Mini Normal 2279: VGSR - GAME OVER

[Frogsterking]

I think like

several people

in this game are sincerely arguing teamsolves in early d1 and

I just do not get it.

Delta could you elaborate on the furtive read

You, eiralox, and Delta

have all been doing it quite a lot iirc

I'm hoping to get AI information.

It seemed like you were holding something back

so I asked you questions.

What exactly about me thinking

it's a bad idea to gamesolve on day 1

have you that impression? These questions kind of feel like posting for the sake of posting honestly

[Ausuka]

Are you trying to imply that I believe the scumteam is exactly you, eiralox or delta while voting none of you? If not I have no idea what you're trying to say

[Ausuka]

If you think that for some reason me not explicitly stating the people I'm talking about (even though I think it's pretty obvious who has been pushing associative reads here) is holding something back I don't think that explains the second question

[Frogsterking]

"I want Frog, Delta and Eir to stop introducing the idea of a team solve because it makes it easier for scum to misdirect the conversation"

is a different post from what you wrote in 257 and the difference is AI. I asked you questions to establish why you might write an abomination like 257 if you're Town. If you don't want me to ask you annoying questions then bother to mention who you're talking about and why. End of discussion.

[Ausuka]

It's not substantially different. Anyone else can correct me if I'm wrong but I think it's really obvious why I would criticise team solving. I think it's also extremely obvious who I was talking about there. Like super extremely blatantly obvious to the point where I do not think this is a real train of thought from you.

[Ausuka]

Like hmm who could this post about several people making teamsolves in the thread be about??? Maybe the people who have been doing that repetitively, in this thread, open for everyone to read

[DeltaWave]

"Buuuut I put you in lurk bin so anything u say against me is false cos u perked up at me never saw me etcetera etcetera" which is such an absurd approach to my approach that, while it humored me, it's not something i'm going to humor.

not my point. i lumped you in with the other sideliners and made a comment that there's got to be scum within that group. you then immediately started to tunnel on me despite never mentioning me before in this game - indicating that you're playing self-defense rather than communicating a genuine scumread. or in other words, you're acting like i hit a little too close to a nerve.

but........ time for me to consume biomatter and view pixel films. i'll go through your ISO tomorrow with a fine comb. I'll see if the vibes that your latest actions have conveyed are wholly consistent with your past iterations.

oh yeah of course. accuse first, read later. i'm sure you'll hop on the bandwagon when you get back. it's silly for you to even pretend like there's some rational basis behind what you're saying - other than "I was successfully sitting things out on the sidelines until DW called me out, now I have to defend myself somehow."

[furtiveglance]

I was out today. I'll be able to post more this time tomorrow. In short, Deltawave has been giving some good stuff and I quite like it, enough to unvote. I think Eiralox looks worse from their back and forth and I think the "I faked a read to test reactions" is easily faked and not amazing townplay in any case. BBT is a bit sus but not enough to vote yet. I'll vote Juice because they laughed about being sussed for RVS or something and it was weird.

VOTE: Juice

[hoppip]

Spoiler:

Here are some reads of mine.

Consensus (or close to consensus) reads I have:

Frogsterking, Ausuka, Inutile, Hoppip Town

Reads that aren't consensus (I think):

Nuclear Ghandhi Town, Mohab sus, DeltaWave sus

i would rather this not continue to detract from us finding mafias

This has big "how do you do fellow kids" energy

VOTE: Inutile

I sus DeltaWave for this, and I think their delayed omgus style interaction with hoppip (83) also is mafia.

VOTE: DeltaWave

I'd like if you could elaborate on your townreads.

Can you elaborate on your thoughts on 83 as well? I really do not see what you're seeing there

I missed this intially because I posted right after. I townread you for the progression on inutile, it looked natural. Frogsterking is making a lot of reads early on which I usually find towny. Inutile and Hoppip both just seem to have an innocent kind of energy, I can see their approaches to the game being from a town perspective.

83 interested me because DeltaWave says Hoppip is acting sus after their interaction in 82, in which Hoppip said DeltaWave 'shaded Inutile for superficial reasons', which is what it looked like to me as well. Hence I called it a delayed omgus.

Ok, the townreads don't do a lot for me but to be fair it is very early in the game, so

I don't think hoppip was really calling Delta suspicious in post 82. He seemed to be saying that Delta's point is bad but he's not necessarily scum for it. In any case, I'm still not really sure what you mean and why you find it suspicious - it's only one post after so not really delayed, and anyway don't you think town could suspect someone who they're in some sort of confrontation with? The idea of 'delayed omgus' just feels off to me honestly.

