Pokemon Battles 2 - Attack on Giratina [GAME OVER]

[Meuh]

Though I feel like larges generally start really shit for town and then progressively improve so idk

[Meuh]

VOTE: Firebringer OMGUS

[Meuh]

Chandra your read on me is super tbh. From what I can see you disliked my wagon hopping day 1 and then threw some random shade early day 2 and since then you've just included me in every scumpool ever and haven't commented on like anything I've done since early day 2?
This ropes into my issues with the way you're playing here, there's a lot of pointing at where to find scum and where to vote with little thought processes shown and little progression. It doesn't feel like you're actually trying to figure the game out. You're present and you're moving the game but it's always moving players towards some scumpools and some players and never advancing the gamestate with reads.
VOTE: Chandra

[Meuh]

It's like you've been trying to make sure you've established me as a viable wagon both so you can jump on it and so I can stay perpetually on people's radar (or at least perpetual until I get mislimmed, which is the endgoal there) without much substance as to why you're so willing to vote me and haven't reconsidered ever?? My early day 2 had solving that you brushed over to call me out on 2 random posts instead and my numerous attempts to move the game forward and figure things out are ignored and you're keeping the read stagnant.
There's nothing you find scummy or towny about my recent posting because you're not sorting me, you haven't actually thought about my alignment, you're not trying to figure things out, you're just making sure I never get too townread as to get out of the limpool. Your posts are the means to getting townies limmed and not the means to solving the game.

[Chandra Nalaar]

Am I allowed to townread OMGUS posts

[Merlyn]

Why does it matter to you though Merlyn - are you reading the slot as town? Where are you at?

I'm really interested in DGB thinking that giving you the gift would make him confirmed town. Italiano asked if there were any reasons not to lim DGB and I was thinking this would be a reason, if it was a super town ability. I'm not sure I do think a stat boost would clear someone in my eyes, so why did DGB?

I'm still trying to assemble reads. Normally when I replace in, I like to read the whole game beforehand and kind of make notes as I go- I gave up on that like 80 pages when I realized I wasn't really retaining anything useful. I'm trying to just see where people's heads are at and then go find the arguments and cases that have been made to support them and see what I think. For just vibes from posts today, I like Italiano, FL, and Yimmy. I'm kind of on the fence about you, Meuh, and STD.

[Merlyn]

Am I allowed to townread OMGUS posts

I like a little OMGUS here and there, sometimes the person voting you really is scum

[Chandra Nalaar]

Scumhunting update: I spent like 2 minutes trying to meta Black and stopped caring

VOTE: STD

[Firebringer]

VOTE: STD

would be willing to sheep chandra on me for the memes as well for the record

[Chandra Nalaar]

VOTE: Titus

Don't sheep me right now, I'm stumbling around in the dark.

[Firebringer]

VOTE: Don't sheep me right now, I'm stumbling around in the dark

[Flavor Leaf]

We need to stop being friends tbh.

We had a good time hanging out, but we have to find scum, so we gotta step on each other’s toes possibly.

The fact of the matter is we’re on Day 4, and there are absolutely no good reasons or cases for anyone to be scum, which is entirely indicative of scum being town read and likable this game.

I probably could town case everyone in this game, and I might go ahead and do that to see if that’s true when I get the time the next few days.

We get one scum flip, it will all start to fall into place, so I don’t think this game is as one sided as it seems.

DGB/Not Mafia are probably are biggest No-Info slots, and it feels like scum’s gotta be in at least one of them considering they aren’t getting run up as much as you’d think they should or pressured.

DGB wagon fell apart already in favor of Meuh.

Meuh I town read, but they’re directly interacting with me a lot more than everyone else, and I do feel it’s possible they’re playing me, but nonetheless, they are doing well at playing around me if they are scum.

Chandra, while i don’t want to count out based on respecting what I feel their scum game would be, not that I can recall off the top of my head, I do feel I get their position which is why I like Chandra-FB duo, and if I like that duo, Wheme also makes sense as town for me. I don’t think scum claim their Mathblade kill like that, and I don’t think Chandra gets upset at Math for doing that if it’s scum, unless it’s hard theatre, but I do believe if Chandra is scum, Wheme probably is as well.

