Open 861: The Turing Test [game over]

[Datisi]

vote count 1.02

with 13 votes in play, it takes 7 to make a decision. day 1 ends in (expired on 2022-08-11 09:45:00).

yeet

Loki Dokie [2]:

Dannflor, Roden

Vivax [2]:

Radical Rat, furtiveglance

Donempire [2]:

GuiltyLion, Aristeia

GuiltyLion [1]:

Donempire

Dannflor [1]:

Loki Dokie

furtiveglance [1]:

Vivax

not voting [4]:

KittyTacky, kutiplz, Bell, fireisredsir

mod notes

~ replacing Donempire.
~ this is a mod note.

[Dannflor]

Vivax almost seems... too scummy to be scum

[Radical Rat]

Vivax almost seems... too scummy to be scum

Code: Select all

Historical records indicate that this is a common excuse used for hiding in plain sight. We should not grant our glorious AI master's reprieve simply because they make no effort to lower themselves to the level of appearing human

[Vivax]

Vivax almost seems... too scummy to be scum

Great read off so little
Thought my Loki defense would look rather sketchy since I didn't communicate at the time I changed my mind on him before furtiveglance came in.

[Dannflor]

Yeah I'm not necessarily town reading him I just find his posts shocking

[Loki Dokie]

UNVOTE:

Trying to decide now on Roden or Vivax because Roden has never wrongly sr me and he was in Terminator so unlike Dann, he definitely knows who I am. Vivax’s 180 on me is hella weird as well,

@Roden tell me how I’m different here than in Terminator and if you know my main, your vote on me is even worse,

[Vivax]

Yeah I'm not necessarily town reading him I just find his posts shocking

Were you able/willing to get behind the point on Furtive?
Why would the 'either way' be so salient to them as town to the point of making a scumread?

Not to take away from your intention of voting Loki.

[Loki Dokie]

Actually Vivax was in Terminator as well, so he doesn’t get a pass for that.

[Loki Dokie]

Vivax almost seems... too scummy to be scum

That’s actually his scum meta. His alignments is really obvious. I’ve seen him as both alignments, so that shouldn’t be a reason to clear him.

And @Dann, why was Fire jumping off of me not some huge wake up call for you?

[Loki Dokie]

I also have played with scum!furtive before (but he doesn’t know it) and it’s not a lot to go on yet but he seems different here than in that game.

[Radical Rat]

Actually Vivax was in Terminator as well, so he doesn’t get a pass for that.

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In fairness, Vivax didn't arrive in Terminator until after your fragile flesh body was destroyed. Similarly, Roden was replaced relatively early. However, even if these weren't the case, it seems unfair to expect that just because others have played in a game with you that they will now be able to read you perfectly. Especially if you are a competent scum player.

Your conclusion is likely correct regarding Vivax, but your reasoning seems distinctly inorganic.

[Loki Dokie]

At least one of the votes on me has been from scum.

And obviously not fire since I would have no way of guessing that he would know who I am, so scum!him would have never said he knew who I was and jumped off of me like that.

[Dannflor]

Yeah I'm not necessarily town reading him I just find his posts shocking

Were you able/willing to get behind the point on Furtive?
Why would the 'either way' be so salient to them as town to the point of making a scumread?

Not to take away from your intention of voting Loki.

I think your tone has been awkward, the "either way" included. I think it's a fine reason to vote you at this stage of the game. I'm not sure how to read your tone yet and whether or not I should be excusing it.

I don't at all get your logic in the OMGUS vote on furtiveglance. It's fairly obvious to me that furtiveglance had a tonal read on you.

[Loki Dokie]

Actually Vivax was in Terminator as well, so he doesn’t get a pass for that.

Code: Select all

In fairness, Vivax didn't arrive in Terminator until after your fragile flesh body was destroyed. Similarly, Roden was replaced relatively early. However, even if these weren't the case, it seems unfair to expect that just because others have played in a game with you that they will now be able to read you perfectly. Especially if you are a competent scum player.

Your conclusion is likely correct regarding Vivax, but your reasoning seems distinctly inorganic.

Roden has never wrongly sr me and he was around in the beginning but I don’t tr the votes on me regardless because they’re at the best, hella dumb because smart town would realize have multiple people jump on someone like that for no good reason whatsoever is extremely suss.

Dann has also never wrongly sr me either but for some reason he hasn’t figured out who I am yet. Dann would never vote me as either alignment here if he had any idea who I was.

If town. he isn’t terrible at reading me, if scum, he’s not a masochist, so instead of trying to determine whether or not he’s correctly reading or pocketing me, I have instead need to determine if he’s wrongly sr me or shitpushing me but rn, Roden and Vivax look the worst to me.

[Loki Dokie]

Dann’s posting beside his bad vote on me look decent, so meh.

[GuiltyLion]

ok I am feeling good about a Dann TR currently. I am not sure if I should be in the business of sharing every townread this game but I do like working with Dann so I'm gonna throw that one out there

I still kinda gut scumread everything fire is posting, I don't like that they unvoted Loki and didn't vote anywhere else.

I also don't like Rat describing my case as "nitpicking" in 175 - calling out the logical slip up is arguably a reach, like I understand that particular point is not necessarily AI, but the overall argument I was making was that I felt fire's TR on Ari was premeditated, which is definitely a cause for concern. Also, I want to clarify my understanding of that post in general - RR, are you using "human"/"AI" as stand-ins for "town"/"mafia", or are you just making a joke about the flavor and Bell's comment as opposed to making a read on me?

