Legends of the Buisness Company [Staplers Take Over the World]

[Dunnstral]

Lazer Tag

Round 1 Results:

NorwegianboyEE has been Shot!
Dunnstral has been Shot!
Enchant has been Shot!

Living Players (9): Shirou, Gamma Emerald, Save the Dragons, Psyche, T-Bone, PookytheMagicalBear, Sheepssaysmeep, Thestatusquo, SirCakez

Round 2 Ends In (expired on 2023-01-31 14:45:00)

who shot dunnstral? was it you psyche?

I wasn't active for this challenge and didn't do anything

But yes, who shot me?

[Dunnstral]

I think that Lazy Shirou is town and would prefer to not eliminate there.

Not sure about Psyche but that is the only real option for me.

[Thestatusquo]

Of course you do.

[Enchant]

I didn't apply action because i suddenly stopped caring.

[Enchant]

But i can be petty and swap them in Elim.

.. HMmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[sheepsaysmeep]

pg 94, randomly feel like an update is warranted

-liking std more, mind melding

-gamma is pretty bad
has had wolfy vibes overall but in particular took a stance on shirou v alisae by being like "shirou says the game feels so easy rn, and I had a similar worldview earlier in the game where it felt easy," and thus aligns hard with shirou, dont like that

i think gamma needs to get limmed my tr is completely gone

I’ll grant that your Alisae read isn’t as bad as it seemed at first but I still don’t trust you when you’re going after the most obvtown player in the challenge imo, and I don’t like your shade of Haschel.

this is also like a pretty bad response lmfao

-no actual clue abt shirou v alisae, but I find it interesting that I think shea + shirou have overlapped on a line of reasoning abt alisae
actually looking back I guess there's Less overlap than I thought, but they're both (in rly different instances) like "alisae drifts in 'idk abt anything' until suddenly developing stances that feel more based on the thread's reads than natural solving" and both times I nodded along and liked them for the line of reasoning for a few minutes

-need someone to clarify to me the seeming consensus on enchant, I've read rly varying perspectives from like Objectively effectively inno child here to like, my predecessor saying theyre wolfy and no one actually trying to convince him otherwise with explanation lol. like is it like old-creature-meta type or just a bunch of ppl have exaggeratedly strong reads.
but either way it seems weird/impossible to assert that this stuff, like, is def villager lmao, even by extreme meta. like in creature's case the villa-lock thing was him producing, meaningful content. that he supposedly couldnt fake

[Psyche]

ooh oooh ooh ok i have something

have obsessed some over how i should read that one enchant post about elo that tried to break the game. and has implied that the take contained may not be as cold as i originally thought so why not write it out? warning note that i still haven't read most of the posts in this thread.

It's definitely pro-town to outline such a strategy but otoh scum could notice the potential strategy and decide to divulge it for town points.

This alternative though requires that the scum player was thoughtful enough to identify the strategy and then presumably just as thoughtfully determined that the downsides for scum of revealing the strategy were outweighed by the upside of being the party that revealed it

Prima facie, since the strategy as outlined was so powerful, the scenario above seems hard to take seriously, leaning me toward a townread. so question to me is how firm the townread should actually be.

One interesting factor this hinges on is that firebringer really didn't do any clarification until after the public discussion. I think this assumption is reasonable primarily based my belief that he'd want to address apparent gaps in his design promptly. This belief also suggests that the team swap strategy wasn't discussed in a private thread -- at least not substantially enough for FB to take action. I feel like the strategy was apparently powerful enough that scum who'd noticed it would at least discuss a bit before bringing it up in the public thread, perhaps even actively reaching out to FB first for clarification. So the observation that FB's clarification occurred after public discussion makes me feel all the more sure that the team swap strategy wasn't proposed by scum.

This conclusion withstands consideration of some other assumptions that might seem weak on their own.

For example, one factor that might motivate scum to reveal even a powerful town strategy is if they think the strategy's discovery by the town is inevitable. If they don't think the strategy's implementation depends on whether they specifically are the ones who outlined it, they might decide to reveal it themselves in hopes of minimizing harm. If a scum player has high respect for the analytical players of someone in the player list, then maybe they'd be especially inclined to this reasoning. The problem w/ this argument is that it assumes a pattern of caution in the scum player that contradicts with FB's behavior. Cautious scum would workshop this move first with their teammates.

