Micro Normal 1104 - Postgame

[Hu Tao]

Hi.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Umlaut
Ty!
Entrance was awkward

Why? Seems like a joke post like mostly everyone's

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Umlaut
Ty!
Entrance was awkward

Why? Seems like a joke post like mostly everyone's

Are you the same Hu Tao that I know for the record or no?

Unless you mean the Hu Tao here or the Hu Tao from Genshin Impact then no . I'm not Hu Tao on any other site

[Hu Tao]

Being voted as soon as I join my first game. Anxiety inducing. Anyway, I'm going to give a rundown of my aim here:

I played a lot of mafia on non-forum sites, and was pretty good. I want to see to what extent those skills transfer to forum mafia, where you get more information (because people type more before each day ends) but also people have more time to come up with convincing lies (because they have literally hours if they want to to craft each message). So, I'm excited to see how this goes.

Welcome! Hope you have fun

[Hu Tao]

I like overcat so far. Even though they suspiciously chose a dog for an avatar as a cat

[Hu Tao]

Kay will this be the game we can finally get on the same page

[Hu Tao]

I like overcat so far. Even though they suspiciously chose a dog for an avatar as a cat

their reads reek of TMI but they're new so w/e

I can't tell if this is a joke or you can't tell that my post was a joke

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao
Them liking the doggy is wolfy /srs

eh?

I must be wolfy too because I like Overcat's 36.

Mind explaining this further?

its just shading a read on a town fmpov and their post before that reeked

Surely this can't be serious

[Hu Tao]

Luka can you explain the read more clearly, so I know if you're just misunderstanding or you're trying to force a bad read. Do you think I'm scum because I said I liked Overcats vibe and made a joke about cats and dogs?

[Hu Tao]

Yeah I think Luka is by far the worst so far but I'd still like him to explain in case we are misunderstanding

[Hu Tao]

Also Luka another question when you get back, if you thought Overcat was TMI, why would you vote me? Wouldn't you vote them even if you didn't get the context of my cat and dog joke?

[Hu Tao]

Thoughts on Luka saying cat is scummy?

[Hu Tao]

I like overcat so far. Even though they suspiciously chose a dog for an avatar as a cat

their reads reek of TMI but they're new so w/e

I can't tell if this is a joke or you can't tell that my post was a joke

So the tl on the slot was a joke? I'm aware that the latter sentence was a joke, but the former is as well?

At the time of the post I was just saying I like them as in terms of their vibe. But now I do actually tr them

[Hu Tao]

Luka can you explain the read more clearly, so I know if you're just misunderstanding or you're trying to force a bad read. Do you think I'm scum because I said I liked Overcats vibe and made a joke about cats and dogs?

Why are you trying to rope the latter thing in here at all? I think you're scum soley for the former thing, you didn't actually read the slot and you just launched a pockety TR on it

Okay so you were confused on what I meant. If I say I like someone just means their vibe, not that I have a strong tr on them or whatever. But now after their most recent posts, I do have a town read on cat

[Hu Tao]

I'll wait for Luka to comment on my questions, but for right now I'm liking Cat and I'm liking Eira (based on that last post). I think FancyPants is a wolf

Why do you think FancyPants is a wolf but you're not voting their, and instead voting me whomst you in your post don't dictate a wolf on? Infact, in one of your earlier posts voting me you never called me wolf either, and you provided reasons to town me in the post before that. What's your gameplan here exactly?

Not sure if you noticed by fancy pants name is green......

[Hu Tao]

At the time of the post I was just saying I like them as in terms of their vibe. But now I do actually tr them

Why?

They seemed genuine and not forced to start which a lot of new players can be at the start if they are scum

[Hu Tao]

Okay after seeing Luka talk more I understand why he scumread me originally for thinking it was a pocket attempt on Overcat. I will agree it's possible that scum jumped on Luka quickly after that. Not sure why people didn't wait for Luka to clarify the statements.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: ceejayvinoya

I was just about to vote ceejay but 2 quick votes makes it interesting. Why did you vote him?

[Hu Tao]

• I'm town.
  
• FancyPants is town.
  
• Overcat, JV, Hu Tao get provisional town leans.
  
• This leaves {KayJayQueue, Luka, ceejayvinoya, Eiralox}.

I can help you narrow down your list!

