, I just think you [have] this way with yourself. You know what to say and when to say [it]." ~VFP
"Koba doesn't really have a scumrange/townrange, Koba will kill your pet cat to win a game" ~Pooky
In post 1701, DkKoba wrote:Like keep in mind - the point of view of scum is that things are bleaker than they actually are when townies are converging on you. It seems like you need to do something big when in reality townies will more often than not just reeval in a weird way sometimes(see: my fred 180) and defy expectations.
In post 1700, Lowell wrote:So are we talking ourselves out of a winning move here or what? Are we still looking for reasons not to vote whoever replaced Kenny?
Yes we are actually because Dunns towntold. Sorry, replacements suck, but the time for accountability for your prior takes in this game is fast approaching
lowell is afraid to directly engage the gamestate bc they are extremely frozen scum btw thats why they keep quipping at me with sarcastic remarks beacuse to acknowledge my points at all by doing anything but waving it away by saying "i was right on scum" means exposing a fake thought process. It means having to expose the fact that their pushes on people who are town are extremely fake.
Like its just hilarious how badly Lowell wants to completely ignore what Dunns has said because as scum, they NEED this flip to go through or they lose, so that then vig can kill me and they can try to have control back and kill maybe BBT and then somehow kill someone else in final 3 or hope eira mishshoots again.
The only time Lowell decides to engage the direct gamestate on day 2 for instance is to collect towncred on gamma lim and defend themselves from me saying they are tied to gamma. I will quote all of lowell's posts this dayphase to show how Lowell is literally unable to directly interact, while every other player has been able to.
In post 1410, Confidently Wrong wrote:See i would self vote here but i know that no one will listen to me abojt lowell so i want to thunderdome lowell here and now and no one contribute arguments for lowell. Let him make his case. I will SHOW YOU he is scum.
Honestly dude I'm not "making a case" for me being town, that's not how it works. And I've never been more right about a mafia game than this one. Besides, my "case" is that I was right about loftwing and pushed him even after others (you) were saying "oh nothing to see here, great claim!", then joined the push on gamma while others (you, again) were like "weeeelllll, let's give him more time I'm not so sure what about LOWELL???" And I've already heard your awesome response of "WIFOM DOUBLEBUS THATS WHAT YOU WANT US TO THINK OMG" enough that I don't care to hear it again.
In post 1482, Lowell wrote:VOTE: kenny. It's him or CW and I'm tired of arguing with CW.
In post 1486, Lowell wrote:I’m remembering why I quit this site for 5 years.
In post 1487, Lowell wrote:Just vote me, CW. I’m saying nothing more to you.
In post 1583, Lowell wrote:Checking in, mostly out this weekend. Still Kenny or CW for me, with fancy as unmovable town and irrel and eira not far behind.
In post 1700, Lowell wrote:So are we talking ourselves out of a winning move here or what? Are we still looking for reasons not to vote whoever replaced Kenny?
In post 1703, Lowell wrote:It’s getting harder and harder to play to my wincon. Can we finish this already?
In post 1705, Lowell wrote:Nah your case is boring and dumb and I’ve been kicking ass and taking names so I’ll pass.
In post 1709, Lowell wrote:Let’s just vote. Scum need three misses right? I’m good with calling fancy, eira, and irrel town and going from there.
We've had a *pleathora* of discussion, a lot of which lowell has acknowledged exists and has read due to the self defense. these are all of lowell's posts this dayphase. not a single post engaging the game or trying to solve. just trying to blindly follow this PoE that he has made to quickly kill townies.
I do notice there is a severe lack of Malcom being mentioned which leads me to believe that in the scenario where Lowell got what he wanted, after killing Kenny/Dunn, Me, and BBT, he intends to push on Malcom for the final kill and ride off the fact people are clearing him for hellbussing his partner.
huh.. i wonder how kenny managed to go to the bottom. surely it cant be because mala the miskill ended up flipping earlier than expected and the thread's interest in killing kenny wasnt a factor.
Okay I feel like this has escalated and I need to step back and reset.
CW, I’m sorry I’m being salty. My frustration is getting the best of me which is dumb. I appreciate the time you put into this game and your earnestness at playing to your wincon. Games need players like you even if players like me are sometimes assholes about it. I realize I’ve been tilting over the line from “fun and witty” to “kinda dickish” which isn’t fun for anyone.
to:dr Fair play on your case on me. Honestly I’m never going to have the energy to engage at your level so if you really think I’m scum (or want it to appear so! Also okay!) you should vote me. I’m probably not going to give you what you want but I’ll be nicer in the future.
