Mini Normal 2285: GM [game over]

[Val89]

Why are we expecting a replacement?

Are people just making the assumption Sco won't respond to the prod?

[innocentvillager]

Seems like I am just misremembering then if both you and Kitty have the opposite impression of me

But regardless, I think Pooky’s push was the catalyst. If hes scum he used his bear sense to sniff out a viable push there and went for it.

[skitter30]

i mean i'm not sure i'm 'expecting' a replacement so much if the options are 'flip the slot now' or 'wait a few hours and if he doesn't show up replace the slot'
i'd rather the latter

pedit yeah i agree that his push was the catalyst for sure
that's why it doesn't make sense as a bus

[innocentvillager]

Why are we expecting a replacement?

Are people just making the assumption Sco won't respond to the prod?

Because they have like 3 hours or something to respond to the prod?

[skitter30]

i think he could be scum here tho

[innocentvillager]

If you are town I'm worried it's just a playstyle thing but like it feels like you are trying to manipulate everyone in the palm of hands

this isn't manipulative-pooky and this game is like the antithesis of him trying hard

He tried abnormally hard in the beginning I felt

Now hes kind of whatever i guess sure

Do you think his characterization of his own meta as just a pure memer (for the most part) when scum is reasonable

[innocentvillager]

skitter I kind of see what you’re saying ablut how scum doesnt play like this but idk maybe hes just tired of constantly playing scum?

I agree with freedom that i dont expect town to play like this either.

So at this point with the information we have is which is more unlikely?

Stubborn deflated town who’s too lazy and sees no path forward or deflated burnt out wolf?

i mean sure but he doesn't really seem like the type to just 'give up' when the going gets rough, based on the numerous fights he's picked over teh last two days

also, like, if he's scum ... why is the game dead? is he getting bussed? what are scum doing rn ?

He also doesnt seem like the type to give up when the going gets rough as town either but here we are I guess? I thjnk Toto might be right that his flake out is kinda NAI and we should just look at other things to evaluate Scol

I guess scum could be silently bussing him because hes not really townread by anyone and they view him as a lost cause maybe their last hope is one of us questions our sanity and flips on him. Hes gone

[Val89]

when I've pointed out the issues I have with the post being internally inconsistent I've been told

I'm 'expecting too much of a early post'.

i also don't believe i said the bolded, i just think you read it wrong

OK, then how should I have been reading it?

I think you're expecting too much out of a post20 post, and i think it's quite reasonable (and good) for ehat we had at the time

Like you're attributing a scummy motivation to something that i think boils down to - he missed the ic post, and found 17/19 more noteworthy to comment on than 7/13
Like you're expectations for what he *should* have been doing at that post are unreasonable imo

[Ydrasse]

i’m silently bussing

[Val89]

Looking at skitters ISO for that quote has reminded me that at one point, she wanted to wagon KT for changing his read on Sco.

Like ig i'm kinda confused how kittytacky can start off liking 20 and then move to disliking it when other people find it scummy without scoliosis posting anything in between

This was all pre-Pooky rep-in.

My point being if you are going to use the origination of the Sco wagon as a vehicle to read Pooky, it would be worth re-reading those early pages, because I don't think either narrative, that KT nor Pooky really got the ball rolling there tells the whole story.

I need to go check if there were indeed "other people" plural who found 20 scummy, or if skitter was just overstating it for the sake of trying to get something moving on KT since I remember feeling like a lone voice but if there were multiple people expressing reservations about Sco prior to KT starting to push there, I don't understand either point of view.

[skitter30]

If you are town I'm worried it's just a playstyle thing but like it feels like you are trying to manipulate everyone in the palm of hands

this isn't manipulative-pooky and this game is like the antithesis of him trying hard

He tried abnormally hard in the beginning I felt

Now hes kind of whatever i guess sure

Do you think his characterization of his own meta as just a pure memer (for the most part) when scum is reasonable

i dont' think he's been trying hard really at all in this game
and i think he plays some scum games as a memer and sometimes he's more serious, i think it depends on the game

[skitter30]

OK, then how should I have been reading it?

then i misremembered what i said

[skitter30]

My point being if you are going to use the origination of the Sco wagon as a vehicle to read Pooky, it would be worth re-reading those early pages, because I don't think either narrative, that KT nor Pooky really got the ball rolling there tells the whole story.

there was a lot of desire to wagon scol prior pooky rep-in

he was not immediately getting flipped tho; i don't think the push on him in the ~200-300's was going to lead to his flip in the immediate future, at that stage of the game

at the same time, i think pooky voting there (coupled with unwnd immediately following the vote), was a catalyst that led to an argument between pooky/scol that led to herta placing an 'e1 or e2' vote a few hours later

i don't think pooky votes there, or starts that argument, if they're buddies
it makes a lot of sense if scol is town, tho, and there were many people focused on the slot already

i don't think it's contradictory at all to think that kitty's push and pooky's push at different stages of the game had different weights and impacts

Spoiler:

hyyyyyype

VOTE: scol

vote count 1.06

with 13 votes in play, it takes 7 to make a decision. day 1 ends in (expired on 2022-12-06 00:45:52).

yeet

Scoliosis [3]:

KittyTacky, unwnd, PookyTheMagicalBear

Herta [2]:

skitter30, geraintm

geraintm [2]:

innocentvillager, Herta

skitter30 [2]:

Val89, Scoliosis

PookyTheMagicalBear [2]:

Ydrasse, Dannflor

Ydrasse [1]:

Toto

not voting [1]:

Freedom

mod notes

~ this is a mod note

flavour

Pooky swoops in and takes over

VOTE: scoliosis

That's E-1 or E-2

(scol votes pooky a couple posts after the vc leading to a fight between them that culminates in many people voting scol)

[skitter30]

sorry technically unwnd voted first i think but it was in collusion/with the support of pooky

i still don't know who's scum in that interaction but the posts from 450-460 or so are gross and there's definitely scum in the two of them

[Val89]

then i misremembered what i said

Well, did you

mean

to say something different?

