Mini Normal 2334: trees (Day 6)

[Elements]

Bloop

[Thomith]

expecting the two of us to lead town to another perfect win ccs

Hmm.

Probably a joke, but I'm not too sure how much I'm liking this post.

why

It feels like it could be performative in some way.
Either "look at me I'm town" or if SaltiestCactus does flip scum, immediately buddying to cCS to make cCS look bad.

[Thomith]

VOTE: Elements

[Elements]

VOTE: Elements

<3

[Thomith]

let PRs do things, let mafia play in the dark guessing who to use their powers on, the gamble is Town gains more than Mafia does from the blind NP1 shots in the dark than any extended period DP1. It's true we may end up voting off mafia but at what cost of leaking reads based on who did or didn't say what?

Leak nothing, let DP2 reports and claims dictate how things flow. If a strong PR dies NP1 that's bad luck and frankly DP1 random bandwagons are as much luck too but reveal more to mafia regarding how others respond.

We are also starving ourselves of information by not fading somebody day 1.

Even if we don't flip scum today, when we hopefully have some people flipped red later in the day, noting how people have voted, what wagons formed, whether scum got wagoned day 1 and then a counterwagon formed to get heat off of them, all of this is information we don't get if we just opt to immediately not eliminate during the first day.

[Thomith]

VOTE: Elements

<3

Why did you vote Madman?

[Elements]

VOTE: Elements

<3

Why did you vote Madman?

I disagree with basically everything he's said and then he vote no lim

[Thomith]

VOTE: Elements

<3

Why did you vote Madman?

I disagree with basically everything he's said and then he vote no lim

Do you think what he is saying is scum motivated?

[Elements]

Red team can post things that aren't red team motivated

[KayJayQueue]

Spoiler: the exact opposite of a tl:dr

Is there a tl:dr, asking for a friend (the friend is Hu Tao)

I can skip what I said about Mafia pressure in general and say one thing about this DP and situation:

We have 12 other people than ourselves as Town. Scum probably at ratiod 3:10 (4:9 requires an underpowered mafia and this is a 'Normal mini' setup so in all regards we can assume the 3:10 ratio unless there's a thirdparty at play).

As Town, all of the 9 other Townies than me are operating trying to appear as Towny as possible to others, masking what they do and say but also trying hard to read 12 others and interrogate and force reactions (or they're just random posting silly hellos etc I'm not saying it to be mean but to clarify it's junk activity often dubbed 'fluff' or 'filler' perhaps).

The 9 others are all operating in a way that may well seem scummy at first, though I had a towntell from one player who replied to me so far, I think that's not a good bet to be what happens often during this DP. Meanwhile, the scum are only worried about appearing Towny and watching what they say, they will be primarily concerned with reading PR vs vanilla dynamics in how people operate. That type of leaking and telling is far more likely to become obvious the more we have happening during the DP.

Either we all out instantly and try to crack the balance and whatever else or we hide it and vote no elimination. If we vote scum they'll force a PR CC or end up appearing unCC'd PR by picking, by luck, the type of PR that isn't directly had by another (for instance tracker and watcher cancel out balance-wise while cop and the other wouldn't necessarily, you get the idea). Either way it's a disaster where at best we voted off a vanilla or forced a PR to CC and happened to vote the fake one in the CC.

Ooookay thanks

[awesomeming327]

messing around at the start of the game is fine, at the end of the day the goal is to have fun

Might've wanted to used wording other than "end of the day" in this context

[camelCasedSnivy]

VOTE: Thomith

no witty reasoning, just chose randomly for once

[DrNickRiviera]

Hi everybody!

*in unison*
Hi, Dr. Nick!

At least one person gets it, and congrats.....you have successfully pocketed me

Red team can post things that aren't red team motivated

Ok, but what else makes Rational part of the red team?

Apologies if you already said why

[DrNickRiviera]

VOTE: Elements

<3

Why did you vote Madman?

I disagree with basically everything he's said and then he vote no lim

Thanks Elements from the past

Is it that you disagree about his stance on RVS?

Coupled with the no lim vote, ya is weird, but would Rational be that much of a Madman to enter the game like that as scum?

Will I ask another question??

[awesomeming327]

Red team can post things that aren't red team motivated

So can green team!

[Dannflor]

VOTE: DrNickRivera

I think if RationalMadman truly holds the (wrong) belief that not eliminating Day 1 is best, he’s likely going to have a similar entrance as either alignment.

Town reading him over it feels like you might have too much information

[Dannflor]

And @RationalMadman, yes you are incorrect. There is empirical evidence that good townplay and good town players can achieve a Day 1 scum elimination much better than random chance.

No one is going to vote no elimination with you. If you want to be productive and helpful, stop wall posting about that, and either join a wagon or at the very least start commenting on what you think people’s alignments might be

[Grovyle in a Fedora]

VOTE: Elements

<3

Why did you vote Madman?

I disagree with basically everything he's said and then he vote no lim

Does that mean they are scum?

[DrNickRiviera]

VOTE: DrNickRivera

I think if RationalMadman truly holds the (wrong) belief that not eliminating Day 1 is best, he’s likely going to have a similar entrance as either alignment.

Town reading him over it feels like you might have too much information

Never said I am town reading him per se, but trying to figure out why exactly Elements is scum reading him.

[Grovyle in a Fedora]

I mean yes they can be scum but I don't see anything that implies that their belief is disgenuine here and I find it suspicious to overtly latch onto calling then scum for it.

[DrNickRiviera]

And @RationalMadman, yes you are incorrect. There is empirical evidence that good townplay and good town players can achieve a Day 1 scum elimination much better than random chance.

No one is going to vote no elimination with you. If you want to be productive and helpful, stop wall posting about that, and either join a wagon or at the very least start commenting on what you think people’s alignments might be

I do agree with you here about Rational, though. Complaining about RVS and doing nothing about it isn't exactly 'pro town's

Get used to more flippy floppy reads from me all game

[Grovyle in a Fedora]

committing to a read is free and gives info and you can always change your mind later

Scum won't feel particularly threatened if your pushes have no teeth after all.

Willing to park here for now VOTE: elements

I like Dann, rational, kayjay, and thomith so far

[DrNickRiviera]

committing to a read is free and gives info and you can always change your mind later

Scum won't feel particularly threatened if your pushes have no teeth after all.

Willing to park here for now VOTE: elements

I like Dann, rational, kayjay, and thomith so far

What exactly has Kay done to deserve a town read?

[KayJayQueue]

committing to a read is free and gives info and you can always change your mind later

Scum won't feel particularly threatened if your pushes have no teeth after all.

Willing to park here for now VOTE: elements

I like Dann, rational, kayjay, and thomith so far

What exactly has Kay done to deserve a town read?

You’re not allowed to ask that from my pocket Doc!

[Grovyle in a Fedora]

committing to a read is free and gives info and you can always change your mind later

Scum won't feel particularly threatened if your pushes have no teeth after all.

Willing to park here for now VOTE: elements

I like Dann, rational, kayjay, and thomith so far

What exactly has Kay done to deserve a town read?

Their entrance was towny via a micro interaction.