I know you can't provide what I want to find you town because I do not believe that you are town. It's that simple. And my vote has been parked on your slot for a good portion of the game as it is right now.
ugh end this shit. im still where im at, not seeing toffee as more scum than cw/whoever is kenny. lowell is still townlock and cw continuied tunneling there along with bbt is well not gonna help imo.
VOTE: Confidently Wrong
Honestly just end this shit, If we're wrong we know what to do, but rn im not voting lowell. im not voting toffee. that's it.
In post 224, MalcolmTucker wrote:I'm not even sure it's that you're playing "weirdly" though, it's just that you're incredibly willing to hand out a free townread early on without much of a reason for doing so. I understand meta will often come into games and that's fine, but your posts could easily read as an opportunistic attempt to cosy up to Shoshin and get on her side early on if she's town and you're not.
In post 224, MalcolmTucker wrote:Your townblock, for what it's worth, gives me a similar fear...we're not that long into the game, I'm wary to put too much faith and trust in anyone at this stage.
This is fair. Does it make you think I'm scum trying to prop up a partner? Or just town who's likely to be wrong? Because, if the latter, it's only dangerous if you think one of my three townreads is scum. Let me know if you think so at any point.
Realistically I don't think we'll manage a consensus 5-6 person townblock with 0 scum. But I do think we can make one with, at most, 1 scum. And that's a pretty valuable potential town tool.
Like I get your paranoia but do you disagree with the concept of a townblock or just that i've picked three names already?
I don't disagree with the idea of a townblock in general, I'm just not too keen on ruling out certain players as mafia early on in D1. I don't particularly scum-read anyone you've put in there so far but we're only a couple of days into the game, ideally nobody should be completely free from pressure.
My gut-feeling right now is one of you/Shoshin could be mafia. Shoshin's push on me was weak and opportunistic, but if they're town and you know they're wrong could be a useful pocket for you, as I've stated. I'm liking your engagement a lot more this page though.
Its probably wrong but i am confident of at least 2
In post 437, Confidently Wrong wrote:Well I'm confident enough in lowell that I'd veto anyone i believe is spewed town off him, and i even actively townread loft off meta and malcom as well. Kenny i refuse to comment on because he did fool me recently in a somewhat embarassing way.
In post 438, Confidently Wrong wrote:I think Lowells reaction to a wagon starting on him however should be indicative enough that he isn't solving the game and is self pressing in a scummy way
Subject to change but time to cast a vote somewhere. Not confident their opportunistic jumping around from wagon to wagon is townie. The vote on Mala felt particularly opportunistic as I said earlier on.
I think fundamentally the reasons you are presenting for reading people is flawed and not consistent(results wise) in any way.
So I envision it shall be difficult to convince you similarly to the last time we played together.
Jumping around wagon to wagon is not a scum behavior.
Every other player I feel a confident enough reason to townread them.
kennyk is also never paired with Lowell
In post 543, Confidently Wrong wrote:I hope that satiates any concerns you have that my read is faulty based on reasoning you think could apply to you. I could go for a townblock including myself, Irrelephant, you(loftwing), CSF, Fredrick, and Fancy Pants
In post 708, Confidently Wrong wrote:also i fully think shoshin is town and never eliminate and the only reason their reads are so bonkers is because theyre both misclearing the most obvious scum and misreading an easily findable townie for what I believe are incorrect reasons to label someone as mafia.
In post 710, Confidently Wrong wrote:shoshin please cite a single thought from Eira you thought was towny. Because I guarantee you binned them town for posting a lot and being pushed by someone you are currently confbiasing into a scumteam for defending your top scumread.
In post 723, Confidently Wrong wrote:If you want to be obtuse, I think you are town because your thoughts are obviously independent and I can trace how you reached conclusions.
I disagree with your conclusions, and think the process is wrong. But its a towny process.
In post 724, Confidently Wrong wrote:If you want to play with your ego and get mad and vote me for disagreeing with you go ahead, but don't be surprised when it doesn't help win the game for town.
for visibility
In post 728, Confidently Wrong wrote:I am at a point where I can call every one of these players town with confidence, if I am wrong about *any* of them it is at worst only 1 in my humble opinion.
And then to add on to that, I would say Mala after her recent postings and Kenny, are both also townreads for me although I am not confident enough to lock them in. Mala is closer to townlocking than Kenny here in this case.
This leaves us with a trio of BBT/Lowell/Eiralox
In post 735, Confidently Wrong wrote:No I think Shoshin or MalcomT is not that useful right now and I think they are town
In post 785, Irrelephant11 wrote:CW could be scum trying to power a miselim through. I think loftwing is a pretty good flip
We should consider making a flip happen sooner rather than later because this weekend is a holiday weekend for everyone in the US and we have about 2.5 days left in this game day, during which the American players might barely post (e.g. me, I'll be hanging with family)
What signs do you see me being scum?