I think they’re town, and that is my working pool.

Cakez, has dropped a tier lower based on me not really knowing what they’re up to, and not agreeing that I should have been unabashedly on the top of their read list all game.

I do think that was a tactic Cakez is playing, even if they’re town. If they’re town, they’re meme reaction testing me, which is fine, it’s just hard for me to read.

My paranoia on Cakez is making me get flashbacks of misfading them, though, so it still leans town for me.

[Flavor Leaf]

Merlyn’s looking fine, I like that post, i think their town reads are solid and doesn’t make sense for scum to empower Italiano, so if Merlyn is scum, Italiano probably is too.

I could see Blue and Squirtle legit getting mad at each other as Scum/Scum, and Blue going fuck this, and leaves out.

In the Jaded Flavor Era circa 2020-21, I got mad at Squirtle teammate as well.

[Meuh]

VOTE: sheep

Erm Sheep already died and flipped town...

[Chandra Nalaar]

Hey Stargazer! Long time no see. Have a vote.

VOTE: Stargazer

Also, I cannot be targeted by investigative abilities.

Tipping my hand, but are there even investigative abilities in this game? The only one that's flipped is on the SK.

Irony is that, if we wait long enough, deadline start knocking and we will NEED compromise lim.

It's a catch 22.

If we don't compromise on a decent lim, then we compromise on a shitty lim.

Perfect being the enemy of good is the story here.

Perfect is Drew lim but I get the feeling I may need to compromise.

Remember this powerful Drew scumread? Titus commented about it a lot and became frustrated it didn't turn into anything, but I never saw her try very hard to make it happen. Just some potshots and a naked vote. If you were frustrated by it not going anywhere I'd expect more motion to make it happen first.

While I don’t have the conviction that Titus has, I feel like it’s an acceptable read to have ScumDrew. I have a few things from Drew I’ve mentioned I feel are scummy, so I don’t necessarily see what’s wrong with having that read.

Drew, 5172 is just complaining about being scum read by Titus. You haven’t flipped yet, and while she keeps repeating it, I wouldn’t even say she’s pushing you that hard. Why’s it effecting you like that?

I can't speak for others, but she has done this too me before.....most notably and recently, what I keep hinting at, the last game we played when she was scum.

Was very similar, I made a jokey post, she took it seriously and just pushed me as scum without listening to any reasoning or explanations I gave......and low and behold she was scum.

I have been scum read here, fine, I don't agree and will point it out when I don't, but fine.

But Titus locks her sights on me and doesn't consider anything else.....even bases her other reads off of me being scum.

Like I said, she is being anti town and a waste of a slot.....even if she is town.

I am trying to get through to her to use logic and reasoning to even consider for a second that I am not scum, but she clearly isn't using it now.

Sorry what was a bit of a rant lol.

Drew, if you want to get through to me, stop bitching about me scumreading you. I'm not going to engage with you about my read on you unless and until someone else gives a damn.

Go find me other scum. Like case Italiano since I think it's possible.

Whining just convinces me I'm right.

I can hear this as talking to someone she knows is town. Can you?

in fact I want 3 people to give me TL;DRs if possible

it avoids being mislead by bias, alignment-related or not

Tldr, do not do this. Start fresh. We are deadlocked with camps forming. I should take this chance to try and be listened to regarding my townreads but my scumreads were also wrong. I'm as wrong as everyone else.

I find the "camps forming" comment to be mysterious with no interest in helping anyone else follow the process. Having a few reads wrong doesn't mean you throw them all away and start from zero, and there's no interest here in remedying that situation.

blue is still not dead. which tells you what my thread power level is at rn.

Same. I get the feeling I am set up to save Blue.

This never made any sense. "Set up" with no pressure against her? What does that even mean?

Lady Lambdadelta,

Enchant, Firebringer, NorwegianboyEE, Skygazer, Metens, KittyTacky,

Doctor Drew,

SirCakez, Meuh, Sheepsaysmeep, Black

WhemeStar, Flavor Leaf,

Ranger, Doctor Drew,

KittyTacky, NorwegianboyEE, Malakittens, SirCakez, ItalianoVD, Enchant, Not_Mafia

For the record the list of voting both is
Kitty
Mala
SirCakez
Enchant

And the effort to sort Kitty, SirCakez or Enchant is where exactly?