I'm just struggling to understand why you went to the trouble to quote and bold that part of the post as if it was something you ought to push back against?

Is that not an opinion you want to be associated with now that Sco is close to going over? My recollection is that 20 being a

good post(tm)

was the genesis of your TR on Sco, and you dismissed my criticism of it as being misguided. That previous post I quoted seems to imply you wanted to wagon KT because they were swayed by my critisim of it as well. 'Val was expecting too much of an early Sco post' seems like an opinion you would remember having in that context.

[Val89]

i don't think it's contradictory at all to think that kitty's push and pooky's push at different stages of the game had different weights and impacts

Is anyone suggesting it is?

[Val89]

i think he could be scum here tho

Just to clarify, he being "pooky"?

[skitter30]

i felt like 1651 was dumbing down my argument into something less nuanced than what i was trying to say at the time, which made me bristle a bit because i don't think that's something i would have tried to argue or say in that way

what i meant 292 more in the sense of:
your expectations for his reasoning on the difference between posts are unreasonably high given the stage of the game, i don't think that he needs to have an explanation for why he commented on one prior post and not the other, and i don't think it's scummy if he doesn't have such an explanation. in post 20 he can choose to have found one or two prior RVS posts notable but not all of them, and that doesn't imply that he's internally inconsistent or making up things

i don't particularly care to rehash our differing interpretations of 20 yet again tho, which is why i kinda left it as is

it isn't something i 'ought' to push back against, it's just more like i don't like how you presented my argument, and you sometimes take things out of context (or draw odd conclusions) which annoys me

[skitter30]

i don't think it's contradictory at all to think that kitty's push and pooky's push at different stages of the game had different weights and impacts

Is anyone suggesting it is?

Looking at skitters ISO for that quote has reminded me that at one point, she wanted to wagon KT for changing his read on Sco.

Like ig i'm kinda confused how kittytacky can start off liking 20 and then move to disliking it when other people find it scummy without scoliosis posting anything in between

This was all pre-Pooky rep-in.

My point being if you are going to use the origination of the Sco wagon as a vehicle to read Pooky, it would be worth re-reading those early pages, because I don't think either narrative, that KT nor Pooky really got the ball rolling there tells the whole story.

I need to go check if there were indeed "other people" plural who found 20 scummy, or if skitter was just overstating it for the sake of trying to get something moving on KT since I remember feeling like a lone voice but if there were multiple people expressing reservations about Sco prior to KT starting to push there, I don't understand either point of view.

[skitter30]

the implication in 1734 is p clearly that you think i shouldn't be thinking that pooky was the catalyst of the scol wagon, is it not?

you seem to imply that me thining KT was scummy earlier means that I shouldn't think pooky is resonponsible for the scol wagon?

[skitter30]

i think he could be scum here tho

Just to clarify, he being "pooky"?

yes

[skitter30]

I need to go check if there were indeed "other people" plural who found 20 scummy, or if skitter was just overstating it for the sake of trying to get something moving on KT since I remember feeling like a lone voice but if there were multiple people expressing reservations about Sco prior to KT starting to push there, I don't understand either point of view.

also you yourself are admitting that you had a similar POV to kitty at this time
what exactly is the criticism with the statement of 'other people' here ?

[Val89]

the implication in 1734 is p clearly that you think i shouldn't be thinking that pooky was the catalyst of the scol wagon, is it not?

No, it wasn't you I was thinking about. It was your post about wanting to wagon KT for having changing his read in response to "other people" that reminded me that this:

I originated the push, not Pooky

Could well be off-base as well. If there

was

multiple people pushing Sco before KT changed their TR on them, then I don't think KTs argument as to why Pooky is town holds any water either. I have felt town vibes from Pooky, but that doesn't seem like a good reason to be doing so.

I've haven't had a chance to look properly if your reference to multiple people is accurate or exaggeration (in my quick scam I saw a post or two from IV that might have indicated they werent buying it either, but I want to sit down and look properly) but if it is, then I have issue with KTs charactisation in 1719.

To be clear, I don't think neither KT nor Pooky are scum, but I also dont think letting TRs based on poor logic or misrecollections go without challenge is in the interest of town when the day could end, and my ability to point out those flaws end with it, at any moment.

Pedit: it's not a critism. I remember feeling like a lone voice in disliking 20, and the responses I remember having were "Vals probably town for having those thoughts, but they aren't good thoughts" and I count you as one of the slots I remember hearing that from, and if I was the only one, and KTs read on Sco was because of something else, then I can understand why KT thinks they way they do and there is a good reason to be thinking Pooky town I might agree with, but if my recollection is wrong and your post is true in that there was multiple slots (that's what "people" means, right?) — and it might be, because it wasn't challenged at the time - then it's a bad reason to be TRing pooky on KTs part.

[skitter30]

people remember different things differently
and tend to be the protagonist in their own story

[skitter30]

and 1734 definitely seemed like it was directed at me, but fair enuf