Mini Normal 2300: THIS GAME HAS A VIG [game over]

[Venmar]

Hello Malakittens, long time no see

VOTE: Malakittens

[Venmar]

I have many thoughts and opinions

Y'all can wait till after work for them hehe

[Venmar]

just peeking while at work

UNVOTE:

my rvs cause yall weird and will make actual post when i come home

[Venmar]

Ok I'm here

Malakittens is a vibe and I forbid y'all from elimming her today

[Venmar]

Good vibes:

Malakitten
Gera
Greeting

Null vibes:

Greeting (kinda lean good)
Invisibility (kinda lean good)
Patchwork (kinda lean bad)

Bad vibes:

Umlaut
Black
Bristep

[Venmar]

VOTE: Umlaut

No I will not explain but y'all should sheep me

[Venmar]

VOTE: Umlaut

No I will not explain but y'all should sheep me

That's a bad idea! I recently misread umlaut so I'd like to see the reasons here.

No I think it's a good idea. Reasons = vibes

[Venmar]

VOTE: Umlaut

No I will not explain but y'all should sheep me

That's a bad idea! I recently misread umlaut so I'd like to see the reasons here.

No I think it's a good idea. Reasons = vibes

vibes=I am scum and I hide behind unprovable things
Well, not always, but it is a possibility.
In this case
VOTE: Venmar

Bad vibes from this tsk tsk

[Venmar]

Disagree with T3, Greeting was just ahead of the curve and I came in for the slamdunk on Umlaut

[Venmar]

i think the blue squirrel could be town but dont quote me on that

[Venmar]

Good vibes:

Malakitten
Gera
Greeting

Null vibes:

Greeting (kinda lean good)
Invisibility (kinda lean good)
Patchwork (kinda lean bad)

Bad vibes:

Umlaut

Black

Bristep

Bolded has become firmer in this category unfortunately

[Venmar]

venmar, why do you dislike black's post? i thought it was a good catchup and it provided some fresh takes
like are you gonna engage with it or what? are you just saying you're more sure about black cause you wanna OMGUS?
i'm not opposed to a venmar wagon, but there's a lot of people on him right now. i'd rather use my vote somewhere else.

speaking of votes... can someone explain why they're voting umlaut? they've just kind of been unremarkable this game

Wait so Black scumreading cause im reading this game off of mainly vibes and gut but then you doing this:

bri (bad vibes to me)

wait have you explained this or does it start and end with vibes

starts and ends with vibes

Is supposed to make sense?

BIG THINKING EMOJI

[Venmar]

I realize Blacks reasoning is more nuanced but I think y'all are being opportunistic and voting me for taking a laid back approach to this game and its easy convenient for scum to take advantage of that and push an easy wagon, and that's the vibe Black is giving me!

[Venmar]

I realize Blacks reasoning is more nuanced but I think y'all are being opportunistic and voting me for taking a laid back approach to this game and its easy convenient for scum to take advantage of that and push an easy wagon, and that's the vibe Black is giving me!

This reads as you think I'm scum but that townies jumped on the wagon. Would this be a fair assessment?

Mmmmm, probably?

[Venmar]

Black's #256 bothered me because a chunk of the wall is irrelevant comments ("Hi patch", "Cant believe we won death note", etc), a lot of it is just empty commentary to me ("not following these reads by Umlaut", "this feels a little fence-sitty from bris", etc) that feels like Black trying to find a reason to be productive and useful as !scum, like trying to fill a quota, rather than being a townie trying to focus on something and scumhunting, and a lot of the reads are just pretty non-committal and fencesitty in of themselves (see the comments to 153, 233, 120, etc) despite her criticizing others for the same.

Her reasons for voting me are then also pretty poor since idk how she spends much of the post throwing shade at other players, some more than me like Umlaut, and then decided to single me out because I accidentally wrote down Greeting twice in my reads post and because I jokingly told people to sheep me with no context on Umlaut. Former reason is just bogus and the latter feels like manufactured outrage. It definitely feels like Black is really reaching and making a mountain out of a molehill by focusing on stuff like that and taking advantage of the fact that I've decided to play passive and have provided no context for me vibe reads which is a really easy playstyle to just blindly attack as scum with not much effort.

Her doubling down after I simply said I had more bad vibes from her is also not great imo, saying I am playing "the typical scum hanging out in the background role" just kind of genuinely means nothing imo and is something that only feels true to the person saying it, there's not much in what I've done that is different from other low-effort posters in the game so this comment is just confirmation bias.

[Venmar]

VOTE: Black

To reflect the change in the strength of the vibes

[Venmar]

venmar, why do you dislike black's post? i thought it was a good catchup and it provided some fresh takes
like are you gonna engage with it or what? are you just saying you're more sure about black cause you wanna OMGUS?
i'm not opposed to a venmar wagon, but there's a lot of people on him right now. i'd rather use my vote somewhere else.

speaking of votes... can someone explain why they're voting umlaut? they've just kind of been unremarkable this game

Wait so Black scumreading cause im reading this game off of mainly vibes and gut but then you doing this:

bri (bad vibes to me)

wait have you explained this or does it start and end with vibes

starts and ends with vibes

Is supposed to make sense?

BIG THINKING EMOJI

Also can you answer my fucking question instead of deflecting.

Rawr

I did though in 315 you're welcome!!

[Venmar]

wouldn’t you say confirmation bias is more likely to come from town than scum?

...also if black is scum i’m gonna be honest i don’t think she’s this bad at it and also i find you’re claiming black did stuff she didn’t actually do? maybe i’m mistaken, it’s pretty late where i am, but i thought her catch-up post wasn’t that bad

No

You're giving her a lot of credit, what she's doing isn't "bad", she got me to E-2 with no real effort. Re-read her post with what I said about it in mind. There's not much meat or substance in the post and tell me with a straight face that her voting me out of that pile of reads/observations makes sense

[Venmar]

Black's #256 bothered me because a chunk of the wall is irrelevant comments ("Hi patch", "Cant believe we won death note", etc), a lot of it is just empty commentary to me ("not following these reads by Umlaut", "this feels a little fence-sitty from bris", etc) that feels like Black trying to find a reason to be productive and useful as !scum, like trying to fill a quota, rather than being a townie trying to focus on something and scumhunting, and a lot of the reads are just pretty non-committal and fencesitty in of themselves (see the comments to 153, 233, 120, etc) despite her criticizing others for the same.

Minimizing my catch-up post to "empty commentary" is pretty disingenuous. Did I solve the game? No, but I gave thoughts on most everything I felt was worthy of talking about. There's more content in that one post than you've provided all game. Even if it was empty it would still be better than no content at all

Her reasons for voting me are then also pretty poor since idk how she spends much of the post throwing shade at other players, some more than me like Umlaut, and then decided to single me out because I accidentally wrote down Greeting twice in my reads post and because I jokingly told people to sheep me with no context on Umlaut. Former reason is just bogus and the latter feels like manufactured outrage.

