Newbie 2108 - Postgame

[Elements]

I do think if this flips town then Pav/BBT are where my suspicions lie

[Elements]

Sorry for stealing your end of day pagetop!

[Elements]

I'm not seeing Aureal anymore atm but I will re-evaluate post flip

[Pavowski]

Cactus not really saying anything to save itself here

Can you respond to post #1127? I want you to elaborate on what you mean by unfair reasoning

Spoiler:

@cactus Is your argument that people who correctly townread Weuler should be scum? Because I did too, and you've been pretty townready on me.

My argument is that people who do not have a reason to townread Weuler is scum
Can you point out which one of Weuler's posts you found towny?

- The early e-1-then-unvote I bought as newbie town, and said so at the time.
- 270 - prevaricating, slight town to me in the early game
- 342 - felt like legitimate attempt to pressure charles into actually posting content not just 'hi, bye'
- 378 - the mea culpa felt geniune, I read it as nervous town (same as myself D1 out the gate)
- 401 and similar around that time - felt like legitimate scumhunting to me.
- 578 - I don't see how this post would have come from scum at all, scum don't tend to discuss PRs in open chat (whereas town, esp. newbie town, obviously do sometimes) unless they have an agenda to it and I saw no agenda there.
- I'm getting bored of isoing a dead player who we now know the alignment of anyway, I don't think this exercise was a particularly useful one other than I think it shows there's plenty of reasonable posts to suggest that faith in Weuler's towniness wasn't unjustified (triple negative?).

preview: and indeed I missed a bunch of current posts doing this.

Good examples. In hindsight we of course know that Weuler was newbtown
However, Aureal cited none of these quotes, showing that she doesn't have the town perspective that she should have while townreading Weuler.

Here it is again. Basically -- Aureal SHOULD be thinking *this* but isn't, therefore scum

This is not good/fair reasoning

What should Aureal be thinking?

I'm answering this question just as an exercise as I think you're scum and I don't think the question itself has anything to do with sorting anybody except for me, which scum!you only has to pretend to do.

When you say x player should be thinking y, you're assuming you know everything that's going on in their head, when you simply can't. That's why I say this is not good reasoning; that player could have hidden assumptions they haven't shared, or possibly YOU have made assumptions about what they know which are not true.

When you ask me what Aureal should be thinking, it's white noise to me. It's just such a weird question and not how I approach the game.

[Pavowski]

Nooo, I was still keen on a Pav wagon. Think I would have done Aureal over Cactus though, still don't thinkcactus is scum.

Anyways, we will see now the hammer is dropped.

Will do some reading over the night phase. Sorry I missed the end of D2, was working and then afterwork drinks. Logged in this morning to do last minute play but the hammer has fallen.

Does a scumpartner post this?

See there I go making ASSUMPTIONS

[Pavowski]

You know what they say about ASSUMPTIONS

They make an ASS out of U and Many Players TryIng Out NonSense

Or something like that

[Alianna]

2.FINAL

Votecount 2.FINAL

cactus (ELIMINATED): Elements, Pavowski, Aureal, BlueBloodedToffee
Aureal (1): cactus
Pavowski (1): Brickwalll
Elements (1): IdleMuse

[Alianna]

cactus has been eliminated. Their role was

Mafia Goon

.

It is now Night 2. The night deadline is in (expired on 2023-01-16 13:00:36).

The night can end early if all living players agree.

[Alianna]

Pavowski has been killed. His role was

Town Mason

.

It is now Day 3.

[Alianna]

3.00

Votecount 3.00

Not Voting (5): Brickwalll, IdleMuse, Aureal, Elements, BlueBloodedToffee

With 5 players alive, it takes 3 votes to secure an elimination.

The day deadline is in (expired on 2023-01-23 13:12:10).

[Aureal]

Okay. Well. Seeing that, I'm going to start off by asking Elements why she was so sure (for a time) that cactus was the mason and BBT why he was so sure that cactus wasn't. (Feel free to wait on that until Elements answers.)

Also VOTE: Elements.

[IdleMuse]

VOTE: Elements.

None of my reasonings for this have changed by the reveals, and in fact 1060 and 1065 are pretty interesting reading now. BBT outed Pav as the other mason to her in their not-so-subtle convo around 1075 when elements was implying she townread cactus as the other mason, although I've lost the specific post in question re. pav now.

[IdleMuse]

err that's e-1 but I don't think we're at mi-lo so I'll let that vote stand.

[Brickwalll]

Good job team! I was completely wrong on cactus and Pav.

I had elements down as town mason but with pav now flipping TM then I also suspect scum is amongst Aureal/Elements. I have Idle and BBT as town. My vote would be on elements not for the two votes already there.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I really don't think Elements is scum

[BlueBloodedToffee]

If Elements is scum, why drop the Mason read and bus?

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Cactus' early push on Elements doesn't feel bussy.

Idle scum reading Elements for aggression but town reading Cactus for the same thing could easily be a partner defending though.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Idle thinking I 'outed' Pav is interesting as well. Did it read that obviously to everybody else?

Or did I just tip scum off on who to kill

[BlueBloodedToffee]

I don't think I am ever voting Elements or Brick.

So whichever is town out of Idle/Aureal, I

really

need you to town it up.

[Aureal]

Idle thinking I 'outed' Pav is interesting as well. Did it read that obviously to everybody else?

Or did I just tip scum off on who to kill

No. I had Pav as next most likely after cactus, but I really don't know what you and Elements were referencing about looking at D1/D2 stuff. And you saying "it just isn't" sounded like you implying that claim, so I felt good going after cactus afterward with the confidence that one of you was scum and one mason. I actually had a nice wall in my head since the cactus flip about how the scum is totally Elements, and Pav being the mason is making me take a slight step back and re-assess, but I'm not feeling it changes too much.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Talk to me about the scum totally being Elements.

[BlueBloodedToffee]

Also, talk about how you landed on Elements being scum over me?

[Alianna]

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[Alianna]

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[Alianna]

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