I’m town (:

[Hu Tao]

Good morning!

ceejay is a pretty strong town read of mine. I think a problem with forum games is that people are a bit too forgiving, and they may tend to go after people who are less charismatic rather than less towny. I'm very unhappy at the idea of votes being taken of Luka my biggest scum read onto ceejay who is a trust of mine at the moment. It's like we have two people that we are suspecting of doing a crime. One has tattoos covering them, blood on their hands, and a constant facial twitch, the other just happened to be found in the area the crime was committed. Leave ceejay alone.

You don't think Luka explaining changed anything?

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: ceejayvinoya

This is mildly concerning

Did you change the way you play? For some reason I remember you being more direct and engaging on a previous game.

Can you go into depth about this?

[Hu Tao]

Good morning!

ceejay is a pretty strong town read of mine. I think a problem with forum games is that people are a bit too forgiving, and they may tend to go after people who are less charismatic rather than less towny. I'm very unhappy at the idea of votes being taken of Luka my biggest scum read onto ceejay who is a trust of mine at the moment. It's like we have two people that we are suspecting of doing a crime. One has tattoos covering them, blood on their hands, and a constant facial twitch, the other just happened to be found in the area the crime was committed. Leave ceejay alone.

You don't think Luka explaining changed anything?

I'll answer your question with a question, what do you think of my logic on the Luka vote, do you agree with it? Do you disagree with it? Explain why.

I agree that scum seem more focused on how things look. I get your point now because regardless of his opinion it was still showing how things looked to Luka at the time.

[Hu Tao]

Naur

[Hu Tao]

FancyPants do you have any thoughts so far about the game?

[Hu Tao]

And no, it’s not Hu Tao.

LETS GOOOOOOO

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Human

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Human

Please don’t make me regret my decisions

Too late

[Hu Tao]

Only actual read I have is cat town here

[Hu Tao]

Only actual read I have is cat town here

would you tell me why you voted?

For reactions

[Hu Tao]

I would say eira is the most sus voting right after I did despite unvoting that slot right before.

[Hu Tao]

give me a fancy word

Nyaa

Only actual read I have is cat town here

DId you not read the doge town?

The cat IS the dog

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: eira

It's time

[Hu Tao]

Luka / FancyPants
KayJayQueue / Umalot
Eiralox
GuyInFreezer / JacksonVirgo
HuTao

Do you still scumread me for that thing in the beginning or is it something else

[Hu Tao]

Hu Tao hasn’t tried to pocket me nearly enough for my liking. This is sus behavior.

You've barely been here

[Hu Tao]

Hu Tao hasn’t tried to pocket me nearly enough for my liking. This is sus behavior.

And neither has Jack. I hate this timeline.


Hu/Jack scum team and my entire world would shatter.

[Hu Tao]

Hu Tao hasn’t tried to pocket me nearly enough for my liking. This is sus behavior.

You've barely been here

I’m here now and I’m waiting lol

What do you think of eira

[Hu Tao]

[Hu Tao]

Firebringer replaces FancyPants.

Yay!

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao
Them liking the doggy is wolfy /srs

I agree with this vote so hard. No wonder im a fan of luka

Never mind

[Hu Tao]

Do you still scumread me for that thing in the beginning or is it something else

dunno what youve done yet so idk i guess its changed?

If you don't know what I've done, how has it changed?

[Hu Tao]

I care because I'd rather be on the same page with someone I know is town and is not manipulating me

I feel this

[Hu Tao]

Like that seems way too confident of a GIF post to make as town

But overcat was pretty lock town imo

[Hu Tao]

Only actual read I have is cat town here

No updated stance on Luka after all your interactions?

I already outed my updated thoughts on Luka, are you checked out this game or are you scum

[Hu Tao]

I'm making a towncore from people I think are towny. You should be in it but nuh uh :3 My current stance is the voting humaneatingmonkey claw technique and I already said I'll explain it whenever.

I sunk multiple hours into that it feels like lmao, I don’t actually know how long it took me

I mean yeah you're jiving me for not efforting yet on p16 of a micro but honestly i already need a break -.-

have fun Virgo

Why is monke your biggest scumread?

[Hu Tao]

Eiralox feels like they're just trying to position themselves to be able to vote low-hanging fruits based on consensus, less so trying to really sort people.

Agreed

[Hu Tao]

Also I thought about things but I think I can say Hu Tao can be my townread #5. Normally this is where I stop but I’m going to go for bonus points because one of those 5 is IC so I’m kinda cheating

Easiest pocket of my life.

Thoughts on Eira?