This reads as "Black's reasons to vote me are poor because those reasons could apply to other people so it doesn't make sense for them to vote for me"

What kind of opinion is this? Maybe if I had 3 votes I could spread them around to all the lurkers I think could be scum, but I don't. So you are my choice. There's nothing poor about that reasoning at all

It definitely feels like Black is really reaching and making a mountain out of a molehill by focusing on stuff like that

and taking advantage of the fact that I've decided to play passive

and have provided no context for me vibe reads which is a really easy playstyle to just blindly attack as scum with not much effort.

Yeah? Where have you stated that you made a conscious decision to play passive this game? To me this just sounds like an excuse for your lurking behavior. "Oh I decided to play passive this game". Yeah, wolves do that too. We're going to need stuff from you that shows us you're town if you're town

1. I was giving my opinion on your play. I don't think it was minimizing, your wall post wasn't particularly fat in content to begin with, it was mostly one sentence observations and many of them weren't very impressive unfortunately. I find that scum are more likely to appear active and "react" to content rather than generate content themselves or scumhunt actively, and the former is what your wall post looked like.

2. This is a weak response to my criticism, you basically admit that I am right that I'm not doing much else different from other "lurkers" (even though I dont think Ive lurked this game) and throw up your hands that you don't have 3 votes to vote them all. You make no attempt really to justify why me putting someone twice on my reads list twice or joking about people sheeping me was worthy for you to single me out. Nor do you address the fact that I feel like you shaded certain people like Umlaut more than me in that wall post.

3. This is a lot of nothing. I don't need to announce how I'm going to play, I just decided to play off vibes and as a playstyle thing I feel like it was the actual reason you pushed me since it made me an easy target. There's a lot of confirmation bias here too, "Yeah Scum like to be passive too", isn't really something that rings true to anyone but you because you want it to with regards to me.

"We're going to need stuff from you that shows us you're town if you're town" is also such a nothing statement and it irritates me usually when people say it, I always just interpret it as someone trying to deflect attention from themselves and put the onus of being townie and active on others rather than do these things themselves. Being townie comes naturally to those who are town, going out of your way to tell someone that they have to actively do it feels like scum telling people to give them reasons to TR them or to do things to pick at. I'd rather people just do whatever and pick at them good or bad for that.

[Venmar]

always ascribe me points for idiocy rather than any grand plans.

I feel that

[Venmar]

ok I basically got what I wanted to see from Venmar. UNVOTE: . Which was content.

Curious about this. Venmar's content was basically attacking the person that attacked him. Personally I think we need to see a lot more solving from this slot

Actually I was already bad vibing you before your attack on me! I have proof!

[Venmar]

DEFLECTION +100

[Venmar]

Tbh I was in the process of looking at the other stuff, and was about to say that something about the discussion between Umlaut/Gera/Black about the whole setup thing doesn't sit well with me, I mostly see it as a pointless discussion and as a kind of theatre. Sky said in signups that the setup has 2 scum and the fact that this generate a whole page of discussion is weird to me.

[Venmar]

Like I think it mostly reflects poorly on Umlaut, it's interesting that when the posts can be simple setup discussion or defense of himself is when he decided to be more active (I know I know Black this looks like me a bit!!!). Really juicing the content if you know what I mean.

[Venmar]

Probably the Blue Squirrel. Malakitten also a TR but thats cause I like her vibes and energy

[Venmar]

I feel like the speed and easiness with which my wagon has grown should probably tell y'all something but hey, that's just me.

I feel like y'all are being incredibly reductive and disingenuous by saying that my focus on Black is purely OMGUS, and it's starting to piss me off tbh.

maybe this is a hot take but ill share it anyways
i feel like while i mindmeld with a lot of black's ISO, it is a little bare-boned
i also feel like venmar is just OMGUSing and i have no idea if it comes from town or scum

Like are you a parrot or something who saw T3's post a few posts back and just copied the OMGUS reason rather than actually following your original train of thought when I challenged you to think about the game? What happened to #332

[Venmar]

Black's #256 bothered me because a chunk of the wall is irrelevant comments ("Hi patch", "Cant believe we won death note", etc), a lot of it is just empty commentary to me ("not following these reads by Umlaut", "this feels a little fence-sitty from bris", etc) that feels like Black trying to find a reason to be productive and useful as !scum, like trying to fill a quota, rather than being a townie trying to focus on something and scumhunting, and a lot of the reads are just pretty non-committal and fencesitty in of themselves (see the comments to 153, 233, 120, etc) despite her criticizing others for the same.

Her reasons for voting me are then also pretty poor since idk how she spends much of the post throwing shade at other players, some more than me like Umlaut, and then decided to single me out because I accidentally wrote down Greeting twice in my reads post and because I jokingly told people to sheep me with no context on Umlaut. Former reason is just bogus and the latter feels like manufactured outrage. It definitely feels like Black is really reaching and making a mountain out of a molehill by focusing on stuff like that and taking advantage of the fact that I've decided to play passive and have provided no context for me vibe reads which is a really easy playstyle to just blindly attack as scum with not much effort.

Her doubling down after I simply said I had more bad vibes from her is also not great imo, saying I am playing "the typical scum hanging out in the background role" just kind of genuinely means nothing imo and is something that only feels true to the person saying it, there's not much in what I've done that is different from other low-effort posters in the game so this comment is just confirmation bias.

The only post you even bothered to analyze is the post where Black scumreads you and votes you, and your analysis is a half-baked justification of what is just an OMGUS
VOTE: Venmar

Careful, don't let that big brain of yours get out of hand now

[Venmar]

Damn, I guess you caught me, I'm scum

[Venmar]

I don't townread Umlaut though and I think you know that

[Venmar]

Damn, I guess you caught me, I'm scum

That's not what I was implying. I guess I should have asked if you still feel this way, but your second post kinda answers that for me

When you asked me the people on me were you, Bristep and Invisibility. I felt that way

then

since I townread Invisibility, nullread Bristep at best.

[Venmar]

Man everyone who thinks I'm scum is either scum or dumb

"Townreading Gera was objectively and factually WRONG!!! YOU CANT DO THAT"

Like are you fr right now jesus christ

[Venmar]

Funny enough I was just gonna vote myself in one of my last few posts but now I'd be hammering myself.

Someone should hammer me tbh I'm too frustrated with this bs

[Venmar]

When I flip town I think at least 1 scum is in Black/Umlaut

Bye

[Venmar]

You should unvote me to see

[Venmar]

VOTE: Umlaut

[Venmar]

Kind of curious how nobody has asked me to claim yet lol

There's definitely scum on my wagon the question is are they both on it.

