Newbie 2105 | Game Over

[Tapiocaphobe]

it was a hunch

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Based on what?

[Bellaphant]

My only info yesterday though was Spartan maybe wasn't scum.

[Alianna]

We haven't had a VC in a while so here's VC 3.2!

BlueBloodedToffee (1): Tapiocaphobe

Not Voting (5): BlueSnakelet, BlueBloodedToffee, Looker, Bellaphant, Spartan117

With 6 players alive, it takes 4 votes to secure an elimination or 3 to secure a no-elimination.

The day deadline is in (expired on 2022-12-04 19:56:36).

[Bellaphant]

@Bella and BlueSnake: What motivated you to choose each of your targets?

Why does this matter?

Who do you think is scum?

Ugh this is such a weird question. I really want to call the scum team bbt and Spartan for hard defending each other while pushing a tapio elim but is this town??

[BlueSnakelet]

I don't think so. I really feel that BBT and Spartan are trying to get a miselimination Today at all costs.

Failing that, I can see a BBT/Looker duo too. Either Spartan and BBT could be trying to draw votes away from Looker and into Tapioca, but I don't really see Spartan/Looker as a particularly likely option. Plus, Spartan was jailed Night 1 while a NK still occurred, so Spartan is a less likely suspected than BBT overall.

Either way, I think we should eliminate BBT today.

[Spartan117]

BlueSnake what do you think of us eliminating Tapio?

So in answer to my very specific question to you BlueSnake you are against elimming Tapio today?

Is that correct?

[Spartan117]

May I remind you that if we don't elim 1 scum in this vote the game is over as it will go from 4 Town and 2 scum to 2 Town and 2 scum which is a Scum Victory. So it is incredibly important we hit 1 of the two scum.

[Looker]

Is there a benefit to not answering my questions? I don't understand.

[Spartan117]

I don't think so. I really feel that BBT and Spartan are trying to get a miselimination Today at all costs.

Please tell me where I have made you think I am trying to get a miselim, I am hiding nothing bar 1 very slight concern, I have broken out all the possible combinations to make the situation as clear as possible to you. Including night action involvements.

Also you are currently only 99% Town for me still.

[Spartan117]

I am currently happy to eliminate anyone but Bella, she is the only person I trust, of course I want us to take our time and make this decision very carefully.

[Spartan117]

Is there a benefit to not answering my questions? I don't understand.

Looker would you be happy with a Tapio elim?

[Looker]

I would prefer BBT unless Tapioca has boldly led both miselims as scum

[Spartan117]

I am no longer convinced by my argument from Day 1. The fact that you weren't pushing for Greeting's elimination can be more easily explained by you being town, and having no reason to eliminate Greeting, then by being scum and having a 4D chess plan to gain a minuscule amount of towncred. After thinking about it a few times, it became obvious that the potential reward that Scum!Spartan would gain with it does not outweigh the risk of failing to eliminate Greeting.

This post which BBT pointed out previously is my only main reason that I'm holding onto my town read of your slot and believe your claim. I think it is between BBT, Tapio and Looker but game mechanics wise can't let myself rule out the possibility that you have played us but I think the option to salvage us from that situation isn't possible.

I will break my reasoning down more when I get in tonight between the 3 and would be personally happy to elim Tapio or Looker as I think that's where the scum team lies, I could see from their posts them flounder somewhat after the PRs revealed.

[Looker]

Okay so we have a jailkeeper and a tracker who is Bella and BlueSnake respectively provided there are no counter claims. We also have a mafia rollblocker.

The scum team thus must fall on 2 of
BBT, Spartan, Looker and Tapio.

Night 1 I was tracked and jailed, there was a night kill.
Night 2 BBT was jailed, there was no Night kill, Tapio was tracked and they visited no one, so if Tapio is scum they would have to be the mafia goon.

Phone posting stuff to my ISO for convenience

[Looker]

Spoiler: Full Setup List

Column A & Row 1:

Mafia Roleblocker, Mafia Goon, Town Cop, Town Doctor, Vanilla Townie x 5

Column A & Row 2:

Mafia Roleblocker, Mafia Goon, Town Jailkeeper, Town Tracker, Vanilla Townie x 5

Column A & Row 3:

Mafia Roleblocker, Mafia Goon, Town Mason x2, Vanilla Townie x 5

Column B & Row 1:

Mafia Rolecop, Mafia Goon, Town Tracker, Town Friendly Neighbor, Vanilla Townie x 5

Column B & Row 2:

Mafia Rolecop, Mafia Goon, Town Jailkeeper, Town Friendly Neighbor, Vanilla Townie x 5

Column B & Row 3:

Mafia Rolecop, Mafia Goon, Town Tracker, Town Doctor, Vanilla Townie x 5

Column C & Row 1:

Mafia Goon x 2, Town Cop, Vanilla Townie x 6

Column C & Row 2:

Mafia Goon x 2, Town Jailkeeper, Vanilla Townie x 6

Column C & Row 3:

Mafia Goon x 2, Town Mason x2, Vanilla Townie x 5

[BlueSnakelet]

It's because this elimination is so critical that I'm doubting the push on Tapioca. Mafia wants us to get it wrong just as much as we want to get it right.