[Hu Tao]

KayJayQueue

Spoiler:

I really like Kay's entrance (9), to me it shows that she's not stiff going into a game with town JV. I know how highly she thinks of my play so her not being stiff shows a lot, this is shown especially paired with 28, where she is showing "aggression" towards me for a recently closed game where I was wolf in.

31 and 45 both inherently give me a little pause, but upon thinking a bit deeper I think these are natural posts to come from her given how she's treated RVS in all the games I've played with her in so far.

I don't think wolf!kay votes without reason, her 54 shows that she is

still

loose socially, I don't feel she'd vote for a non-serious reason especially given that the game "skipped RVS" according to her own words, so she isn't hiding behind RVS either.

143 is the first post I really don't like, while what she said was factually true (she works god awful hours on weekends), dropping this feels awfully defensive when typically she has been fairly loose and relaxed this entire game so far but I do know she gets defensive so this is going to be a "back of my head" thought for a while.

272 is Kay's first content"ful" post, at #30 in their ISO. This is concerning to me that I was town-reading somebody this far into the game without any semblance of content so I'm somewhat concerned what I'm reading into is her as a person (very possible) or she's directly appealing to me directly or otherwise. The first contentful post of hers is also incredibly withdrawn, it feels like it's trying to negate Luka's townread of Eiralox to keep the wagon in its place without trying to push it actively herself. Although she says that she meant to be talking about Umlaut which, if true, would remove this fear of mine so maybe I'm trying to justify a rogue feeling of paranoia that started forming midway through reading the game.

Spoiler: Possible Pocket Attempts (5)

Behold, I doth void my bladder and expel feces hither and thither without constraint.

I really appreciate that, although the same in spirit, you change up the vocabulary in your entrance post (:

2. Toxic and harmful behaviour will not be tolerated. This includes, but is not limited to:
- flaming, insulting, or directing personal attacks at other players
- use of slurs or derogatory language
- spamming
- excessive AtE
- excessive discussion of real life issues (a mention is fine, but please don't derail the game or use this thread as a place to vent)
- otherwise being a jerk or making the game unenjoyable for others

I was planning on using slurs and derogatory language, but I will respect the rule henceforth.

Okay you take the bad language, I’ll do the excessive AtE. (I know, I know, totally out of character for me)

I’m seeing a back-to-back vote on my declared townread on page 5 and that is no bueno.

That’s okay just get a new townread. I’m available!

And no, it’s not Hu Tao.

It’s me!

Hu Tao hasn’t tried to pocket me nearly enough for my liking. This is sus behavior.

And neither has Jack. I hate this timeline.


Hu/Jack scum team and my entire world would shatter.

As of page 14, I think Kay is town. I think they need to start posting more content or this will start to slip off as the primary driver of this read is her behaviour more than content which arguably is probably stronger to use in the early game but I do want to hear more from her.

You seem to be digging really deep trying to find things to feel off about when you know exactly how easy it is for you to read me. You seem really invested in this game so early, moreso than usual town games of yours. I wonder if that’s indicative of anything…

Thoughts on me?

[Hu Tao]

Are you wolf? This feels unnatural

No, I just can’t trust you after you absolutely misted me and made me think you’re town and then made me feel like a complete idiot. Now I have no confidence in being able to read you and everything you do feels weird because this isn’t how you acted in our recent town games.

I switch up my play every time at least somewhat, that’s how I play. And it’s why metareading me seldom works against me

To be fair I do the same thing

[Hu Tao]

This is just such a weird post from you. You’ve never been scared of me before but now you are? I don’t buy it. I said I’m obvious because you always town read me when I’m town. And since I’m town in this game, I once again assumed you’d be able to read me. This pushback from you scares the shit out of me and I’m not enjoying it at all. This isn’t normal for you and it’s not towny at all.

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

Has Jackson scumread you when you were scum before?

[Hu Tao]

You said I was digging in deep, and I’m motivated early in the game. Is this what you don’t like about my iso on you?

I found the things that “gave you pause” and “worried you” as extremely reach-y. It felt like you were pushing yourself extremely hard to find something that could be scummy in my iso just to have something to post on me. Usually, you wouldn’t mind being seen as town-reading me but this time it seems like you didn’t way to seem too eager. That and the amount of effort you put into this ISO-dive this early is different than you in other games. In our town games, you seemed way less invested. So my conclusion is that you have a reason to be invested in this game.