[Venmar]

You people aren't even reading my posts really, it's not a "why me" argument, it's the fact that Black mentioned me once in her post but threw shade at Umlaut twice, Gera twice, and Bris once. Her views "evolved" on the latter two a bit by the end of the post but idk how someone spends a catchup post talking about others more including twice about how she didn't like Umlaut and his reads list and then pulls me out of the hat unless they are scum pretending to give out reads and then pushing someone arbitrary that is in their interest to do so. I don't fully buy Blacks "Oh I just wanted to push Venmar and see how people reacted and see what stuck" tbh.

I know everyone here is fixated on the fact that Black voted me and I hit back and it looks like OMGUS, and that nobody here can look past the fact that y'all want to boil it down to "why me", but y'all are acting like OMGUS is an AI behaviour which imo it isn't on its own, and more importantly I just feel like everyone either isn't reading my posts, don't have the reading comprehension to see what I'm seeing or are just purposefully misrepping me, and it's really frustrating. Or maybe I'm just stupid and having a real bad town game, idk.

[Venmar]

Above was mostly a reaction to NK15's #466

[Venmar]

Jesus you are dense

[Venmar]

#467 and #468 by Umlaut don't vibe with me

Gera complaining about Invisibility being hyper active scum or w/e is dumb

Greeting's analysis of Black and I as TvT seems premature tbh but I'm okay with their posts for now

[Venmar]

You people aren't even reading my posts really, it's not a "why me" argument, it's the fact that Black mentioned me once in her post but threw shade at Umlaut twice, Gera twice, and Bris once. Her views "evolved" on the latter two a bit by the end of the post but idk how someone spends a catchup post talking about others more including twice about how she didn't like Umlaut and his reads list and then pulls me out of the hat unless they are scum pretending to give out reads and then pushing someone arbitrary that is in their interest to do so.

I have no idea why you are still caught up on me voting for you. You're acting like I wrote my vote in pen and announced that I'm not budging. Like why are you so fixated on the fact that I voted for you over Umlaut? There was already a wagon formed on him if I'm not mistaken and there was a lot more value in creating a wagon on you. Why can't you get over the fact that I voted for you?

I'm responding to the people who keep bringing it up to push me, I could roll over and die as well if you want

[Venmar]

I disagree! You should hammer me if you think my fixation is weird!

[Venmar]

Look I am not saying you are confirmed scum, I'd be tunneling you if I thought that, but you haven't really done anything to push you out of my scumpile either? If you think your vote was perfect and super townie, fine, I disagree, we can leave it at that? I'm only looking fixated because people like NK keep bringing it up and I'm just responding to them.

[Venmar]

Evidently when I inevitably flip green, of course there's been some value in starting a wagon on me and generation discussion, I've had meaningful interactions with Black, Greeting, Umlaut, Mala, Invis, Gera, even NK15, maybe others idk. I'm just saying that I don't think just because that is the case that it was also your initial motivation for the wagon. I don't think there is a lot to support that in what you posted back then and just because you're saying it now after the fact I am not convinced. I could be convinced otherwise later but encouraging my fixation probably isn't productive either, idk?

PEdit: I don't even know what is going on anymore, I feel like I'm being gaslit or I'm just dumb and digging my own hole deeper. I don't remember not acknowledging this or that.

[Venmar]

I clearly want to sort you, I have you sorted and have said I could be wrong but idk why you think it's productive to keep trying to hammer the fact that you thought your reasoning wasn't scumnmy into my head as if it's going to accomplish something. Are you more interested in me sorting you, you being right, or me just not SReading you anymore?

[Venmar]

I feel like we're going in circles tbh. If you did explain why, point it to me, but I feel like you could answer your own questions by reading my posts about the topic.

[Venmar]

Starting a counterwagon to Umlaut who, get this, I also scumread? I think it's easy to discern why I wouldn't buy that? You and Umlaut as a pairing made sense to me for some reason up until you decided to pivot to Umlaut, at which point idk if bussing him is a strat here, that I'll have to sort later. Besides, I don't find starting counterwagons is inherently more productive than just pushing the current wagon and seeing what falls out. It's mostly NAI to me, so I disagree that it's a "non-scummy" or correct reasoning, though obv I found the way you did it to be more scummy than NAI.

#315 and my rebuttal in #377 remain accurate on my thoughts on the matter if you have more questions.

[Venmar]

No that's my issue with your current explanation for going for Umlaut originally, which wasn't your original reason until recently? It was in the back of my head originally though

[Venmar]

I'm sorry black. Honestly I just say things and I don't mean to do many things people then accuse me of like twisting words, I don't want this conversation to be needlessly frustrating for either of us. I think sometimes my thought process makes sense to me but it comes across as shitposting half the time.

[Venmar]

Gosh darn it, who is scum?

[Venmar]

I got some town vibes from our exchange on D1 Venmar but this feels like fake frustration and a question for the audience rather than a genuine thought

Don't make a bigger deal out of it than needed! I was just confident that Umlaut would flip scum tbh

[Venmar]

Gosh darn it, who is scum?

how do you feel about Black right now?

Honestly still scumread her, its where im gravitating right now but I think the T3 NK and Umlaut flipping town had made me think that one of the lurk/fluff posters like Gerain/NK/Gera may actually be scum just by PoE and I'd lean NK for now cause yeah that hammer stunk

[Venmar]

Malakittens I've also mostly townread cause I like her vibes/playstyle but tbh I don't remember her doing much

[Venmar]

I kind of want to park my vote here actually

VOTE: Malakitten

I dont think I'm needed to pressure NK for now

[Venmar]

explain why please

I've re-evaluated my townread on her. I feel like she hasn't really done anything I can remember and I feel like I've given her a mental pass till now and would like to add a bit of pressure if possible.

Plus I took a quick look at T3's ISO cause I feel like there must've been a reason for him dying and his main scumreads were Greeting, Mala and Umlaut/Bris in that order of strength? Could've been a random NK or could've been silenced to take some pressure off of Greeting or Mala and I kinda like Greeting more but I'd like to pressure both. Latter feels more plausible than misdirection since NK15 or I probably felt like the obvious D2 pushes anyway.

I'm probably trying to overthink this idk?

[Venmar]

Also been sitting on this for a while but I've decided that I hate Gera's #579, I couldn't decide if it was scummy or just NAI but I don't see a reason why NK15 would warrant a defense from Gera tbh, the vibe of the post is off to me

[Venmar]

VC 1.19

Umlaut

(6): Greeting, Black, Venmar, patchwork, Malakittens, Not Known 15

Venmar

(3):

bristep123

,

Umlaut

,

T

3

Not Known 15

(1): Invisibility

Invisibility

(1): geraintm

If we are to assume that the scums spread their votes, then I would suggest going after

bristep123

next.

The kill of Night 1 suggests either inexperience or an unconventional approach, which, in my opinion, fits into the

N K 15

/

bristep123

scumteam.

