Open 905: Pick Your Power X/Y S/S [game over!]
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
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gob he/himMafia Scumhe/him
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 3201
- Joined: June 13, 2015
- Pronoun: he/him
- Location: Town of Salem Forums
Obliveon seems good. Buggy-type towny energy.
I also like Penguin and MAy-
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gob he/himMafia Scumhe/him
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
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- Location: Town of Salem Forums
I feel like Eevee is such an overrated pokemon. I hate it + all the eeveelutions. I do not like anything that is popular because popular = bad because most people = bad.-
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davesaz HeSurvivorHe
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 12557
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- Location: Socially distant
Eliminating people from consideration as possible scum without evidence from their posting and votes (and before mechanical results but that comes later) is one of the worst things town can do.In post 164, Oblivion wrote:
This is a game of "could"s, though. Determining what is more likely and staking your moves on that, then adapting with new information is the entire methodology of the game.In post 158, davesaz wrote:
The point is that they could, not that they will. Whether they have or not is immaterial, gambler's fallacy.In post 144, Dunnstral wrote: Can you show an example of two mafia picking the same draft number in a previous version of this setup?
Simply stating that because somehting "could" happen that we shouldn't act upon the idea that it is unlikely and attempt to solve with a mentality in mind feels reductive and dismissive, to it.
It thinks there is a good line of reasoning and ability to choose where to look first in the logic it has presented. It even stated that it wasn't willing to say it was a certainty, and yet here we are discussing in a circle about "if something IS possible then we should consider both worlds" instead of hedging and using logic to try and eliminate worlds until proven otherwise.
Not sure why it's focusing on 17 when it didn't even say anything until 40, care to explain that aspect of the points it's making?Wanna play Minecraft with your ms friends? Check out the minecraft thread, or the channel on discord-
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gob he/himMafia Scumhe/him
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 3201
- Joined: June 13, 2015
- Pronoun: he/him
- Location: Town of Salem Forums
I don't like anybody but myself.-
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davesaz HeSurvivorHe
- Survivor
- Survivor
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- Joined: August 24, 2014
- Pronoun: He
- Location: Socially distant
So much spam, from former listmods even
I'm not against fun on principle, but the scrolling to get to real stuff...Wanna play Minecraft with your ms friends? Check out the minecraft thread, or the channel on discord-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
Y'all I need fire offline mobile game recs the book I brought sucks-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
I like understand your preference for different styles of play and I'll be generous about the choice to be sarcastic about it. I think the former listmods bit is pretty weird though. Don't understand the premise but if there's a sustainable premise in there can't I just be retroactively double fired for play style or whatever lolIn post 180, davesaz wrote: So much spam, from former listmods even
I'm not against fun on principle, but the scrolling to get to real stuff...-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
Bc empirically towns lose games where they eschew organic gameplay for mechanical decision tree math whether or not on paper they shouldIn post 41, Oblivion wrote:
It is of the opinion that this is a very defensive post that doesn't seem to have a prediction for how on guard it is. Yes, can you explain to it why you felt the need to bring up and defend yourself from an attack that hasn't even been levied?In post 17, davesaz wrote: I think reading too much into the draft would be a mistake. You have to go pretty deep into my history, given it's been ages since I played this (modded it a lot), but it will be clear I've always had this position.
Further, it thinks that the major element of this game is draft speculation and reading into player mentality for the choices that are made. Why shut that down?-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
Ok but what if you had picked 98 this game wouldn't it have been ballerIn post 55, Dunnstral wrote: I'm dredging up forbidden meta.
viewtopic.php?p=13624176#p13624176 (I picked 3 but the image is missing)
viewtopic.php?p=12257848#p12257848 (I picked 3)
viewtopic.php?p=11815209#p11815209 (I picked 1)
viewtopic.php?p=8860204#p8860204 (I picked 1)
viewtopic.php?p=8141009#p8141009 (I picked 2)
I'm town in all 5 of the above games-
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Jake The Wolfie he/theyMafia Scumhe/they
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 3605
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- Location: Floorda
The May I know dodge rolls off the map. Is this not you?In post 175, May wrote: I am May. May is famous.Show"I'm sorry that you put asbestos in your coffee."
"All dictionaries aught to have one typo."
Here's some text to break up all the links in my sig.
Currently my favorite role I've seen in a Normal.