And why is Loftwing a good flip? Over Eira even?
In post 820, Confidently Wrong wrote:Shoshin i will be extremely dissapointed if you help town lose this game because you think your solutions are the only correct ones.
In post 821, Confidently Wrong wrote:Loftwing i get the vibes thing on Fancy but im pretty sure they are town
I know you're trying your best to help people find you and I'm sorry there are stubborn townies this game being unfair to thay and intentionally ignoring it.
In post 822, FancyPants wrote:It's hard to vote off Loftwing based on your input because your reasoning for him being Town is meta related, and when I did my dive (admittedly before I knew he was an alt) I didn't find the same.
As for your case on Eira I think I understand your jist but what I don't see is why "Eira is just wrong and bad at cases." is a worse explanation. Additionally it's partially supported by your surety of everyone else's alignment (you could only know Eira is making reads based on knowing everyone's alignment if you ALSO know everyone's alignment, I hope that makes sense).
I understand you could just be that sure of yourself, or at least pretending to be but it's kinda weird and difficult to just sheep.
I'm willing to compromise on Lowell as a "let's avoid loftwing vs eira" thing.
I'm not feeling Loftwing *at all* and I'm seeing their towngame here.
VOTE: Lowell
also BBT's last post being actually towny making me feel better about untownlocking irrelephant in my reads... because now I got a wild potential world of Irrelephant/Eira/Lowell
So you said earlier that you feel there's scum pushing Loftwing, no?
Well, if you look back, both Lowell and Eira switched their vote to Loftwing once a wagon on themselves started building.
My conclusion off that was that they were trying to self preserve by voting out Loftwing, rather than being a townie who organically found Loftwing scummy.
In post 956, MalcolmTucker wrote:I've not particularly SR'd Fredrick for most of the game (found the slot hard to read initially), but I think BBT is very much town, going to take a proper look at their case on Fredrick and see where I stand.
Lowell's posting hasn't screamed townie at me, but some of their recent responses don't indicate a scum player trying to stay on the good side of town either.
Fredrick is town, probably PR, we are NOT voting there.
he has clearly played in a non agenda way do not fucking counterwagon them last second.,
In post 966, Confidently Wrong wrote:Nevermind the fact lowell has completely ignored me this whole game while I have pushed them probably the hardest - a fun little tactic.
Lowell/Eira are blatantly paired and Fred is in my townblock. I will vehemently oppose fred unless you have an actual good case there.
In post 969, Confidently Wrong wrote:Your case implies Irrelephant scum which is why I'm asking because I believe that slot is actually not as town as I first believed.
I admit I'm mostly scumreading Lowell for how they defend Eira in such a subtle yet overt manner.
Fredrick is also here defending Eira without explaination.
TBH
I feel a little less against it purely for the fact Fredrick has gone against my own reads so
i pray that my read on irrelephant is wrong because if irrelephant is scum i see you being tunneled in on that slot being town and being pocketed to no end.
asking you directly to make sure when you end up in limlo that you actually critically think about *why* you are there and why other people are there.
In post 1089, Confidently Wrong wrote:Illl be honest i had lower confidence that loftwing was town after their claim but i was extremely tunneled on eira who was unaligned there
Having a scum flip means i can delete next scum tho
CW
44 Fancy Vote
89 Asks Shoshin why FAncy is town
108 Reaffirms Pants Tunnel
111 Agrees with Lowell, votes CSF
157 Votes Fred for secret-sharing gambit
200 Votes Mala"I want pressure on this slot so i can start solving the game from slots i feel Comfortable solving fast"
431 "Mala/Lowell/eiralox is a team I'd lock in rn gth
Its probably wrong but i am confident of at least 2"
257 Malcolm has gut feel Irrel/Shoshin could be mafia, CW says they are town
286 Lockstown CSF
287 "Still gonna tunnel mala until she towntells"
^^One of the summiest sentences to me
295 Loft is town
296 Lets sort by post count
I picked up on this and mentioned it a view times to explain CW D1 but no one seems to have picked up on this.
371 Vote Kenny
385 Vote Lowell
402 "Loftwing is town, unvote them and vote scumclaimed lowell"
421 "The claimed mafia lowell spewed them town"
430 "Whats funny was that i changed my read on fancy bc of lowell so cheers thanks for the free town"
Another lazy townread on par with the CSF reads and to a lesser extent the comment about mala
^^^ sorting by post-count coming to fruition here, Note, as I mentioned D1, that CW seems to be going after inactives but never adds Shoshin to that grouping, later townreading Shosh and making sure to display it for all and posterity to see.