Oh, and please do not hammer before announcing intent to do so.

Why is NK your vote? Do you think a scum like bristep parked on me while the Umlaut wagon was all town until NK came in with a scummy hammer?

[Venmar]

Venmar #582 and Greeting #585 pings my radar, Ven speculates that T3’s reads pre-death got him killed then immediately Greeting focused on the Venmar wagon at end of d1, speculating that NK and I spread our votes despite both being on Venmar until NK hammered Umlaut. It’s stretchy logic and potentially distraction to set up me as the d3 miselim no matter how nk flips. It’s definitely very interesting given the fact that greeting was on T3’s list and this being highlighted immediately before greetings post.

I struggle to see how my post is connected to what Greeting went on to say based off of your explanation here, tbh. I can't tell if you're scumreading us by association or for doing two different scummy things separately?

Besides, I have three issues with your logic if you

are

accusing me of working or coordinating with Greeting, one is that I'm also sus of Greeting and I immediately attacked Greeting after his post because I disagree with his VCA. Two, you were at the bottom of my list and I didn't focus on you much, I singled out Greeting and Mala so saying you're being set up as a D3 miselim is incorrect with regards to me, and three, you seem to be hinting that Greeting and I coordinated our posts which I imagine would require daytalk, and as far as I'm concerned we have no ways of knowing if that's a thing..?

[Venmar]

I kind of townread Patchwork for the way they've decided to agree with me on Mala, just gives me townie vibes

[Venmar]

like iirc no one scumreads me as of right now
anyways bri i have a question for you. what's your read on mala, and why?

I don't townread you. I think you could definitely be scum

Any thoughts on Mala, Greeting, whats happened last two pages, etc?

[Venmar]

You’ve misread me I’m afraid, I wasn’t speculating that you and greeting were a scum team. I said greeting seemed to react to your post, not coordinate with it.

That's fair, I rescind much of my post with regards to that then. You scumread us for independent reasons then or what?

[Venmar]

The t3 read list applies to them as well but it was the combination of ven's post and greetings reply which pinged me rather than just gen’s post in isolation. T3’s reads in isolation i can’t wholly get behind given our last game when he vigged town players 3 nights in a row.

Though you can understand my confusion since in posts like this you emphasize that it's the combination of our posts that pinged you rather than either one in isolation so I'd like you to explain why they're scummy together rather than just by themselves if you don't think we're a scumteam?

[Venmar]

The t3 read list applies to them as well but it was the combination of ven's post and greetings reply which pinged me rather than just gen’s post in isolation. T3’s reads in isolation i can’t wholly get behind given our last game when he vigged town players 3 nights in a row.

Though you can understand my confusion since in posts like this you emphasize that it's the combination of our posts that pinged you rather than either one in isolation so I'd like you to explain why they're scummy together rather than just by themselves if you don't think we're a scumteam?

So I’m not referring to your post as scummy. You speculated that greeting and mala could be scummy based on T3’s list, I’ve clarified here that the reason why I have got a ping from greeting was due to his reaction to your post not because you pinged him in yours - otherwise it would be inconsistent for me to sus him and not mala.

Why say my post pinged you in #590 then?

[Venmar]

Okay, I'm mostly happy with Bris' explanation tbh

Honestly I kind of think both scum are in this group; {Malakitten, Greeting, Black, NK15}

Invisibility and Patchwork feel like town to me, I can kind of vibe with Bris and Gera might be town just by PoE of me scumreading others more.

[Venmar]

I think the coinvent 180 flip on me feels odd. esp when venmar was "townreading" me all D1, but noticed when there is support for me is there to start pushing me

This would make sense if it was true but I'm like 99% sure nobody was talking about you today until I decided to pivot on you and I could've just piled on NK15. I kickstarted the discussion on you so there's nothing to the idea that I read the room and saw support to push you lol.

Bad reaction by Mala imo.

[Venmar]

like iirc no one scumreads me as of right now
anyways bri i have a question for you. what's your read on mala, and why?

I don't townread you. I think you could definitely be scum

Any thoughts on Mala, Greeting, whats happened last two pages, etc?

I haven't read the last few pages in detail but I didn't like Greeting putting NK at e-1

Mala is in my blind spot. What should I look at regarding her?

She hasn't really done anything all game, was one of T3's main scumreads, and tbh has just been present but not contributory and my gut changed places on her. Don't think her reaction to the pressure so far has been great either tbh.

What was your original read on her in D1?

[Venmar]

Why would I kill someone who was scum reading me?

You know damn right that I wouldn’t do that.

Why would I know that?

[Venmar]

All I see is Venmar/patches voting together pretty much this entire game. If this is the pair I'm going to lol

Lol

[Venmar]

You we're on the Umlaut wagon together D1 which just so happened to be the Venmar counterwagon. You two also tried to shade me at the same time but you never voted me like Venmar did

I also find it a little weird how you didn't vote until the game was almost 500 posts long. Normally you get into it quicker it think

Spoiler: Venmar/Patch

VC 1.15

Venmar

(5): bristep123, Umlaut, T3, Not Known 15, geraintm

Umlaut

(4): Greeting, Black, Venmar, patchwork

Not Known 15

(1): Invisibility

Not Voting

(1): Malakittens

With 11 alive, it takes 6 votes to accidentally disassemble a player. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2023-05-09 12:20:00).

VC 1.16 (unchanged)

Venmar

(5): bristep123, Umlaut, T3, Not Known 15, geraintm

Umlaut

(4): Greeting, Black, Venmar, patchwork

Not Known 15

(1): Invisibility

Not Voting

(1): Malakittens

With 11 alive, it takes 6 votes to accidentally disassemble a player. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2023-05-09 12:20:00).

VC 1.17

Venmar

(5): bristep123, Umlaut, T3, Not Known 15, geraintm

Umlaut

(5): Greeting, Black, Venmar, patchwork, Malakittens

Not Known 15

(1): Invisibility

Not Voting

(0):

With 11 alive, it takes 6 votes to accidentally disassemble a player. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2023-05-09 12:20:00).

VC 1.18

Umlaut

(5): Greeting, Black, Venmar, patchwork, Malakittens

Venmar

(4): bristep123, Umlaut, T3, Not Known 15

Not Known 15

(1): Invisibility

Invisibility

(1): geraintm

Not Voting

(0):

With 11 alive, it takes 6 votes to accidentally disassemble a player. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2023-05-09 12:20:00).

VC 1.19

Umlaut

(6): Greeting, Black, Venmar, patchwork, Malakittens, Not Known 15

Venmar

(3): bristep123, Umlaut, T3

Not Known 15

(1): Invisibility

Invisibility

(1): geraintm

Not Voting

(0):

With 11 alive, it takes 6 votes to accidentally disassemble a player. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2023-05-09 12:20:00).