Get to know a Wolf-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
It can be simultaneously true that you will gain a material benefit for doing it, but that the benefit won't outweigh the less measurable effects on the day play. It's like skipping small econ micros in StarCraft because if you're not doing an attentive harass on their 2nd base having a 120% output single base game ain't gonna matterIn post 62, June wrote: also i think that like every single iteration that i've played of this setup or almost all of them there's been at least one person who goes "noooo the draft means nothing ignore it" but then we used the draft to solve the game or made it easier at some point so there's that-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
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NAI for davesazIn post 78, gob wrote:
Davesaz just admitted theyre wolfing everyoneIn post 74, davesaz wrote: I can see a headache coming in this game from trying to read words that don't fit my language map.-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
I wish I could have let you draft for me if you enjoy this setup I hate itIn post 108, davesaz wrote:
Well, there is a reason I sign up for this setup the moment it shows up in the queue.In post 75, Firebringer wrote: aren't u just gonna work of mechanics anyways davesaz-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
Town indicative cause an example appeases betterIn post 158, davesaz wrote:
The point is that they could, not that they will. Whether they have or not is immaterial, gambler's fallacy.In post 144, Dunnstral wrote: Can you show an example of two mafia picking the same draft number in a previous version of this setup?-
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Oblivion It/ItsGoonIt/Its
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 590
- Joined: February 21, 2024
- Pronoun: It/Its
Okay, now can it ask people if this is a remotely fair interpretation of its points? It doesn't feel that it is. It isn't saying to remove people from consideration forever, it literally said that you adapt as more information becomes known.In post 178, davesaz wrote:
Eliminating people from consideration as possible scum without evidence from their posting and votes (and before mechanical results but that comes later) is one of the worst things town can do.In post 164, Oblivion wrote:
This is a game of "could"s, though. Determining what is more likely and staking your moves on that, thenIn post 158, davesaz wrote:
The point is that they could, not that they will. Whether they have or not is immaterial, gambler's fallacy.In post 144, Dunnstral wrote: Can you show an example of two mafia picking the same draft number in a previous version of this setup?adapting with new informationis the entire methodology of the game.
Simply stating that because somehting "could" happen that we shouldn't act upon the idea that it is unlikely and attempt to solve with a mentality in mind feels reductive and dismissive, to it.
It thinks there is a good line of reasoning and ability to choose where to look first in the logic it has presented. It even stated that it wasn't willing to say it was a certainty, and yet here we are discussing in a circle about "if something IS possible then we should consider both worlds" instead of hedging and using logic to try andeliminate worlds until proven otherwise.
Not sure why it's focusing on 17 when it didn't even say anything until 40, care to explain that aspect of the points it's making?
For your benefit, it has bolded in its own post the two different times it has said this that you seemed to ignore. Creating a world view, interrogating that world view, and then making a choice on how you want to act upon that world view, and then seeing whether you were right or wrong is quite literally the basis of scumhunting, let alone scientific methodology.
It is focusing on all of your posts, but most especially the ones in which you come off as a curmudgeon attempting to shut down lines of reasoning before they evolve. It believes you are possibly trying to dictate and control what ideas are accepted within the town and silence others that may not work for you. By further interrogating you, it can decide whether your actions are a part of the mental model it thinks is acceptable for your townplay or whether these actions are guided by a further motivation that doesn't register as town.This is the law, written in the stars and seeds: in the end, all things must fail. They are old as the stars.But not older.
And you, who have your human heart again, know all their secrets still.
This is the truth you will use to break them, to rend chains apart and set their prisoners free:no one else has ever loved this way before.-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
Oblivion can i call you O-Ring
It's a term of endearment and doesn't mean onion ring-
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Oblivion It/ItsGoonIt/Its
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 590
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- Pronoun: It/Its
Empirically requires evidence you don't have. Furthermore, no one is attempting to eschew "organic" (it has words for the manner in which you have phrased this for your own benefit/bias) gameplay and replace it solely with a decision tree.In post 183, May wrote:
Bc empirically towns lose games where they eschew organic gameplay for mechanical decision tree math whether or not on paper they shouldIn post 41, Oblivion wrote:
It is of the opinion that this is a very defensive post that doesn't seem to have a prediction for how on guard it is. Yes, can you explain to it why you felt the need to bring up and defend yourself from an attack that hasn't even been levied?In post 17, davesaz wrote: I think reading too much into the draft would be a mistake. You have to go pretty deep into my history, given it's been ages since I played this (modded it a lot), but it will be clear I've always had this position.