Can you give me examples of what I said and point put what you feel is reach-y. I got a spring of motivation as I couldn’t sleep, I was motivated to do much more than this game which you should know about from me spamming you in dms when you were sleeping lol. Unsure if that’s legal to say? Idfk

I honestly don’t think you know how to act as scum re:me and this is the result. The last game we were in together where I was town and you were scum didn’t have a normal thread to just talk in, so it was easier for you to maneuver around me and pocket me at the same time. Because this is a normal game with normal mechanics, I think you are unsure of how to deal with me in game. If you’re scum, you had to decide between trying to pocket me (you obviously decided against that) and to lay groundwork to use against me later. The only problem is, the groundwork you laid in your deep dive post was just reaching especially because town!Jack wouldn’t have been worried about the things you said you were worried about in that post. And then subsequently you try to say you can’t read me which is just weird because you’ve never been worried in previous games that you are reading me wrong. But this game has you worried? I don’t get why.

Town

[Hu Tao]

Okay I have Fire, GIF and Kay all town. Better reads than I thought I'd get today

[Hu Tao]

I still want Eira gone today. Since Luka is just tunneling me for whatever reason he can go too. But would prefer Eira

[Hu Tao]

Tbf Jackson could be scum. I don't Townread him

[Hu Tao]

Kay who are you 2 biggest scumreads

[Hu Tao]

Your*

[Hu Tao]

I still want Eira gone today. Since Luka is just tunneling me for whatever reason he can go too. But would prefer Eira

This is really aggressive when I haven't even interacted with you that much or at all. And your Luka take is pretty basic

So am I scum? Am I wrong?

[Hu Tao]

So who are your scum reads?

[Hu Tao]

But overcat was pretty lock town imo

Hu Tao's catchup consisted of calling Overcat lock town (whomst they previously only had as a town read), the reason that they're lock town they haven't stated in their ISO other than good vibes, and they had a pretty horrible OMGUS on me before backing off of it once called out on it!

Catchup?

And you mean when everyone else was also suspect of you and I was the one saying that we should wait for you to respond?

[Hu Tao]

Hu Tao's posts are still pretty stinky, they aren't attempting to solve the game and they're just asking questions / basically being filler. I don't remember a single significant read since like, P1 and the lsot they were reading had a grand total of 2 posts that feels like TRing a partner or blatent TMI.

You should really read my other games then. This is just how I am, if you don't like it then too bad. The people that are familiar with me would say something if this was out of the normal

[Hu Tao]

I don't know what exactly you expect me to town from your ISO Hu Tao. You have 2 reads, one of which is explained in any depth and that boils down to "x post looks good", you're chalking up a push on you to a "tunnel" without actually probing me for reason as to why I'm "tunneling" you, you're playing this game immensly safe which even people who have you town are admitting, and your ISO is not good.

How come you aren't bothered by the others who don't have reads too? Quite a few haven't really outed any reads

[Hu Tao]

Luka / Arcanine Cutie
KayJayQueue / Umalot
Eiralox / HumanEatingMonkey
GuyInFreezer / JacksonVirgo
HuTao

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao
Them liking the doggy is wolfy /srs

eh?

I must be wolfy too because I like Overcat's 36.

Mind explaining this further?

Okay, so, in terms of this question:
@Overcat
Elaborate on what "Effort" Jackson has put in please.

I'll say that questions normally have a question mark on the end, and don't include quotation marks alongside any of the words to indicate deep skepticism. I will answer your question, but you have to remove the quotation marks if you want that.

The next point I'll make is that one of the scumreads I learnt from my experience on mafia websites is that town tend to ask questions and try to ascertain people's reasons for things quite strongly, and scum tend to ask questions but be disinterested in the answers, and are generally asking them in a way that's for social posturing. Luka has indicated they are mafia quite strongly to me in this instance (not definitely, but I'm like 70% sure), as their question wasn't actually a question, and the quotation marks indicated a lack of interest in my answer.

The second point I'll make as a more minor fos is that scum tend to be more interested in the way things 'look' and town tend to be more interested in more definite things. Luka stating that "Them liking the doggy is wolfy /srs", is a social putdown along the lines of 'oh, so you associate with him?' sometimes that valid reasoning, in this case it's not. I don't want to make my post too long, and take up too much of the conversation space, though if anyone's curious I have one more read or two I can out.

