Newbie 2111 - Know Your Skittles! (Game Over)

[Human Sequencer]

VOTE: Weuler

[Human Sequencer]

@Taly Post!

[Black]

Based on my “reads” they could try to draw conclusions on who else was scum

I don't know why that comment confused me so much

I don't like the defense "I wouldn't do that as scum" though

[Aureal]

My Incredible Page 4 Solve, A Study In Infallibility

Human

Bruh

Startled by my vote and perhaps nervous!

rn I'm thinking Taly, Arko, Human
VOTE: human

VOTE: Akro

What better way to show yourself to be innocent than to vote someone who was just called as scum along with you?

Reaction testing

After reacting poorly to being voted, trying to distract by doing reaction testing on others.

I have noticed that of the 3 people who haven't talked yet 2 of them are SE's and it is RVS so it's worth a shot
VOTE: Taly

Now only SE's haven't posted yet
UNVOTE: VOTE: Human sequencer

Not just bringing up SEs for no apparent reason but repeating the thought without drawing any reasoning for SE status to be relevant, and moving vote from one to the other without any reasoning (the comment about Taly being on vacation came later). Why? *shrug*

Probably! But maybe we should test the actual newbies first to make sure they aren't going to run away if we do something like VOTE: Human.

I didn't run you can unvote now

Is still nervous about that vote!

Also VT read on Human Sequencer, it'd be odd to ignore a game if there's something interesting happening and since there's no indication of them going V/LA
(And thus clearly everyone that has posted so far must have an interesting role, QED you're all scum)

There are two sum and two PRs and nearly everyone has posted so far

And the possible scumslip, of course.

---

Weuler

Did that comment actually seem scummy to you?

No it seems like a comment from a newbie. Consider my vote an effort to discourage further PR-hunting.

Voting for a newbie for doing a newbie thing and not specifying that it isn't seeming scummy until questioned about it.

VOTE: human
Clear scumslip knowing there are two town prs

I can't tell if you're joking but you might be onto something. I didn't actually look at the Newbie Setup until now but Options A and B have three chances at 2 town PRs. Option C only has one.

I think role hunting in any form is harmful right now. I don't even know if talking about the Newbie Setup is a good idea

So you talk about the newbie setup and then say talking about it isn't a good idea?

Distorting Black's words to make her sound worse. But also subtly encouraging the idea that it's bad to be talking about the setup (and thus the possible scumslip).

Further, if we take the idea that this truly was a scumslip, we have to consider how Human would even realize the setup, for a true newbie isn't so likely to have considered the ramifications of the setup chart. If Human really did say that because he's scum who knows the possible setup thanks to scum info, it was likely because it was mentioned by a more experienced partner. And the most likely candidate would be Weuler, as I know it's not me, Elements pretty clearly wouldn't want to just promptly point out that her partner made a possible scumslip, Arko seems less likely due to his initial posting about being busy, and the other two SEs had yet to materialize though theoretically they could've posted in the mafia PT but not here (my joke about it being especially thanks to them wasn't

entirely

a joke ).

Please clap.

[Human]

I just realized I said sum and not scum oh god

[Human Sequencer]

VOTE: aureal
Do you actually believe what you're writing?

[T-Bone]

Skittles Fact: PenguinPower is a flightless bird.

Vote Count

Human - 1

(Aureal)

e-4

usesPython - 1

(Weuler)

e-4

Weuler - 2

(Elements, usesPython)

e-3

Aureal - 1

(Human Sequencer)

e-4

Not Voting - 4

(Arko, Black, Human, Taly)

With 9 Alive, It Takes 5 to Eliminate

Activity Check: Prodding Taly

Deadline: (expired on 2023-02-16 10:00:00)

[usesPython]

0 experience with Mafia and Mafiascum, 1k hours in Town of Salem

Pretty unsure on your slot. I feel like you're doing a lot of stuff that looks like you're being busy and scumhunting, but it doesn't really line up or do anything logically. But it does seem like it's coming from a genuine place? So I'm getting mixed signals.

It's because you're incorrectly assuming Town of Salem experience directly translates to d1 forum mafia scumhunting.

No nightkills, no elims, no investigative PRs posting results, no unique or unfakable roles claiming (or counter claiming), and no vote for role (Almost all of which would be available by the time you can actually start voting in ToS) means I'm left with relying solely on reading people to find town or scum instead of it being merely one of the tools I'd use to tip my read one way or the other.