Mod notes: brb killing Umlaut

VC 2.03

Not Known 15

(2): Invisibility, Greeting

Malakittens

(2): Venmar, patchwork

Venmar

(1): Not Known 15

Greeting

(1): bristep123

Not Voting

(3): Malakittens, geraintm, Black

With 9 alive, it takes 5 votes to put a player on the blocking chop. Day 2 ends in (expired on 2023-05-16 09:40:00).

VC 2.04

Malakittens

(2): Venmar, patchwork

Greeting

(2): bristep123, Invisibility

Not Known 15

(1): Greeting

Venmar

(1): Not Known 15

Not Voting

(3): Malakittens, geraintm, Black

With 9 alive, it takes 5 votes to put a player on the blocking chop. Day 2 ends in (expired on 2023-05-16 09:40:00).

I feel like scum normally try to avoid this type of stuff but if it's to keep Venmar alive I can kinda see it. There's equity here

Hi there, seeing as how I know I am town, if one of me or Patch is scum its Patch. I apologize for the confusion, I hope this helps clear it up.

[Venmar]

Blacks sudden focus on Patch is weird considering she still hasn't provided the analysis she has promised (presumably on NK, Greeting, exchange between me and Bris, etc) and it feels like a deflection or a changing of topics.

It's also mostly baseless without one of Patch or I flipping and I feel like the interactions between me and Patch are pretty tame or unsuspicious, at least to me. I feel like Patch was combative with me last day off of memory

[Venmar]

What are your thoughts on patches?

See below

I kind of townread Patchwork for the way they've decided to agree with me on Mala, just gives me townie vibes

[Venmar]

Where was patch combative with you?

Idk, was going off of memory but Patch was mostly disagreeing with me last day. I'd say off of vibes, I don't think Patch and I were really on the same page, though I did manage to convince them a bit to look at your posts a bit more critically. Tbh while I was collecting the below posts, maybe it's a bit off in how Patch has developed their reads at times, but it's not enough to overwrite my current read of them.

I'd say these posts are examples of what I mean:

Spoiler: Posts

maybe this is a hot take but ill share it anyways
i feel like while i mindmeld with a lot of black's ISO, it is a little bare-boned
i also feel like venmar is just OMGUSing and i have no idea if it comes from town or scum

also like wdym by "what happened to 332"??? i can agree with black without thinking she's locktown

venmar, why do you dislike black's post? i thought it was a good catchup and it provided some fresh takes
like are you gonna engage with it or what? are you just saying you're more sure about black cause you wanna OMGUS?
i'm not opposed to a venmar wagon, but there's a lot of people on him right now. i'd rather use my vote somewhere else.

speaking of votes... can someone explain why they're voting umlaut? they've just kind of been unremarkable this game

Wait so Black scumreading cause im reading this game off of mainly vibes and gut but then you doing this:

bri (bad vibes to me)

wait have you explained this or does it start and end with vibes

starts and ends with vibes

Is supposed to make sense?

BIG THINKING EMOJI

Also can you answer my fucking question instead of deflecting.

Black's #256 bothered me because a chunk of the wall is irrelevant comments ("Hi patch", "Cant believe we won death note", etc), a lot of it is just empty commentary to me ("not following these reads by Umlaut", "this feels a little fence-sitty from bris", etc) that feels like Black trying to find a reason to be productive and useful as !scum, like trying to fill a quota, rather than being a townie trying to focus on something and scumhunting, and a lot of the reads are just pretty non-committal and fencesitty in of themselves (see the comments to 153, 233, 120, etc) despite her criticizing others for the same.

Her reasons for voting me are then also pretty poor since idk how she spends much of the post throwing shade at other players, some more than me like Umlaut, and then decided to single me out because I accidentally wrote down Greeting twice in my reads post and because I jokingly told people to sheep me with no context on Umlaut. Former reason is just bogus and the latter feels like manufactured outrage. It definitely feels like Black is really reaching and making a mountain out of a molehill by focusing on stuff like that and taking advantage of the fact that I've decided to play passive and have provided no context for me vibe reads which is a really easy playstyle to just blindly attack as scum with not much effort.

Her doubling down after I simply said I had more bad vibes from her is also not great imo, saying I am playing "the typical scum hanging out in the background role" just kind of genuinely means nothing imo and is something that only feels true to the person saying it, there's not much in what I've done that is different from other low-effort posters in the game so this comment is just confirmation bias.

wouldn’t you say confirmation bias is more likely to come from town than scum?

...also if black is scum i’m gonna be honest i don’t think she’s this bad at it and also i find you’re claiming black did stuff she didn’t actually do? maybe i’m mistaken, it’s pretty late where i am, but i thought her catch-up post wasn’t that bad

[Venmar]

It's also mostly baseless without one of Patch or I flipping and I feel like the interactions between me and Patch are pretty tame or unsuspicious, at least to me. I feel like Patch was combative with me last day off of memory

I didn't tunnel Black like you were and you tried to bite my hand off for it

I just wanted you to see the light.

[Venmar]

I'm not exactly sure why the wagon disappeared in the first place. I've been asked why did I put

Not Known 15

on E-1, but maybe the question should be reversed. Why shouldn't

N K 15

be eliminated today?

NK's wagon probably disappeared cause I decided to pressure Mala instead and analyze T3's death, which kind of lead to a bunch of people doing the same which is why I think the votes are now mostly spread out evenly between you, Mala and I.

I do think NK15 deserves to be pressured for that hammer and for generally being cryptically lurky. Wouldn't be opposed to returning to that potentially.

[Venmar]

Town to Lean Town
Invisibility
Patchwork
Bristep

Null
Gera/Greeting

Lean Scum to Scum
NK15
Black/Malakitten

Kind of where I'm at atm, in this order of roughly towniest to scummiest

[Venmar]

Enchant is a vibe don't call them useless

[Venmar]

Enchant what are your thoughts about replacing into a scum slot.

[Venmar]

I had a look at not known's posts.

Boy, their day 1 votes are bad.
And I just cannot see them as scum because they are that bad.

But their day 2....not much better.

I don't want to vote them though.

I realise the above makes no sense

Any thoughts on others aside from NK/Enchant?

[Venmar]

Can we talk about Mala's vote for Umlaut btw?

Malakitten as far as I can see, didn't vote for pretty much all of D1 aside from RVS and then her Umlaut vote. Looking through her ISO, she basically never mentions Umlaut aside from this post:

I’m not really sure I understand the umlaut votes right now.

As for greeting it’s a bit early for me to give an opinion on how I feel about him.

Here she kind of soft-defends Umlaut by at least expressing that she doesn't understand the votes. Umlaut at this time had 3 votes (Greeting, Venmar, Invis).

The next time Mala even mentions Umlaut it's in the post she votes for him and puts him at E-1

VOTE: umlaut

Lowkey don’t vibe wi venmar scum

Oh e-1!