Anyway, I normally don't vote and make decisions so early on, but I think this is mafia

VOTE: Luka

Actually no, the TMI comment is wack

VOTE: Luka

These were all sus posts on you

[Hu Tao]

You should really read my other games then. This is just how I am, if you don't like it then too bad. The people that are familiar with me would say something if this was out of the normal

I think said people should correct me then if my accusation is false, I don't know why you expect somebody to white knight you here in any way :3

I never said I was expecting someone to do so, I'm just saying if you're the only one thinking this maybe you're the issue here

[Hu Tao]

Overcat and Kay say thing can only see coming from town. Just their vibe, idk how to explain

[Hu Tao]

So uh

[Hu Tao]

I'm fine with just eliminating someone idc who at this point. I've come to find out I'm terrible day 1

[Hu Tao]

Not gif or Kay though

[Hu Tao]

Gonna quick hammer anyone who gets to E-1 cause I'm NotMafia

[Hu Tao]

I guess but usually it just ends in overthinking most of the time. At least that's how I always look at it, I know lots of people disagree with me though

[Hu Tao]

Nah, you slipped. It must have been weak, but it's definitely true. You're scum VOTE: Luka

VOTE: HEM
U slipped

hey not to put a lot of pressure on you but i think this day 1 really relies on you leading the town into something good and if this is the best you can do then I'm really disappointed

From what I've seen on this site so far, when someone is an IC day 1 they don't do much. Probably since they don't have anything to prove, unsure

[Hu Tao]

You know this is a team game, yes?

Yeah for mafia

[Hu Tao]

humaneatingmonkey (E-2): Eiralox, Umlaut, Firebringer

Feels icky to be honest but I'll ignore it for post game credit ^w^

Probably

[Hu Tao]

Yeah for mafia

For everybody. Nobody gives a shit if you go 2/2 if you aren't able to convince people to follow you!

It's a joke. Relax

[Hu Tao]

Luka is more townie than the IC now

Idgaf, fuck you

Doubt

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Eiralox

This is the best place for my vote. I really really want to sheep Firebringer instead but he's just not interested in the game as much as I want him to be. Eiralox has been delaying his big reveal and I'm not convinced that there's a big reveal anyway. Stop making yourself hard to read if you're town, please.

This kinda feels like you're just trying to save yourself and is giving me the pause

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

[Hu Tao]

Or maybe I'm overthinking in the moment. I'll think it over

[Hu Tao]

I can tell by your bottom 2

[Hu Tao]

I can tell by your bottom 2

- This users reads consist of:
1. My top town
2. A P3 gut read off of 3 posts
3. A scum read on me (town) and Eiralox (maybe town)
:3

So you've never has a gut read on anyone early?

[Hu Tao]

Sorry this weekend was busy. I'll catch up more in a bit

[Hu Tao]

Luka, what exactly is ur reason for voting Hua Toa. Hua tao fine with elimming anyone and just openning up with that feels like town hua. Not caring about appearances, why u voting them

they have 2 reads one of which was a page 3 ggut read, when asked whhy they thought it was the case gut was their reasoning yet the feel enough to call it lock town. The play feels really bad and pockety and multiple times have they misinterpreted my arguments against them strawmanning it and then, not conceding to but just ignoring it once i called them out on it. the second read is once again a read on kay which just feels like blatent TMI with the thread state right now and i dont know what the slot is doing if theyre a towner

Read any of my previous games I always go on gut reads. Again, which is why no one here but you has an issue with it.

[Hu Tao]

Sounds a bit TMI to be, sweatie

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: GuyInFreezer
get in here and solve or die by my hands

Bad vote. Cat was obvious town. Just read first few pages

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: GuyInFreezer

HEM just jumps on anything

VOTE: HEM

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: GuyInFreezer

HEM just jumps on anything

VOTE: HEM

also quite ironic since your stance today is you'll jump on anything

Sometimes I say things to see how people react to what I say. I learned this from a player called flavor leaf

[Hu Tao]

22 hours left. I would prefer a non gif elim

[Hu Tao]

Hmmm. I guess I don't see the scum motivation there. But not sure if that was the intent.

[Hu Tao]

Makes me wanna unvote though

[Hu Tao]

Maybe I just go to my original read idk

VOTE: Eira

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Jackson

I'm fine with this too

[Hu Tao]

I'll check in a bit later but we need to make a decision before deadline

[Hu Tao]

Uhh. I may or may not be here before deadline. Going to sleep now. I think my vote is better off putting someone at e-2 at this point. I should be able to check in about 9 hours from now. So if I need to hammer someone then I shall.

VOTE: Umlaut

[Hu Tao]

3 hours left. Anyone here???