Math, please let things develop. "Bad" things may happen but we need to sort this out. Think of it like not overtalking in Botc. Take note and see who moves.

I'm not a fan of an StD wagon but I don't have an issue with people who voted (minus Italiano). That can check work.

LAMIST.

If the plan is to take notes, what is the result of that? What have you observed, it's day 4.

Legit never kill Math this game. I know, it's hard.

I occasionally PL Math but I can't see a reason to. We're in lock step which is a bit frightening that I'm totally wrong.

I agree, it is odd to see these two agreeing -- which is why I'm puzzled to see this as the only post on that subject.

It's also odd that this post doesn't contain any comment on Math's alignment, while responding to a very strong opinion from me on the subject.

I am strategically in favor of quick limming but unsure. I don't get why I'm alive.

Meuh, we can coordinate.

"I don't get why I'm alive" never made sense. Sure, a bunch of slots are townreading here for some reason (which is itself suspicious -- I don't see what Titus has done that merits that level of townread) - but nowhere close to nightkill territory.

@Yimmy - on what if they’re not there? VCA is a supplementary puzzle to read overall gamestate, but still needs the other stuff.

Like, VCA can be the bun, but just a bun doesn’t make up a hamburger

Sorry my VCA is all beef no gluten.

Why is Italiano still alive?

Italiano is still alive because you never voted him or pushed him.

ItalianoVD was is pretty pure but I'm frustrated it's not Drew.

Why are we still thinking Squirtle could be scum.
I might have bought it if they didn’t alt-slip but this really isn’t how they play as scum imo.

Same. Will probably go to Italiano if no one's interested in Drew. Just feel like scum are gunning for SquirtleSquad for no reason.

Again, I just don't believe this was frustration in the absence of significant effort to push it.

yawn

more votes on italiano or meuh

Meuh? Wtf...

I'm interested in the Meuh read. I saw no progression from Titus between having patchwork in her solve and acting like Meuh scumreads were bizarre.

Squirtle/Blue/Black/LLD square is not pure.

Squints. Town fracture and camp all the time. Sure Blue or Black could be scum but the other two I am TRing.

Doesn’t mean you are correct

True, I'm weakest early. I'll give my thoughts and play with them but I don't try to dominate like the ancient days.

Show me your thoughts and play with them. It's not early anymore.

Rathe (10)

Titus, SquirtleSquad,

Doctor Drew

,

Chandra Nalaar

,

Sheepsaysmeep

,

Save the Dragons,

Meuh

,

Firebringer

,

SirCakez

,

Pink Ball

Magical Girl (12)

Lady Lambdadelta

,

Enchant

,

Firebringer

,

NorwegianboyEE, Skygazer, Metens, KittyTacky,

Doctor Drew

,

SirCakez

,

Meuh

,

Sheepsaysmeep

,

Black

On top of the Orange ones probably having scum, the Blue Differences could each contain scum, tbh. I'd be surprised if the Blue doesn't have scum in them.

The way MG went through makes me want to know Rathe's alignment. Did scum resist bc he was scum or useful? Was MG limmed for her opinions or to keep Rathe as a lim?

These wouldn't be resolved with a Rathe flip but would be a start.

Chandra is my biggest townread though

Why would Chandra protect a scum player though?

This level of conviction in Drew scum just doesn't match up with the level of effort put into killing him.

Doctor drew is out of the elite 6, STARgazer takes his place.

Drew still might be town, idk. I don't like his sudden push on me EOD. But maybe scum him wouldn't have done that when scum already were getting a misyeet.

Awww, but you like being called scum.

And I could have used MG's little help.

Pre Edit: Fire, did you say PB rages as scum as well, or just town.

Forget to say something?

Uhh.....happy Sunday?

I know what happened to you last night.

Both

. So why not say something?

I took 2 damage somehow, no idea how it happened though.....not sure why I was supposed to say something about it.

Typo? I deal 1 3 or 5 damage when vigging. I heal status effects regardless of if I heal hp or damage.

So just odd.

You always claim vigged for accountability. Own actions.