Like, with hindsight, I find the lack of read progression here and the vote in general very stinky? The subsequent "Oh, oops, E-1, hehe" type post also just kind of rubs me the wrong way. Perhaps Mala voted Umlaut over me because she townread me a bit more, but it's a low-effort way of pushing someone else onto E-1 without an effort at analysis or explaining read or vote.

[Venmar]

@Invisibility

; What are your thoughts on Malakitten and Black?

[Venmar]

VOTE: Black

Can we try this if you guys like Mala. Idk why any of you do tbh its kinda frustrating

[Venmar]

Yay!

VOTE: Malakitten

[Venmar]

VOTE: Black

Can we try this if you guys like Mala. Idk why any of you do tbh its kinda frustrating

Don't make me counterwagon you

OMGUS

[Venmar]

VOTE: Black

Can we try this if you guys like Mala. Idk why any of you do tbh its kinda frustrating

what is your current interpretation of the discussion you had last yesterday with Black? Also has anything she's done today changed your opinion on her? (other you viewing her as focusing on Patch too much which you've already said)

I still think Black is scum, I hope this clears it up. Her posts recently have reinforced my thoughts on this, #721 and #723 just ping my gut among others

[Venmar]

though part of me does want to vote Enchant cuz 1. it would be funny and 2. I want to

Missed chance to vote and instantly revote back.

Which you will never recover.

You still haven't responded to my post here:

Enchant what are your thoughts about replacing into a scum slot.

[Venmar]

Honestly so true, you should vote Mala instead though because I am TOWN

[Venmar]

it's ok Enchant I respect your opinion. Give me an opinion right now I can prove it

I don't have opinion, i sheep first person who asked me to sheep.

Spineless life

Yeah but have you considered the fact that voting me hurts my feelings and makes me feel sad?

[Venmar]

I'm not good at cases tbh, unfortunately this game doesnt have a chad town caser for me to just attach to

Look at my ISO though, #694, #634 and #582 are the gist of it

[Venmar]

Mala is town, but I think Venmar might be too

Wait why is Mala town for you all of the sudden? You had her as a "blind spot" for you not even 2 pages before this post, here:

What was your original read on her in D1?

She's been in my blind spot the whole game. All I remember is NK putting her at e-1 on like page 6 or something and thinking that was pretty scummy of NK

All I see is Venmar/patches voting together pretty much this entire game. If this is the pair I'm going to lol

Which also reminds me that your exploration of Patch and I peetered out and you didn't really respond to my posts on page 27, specifically 660 and 661

[Venmar]

Did you not read 661, the post I referenced and above the one you quoted?

[Venmar]

Wait why is Mala town for you all of the sudden? You had her as a "blind spot" for you not even 2 pages before this post, here:

Vibes

This is the only meaningful post Mala made between you calling her a blind spot and you calling her town:

So patch if I’m up there on the town list why are you voting me

Was that really enough off of "vibes" for her to become a firmer townread than me who you've been saying is probably town for a while now?

[Venmar]

Did you not read 661, the post I referenced and above the one you quoted?

Where in 661 do you say how you're reading patch? Do you TR them or not?

Sorry I meant #660 but it's still above the post you quoted (661)

[Venmar]

I've called Patch town in these posts as well: #628, #673, and #618

[Venmar]

Did you not read 661, the post I referenced and above the one you quoted?

Where in 661 do you say how you're reading patch? Do you TR them or not?

Sorry I meant #660 but it's still above the post you quoted (661)

That's the only reason you townread patch?? Because they're helping you wagon people?

Oh, also vibes

[Venmar]

Malakitten or Greeting

[Venmar]

I have no interest in voting Patch, thanks. I won't be voting anyone not named Mala or Black today

[Venmar]

@Invisibility

; What are your thoughts on Malakitten and Black?

noting

Yay!

VOTE: Malakitten

see, didnt liek them up top and now this sucky vote

I don't understand most of your posts including this. I was voting Mala before I asked Invis anything lol

[Venmar]

I feel like I'm just screaming into the wind this game like an idiot.

[Venmar]

Venmar dude chill

???

[Venmar]

I don't remember anyone being mean or using personal insults this game..?

[Venmar]

? posts don't agree with that, the Q was 700, the vote 735?

I was voting Mala the whole time, voted Black very briefly and hopped back on Mala when Invis joined.

Your logic is so busted, asking someone about their thoughts about a player is normal behaviour from town trying to solicit votes for their scumreads.

Just fucking vote me already

[Venmar]

Gera should vote me if he thinks I'm scummy. Dude is sitting here not voting anyone nor contributing while shading and being defeatist. Like be useful, like voting me or something

[Venmar]

Yeah, I am townreading a lot of players, but honestly I tried reevaluating my reads and still came to similar conclusions. If the scum team is not

Enchant

/

bristep123

, then I would go after

Black

, who, upon re-reading isn't as towny as I previously thought.

Patchwork

has no reason to come after me if he is scum, because I will flip town and they would know it. Which is why I think they're town.

Greeting is mafia lol

Why are you still voting me

[Venmar]

Gera should vote me if he thinks I'm scummy. Dude is sitting here not voting anyone nor contributing while shading and being defeatist. Like be useful, like voting me or something

I've not got any strong reason to vote anyone today, joining a wagon for zero good reason just for thr sake of it to me is bad.

I don't think this is true but w/e

I think Gera is more anti-town than scum tbh but I've never played with him before so idk if this is typical

[Venmar]

I've had enough paranoid thoughts about Patch and Invis as well to basically have no strong townreads anymore and I think you're all scum. Game is going to break me.

[Venmar]

I'm sad I spent all that time making my mala post and no one even acknowledged it's existence

I saw it but I disagree with it generally, I feel like you correctly scumread her for the actually bad things she did (like her OMGUS flip on me, being upset she couldnt pocket me, etc), give her too much credit for things I'd consider very minor, or you draw incorrect conclusions (like the whole Mala putting Umlaut on E-1, theorizing that the only way Mala is scum here is if she's partners with me is a wild theory considering voting for Umlaut would put Umlaut at E-1 and voting for me would have been hammering me; !scumMala doesn't benefit much from hammering !townme and would've gotten blasted like NK did for hammering Umlaut. This is also ignoring that I'd be hard bussing my partner right now if your original theory was true. You're giving Mala way too much credit for her Umlaut vote which to this point I don't think she's even attempted to explain or excuse?).

Also idk why you still townread me when even in the Mala ISO you threw strays at me like the above Mala theory and for my weird pivot on my Mala read, etc.

[Venmar]

Yeah, I am townreading a lot of players, but honestly I tried reevaluating my reads and still came to similar conclusions. If the scum team is not

Enchant

/

bristep123

, then I would go after

Black

, who, upon re-reading isn't as towny as I previously thought.