[Hu Tao]

At this point I think umlaut is the only viable hammer potential. Only one at e2

[Hu Tao]

At this point I think umlaut is the only viable hammer potential. Only one at e2

You say that as if you can't also pivot to HEM and they'd be at E-2

Idk. The way hem claimed and voted his scum read instead of the next viable wagon doesn't seem scum to me

[Hu Tao]

i can do eiralox too, if enough people says "same"

Same

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: eiralox

[Hu Tao]

Hmmmm. Question is, do we believe you

[Hu Tao]

I'll think it over in next 20 mins

[Hu Tao]

Is anyone very against voting umault here?

[Hu Tao]

Um. Is there anyone we can all agree on or no

[Hu Tao]

At this point I think umlaut is the only viable hammer potential. Only one at e2

Really hate this attitude. I have seen wagons form from nothing near deadline and I'm sure you have too. Moreover since I know I flip green I don't like the "I just can't help voting here"

Could vote Hu for thar but we are close to deadline and I don't want to split the vote even more. I will go along with Eira if that's where we are going, that nonspecific PR claim is meaningless.

Well for the first part, I wasn't sure how many people would be here for deadline

[Hu Tao]

I'm trying to come to a compromise where we don't Elim a potential pr

[Hu Tao]

I'd be willing to vote Luka since he's tunneling me for no reason but I doubt that's happening

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao

Let's give this a whirl first

Ah yes, let's vote the one trying to get everyone to Elim one person

[Hu Tao]

my mind is absolutely breaking and at this point i don't know how to eliminate

Imagine being voted cause you're trying to being everyone together for a vote

[Hu Tao]

So it looks like we have hammer on umlaut

I don't think we do

[Hu Tao]

Oh I think you meant we can get to hammer. Yes I agree.

VOTE: Umlaut

[Hu Tao]

I think that's e-2

[Hu Tao]

That should be E-1. They should claim first though

[Hu Tao]

If we are voting um, no need to talk about the claim imo. If she's town we leave scum confused

[Hu Tao]

[Hu Tao]

Is that a pr claim then?

[Hu Tao]

Well 1 of those 2 is scum

[Hu Tao]

Okay screw it. I'm making an executive decision. If this is town, tomorrow you can blame me.

VOTE: Eiralox

This was my original gut feel anyway

[Hu Tao]

Okay screw it. I'm making an executive decision. If this is town, tomorrow you can blame me.

VOTE: Eiralox

This was my original gut feel anyway

I'm protective role. Want me to reveakl what protective role Hu Tao?

Screw this game. What a circus.

VOTE: Umlaut

That makes sense how you were acting

[Hu Tao]

HEM can you hammer

[Hu Tao]

It's okay

[Hu Tao]

Pretty confident in 2/3 HEM, Jackson, Luka. Vote them in any order and we win

[Hu Tao]

My thought process:
If Eiralox saved me Hu Tao is wolf. If Eiralox saved FireBringer than HEM is a wolf.

What if scum just killed Eira? Why isn't that in your consideration? Also why would scum kill you?

[Hu Tao]

Pretty confident in 2/3 HEM, Jackson, Luka. Vote them in any order and we win

Why aren't you re-evaluating today when you're alive + two town flips, both of which you didn't TR? Also, if even one of them is wrong then you go into LYLO w/ two wolves and it's once again; possible your reads are wrong. If you're town you're over confident on things you're labeling scum reads.

I think overcat was obv town. And this feels like town Kay. I don't think either are scum. My town reads haven't changed since yesterday so I'm not sure what you expected?

[Hu Tao]

My thought process:
If Eiralox saved me Hu Tao is wolf. If Eiralox saved FireBringer than HEM is a wolf.

What if scum just killed Eira? Why isn't that in your consideration? Also why would scum kill you?

I mean, I'm universal town and if you were a wolf. Even if you aren't they can kill me to frame you.
W/ all due respect to Eira I strongly doubt they die.

This question is actually pretty bad since the answer is really telegraphed and it gains you nothing.

[Hu Tao]

My thought process:
If Eiralox saved me Hu Tao is wolf. If Eiralox saved FireBringer than HEM is a wolf.

What if scum just killed Eira? Why isn't that in your consideration? Also why would scum kill you?

Couldn’t Eira have also protected the IC?

Yes, that was his other situation he thought was probable. I agree with that one

[Hu Tao]

Hu can you evaluate GIF as if Overcat was never in the game? I don’t understand the “obvtown” read and GIF doesn’t feel obvious town to me. I want to understand why I shouldn’t be sus of him but I have nothing right now.

Well gif kinda feels like Titus last game. But I'll try to explain why overcat was towny

[Hu Tao]

Okay, so, in terms of this question:
@Overcat
Elaborate on what "Effort" Jackson has put in please.