[usesPython]

Ok brain is no longer mush so time for the Black and HS reads:

Black:

I'm so paranoid already lol

Why do I have to be the one agreeing with Weuler here, this feels like such a weird post

I like Arko for town
VOTE: Weuler

Same. His reads post felt like a town post to me

I don't have many reads yet. I've always had a hard time gauging alignments in the RVS

I still don't like Human's "slip" but that by itself is not vote worthy in my eyes

Arko, Elements seem pretty townie

Weuler feels kinda performative but mostly townie

I'm getting null vibes on Aureal

I don't like python's eagerness to discuss roles. Slightly scummy

Taly and Human Sequencer are M.I.A... I think I would like to vote for one of these to get them going in the game and I think Taly is on vacation so

VOTE: Human Sequencer

Reads make sense for the information available at the time

Human was null but now that I understand the situation better I think he leans town. His thought progression feels natural and I like that he's making reads already

Based on my “reads” they could try to draw conclusions on who else was scum

I don't know why that comment confused me so much

I don't like the defense "I wouldn't do that as scum" though

Not sure I follow the progression, Humans argument is that scum!Human would be playing against their wincon by giving information for reads. Not liking the defense is fine on its own but it should at the very least be followed up with a reason for scum!Human to do what he did (such as the reads being WIFOM)

HS:

Null read, the town read on Human is something that should definitely be looked at later in the game but for now it's NAI

[usesPython]

Further, if we take the idea that this truly was a scumslip, we have to consider how Human would even realize the setup, for a true newbie isn't so likely to have considered the ramifications of the setup chart. If Human really did say that because he's scum who knows the possible setup thanks to scum info, it was likely because it was mentioned by a more experienced partner. And the most likely candidate would be Weuler, as I know it's not me, Elements pretty clearly wouldn't want to just promptly point out that her partner made a possible scumslip, Arko seems less likely due to his initial posting about being busy, and the other two SEs had yet to materialize though theoretically they could've posted in the mafia PT but not here (my joke about it being especially thanks to them wasn't

entirely

a joke ).

Please clap.

I can't believe you forgot to consider me being the person who told Human the setup, is this how little you think of me.

Also curious as to why Black is missing from that list too, given that it's their second game out of retirement and so presumably they can read the setup.

Also also your reasoning that "for a true newbie isn't so likely to have considered the ramifications of the setup chart" falls apart when I'm also a newbie and have read the setup chart. As much as we newbies have to learn, basic reading comprehension is (hopefully) not one of them.

[Aureal]

VOTE: aureal
Do you actually believe what you're writing?

Do you have a better page 4 solve? No, no you do not.

'course, it's page 9 now, so maybe I need to do something more. Foo.

I can't believe you forgot to consider me being the person who told Human the setup, is this how little you think of me.

Awwww, I'm sorry! I can consider you a possible scum too if you want! I hadn't seen enough of you by page 4 yet to consider you!

Also curious as to why Black is missing from that list too, given that it's their second game out of retirement and so presumably they can read the setup.

I could say that Black commented on not having read the setup, but really it just hadn't sunk in yet that they aren't totally new here (Arko too, but I remembered by the time I posted above). I played with Weuler and Elements before as you saw, so I know they're experienced enough to know these things.

Also also your reasoning that "for a true newbie isn't so likely to have considered the ramifications of the setup chart" falls apart when I'm also a newbie and have read the setup chart. As much as we newbies have to learn, basic reading comprehension is (hopefully) not one of them.

Did you read it and realize that mafia know which three sets of PRs they might possibly have in their game? That's a little more than just basic reading comprehension, it takes a little bit of basic analysis too.

[usesPython]

Did you read it and realize that mafia know which three sets of PRs they might possibly have in their game? That's a little more than just basic reading comprehension, it takes a little bit of basic analysis too.

Yes? All you'd have to really do is read the spoilered Full Setups in post 0. Mafia not being told their partner or their partners role in the PM if I'm understanding the Sample Role PMs correctly can be instantly solved by just claiming in the PT which they can post in at any time at which point you can instantly eliminate 6/9 possible role lists once either a mafia PR has claimed or both mafia claim Mafia Goon

[Weuler]

Weuler read:
In Newbie 2109 as VT they make the first post of the game with

VOTE: CCGeek, obvious lurkscum. Haven't made a single post

Whereas in 52 this game they post

Weuler, can I persuade you to VOTE: Taly?

I prefer to vote for people who have made a post

Now obviously the first post is a joke, but I'm not sure it's a joke someone who prefers voting for people who've made a post would make. Might be hesitant to vote for Taly specifically?

Post 73:

Also VT read on Human Sequencer, it'd be odd to ignore a game if there's something interesting happening and since there's no indication of them going V/LA
(And thus clearly everyone that has posted so far must have an interesting role, QED you're all scum)

Let's not PR hunt

Post 74 they vote me and explain in post 78

UNVOTE: Arko and VOTE: Python

Did that comment actually seem scummy to you?

No it seems like a comment from a newbie. Consider my vote an effort to discourage further PR-hunting.

But if it's a scum!Weuler game they start PR hunting themselves in 119 by pushing this line of questioning

My point was there were at most two PR's

A question to clarify: Did you know that not all possibilities contains 2 PR when you wrote the original post?

UNVOTE: Elements
VOTE: Weuler

I'll try to answer this:

First the RVS vote: In this game my first RVS vote was on Elements for joke reasons. In my last games it was on CCG for joke reasons (I was the first who posted. What else would I post?) All subsequent votes in my last game was not due to joking around. My reason for not voting Taly is that they haven't made a single post for two days so I don't see how voting them is beneficial. They will probably just get force replaced soon.

Calling 119 PR hunting is just not true. I wanted to ask Human for clarification. Several people had already pointed out that not every scenario has 2 PRs.