Patchwork

has no reason to come after me if he is scum, because I will flip town and they would know it. Which is why I think they're town.

Greeting is mafia lol

Why are you still voting me

Because i sheep mala

And here I thought you were actually a good player, smh

[Venmar]

I think we should explode Greeting

I think we should explode Mala or Black

[Venmar]

Can't say I'm convinced Greeting is scum tbh but I've mostly glazed over the last 2 pages

[Venmar]

I think we should explode Greeting

I think we should explode Mala or Black

Explore it then. Make your case. Don't make others do it for you

I don't think I'm good enough to case.

I'd prefer to just sulk around tbh

[Venmar]

Jk i'll try to do a case brb

[Venmar]

Mala is scum because:

- Umlaut vote to E-1 was STINKY
- Turn around on me was OMGUS and STINKY
- I don't think she's done much this game and it feels like scum hanging out in the background, STINKY!
- I think T3 NK could point to Mala scum since T3 was one of few people who was exploring Mala as a scumread, Mala indicating otherwise is WIFOM, VERY STINKY!
- VIBES

Black is scum because:

- Her wagon on me D1 was VERY STINKY and I've explained why in posts like #315
- ^ TL;DR I think Black made a bad reads post that felt fake and singled me out to wagon for what I believe to be scummy reasons
- I think Black abandoned my wagon when it was reaching its climax because !scumBlack knew me flipping Green would make her look bad so she pivoted to Umlaut and solicited my help since I scumread Umlaut too, feels like STINKY scum maneuvering!
- I've scumread Black pretty consistently this day because I feel like she's been around but hasn't actually contributed or engaged in actual concrete scumhunting herself, she just seems "present" and asking people questions or hopping wagons without doing much. STINKY
- VIBES

Disclaimer: Vibes and Gut might be the true dominant reasons for both scumreads ty

[Venmar]

ok how did i do?

[Venmar]

VOTE: Enchant

THIS IS A PROTEST VOTE

[Venmar]

SHEEP ME INSTEAD

[Venmar]

I lol’d at venmar and the stinky

listen i am a serious man

[Venmar]

VOTE: Black

[Venmar]

I WANT TO SHAKE THIS TREE

[Venmar]

I WANT TO SHAKE THIS TREE

A wild Umbreon appeared!

1. Umbreon cannot be caught in the wild, 2. I was hoping for a Munchlax

I would know since I'm replaying Platinum atm!

STINKY

[Venmar]

I just feel like you're "around" and asking people the odd question but not doing any actual casing or solving yourself, like you keep asking people to do stuff and to make cases but I just don't feel like you're doing that either? Like I get you're asking questions but I don't think you're actually moving the game state forward or using the answers you get to do much solving.

That's just how I feel :shrug:

PEdit: @Black

[Venmar]

I claim Town Mayor and that my vote has the weight of 6 votes

[Venmar]

That was a joke pls don't kill me

[Venmar]

It's okay I accept your apology

[Venmar]

I was kind of hoping it was real since I am getting kinda tired of Venmar yelling about Black and Mala LOL. Also ummmm the flip would provide information or something idk

I scumread them what can I say

[Venmar]

idk say that you scumread them but in a funny English accent

I mean what do you want me to do. I could see myself compromising on Enchant if push came to shove but I just don't understand why everyone is so intent on townreading the two of them. I feel like I need one of them to explode to advance my own personal reads/solving and nobody seems interested in engaging with me about it.

[Venmar]

idk say that you scumread them but in a funny English accent

I mean what do you want me to do. I could see myself compromising on Enchant if push came to shove but I just don't understand why everyone is so intent on townreading the two of them. I feel like I need one of them to explode to advance my own personal reads/solving and nobody seems interested in engaging with me about it.

This seems like an awful excuse to just stop solving. You should be trying to solve based on a scenario where one or both of us are town, but instead you are just using our presence as a reason to sit around and do nothing

Do you still think im town?

[Venmar]

Do you still think im town?

Unfortunately, yeah. It would be cool if I didn't. I would love to yeet you just for how annoying you've been regarding pushing me

I do want to talk about Newbie 2119 now that its over. You feel completely different in this game compared to that one. In 2119 it really felt like you were putting way more thought into the game and it was almost like your townie-ness was a shining beacon that was hard to miss. I can tell you're thinking about this game too but it feels like you're much less into it or something. And you definitely don't feel as townie. Any clue why that is?

I actually think I'm equally invested in this game as I was in our previous Newbie game. I'm happy with my play this day too but I do think I'm less confident in my reads in general. I feel like my townreads could be scum and my scumreads could be town but I decided I gotta stick with my gut a bit, I'm still trying to solve obv.

It's just kinda weird that you think I'm town but keep shading me in most posts. I'm still trying to process how I feel ablut it.

[Venmar]

I was going to come swinging into this day all like "Ha, I told y'all Greeting wasn't scum!" only to have a scumread of mine get killed and flip town and a townread of mine get vigged and flip scum.

I'm having a real bad game I guess...

Black if you're reading this, I apologize

[Venmar]

thats not why we are townreading you

patch looked like he was setting u up for a mislim thats kinda weird for a scum buddy to open like that without a guilty on you

For what it's worth I've seen Patch say things that look like setting up a miselim for the next day as town as well. I wouldn't clear Enchant just based off of Patch's reaction to it

[Venmar]

Gonna have to re-evaluate a lot of my reads I think, I've been hot dog water. Gonna do some VCA and ISO of Patch in a bit

[Venmar]

My attempt at somekind of a VCA:
Legend: Green is flipped town + me (duh), red are players that flipped scum

VC 1.14

Venmar

(5): bristep123,

Umlaut, T3

, Not Known 15, geraintm

Umlaut

(2):

Greeting, Black

Black

(1):

Venmar

Not Known 15

(1): Invisibility

Not Voting

(2):

patchwork

, Malakittens

With 11 alive, it takes 6 votes to accidentally disassemble a player. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2023-05-09 12:20:00).

Honestly, just based off of the analysis of my own wagon at its peak, it makes me think that scum should be in {Bris, Enchant, Gera} since I just can't see me being run up to E-1 with three other town (Me + 2 flipped town) voting elsewhere and Patch not voting. This soft clears Invis in my eyes and makes Mala more likely to be town to my begrudging admission, idk if both scum don't vote here.

[Venmar]

I could still see Enchant scum independent of Patch's actions; NK15's hammer was super bad and Enchant engaging in a WIFOM defense while spending D2 just hiding behind a sheep of Mala isn't really an inspiring look for me to think Enchant is town.

[Venmar]

Kinda leaning Gera from that trio though, but I'm still trying to sort of Gera has been scummy or just anti-town, it's hard to see the difference usually.