I'll say that questions normally have a question mark on the end, and don't include quotation marks alongside any of the words to indicate deep skepticism. I will answer your question, but you have to remove the quotation marks if you want that.

The next point I'll make is that one of the scumreads I learnt from my experience on mafia websites is that town tend to ask questions and try to ascertain people's reasons for things quite strongly, and scum tend to ask questions but be disinterested in the answers, and are generally asking them in a way that's for social posturing. Luka has indicated they are mafia quite strongly to me in this instance (not definitely, but I'm like 70% sure), as their question wasn't actually a question, and the quotation marks indicated a lack of interest in my answer.

The second point I'll make as a more minor fos is that scum tend to be more interested in the way things 'look' and town tend to be more interested in more definite things. Luka stating that "Them liking the doggy is wolfy /srs", is a social putdown along the lines of 'oh, so you associate with him?' sometimes that valid reasoning, in this case it's not. I don't want to make my post too long, and take up too much of the conversation space, though if anyone's curious I have one more read or two I can out.

Anyway, I normally don't vote and make decisions so early on, but I think this is mafia

VOTE: Luka

Seems like I overexplained a few things and ended up wall-posting apologies. I will overexplain less in future unless requested.

I wanna say two things before bed:

1. I am unlikely to unvote Luka at this point. I believe that given the information we have now, it would be a mistake to vote anyone else.

2. Jackson said - I'll wait for Luka to comment on my questions, but for right now I'm liking Cat and I'm liking Eira (based on that last post). I think FancyPants is a wolf:

I disagree with this read a bit. Whilst I agree that Eiralox's last line is mildly towny, and it's definitely a mood for you, because you seem to like a slower pace of game, I don't want to trust them just yet. I don't like that they haven't shown much emotional investment in the game so far, or taken firm stances on any reads. Once they start doing that, I'm probably willing to townread them, but for now, they just haven't done that.

These just feel like genuine thoughts

[Hu Tao]

Hu can you evaluate GIF as if Overcat was never in the game? I don’t understand the “obvtown” read and GIF doesn’t feel obvious town to me. I want to understand why I shouldn’t be sus of him but I have nothing right now.

Well gif kinda feels like Titus last game. But I'll try to explain why overcat was towny

Well fuck, I think Titus is scum in every game lol

I'm willing to reevaluate but its just a gut read

[Hu Tao]

LMFAO Luka is funny I agree

[Hu Tao]

Getting nervous that Luka could be town. If so then maybe gif is scum and I'm being bamboozled. Still feel good about kay

[Hu Tao]

I feel like I've done more defending of the gif slot than. So maybe we just wait for gif to talk

[Hu Tao]

@Hu Tao you brought up the meta angle as your only defense, can you link a few town / wolf games bestie?

Yes when I finish catching up

[Hu Tao]

Getting nervous that Luka could be town. If so then maybe gif is scum and I'm being bamboozled. Still feel good about kay

Why are you nervous Luka could be town?

VOTE: Hu Tao

I explained already. This seems out of left field to vote for

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao

[Hu Tao]

I am kind of at Jackson scum and im unsure of second.

I think Eiralox could have just been targeted for night kill to get rid of protective tbh. I mean non zero chance scum don't want a save on me i guess.

This is where I'm leaning too. Especially after the random vote on me

[Hu Tao]

Okay. I'm just gonna claim because i cba to try and this will narrow it down. I'm gated tracker. Jackson went nowhere last night. Still think he can be scum though.

[Hu Tao]

Think it depends. But it's why I was sus of eira's claim until she claimed protective.

[Hu Tao]

Think it depends. But it's why I was sus of eira's claim until she claimed protective.

So do you think you’d be the last PR for town given we have 2 confirmed? (I’m including IC)

Probably yes

[Hu Tao]

So town has IC/bodyguard. IC serves as kind of an investigative part of the town power (why is it investigative? IC is like being cop inno but everyone knows), so normally I would expect any other investigative role claim as a scumclaim, but tracker is kinda hella weak so I can kinda see it happening.

Tracker being town means there are most certainly no more town PRs, and that means the role is expected to get a result with false positive or false negative.

Tracker being scum means they can only get result on a bodyguard (there would be no more town PRs if scum has tracker/goon), which is rare to land in the first place.

So either way it’s a weak af power, especially in a micro.

Yeah wish I was a watcher instead

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Jackson

I'm fine with this too

This was my last vote before the compromise of Umlaut or Eira started.

