Mini Normal 2306: Game Over

[Alisae]

UNVOTE: Osuka

Why?

They have some good posts, and I need to do a double take on this game at this point.

What posts are good, none of his recent posts change or do anything for me

[Alisae]

i think i continue to get constant alarm bells from his recent posting and his iso as a whole

[osuka]

an empty vote does not pressure make

it actually does!

it really doesn't, and you and i both know better than to pretend like it does. you should _also_ know better than to say some shit of that caliber to me

both of us know that i'm not getting executed 30 hours into the first day of the game with a "pressure" wagon where only the first voter actually gave a half-assed reason and everyone else just sort of followed to see what happens

[osuka]

if you get alarm bells from me all game then that means i'm doing my job right

[Alisae]

an empty vote does not pressure make

it actually does!

it really doesn't, and you and i both know better than to pretend like it does. you should _also_ know better than to say some shit of that caliber to me

both of us know that i'm not getting executed 30 hours into the first day of the game with a "pressure" wagon where only the first voter actually gave a half-assed reason and everyone else just sort of followed to see what happens

Do you understand what pressure is?

[osuka]

Osuka who is mafia

im not very sure yet but i'm watching a few exchanges

i wanna watch the game a bit longer before i start actually forming any reads. i don't have a hero solve or anything

[osuka]

an empty vote does not pressure make

it actually does!

it really doesn't, and you and i both know better than to pretend like it does. you should _also_ know better than to say some shit of that caliber to me

both of us know that i'm not getting executed 30 hours into the first day of the game with a "pressure" wagon where only the first voter actually gave a half-assed reason and everyone else just sort of followed to see what happens

Do you understand what pressure is?

i do. are we talking about the same thing?

[osuka]

i could just blow this entire thing off with very minimal effort and honestly, so could probably anyone else on this plist by virtue of the fact that everyone here has an internet connection and a computer. it really doesn't take much

[Alisae]

an empty vote does not pressure make

it actually does!

it really doesn't, and you and i both know better than to pretend like it does. you should _also_ know better than to say some shit of that caliber to me

both of us know that i'm not getting executed 30 hours into the first day of the game with a "pressure" wagon where only the first voter actually gave a half-assed reason and everyone else just sort of followed to see what happens

Do you understand what pressure is?

i do. are we talking about the same thing?

usually you explain it if you understand the concept. I'm asking because its possible we have different understandings of what pressure is.

[osuka]

i _would_ be worried about a flashwagon 24 hours from deadline, not 24 hours from the start of the game. nothing comes out of this one other than maybe someone shoving their head up their ass and deciding it's a good idea to deathtunnel me d1, but again we both know that amounts to very little

[JasonWazza]

UNVOTE: Osuka

Why?

They have some good posts, and I need to do a double take on this game at this point.

What posts are good, none of his recent posts change or do anything for me

615 is good and i frankly missed that, makes me want to do a double take on what the fuck Mikhail is doing.

602 also feels like it's coming from town.

[osuka]

it's hard to pressure someone if you don't pose any risk. if you have a good case, that's pressure - the risk is that you'll convince other players that a given slot should be executed. if there's little time on the day, that's also pressure - wild shit happens all the time when the day gets lose to deadline

what's the risk here? i could just fuck off and nothing would happen

[Alisae]

UNVOTE: Osuka

Why?

They have some good posts, and I need to do a double take on this game at this point.

What posts are good, none of his recent posts change or do anything for me

615 is good and i frankly missed that, makes me want to do a double take on what the fuck Mikhail is doing.

602 also feels like it's coming from town.

do u think 615 is something mafia isn't capable of coming up w/?
why does 602 feel like it comes from town?

[osuka]

i'll be here in case anyone wants to talk about something other than what they think i should've done

[Sakura Hana]

Uh my vote wasnt empty, my vote was tied to asking for reads.
And you dont need a hero solve to be able to give a reads list, specially if you're being voted specifically to give reads (at least i am, and from what i recall nurse was as well).

[JasonWazza]

UNVOTE: Osuka

Why?

They have some good posts, and I need to do a double take on this game at this point.

What posts are good, none of his recent posts change or do anything for me

615 is good and i frankly missed that, makes me want to do a double take on what the fuck Mikhail is doing.

602 also feels like it's coming from town.

do u think 615 is something mafia isn't capable of coming up w/?
why does 602 feel like it comes from town?

Both of these are stupid questions and you know that.

[osuka]

Uh my vote wasnt empty, my vote was tied to asking for reads.
And you dont need a hero solve to be able to give a reads list, specially if you're being voted specifically to give reads (at least i am, and from what i recall nurse was as well).

i don't have good enough reads to give you a list and i categorically refuse to make shit up

[Sakura Hana]

Uh my vote wasnt empty, my vote was tied to asking for reads.
And you dont need a hero solve to be able to give a reads list, specially if you're being voted specifically to give reads (at least i am, and from what i recall nurse was as well).

i don't have good enough reads to give you a list and i categorically refuse to make shit up

Cant you give what you got so far?

