Amnesiac Mafia: The Movie! That's a Wrap!

[Dunnstral]

UNVOTE: Frozen Angel

It feels like there is genuine solving going on in the above posts. And that it goes beyond surface level calling people out but tries to consider motivations too.

[Dunnstral]

my biggest problem with my scumreads is feysal and FA seem unaligned because they seem in lock step together against DE so i'm probably wrong somewhere

Unaligned as in not both mafia together? Or are you saying you don't think they are both town either?

[Save The Dragons]

Not mafia together

[Dunnstral]

FA's content all around feels soulless. She is demonstrating quite a bit of thought but I don't feel like she believes any of it further than her words express.

VOTE: Frozen Angel

This I disagree with after looking through her longer posts. How are you seeing those as soulless?

[Dunnstral]

I think FA has done a lot of busy work with no conclusion.

Also I am actually offended by this. from town or scum you. each of those ise reads took like 30 min to 1 hour

and its obvious you never read any of them before dropping this judgement cause literally 1/3rd of those posts is pure conclusions and evalutions if not more and its so out there for people to see that I cant in any universe believe anyone who read them would ever dare to say something so BS like this about them

I agree that TSQ is being rather dismissive here

[Dunnstral]

Part of the distinction to me is that caught scum emotion DOES frequently feel fake to me. In the sense that they know they are bad so everything is filtered through that lens. Even if a scum player is legitimately frustrated by being "caught for the wrong reasons" as people say there is always that in the background.

For what its worth I tend to think caught for the wrong reasons is kind of a bullshit thing in general.

In my experience town gets just as mad if not more mad when they are being scum read for reasons they think are illegitimate than scum does and in fact it happens more often because town is way more prone to think people scum reading them is illegitimate because they know they're town.

I agree with this. Except I'd say it happens more often to town simply because town are ~4x more common than mafia in any given game

[Dunnstral]

Frankly, I think that FA's outburst is largely justified at the very least in her own mind. I'd be pissed if I put a bunch of work into ISO'ing people and trying to catch up and sort the game state, and then having it brushed away as "souless." Okay, and don't get me wrong, if that's your opinion then it's your opinion. I disagree, I feel like the ISOs especially at the very least had conclusions that you could draw from her thought process. This isn't even a comment on the effort of putting together the ISOs: The thoughts and the reads she's drawn from them are right there on the page.

Are they legitimate conclusions? Perhaps, perhaps not. But it's definitely not soulless.

So from her perspective, she's trying, she just put a bunch of effort into reading and probably re-reading a handful of players, and then Klick comes along and votes her because... it felt soulless? That's just such a bizarre characterization of an activity that I saw as the complete opposite.

I'd probably be annoyed too.

This is a good post. When I saw that FA was putting in substantial effort I felt I needed to try to match that. I didn't like Klick calling it soulless or TSQ sayying it was busy work as I feel those posts sidestep commenting on the posts to call it bad. But I disagree and am not sure why they feel the way they do.

[Firebringer]

Anyone have anything want to chat while I catch up.
Will try to make my catch up fast so might miss things

[Dunnstral]

I think maybe "soulless" is the wrong word but Klick's bottom paragraph in 1267 pretty much summarizes how I feel about what I've read from FA. I admit I need to look deeper to get a better feeling here

I don't know it's a feeling I had reading your posts and I haven't deeply analysed it. When I read your analysis of your reads it is missing a level of *belief* that is observable in your posting, because it's all logical arguments and only logical arguments without your own assumptions or perspective. It's a holistic point that applies to all of your deeply-exained reads and not the nitty-gritty details that you want to discuss.

I disagree with this, but it's a matter of taste I guess. I don't see FA's posts as "cold logical arguments". I do think they have assumptions and perspective.

I think that somewhere along the way with Klick's posting they went from arguing that FA is mafia to saying that they can be either alignment based on emotion, so not to take that into consideration, and they aren't really referencing their original point anymore.