Ok, you're right that delayed omgus isn't the right term. It's a knee-jerk reaction nonetheless, it felt to me that DeltaWave didn't want to allow Hoppip to put a bit of sus on them without getting the last word. As to whether or not Hoppip did put sus on DeltaWave, I would argue the answer is yes, whether intentional or otherwise. They said that DeltaWave 'looked bad' to them. So I read into that a bit, I thought DeltaWave looked worse from the whole interaction. I understand your issue with buzzwords like 'omgus', I have the same thing. But in this case I thought it was notable that DeltaWave didn't let it slide, they said they would respond later but made the point of saying that hoppip was being 'somewhat sus'.

Delta wanting to get the last word was interesting to me. Makes it seem like it was for the sake of their ego rather than agenda-driven. I get the feeling that they tend to suspect people based on their own perspective of how Mafia should be played instead of an individual player-to-player basis.

When I get some free time, I'll look through their past games and see if this is something that they can recreate in their scum games.

VOTE: Delta

Doesn't seem like they have any recent completed games, last one was seven years ago. I think it looks pretty bad that they didn't think to mention that a meta dive on their past games would be fruitless and out of date. I think that's worth a pressure vote or two.

Besides, who doesn't love competing wagons?

[hoppip]

Like hmm who could this post about several people making teamsolves in the thread be about??? Maybe the people who have been doing that repetitively, in this thread, open for everyone to read

Do you think it's fake confusion? Or do you think they're playing dumb?

[hoppip]

[quote="In

Do what I said or I won't explain ANYTHING to you.

.........................................................

Spoiler: ???

Yes, daddy.

Not me thinking the same thing when I read that

Of all the posts I made this game, this is the one you found the most interesting?

Yes, actually. Your posts lack seasoning. I get the sense you're holding back in some way.

[Frogsterking]

Objection your honor; they're leading the witness.

Like hmm who could this post about several people making teamsolves in the thread be about??? Maybe the people who have been doing that repetitively, in this thread, open for everyone to read

Do you think it's fake confusion? Or do you think they're playing dumb?

[inutile]

Spoiler:

Here are some reads of mine.

Consensus (or close to consensus) reads I have:

Frogsterking, Ausuka, Inutile, Hoppip Town

Reads that aren't consensus (I think):

Nuclear Ghandhi Town, Mohab sus, DeltaWave sus

i would rather this not continue to detract from us finding mafias

This has big "how do you do fellow kids" energy

VOTE: Inutile

I sus DeltaWave for this, and I think their delayed omgus style interaction with hoppip (83) also is mafia.

VOTE: DeltaWave

I'd like if you could elaborate on your townreads.

Can you elaborate on your thoughts on 83 as well? I really do not see what you're seeing there

I missed this intially because I posted right after. I townread you for the progression on inutile, it looked natural. Frogsterking is making a lot of reads early on which I usually find towny. Inutile and Hoppip both just seem to have an innocent kind of energy, I can see their approaches to the game being from a town perspective.

83 interested me because DeltaWave says Hoppip is acting sus after their interaction in 82, in which Hoppip said DeltaWave 'shaded Inutile for superficial reasons', which is what it looked like to me as well. Hence I called it a delayed omgus.

Ok, the townreads don't do a lot for me but to be fair it is very early in the game, so

I don't think hoppip was really calling Delta suspicious in post 82. He seemed to be saying that Delta's point is bad but he's not necessarily scum for it. In any case, I'm still not really sure what you mean and why you find it suspicious - it's only one post after so not really delayed, and anyway don't you think town could suspect someone who they're in some sort of confrontation with? The idea of 'delayed omgus' just feels off to me honestly.

Ok, you're right that delayed omgus isn't the right term. It's a knee-jerk reaction nonetheless, it felt to me that DeltaWave didn't want to allow Hoppip to put a bit of sus on them without getting the last word. As to whether or not Hoppip did put sus on DeltaWave, I would argue the answer is yes, whether intentional or otherwise. They said that DeltaWave 'looked bad' to them. So I read into that a bit, I thought DeltaWave looked worse from the whole interaction. I understand your issue with buzzwords like 'omgus', I have the same thing. But in this case I thought it was notable that DeltaWave didn't let it slide, they said they would respond later but made the point of saying that hoppip was being 'somewhat sus'.

Delta wanting to get the last word was interesting to me. Makes it seem like it was for the sake of their ego rather than agenda-driven. I get the feeling that they tend to suspect people based on their own perspective of how Mafia should be played instead of an individual player-to-player basis.

When I get some free time, I'll look through their past games and see if this is something that they can recreate in their scum games.

VOTE: Delta

Doesn't seem like they have any recent completed games, last one was seven years ago. I think it looks pretty bad that they didn't think to mention that a meta dive on their past games would be fruitless and out of date. I think that's worth a pressure vote or two.

Besides, who doesn't love competing wagons?

wait

...

what?

why would you expect town!delta wave to mention this unprompted?