[Venmar]

VC 2.18

Greeting

(5):

patchwork

, Invisibility, bristep123, Malakittens, Enchant

Enchant

(2):

Greeting, Black

Black

(1):

Venmar

Not Voting

(1): geraintm

With 9 alive, it takes 5 votes to put a player on the blocking chop. Day 2 ends in (expired on 2023-05-16 09:40:00).

Interesting that both flipped town were voting Enchant. But the Greeting wagon is Patch + 4 unconfirmed players. I think both scum on Greeting is definitely plausible, though an apathetic scum like Gera sitting on the sidelines isn't out of the question since Gera spent both days bragging about how the wagons would flip town without contributing otherwise. If we rule out Invis and Mala for "towniness" based off of previous VCAs, this leaves us with {Bris, Enchant, Gera} again like my previous VCA of my own wagon. I haven't played with !scumPatch prior to this so idk if they'd try to bus their partner for a bad hammer right out of the gate D2 like Patch did, so idk if Enchant deserves being cleared, I haven't liked their play independent of Patch.

[Venmar]

A quick ISO of Patch re: Bris, Gera and Enchant/NK15

Bris:

Patch's interactions with Bris are initially the most sus to me tbh since Patch basically never really interacted with Bris aside from "empty" posts like this, yet lumped him in as a townread in #643. Patch also showed some frustration at Bris' push on Patch in #838 where Patch's frustration seems pretty tame, I feel like Patch would've explored this more with regards to Bris if the latter was town?

However, I think a quick ISO of Bris and his interactions with Patch are better, I think Bris' push on Patch feels pretty authentic. This also made me realize Patch frequently referred to Bris as just "Bri" which makes it hard to ISO fully.

NK15/Enchant;

Patch's interactions here are very very sparse between Patch and Enchant themselves, but Patch's scumreading of that slot and pushing of trying to set it up two days in a row feels more like scum looking for a miselim than bussing for now. I think NK15's hammer was very bad though and I think Patch's reaction to it would've been plausible if they were town as well; obviously Patch flipped scum but the action itself I could see coming from town which is why I think it blended in very well as a quick bus; it didn't take too much for Patch to abandon Enchant's wagon either and they hopped off after I did my 180 on Mala and didn't return to voting NK/Enchant for the rest of the day.

I think if Enchant was town, Patch would've likely focused on trying to elim them harder but honestly it looks like Patch shaded Enchant pretty hard after both hammers but after the first hammer, didn't really push Enchant much and left the wagon fairly early. Honestly many of us did but many like Black, me, etc would still talk about Enchant's slot whereas Patch mostly stopped. This isn't definitive and maybe it's confirmation bias since I don't like Enchant's play, but I don't think Patch's actions hard clear Enchant.

Gera;

This one I'm not sure on, I feel like Patch interacted with Gera a fair bit early in the day and then it peetered off, Patch mostly makes the odd comment with him and ultimately puts him as a null in reads list. Tbh I'd have to analyze this one more later.

[Venmar]

pow: you mad cuz i voted you

hehe

[Venmar]

VOTE: Enchant

This is a OMGUS vote

[Venmar]

Mala vote Enchant!

[Venmar]

I mean have we got nothing else to go on that everyone is relying on vca?

Invis I’ll save you some bother, I shot patch.

VOTE: Gera that defence would be stronger if you hadn’t made the exact same early “I am panicky if I’m scum” claim in another recent game where you were actually scum.

Tbh I think Enchant is just scum based off of the hammers and their play. Gera and Enchant are both scum or town for how they play I think we just yeet the one making the bad hammers first

[Venmar]

VLA til Friday - lots of tests

You should vote Enchant so he can sheep you

[Venmar]

Not convinced Gera is scum tbh.

I really do think it's Enchant and we should flip that spot

[Venmar]

I think if Enchant was town, Patch would've likely focused on trying to elim them harder but honestly it looks like Patch shaded Enchant pretty hard after both hammers but after the first hammer, didn't really push Enchant much and left the wagon fairly early.

fair but people still talked about Enchant relatively little so I still feel okay with considering him town. Patchwork might've thought Enchant was ez lim and then he wasn't and they couldn't figure out anything to say about him. Patch seemed to have difficulty saying stuff about other players that did more like, stuff, so I dunno how much Patch saying less about Enchant invalidates the TR

This post doesn't make sense to me tbh. Enchant's slot is independently scummy for two consecutively terrible hammers that idk why we've given them a pass for. Patch tried to set-up an NK15/Enchant wagon two elims in a row, but never actually pushed or cased it. At best, this is NAI behaviour because Patch had trouble casing or talking about many players and Enchant is still scum independently, at worst, it's scummy behaviour because it looks like Patch distancing from !scumEnchant.

[Venmar]

I think if Enchant was town, Patch would've likely focused on trying to elim them harder but honestly it looks like Patch shaded Enchant pretty hard after both hammers but after the first hammer, didn't really push Enchant much and left the wagon fairly early.

fair but people still talked about Enchant relatively little so I still feel okay with considering him town. Patchwork might've thought Enchant was ez lim and then he wasn't and they couldn't figure out anything to say about him. Patch seemed to have difficulty saying stuff about other players that did more like, stuff, so I dunno how much Patch saying less about Enchant invalidates the TR

This post doesn't make sense to me tbh. Enchant's slot is independently scummy for two consecutively terrible hammers that idk why we've given them a pass for. Patch tried to set-up an NK15/Enchant wagon two elims in a row, but never actually pushed or cased it. At best, this is NAI behaviour because Patch had trouble casing or talking about many players and Enchant is still scum independently, at worst, it's scummy behaviour because it looks like Patch distancing from !scumEnchant.

You still didn't answer why they are terrible.

I didn't? Oh well

[Venmar]

Vibes!

[Venmar]

The 1st hammer was done by NK15 and it got them dogpiled on start of D2 there is no way you people are asking me to explain why that hammer blew ass

[Venmar]

You are so silly

[Venmar]

i just feel like the games gonna end within {gera/venmar/invis}

what do you think of Venmar and me

Better question is what are your reads on players like me, Enchant and Gera considering you aren't voting and are only one who could hammer Gera.

[Venmar]

sigh

[Venmar]

No thanks

Guys im too drunk atm to do analysis or whatever but I think its Enchant

Town I can feel your weight of expectation on me but i am telling you right now that I am going to let you down

[Venmar]

Your winrate is literally 50% either way if you're town what is this mental gymnastics to try and justify voting me

[Venmar]

I did townread patch but at least Bris bailed us on that one

I'm just gonna vote Enchant in a few posts and get this over with tbh but I'll let y'all say your peace first if u want

Or maybe I'll sit down after work and do some actual analysis but I don't see how it isn't Enchant here

[Venmar]

Damn Mala almost lost town the game but it turns out it was Mala all along?

[Venmar]

VOTE: Malakitten

so mad I didnt trust my gut