---

I see now that Klick is saying they are townreading FA. Well, OK. I think it is fair for TSQ to think that Klick was shutting them down in light of the above.

[Firebringer]

Maybe I should deep dive FA
I’m not going to read her emotional response very indicative tho

[Dunnstral]

Pink Ball I feel you are being rude when it isn't really called for

[Pink Ball]

Pink Ball I feel you are being rude when it isn't really called for

I agree, I had a pretty rough day and realized it now that I blew some steam

I’m sorry Black.

[Dunnstral]

I know nobody read the Black/PB interaction because it was a little overshadowed by the way more interesting Klick/FA stuff, but it felt like he kinda got defensive about me saying Dragon's siteflaking was NAI. Then he said I was trying to shut the conversation down and walked that back by saying I wasn't trying to do it on purpose?

Idk, something feels weird about how PB is pushing the Dragon thing riding a page 2 SR while actively shutting down people that bring up NAI stuff about Dragon

OK let's go back to this

I think you and I are seeing PB in that interaction differently here. You are seeing PB being aggressive about Dragon and trying to shut things down. I am seeing them as a lot more laid back, saying what is on their mind, and trying to clear things up without trying to push strong opinions.

[Firebringer]

So nobody wants to talk to me or even say hi or shit post with me for the little time im here.
Rude as fuck

[Pink Ball]

Hi FB

[Pink Ball]

Just jumped out of the shower and had something to eat

[Pink Ball]

I'm up for shitposting a little

[Firebringer]

General question for Frozen angel before I go whip out my notepad and start giving some ~analysis~ of her posts to explain my read or maybe my read will flip midway or w/e.
Maybe its because im in the backburner for you pressure wise, but i think i never ever explained my read on you. Yet i don't think theres once u asked me explicitly to explain.

Now maybe its cause u townread me and u don't care. I don't know. Doesn't seem like thats something you would want to dig into unless you felt very comfortable with your read on me. I mean, someone calls me scum and i can't see why and im not strong on them i do wonder why.

But i digress. I should get out the notepad and get going. I also have like other games to read and shit.

[Firebringer]

i went on a tangeant there without adding an actual question.

my question is: why didn't you question me about my read on you explicitly?

[Firebringer]

I'm up for shitposting a little

but if u start shitposting now u will have to jump back in...

[Pink Ball]

I'm up for shitposting a little

but if u start shitposting now u will have to jump back in...

It's a sacrifice I'm willing to make for the sake of the shitposting

[Firebringer]

Spoiler: Frozen Angel the Firebringer Notes of Destiny

100 posts woah. Okay i am only taking notes on like a quarter of these or half at most. No way i get to them all. Lets go through them and give some thoughts.

329 I didn't like FA calling my early stuff try hard. I think she later explained this as something else.
330 I feel like this isn't really a town question Frozen angel asks. The framing is why wouldn't scum desire to open like dragoneater and im just feeling meh. But i guess the i will write this off as NAI.
336 like the questioning of klick i think here
349 at first i didn't like FA agreeing with my post here but i feel more favorable to it in hindsight.

okay im like only a 1/3 through this iso. I feel more like FA town. Idk. Her thought process seems more clear to me now then before. It felt pretty fake and manufactured in the moment but seeing the whole it looks better

Maybe the only thing i don't like about FA is how fast the switch on Feysal played out?


i feel like this game is going to take a lot of my weekend.

[T-Bone]

BlueSnakelet has requested replacement from Team Mafia

[Firebringer]

im not super into dragoneater scum.
I think that he is an easy out for scum in this game if town.

But i will admit i can't track his thoughts that well here. The flip flopping on me didn't feel very organic but like....i am just really curious where he is with everything at this point. Dragoneater should be more vocal/opinionated. Feels pretty milquotoast and i would hate to assume thats because = scum

[Firebringer]

BlueSnakelet has requested replacement from Team Mafia

RIP buddy