[inutile]

why would you expect town!delta wave to mention this unprompted?

like

i am asking why would this be potentially scum indicative to you?

i guess i don't really get at all why this in particular 'looks bad' to you

[inutile]

Anyone else can correct me if I'm wrong but I think it's really obvious why I would criticise team solving.

hm i actually think mentioning potential associative connections probably fine and good

like it's not like that means 'these two are mafias together!!!'

but rather oh there might be something to this

like something like furtiveglance has now started two wagons since nuclear gandhi became the leading wagon, let me note this for myself and others

seems fine and good yeah

but sure the pushing hard partners like eiralox was doing a bit maybe i can see what you're saying

but even then that helpful for others to look at maybe try to connect the dots that eiralox connecting

see if

a) it makes sense

and

b) if it seems reasonable perspective wise how it came to be for town et cetera

[inutile]

why would you expect town!delta wave to mention this unprompted?

like

i am asking why would this be potentially scum indicative to you?

i guess i don't really get at all why this in particular 'looks bad' to you

i guess maybe unless you thought you saying you were going to look at their past games

was

a prompt for delta wave to say, 'hey that would be fruitless i haven't played any games in seven years' or whatever

but, uh,

i still do not understand how delta wave not doing so would be more likely to come from a mafia

[inutile]

someone scum reads me for my RVS - ROFLCOPTER

not really sure i even buy into the narrative that that was an rvs vote

like a page 8 random vote on the leading wagon seems kinda unlikely for a lot of reasons

though i get that you've also not played in some time so maybe different expectations but still seems unlikely

yeah

[inutile]

Gandhi's not coming back lol

Gandhi was scum's savior and they got SHUT DOWN

it kinda feels like

like you’re playing a different game

like i still don’t really understand where this survey thing is going

thought it was going to be one of those like

‘how much experience do you have playing mafia?’

things people sometimes do for unknown reasons as they seem not so beneficial to me

but i guess not? at this point in the game so idk

and the connections you’re making harder to follow

and!

at some point you said something about ausuka maybe having more that they weren’t saying

and your expectation that that be stated kinda weird since you’re playing the ‘i have a secret read game’

which is like

either your read is worth sharing and should be shared

or!

it is not in which case why even say you have the aforementioned read

but anyway!

yeah kinda maybe feels that way wrt nuclear gandhi but also people are busy et cetera we shall see

[Frogsterking]

like i still don’t really understand where this survey thing is going

thought it was going to be one of those like

‘how much experience do you have playing mafia?’

No it's much better than that.

[inutile]

like i still don’t really understand where this survey thing is going

thought it was going to be one of those like

‘how much experience do you have playing mafia?’

No it's much better than that.

is it like

something you planned on doing before the game started (regardless of alignment?)?

or did something that occurred lead you to think ‘ya know what, a survey might be just the thing to find the mafias here’?

[Frogsterking]

and the connections you’re making harder to follow

Your posts are difficult to follow so glass houses. I still think you're Town and have a tendency to make good points. I accept that I have to work a little bit harder to understand what you're saying than I do with most other players. I prefer you reciprocate that attitude toward my slot.

[Frogsterking]

something you planned on doing before the game started (regardless of alignment?)?

Yes.

[inutile]

and the connections you’re making harder to follow

Your posts are difficult to follow so glass houses. I still think you're Town and have a tendency to make good points. I accept that I have to work a little bit harder to understand what you're saying than I do with most other players. I prefer you reciprocate that attitude toward my slot.

i certainly understand that and am willing to put in the work to do so

however the questions i would often like answered to help fill in those dots have already been asked and you refused to answer on more than one occasion

like for some things there can be implied reasoning but some of your ‘x is town/scum’ type of statements it is like, i am not and would not like to be a mind reader

but also understand maybe you are asking for patience and that is something i am trying to be better about

[inutile]

like for some things there can be implied reasoning but some of your ‘x is town/scum’ type of statements it is like, i am not and would not like to be a mind reader

or the 'ausuka there are findable scums posting' type of thing

it is like, unless your purpose was to specifically see what ausuka would come back with, hard to see i guess

[Frogsterking]

at some point you said something about ausuka maybe having more that they weren’t saying

and your expectation that that be stated kinda weird since you’re playing the ‘i have a secret read game’

which is like

either your read is worth sharing and should be shared

There's a significant amount of content that I'm holding back. I have an overactive imagination which is a double edged sword, and I don't think all of my ideas are worth sharing. I also think sometimes it's better to let things play out.

I mentioned my reads because I was excited about them because I think I have a good grasp on this game. I also believe it's best not to share them at this time in order to avoid the effects of

response bias

. My intention is to play significantly more forthcoming in the last half of D1 and beyond.