I feel like I know who Loki is and I have a lot of trouble with his playstyle because he can not fathom or accept any suspicion or scrutiny on him in any circumstances, but so far I am fine with shelving him as town for now and judging him based off his read accuracy when we get some flips - further if fire is scum then I def think Loki's spewed town by their interaction

Other thing I found odd:

the wagon is on a slot getting replaced, they are effectively dead votes

The slot's scummy actions are not undone, we should wait for a replacement though.

a) What are DonEmpire's scummy actions, in your own words?
b) Why are you not voting the slot if this is how you feel? Better yet, why are you not voting anybody?

[Dannflor]

VOTE: Roden

Join me here Loki

[Loki Dokie]

Lolki seems townie to me from this:

one down four to go

I’m town and this flashwagon on me is as scummy as fuck.

Either way, great tone.

I suspect Vivax for this post, the 'either way' thing is too conscious of mafia faking tone.

VOTE: Vivax

With or without TMI on Loki?
Changed my mind on him, got goosed by AtE.

VOTE: Loki

Loki's alignment doesn't matter, I'm saying you're mafia. Why are you trying to obfuscate/confuse the issue? Why would you even care whether you're 'mafia with someone' or not if you're town? Also this turnaround has not helped you.

If you have no opinion on Loki and think his alignment doesn't matter, me saying either way shouldn't bother you one bit unless you know something of Loki that I don't, which is probs that he's mafia.
So I naturally look to you like a townie who should appear scummy for that.

You are lock scum to me for this fyi.

VOTE: furtiveglance

I dislike your “lockscum” read when there’s nothing remotely scummy about his post.

[GuiltyLion]

the wagon is on a slot getting replaced, they are effectively dead votes

The slot's scummy actions are not undone, we should wait for a replacement though.

VOTE: Roden

I could sheep this

[Loki Dokie]

ok I am feeling good about a Dann TR currently. I am not sure if I should be in the business of sharing every townread this game but I do like working with Dann so I'm gonna throw that one out there

I still kinda gut scumread everything fire is posting, I don't like that they unvoted Loki and didn't vote anywhere else.

I also don't like Rat describing my case as "nitpicking" in 175 - calling out the logical slip up is arguably a reach, like I understand that particular point is not necessarily AI, but the overall argument I was making was that I felt fire's TR on Ari was premeditated, which is definitely a cause for concern. Also, I want to clarify my understanding of that post in general - RR, are you using "human"/"AI" as stand-ins for "town"/"mafia", or are you just making a joke about the flavor and Bell's comment as opposed to making a read on me?

I feel like I know who Loki is and I have a lot of trouble with his playstyle because he can not fathom or accept any suspicion or scrutiny on him in any circumstances, but so far I am fine with shelving him as town for now and judging him based off his read accuracy when we get some flips - further if fire is scum then I def think Loki's spewed town by their interaction

Other thing I found odd:

the wagon is on a slot getting replaced, they are effectively dead votes

The slot's scummy actions are not undone, we should wait for a replacement though.

a) What are DonEmpire's scummy actions, in your own words?
b) Why are you not voting the slot if this is how you feel? Better yet, why are you not voting anybody?

Why does scum!fire unvote me based on correctly guessing my main and it seems you have as well? Wouldn’t it make way more sense for scum!fire to keep pretending he has no idea who I am? Because there’s absolutely no way I would ever know the difference.

[GuiltyLion]

Why does scum!fire unvote me based on correctly guessing my main and it seems you have as well? Wouldn’t it make way more sense for scum!fire to keep pretending he has no idea who I am? Because there’s absolutely no way I would ever know the difference.

1. you're a tremendously difficult slot for scum to push if you're town, and 2. fire may have felt other players would figure out who you are and expect them to figure it out as well, which becomes suspicious if fire pretends not to

[fireisredsir]

I also have played with scum!furtive before (but he doesn’t know it) and it’s not a lot to go on yet but he seems different here than in that game.

agreed, mostly. one of the early jokes pinged as slightly similar but he feels less like he's pressured to overexplain everything and is able to just vibe more. could just be going for a different style of play but seems slightly towny for now

[Loki Dokie]

I mean, someone made a case, or as much as you can make a case at this point of the game on another slot. Isn't that worth reading and either vocally agreeing with or disagreeing or drawing some conclusion from since it's one of the only bits of content in the game so far?

I'm not asking for theses or for everyone to be all caught up or have developed thoughts. It just strikes me as odd when people are present and commenting and posting but ignoring content *especially* at this stage of the game

Not for me it isn’t. I’m actually exhausted rn and this game just literally started, so if you’re town, your vote on me was probably just silly, since you don’t appear to be taking any of that into account but I will reread it tomorrow.

VOTE: Loki

Dann's obvtown here

This vote on me based off this post makes 0 sense. Why does your reading Dann as “obvtown” make my vote scum as opposed to wrong?

And how does town!Roden completely overlook the obvious nuance of this post?

[fireisredsir]

GL is right that i probably do also unvote there as scum, but idk if as scum i actually care to go back and check past games to get a baseline feel for how you play and in the process figure out who you are, since that was done with the intention of sorting whether your reaction was as scummy as it felt or typical for you (dann, here is an example of where doing that ended up being useful!)

if at all id probably do it before voting you in the first place to see if it would be dangerous to provoke you for a reaction in the way that i did (and i would have figured out that yes it would be)

[GuiltyLion]

Loki how would you describe your scumgame? since you are a heavy meta player I'd like to understand what you think are the meta differences between your own town and scumplay