But what about the possibility that scum-enchant is the opposite of cautious-scum? That he detected the strategy, and then revealed it w/o much discussion with his teammates? After all, cleverness and caution don't always occur together. Some recent posts by enchant have even convinced me that he has a whimsical streak. I guess it's possible but I think I'm more whimsical than Enchant and in that situation I'd still probably talk the gambit through in my PT first, though perhaps primarily to bask in its absurdity. So I don't really read enchant as the sort of player to be so simultaneously spontaneous and focused that the issue wasn't discussed in thread and flagged by FB beforehand.

Oh but a possibility more serious: maybe FB is a slack or overloaded guy who isn't following along in realtime. He's managing like 50 different threads and mechanics, I guess. But idk. It was earlygame and reading scum pts are among the more enjoyable duties of a game moderator. So I discount the importance of that possibility.

so yeah pretty strong townread for enchant. wonder what in this thread could possibly shake it. hope everyone else is as easy to read.

on the other hand i really thought furtive was scum why am i wasting my energy when i'm dumb and permanently wrong and have an irl job i'm blowing off someone pls fix me i can't do it i have a 100 page thread to read

why i think an enchant townread is at worst worth betting the game on
to summarize, i think the timing of FB's clarification of the team swap rule substantially constrains available interpretations for enchant's outline of that strategy based around it
w/o the clarification, it's just substantive pro-town setup spec; other players have done that too but identifying less powerful potential strategies (shirou a bit later, IIRC?)
but the timing of FB's clarification seems to further evince that enchant is town because it implies that the team swap strategy wasn't discussed substantially in a scum pt before being raised publicly;
i think the strat is breaking enough that it would've been before enchant-scum opts to reveal it. costs-benefits gap is just too big

[Psyche]

in retrospect i should've also done updates about reads as i reached certain transition points in my reading. i'll take blame if we lose based on that. at time of choice not to do that i just didn't have any reads to talk about in my head.

[SirCakez]

as i stare at this vc i cant help but feel a sense of impending doom if these two are both town

lmfao i have that sense at all times regardless of who is being wagoned

maybe we should just yeet cakeboi

no stfu

[SirCakez]

what if the scum team was some bullshit like STD + Enchant + Sir Cakes + NorwegianBoy

LOL in what world are StD and I scum together
and Enchant is not scum

[SirCakez]

dropping fresh reads
made these with random.org probably more likely to hit scum this way lmfao

town - norwegianboyEE, Dunnstral
nulltown - Save the dragons,
null - t bone, psyche, shirou
nullscum - sheepsaysmeep
scum - thestatusquo, pookythemagicalbear, gamma emerald, enchant

[SirCakez]

like cakes progression on shirou doesnt make a lot of sense to me

ok does any1 here actually think cakes is town

no

ok does any1 here actually think cakes is town

not really

wow look at the wolves circling back around for new mislim targets

[SirCakez]

the fact that the game is this stuck makes me feel like we are onto scum with one of the lim targets here
we did not stall this much on furtive or Titus

[SirCakez]

what if they are both scum lmaoo

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

ok does any1 actually townread cakes latest posting

[Thestatusquo]

In what way does me being scum remotely fit into your worldview

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

those arent real reads he random.orged it

[NorwegianboyEE]

Isn't provably randomness a big no no

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

there is no proof he random.orged it

[T-Bone]

Hyperpost Meta vs Board of Mis-directors vs 3.07

Pysche (5): Dunnstral, Shirou, Gamma Emerald, Save The Dragons, NorwegianboyEE ,
Dunnstral (1) : Psyche ,
Shirou (3) : T-Bone, SirCakez, Thestatusquo,

Not Voting (3): Sheepssaysmeep , Enchant, PookytheMagicalBear,,


With 12 Alive, It Takes 7 to Eliminate.
Deadline for challenge is (expired on 2023-02-11 10:45:00)

Mod Notes:

Are any of you voters budging or not? (I know someone unvoted after this VC) I know I'm undermining myself a bit but I'm willing to budge I guess. Anything to progress at this point.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

im willing to finish the mini game so whoever gets points can switch it to cakeboi

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

i think the fact that we only had 3 gunshots and i know one of them was mine and the other one is gamma's means that the scum dont give a fuck about the mini game which implies they are probly doing pretty well in terms of cruising to a win and that suggests Psyche v Shirou is T/T

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

also even if Psyche v Shirou is T/S I still think Cakes is scum

[Thestatusquo]

Isn't provably randomness a big no no

another scintillating and reasonable contribution designed to find scum.

[SirCakez]

also even if Psyche v Shirou is T/S I still think Cakes is scum

i could be mod confirmed IC and u would still push me