I still think the "always claim vigged" line is ridiculous -- it looks like a reach to try to score a point against Drew, when obviously there can't be a mafia theory point that claiming vigged is protown since players who are vigged generally die.

Furthermore, where did this ability go? Since one must always out as vigged according to Titus, and no one has done that, she is either not using the ability or never actually cared about that argument to begin with.

Drew, Skygazer, Blue, Cakez, and Patchwork is my theory right now.

Drew and Skygazer sheep most popular wagons. Blue has been consistently scummy and might be the head. Cakez is flailing caught scum. Patchwork is demoralized.

I think this explains the vote state.

Here's the patchwork in the solve post I mentioned earlier. I went out of chronological order and don't feel like fixing it.

VOTE: drew

VOTE: drew

hi Sheep. What happened to townlean?

I changed my mind I dont like him

These were some very wolfy posts from Sheep again. Still content with my vote here.

Very worried Cakez is not building a townblock.

He's still not, but you don't seem worried about it anymore.

[SirCakez]

My worry with Kitty/DGB elim is it just feels like another iteration of the scummy low content player elim where we will maybe hit scum maybe not
I'm not really interested in a town block ATM, we haven't even flipped a group scum yet

[Firebringer]

We need to stop being friends tbh.

We had a good time hanging out, but we have to find scum, so we gotta step on each other’s toes possibly.

you can't break up with me.
i break up with u

[Flavor Leaf]

My worry with Kitty/DGB elim is it just feels like another iteration of the scummy low content player elim where we will maybe hit scum maybe not
I'm not really interested in a town block ATM, we haven't even flipped a group scum yet

Yeah, that’s where I’m at too with DGB. I kind of just want to deal in Black and Italiano, tbh, but nobody seems to scum read either of them anymore.

[Flavor Leaf]

We need to stop being friends tbh.

We had a good time hanging out, but we have to find scum, so we gotta step on each other’s toes possibly.

you can't break up with me.
i break up with u

E6 still lives on, I’m actually not too worried about any of those slots.

I just feel people are afraid of pushing others right now, so effort by Chandra onto Titus is good.

[Chandra Nalaar]

If we're going to do another nothing lim it HAS to be NM.

[Firebringer]

if E6 is going strong and scum are in the townreads and are likeable and such....
idk i find that a bit of a contradiction leaf of you saying we can still trust e6 but we gotta start beating each other up because scum are playing the social game of being too likeable.

also who do i beat up? Should i beat up wheme for killing math

or should i make fun of Chandra.

Maybe i take out a page from meuh handbook and declare i am meuh

[Flavor Leaf]

if E6 is going strong and scum are in the townreads and are likeable and such....
idk i find that a bit of a contradiction leaf of you saying we can still trust e6 but we gotta start beating each other up because scum are playing the social game of being too likeable.

also who do i beat up? Should i beat up wheme for killing math

or should i make fun of Chandra.

Maybe i take out a page from meuh handbook and declare i am meuh

I think you misunderstood what I meant by friends, which I get. Probably on me.

I think past few days, nobody’s really pushing anyone (besides Math on Mala), and just kind of hanging out as one big group.

Like for the most part, we’ve all been friends in this game, and nobody’s been seriously casing anyone or stepping on toes.

Like Chandra what they just did to Titus, we haven’t had any of that all game.

[Flavor Leaf]

I guess it goes back to the scrutiny thing Chandra brought up.

We’re not getting any scrutiny on most slots, and the slots that had it, we kinda stopped.

I think a big reason I haven’t been able to get many reads is because usually I get reads from people confronting me.

@Firebringer - you lot in Demon Slayer circled around me, and I had trouble getting reads there until Drew/Grandpa came after me.

Does this make sense?

[Flavor Leaf]

Like i like lightning to come at me, so I can redirect it back at scum, and I really haven’t gotten any lightning being thrown at me this game, which sucks.

Black was the one to do it, and that’s why in my gut, I feel I’m right with Black, and my position in this game is just being controlled completely.

[Firebringer]

i think that makes sense but i think a lot of people have been bickering with u here.
But i haven't found it ver useful for solving because it all seems personality based rather than alignment based fighting u