Further, it thinks that the major element of this game is draft speculation and reading into player mentality for the choices that are made. Why shut that down?
If you read any of its posts, it has said multiple times that it is seeking to use the information gleaned in the draft as a weapon to force others to respond and see how their play evolves as a result, while retaining a framework that, yes infact, scum are somewhat readable through the Psychology of Drafting.
Now, as for its concern with your bias. It would thank you not to decide what is and is not "organic" gameplay. Our approach to other players has been wholy in attempt to generate organic reactions and create mental models for our ability to solve them for later. Simply because it does not play how you play does not mean its methods are less effective than yours.This is the law, written in the stars and seeds: in the end, all things must fail. They are old as the stars.But not older.
And you, who have your human heart again, know all their secrets still.
This is the truth you will use to break them, to rend chains apart and set their prisoners free:no one else has ever loved this way before.-
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Oblivion It/ItsGoonIt/Its
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 590
- Joined: February 21, 2024
- Pronoun: It/Its
It assumes this is a reference to the Magic: The Gathering Card "Oblivion Ring"?In post 193, May wrote: Oblivion can i call you O-Ring
It's a term of endearment and doesn't mean onion ring
It is fine with that, it sees no reason or harm in that nickname.This is the law, written in the stars and seeds: in the end, all things must fail. They are old as the stars.But not older.
And you, who have your human heart again, know all their secrets still.
This is the truth you will use to break them, to rend chains apart and set their prisoners free:no one else has ever loved this way before.-
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Oblivion It/ItsGoonIt/Its
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 590
- Joined: February 21, 2024
- Pronoun: It/Its
It doesn't agree with this, for what it is worth. It thinks that this is a pretty basic way to level yourself against a request. Combing through records of games and providing examples of when this gambit has taken place is a value neutral action that won't indicate Dave's alignment in any real way. Actively refusing to do it while sticking to one's guns, however, is a move a player can play to attempt to look dogmatic, and its experience, limited as it is, is that dogmatic players who appear to "truly believe in their own craft" are read as innocent more frequently than not.In post 190, May wrote:
Town indicative cause an example appeases betterIn post 158, davesaz wrote:
The point is that they could, not that they will. Whether they have or not is immaterial, gambler's fallacy.In post 144, Dunnstral wrote: Can you show an example of two mafia picking the same draft number in a previous version of this setup?
In other words, there's no real motivation for town or scum dave to do anything but what he did there, it thinks. It's a neutral outcome.This is the law, written in the stars and seeds: in the end, all things must fail. They are old as the stars.But not older.
And you, who have your human heart again, know all their secrets still.
This is the truth you will use to break them, to rend chains apart and set their prisoners free:no one else has ever loved this way before.-
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May She | No they/etcGoonShe | No they/etc
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 940
- Joined: October 30, 2020
- Pronoun: She | No they/etc
I've never like made a spreadsheet I just played mafia for 16 years and have anecdata
Organic isn't the right word but I couldn't figure out the right word. "The other stuff" is what I meant
Yes O-Ring is a 3 mana enchantment-
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June AnyTownieAny
- Townie
- Townie
- Posts: 34
- Joined: January 26, 2021
- Pronoun: Any
YIn post 192, May wrote: June is kind of scummy and oblivion is kind of towny-
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Oblivion It/ItsGoonIt/Its
- Goon
- Goon
- Posts: 590
- Joined: February 21, 2024
- Pronoun: It/Its
Your experiences do not qualify as evidence that a methodology is bad, only that it doesn't suit your style. Just as its experiences do not qualify as evidence that Dave's curmudgeoning is explicitly scum, despite it being a familiar feeling to it. It understands that there are cultural differences and playstyle gaps. It has already assuaged two different concerns that it would base itself solely on mechanics, when infact it is clearly doing more than that. But information is information, and if it can use draft info to help corner scum, it's going to do that.In post 197, May wrote: I've never like made a spreadsheet I just played mafia for 16 years and have anecdata
Organic isn't the right word but I couldn't figure out the right word. "The other stuff" is what I meant
Yes O-Ring is a 3 mana enchantmentThis is the law, written in the stars and seeds: in the end, all things must fail. They are old as the stars.But not older.
And you, who have your human heart again, know all their secrets still.
This is the truth you will use to break them, to rend chains apart and set their prisoners free:no one else has ever loved this way before.
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