[Aureal]

Rest of the pages:

The way Human immediately goes to the assumption that my solve is going to get him voted out is weeeeeird. He's definitely new, that's for sure. The interaction with Weuler about the wording is more interesting, though. After being imprecise with Black's post as I noted earlier, Weuler complains in 122 and 123 and then some more in 133 about Human's wording, almost like he's thinking Human really is going to go down for this and really doesn't want to be associated with it if actually scum partners. Asks me if I think it was a slip, and when I ask whether he thinks I was being serious he actually uses an exclamation point(!) to say he's not sure if I am when normally he hardly even uses punctuation- the only exclamation points used thus far are saying hello in his intro post.

Also people point out possible alternate reasoning for Human to say what he did, which had not occured to me and honestly it's probably more likely that he was just writing hastily.

And usesPython makes me very sad by continuing the baffling trend of using an exclamation point as some sort of linkage between a name and alignment. I expected you of all people to know that an exclamation mark means NOT, not EQUALS.

Did you read it and realize that mafia know which three sets of PRs they might possibly have in their game? That's a little more than just basic reading comprehension, it takes a little bit of basic analysis too.

Yes? All you'd have to really do is read the spoilered Full Setups in post 0. Mafia not being told their partner or their partners role in the PM if I'm understanding the Sample Role PMs correctly can be instantly solved by just claiming in the PT which they can post in at any time at which point you can instantly eliminate 6/9 possible role lists once either a mafia PR has claimed or both mafia claim Mafia Goon

Yes, but this requires enough analysis of the setup to realize that knowledge of the roles allows you to do that. Not everyone is going to think that far, and first-timers won't have experienced it yet. That is all. (the roles are probably listed by the mod in the PT even without sharing with each other, from what I can see of previous mafia PTs from newbie games)

[Weuler]

Further, if we take the idea that this truly was a scumslip, we have to consider how Human would even realize the setup, for a true newbie isn't so likely to have considered the ramifications of the setup chart.

That's precisely why I asked them to clarify in 119.

[usesPython]

@Human how much of post 0 and 2 did you read before you posted this?

There are two sum and two PRs and nearly everyone has posted so far

[Weuler]

Rest of the pages:

The interaction with Weuler about the wording is more interesting, though. After being imprecise with Black's post as I noted earlier, Weuler complains in 122 and 123 and then some more in 133 about Human's wording, almost like he's thinking Human really is going to go down for this and really doesn't want to be associated with it if actually scum partners. Asks me if I think it was a slip, and when I ask whether he thinks I was being serious he actually uses an exclamation point(!) to say he's not sure if I am when normally he hardly even uses punctuation- the only exclamation points used thus far are saying hello in his intro post.

This is just grasping at straws. As I remember it, nobody was really going after Human for their possible slip. The purpose of my questions was to get an idea of whether it was a slip or not. The exclamation point remark is just silly. I sometimes use an exclamation mark when I think it is appropriate, for greetings (as you point out), for conveying surprise (when I answered your question regarding your reads), and sometimes to convey to someone that I am taunting them.

[Weuler]

My vote on Python obviously doesn't belong there. I think UNVOTE: Python[/unvote ], VOTE: Aureal is not too bad of a choice. She begins the day relatively quietly, but then suddenly comes with these posts trying to force the scum pair Human/Me. I just don't see some of the points as being genuine analysis.

[Weuler]

UNVOTE: Python and VOTE: Aureal

[Weuler]

I think HS makes a solid entrance and with some interesting points

[Weuler]

I think Euler, Elements and Aureal are the most likely to flip scum.

Do I look like a Swiss mathematician to you?

[Elements]

VOTE: Aureal
*clap* *clap* *clap*

[usesPython]

(the roles are probably listed by the mod in the PT even without sharing with each other, from what I can see of previous mafia PTs from newbie games)

Is there a specific reason you double checked the format of a mafia PT from previous games? The exact mechanics of how mafia know their partner and roles don't seem to be that important given that the end result is the same and you don't strike me as the type of person to be this diligent about this type of stuff.

[usesPython]

Also Aureal at E-2

[usesPython]

I'll try to answer this:

First the RVS vote: In this game my first RVS vote was on Elements for joke reasons. In my last games it was on CCG for joke reasons (I was the first who posted. What else would I post?) All subsequent votes in my last game was not due to joking around. My reason for not voting Taly is that they haven't made a single post for two days so I don't see how voting them is beneficial. They will probably just get force replaced soon.

Calling 119 PR hunting is just not true. I wanted to ask Human for clarification. Several people had already pointed out that not every scenario has 2 PRs.

The RVS was obviously a joke, my specific point was that I don't think someone who prefers voting for people who post would make that specific joke. Given that we know you were town in 2109 and that it was very clearly a joke being the first post in that game, the logical conclusion from that read would be that "you preferring to vote for people who post" is the part that's incorrect. (Though given how scummy Aureal is rn I'm probably reading way to much into a possible Weuler/Taly scum team so I'll drop it)

I'll elaborate on why I think 119 is possibly scummy once Human finishes responding to my questions, for now
UNVOTE: Weuler

FoS: Aureal