Had you had been pushing for Tapioca alone, I would've been more inclined to believe you. In that case, I would think you were a townie with a correct push on mafia, with the Mafia not knowing what to do in response.

But as things stand the way they are, with both you and BBT pushing for Tapioca, I believe in either of two possibilities:

- You and BBT are mafia working together to miseliminate Tapioca.
- You're a townie with a

wrong

push on Tapioca, and BBT is mafia trying to help you miseliminate Tapioca.

[Spartan117]

Tapio is scum yeah?

It's because this elimination is so critical that I'm doubting the push on Tapioca. Mafia wants us to get it wrong just as much as we want to get it right.

Had you had been pushing for Tapioca alone, I would've been more inclined to believe you. In that case, I would think you were a townie with a correct push on mafia, with the Mafia not knowing what to do in response.

But as things stand the way they are, with both you and BBT pushing for Tapioca, I believe in either of two possibilities:

- You and BBT are mafia working together to miseliminate Tapioca.
- You're a townie with a

wrong

push on Tapioca, and BBT is mafia trying to help you miseliminate Tapioca.

Really? Like I can understand them two possibilities but you are completely eradicating other options one of which I think is true which includes Tapio being scum, if you are genuinely town you should be looking at it that all 4 of us could be scum, and in my position because I know im town and because I've experience with BBT in playing multiple games with him before where he was scum and me not seeing him playing the same thus reading him as town and the two of us individually reading tapio alongside Looker as scum which from my position town reading bbt makes sense and is a serious possibility.

[Spartan117]

Bear in mind I was scum reading tapio before any of this PR stuff was revealed, and I'm not saying BBT is definitely scum it's still a possibility for me as Bella could have stopped him from killing night 2, and that's a stronger possibility for you being one of the mafia Goons in a C2 Setup, and I'm holding onto that not being the case because of what I said in my 538. I hope you can see where I am coming from evaluating all the options, so I am not trying to achieve a miselim, I am trying my best to put everything out there for the 3 other remaining town to come together and elim the 2 mafia.

[Spartan117]

It's because this elimination is so critical that I'm doubting the push on Tapioca. Mafia wants us to get it wrong just as much as we want to get it right.

It typically feels to me that the mafia want it more than us because there are only 2 of then so they gotta try extra hard, as town it is easy to fall I to the mindset of there being other town and letting them do the work for us.

[Tapiocaphobe]

so we're on bbt/spartan or me/looker?

[Tapiocaphobe]

Bear in mind I was scum reading tapio before any of this PR stuff was revealed, and I'm not saying BBT is definitely scum it's still a possibility for me as Bella could have stopped him from killing night 2, and that's a stronger possibility for you being one of the mafia Goons in a C2 Setup, and I'm holding onto that not being the case because of what I said in my 538. I hope you can see where I am coming from evaluating all the options, so I am not trying to achieve a miselim, I am trying my best to put everything out there for the 3 other remaining town to come together and elim the 2 mafia.

why is bbt the n2 elim? like let's assume it's me/looker here, why are we shooting bbt?

[Tapiocaphobe]

i don't think spartan/looker shoot bbt either here? i think it's just bbt?

[Spartan117]

Had you had been pushing for Tapioca alone, I would've been more inclined to believe you. In that case, I would think you were a townie with a correct push on mafia, with the Mafia not knowing what to do in response.

There are 4 players left who could possibly be scum 1 of them is BBT 1 of them is me, as town I know its not me, in BBTs position if he is town he knows its not him, if we are town reading each other it only makes sense for us to see Looker and Tapio as the only true game solve if we believe our reads ofc I won't know till after the game and that's the same for you, Bella and the other town.

I was in a game not too long ago where BBT and another player called Rad were the scum team we had no kill for N1 or N2 the jailkeeper jailed the kill target N1 and Rad got jailed N2, and Rad had seemed town albeit I was concerned he was pocketing me. The scum team ended up winning even tho we had no night kill night 1 or 2 because of bad decisions on the day elims. So by no means like I said am I ruling BBT out as I've seen that happen before, I just get a feel from his play he is town even if we did get two town lims day 1 and 2, i was part of that too, and they did in fairness seem very suspect.

[Spartan117]

so we're on bbt/spartan or me/looker?

I think that's pretty much where we are at currently which is funny to me given my previous games with BBT.