[osuka]

i think norwe feels town but i'm generally wary of him as a player. i think alisae can go either way here and i think you're leaning town? FL is a mystery so i dont even try to read him d1. RN is a slot i wanna dig into more, but i feel like i need more content to do that. everyone else i don't have anything worth saying about for the time being

[osuka]

other than the slots that are null, all of that's already been said before

[Alisae]

it's hard to pressure someone if you don't pose any risk. if you have a good case, that's pressure - the risk is that you'll convince other players that a given slot should be executed. if there's little time on the day, that's also pressure - wild shit happens all the time when the day gets lose to deadline

what's the risk here? i could just fuck off and nothing would happen

When you pressure someone, the idea is to make them do something. When a player feels like they have to do something, that is pressure.
You got like, 5 votes. That is a lot of votes and those votes being on you forces you to feel like you have to do something. It doesn't matter if one vote is naked when you have a bunch of people voting you.
Pressure doesn't even need votes to be created. Generally if you read the room and there is a lot of people who want more from a slot but they're voting elsewhere, there is pressure on the slot in question to do things.
Mafia is like a game of ping pong. Eventually the game will get to the point where the gamestate can't really advance if specific slots don't do anything to advance it. This is generally something that happens in situations where people are waiting on a player to do something.

If you fucked off with what you just posted, I would push harder, and then that could eventually threaten an execution or get a claim. It wouldn't do you any good to do this. Yes town get distracted by shiny very easily and can go somewhere else, but when you're dealing with competency, this isn't going to happen reliably.

[osuka]

there's very little value to saying "hurrrrr this slot is null" so i dont do that because its a waste of everyone's time.

i hardly ever bother to put shit together in a list because that's way too much effort so if you want to know where my reads are at, i suggest you read what i've written in the thread. if there's something specific you want clarification on, feel free to ask but general "what do you think about the game?" sort of questions are just sort of garbage and don't really get anyone anywhere

[osuka]

it's hard to pressure someone if you don't pose any risk. if you have a good case, that's pressure - the risk is that you'll convince other players that a given slot should be executed. if there's little time on the day, that's also pressure - wild shit happens all the time when the day gets lose to deadline

what's the risk here? i could just fuck off and nothing would happen

When you pressure someone, the idea is to make them do something. When a player feels like they have to do something, that is pressure.
You got like, 5 votes. That is a lot of votes and those votes being on you forces you to feel like you have to do something. It doesn't matter if one vote is naked when you have a bunch of people voting you.
Pressure doesn't even need votes to be created. Generally if you read the room and there is a lot of people who want more from a slot but they're voting elsewhere, there is pressure on the slot in question to do things.
Mafia is like a game of ping pong. Eventually the game will get to the point where the gamestate can't really advance if specific slots don't do anything to advance it. This is generally something that happens in situations where people are waiting on a player to do something.

If you fucked off with what you just posted, I would push harder, and then that could eventually threaten an execution or get a claim. It wouldn't do you any good to do this. Yes town get distracted by shiny very easily and can go somewhere else, but when you're dealing with competency, this isn't going to happen reliably.

any half-competent town player can see right through that and will know that it's one step removed from a policy exec, so even if i did fuck off immediately that'd STILL be a hard sell

[Alisae]

UNVOTE: Osuka

Why?

They have some good posts, and I need to do a double take on this game at this point.

What posts are good, none of his recent posts change or do anything for me

615 is good and i frankly missed that, makes me want to do a double take on what the fuck Mikhail is doing.

602 also feels like it's coming from town.

do u think 615 is something mafia isn't capable of coming up w/?
why does 602 feel like it comes from town?

Both of these are stupid questions and you know that.

So when I think of Osuka, what I think of is
- A lot of interactions with Mikhail that seems like they're pushing Mikhail but they're also talking to them like they're a villager. This is something I see w/ 611.
- 257 also comes across as strange to me.
- 321 I feel like comes from mafia. It could realistically come from anything but I think in this game it comes from mafia.
- 598 + 599 I want to say reads like mafia pushing a slot.

I feel like when I think of Osuka's posting, he's engaging w/ players in a way that doesn't really come across as wanting to be right, but rather comes across as wanting to be justified and maybe even informed.

idunno so like none of the recent posts really do anything for me.

[Alisae]

I liked Nurse point he made on Osuka when he voted them and it's something I wanted to sleep on.
The reason why I say that mafia will want to talk to Mikhail is because I can imagine that being a player mafia will want to make look as bad as possible and that's kind of how I felt about osuka's interactions with Mikhail