[Hu Tao]

viewtopic.php?t=92345 here is a town game

[Hu Tao]

PRs are .5 points by the way so my push is fully justified post game

What does this mean

[Hu Tao]

viewtopic.php?t=92237 scum game

[Hu Tao]

So town has IC/bodyguard. IC serves as kind of an investigative part of the town power (why is it investigative? IC is like being cop inno but everyone knows), so normally I would expect any other investigative role claim as a scumclaim, but tracker is kinda hella weak so I can kinda see it happening.

Tracker being town means there are most certainly no more town PRs, and that means the role is expected to get a result with false positive or false negative.

Tracker being scum means they can only get result on a bodyguard (there would be no more town PRs if scum has tracker/goon), which is rare to land in the first place.

So either way it’s a weak af power, especially in a micro.

Yeah wish I was a watcher instead

If you claimed watcher you would’ve been eliminated today so

Imagine

[Hu Tao]

This setup is designed so that the bodyguard is probably dead by night 1 (protecting the only town) and the IC probably dead by night 2 (after the bodyguard dies). So we're robbed of night kill analysis as a starting point if we don't eliminate scum in day 1 and day 2, but since we have an IC - we are looking at a slimmer pool. My take is, I'm not sure there's a balance to giving town another way to get conftowns through a gated tracker if we eliminate 1 scum. Unless it's a very specific gate (that I have in mind).

I wanna ask what the gate is, but this is more Firebringer's call.

I'd rather not. I'd want scum to kill me to find out

[Hu Tao]

Is ninja possible in normal games?

[Hu Tao]

I remember being a scum 1 shot ninja before in a micro but idk if it was normal or what

[Hu Tao]

So you think I'm scum now? Or are you scared I can catch you if you're scum

[Hu Tao]

I'm not sure what to tell you. It's my role. Lol. Scum probably have a good power role too

[Hu Tao]

Actually why are you so certain about game balance when we don't know what scum have?

VOTE: HEM

[Hu Tao]

It's very possible he's scum still. But that's my result

[Hu Tao]

Yes, I only claimed since it's a micro and we are in day 2. And we have an IC and I have a good result and a good tr. I can understand you're skeptical. I believe this more than HEMs reason.

[Hu Tao]

You have a good result? Didn't you target JV and still believe he's scum?

Yes. Because it doesn't clear him

[Hu Tao]

Soooooo anyone have any thoughts?

[Hu Tao]

I'm fine with eliminating anyone but Kay.

[Hu Tao]

I still think HEMs 180° is sus. Probably realized he needs tracker gone ASAP.

[Hu Tao]

I'm fine with eliminating anyone but Kay.

Always trying to pocket me

[Hu Tao]

Okay we wait for Jackon

[Hu Tao]

Jackson*

[Hu Tao]

Umm so who claims next

[Hu Tao]

I just assumed that was a VT claim

[Hu Tao]

Kay can you claim

[Hu Tao]

Did Luka claim already

[Hu Tao]

I should have waited maybe to claim pr I guess. But I didn't really want to in case I got quick Elim by accident or something. I think i was e2 or e1

[Hu Tao]

Hi

[Hu Tao]

I am fine with the hammer. I'm prob dying tonight. I think last is hem

[Hu Tao]

I received fruit btw

Scum fruit vender then? Idk what do fruits do? I've never been in a game with one

[Hu Tao]

I am fine with the hammer. I'm prob dying tonight. I think last is hem

I think IC is dying tonight.

Hopefully

[Hu Tao]

He's probably scum lying

[Hu Tao]

No result today unfortunately. Tried to make it seem like I'd have one for today but I don't.

[Hu Tao]

Odd night tracker. So I'm probably dying tonight now

[Hu Tao]

I should really think this over. I'm not sure anymore

[Hu Tao]

I’m still leaning on Hu Tao btw. If Luka is scum that means D1 elim was done by all town.

Well you're wrong on it being me

[Hu Tao]

I'm kinda lost. I think scum has to be someone that was in a good position day 1. Because they did the kill n1.

[Hu Tao]

I'm kinda lost. I think scum has to be someone that was in a good position day 1. Because they did the kill n1.

Tell me who please, I can’t tell lol

If i knew I'd be tunneling already

[Hu Tao]

I’m still leaning on Hu Tao btw. If Luka is scum that means D1 elim was done by all town.

Well you're wrong on it being me

If you ain’t it then it you’ll have to convince me that it’s Luka because I’m not considering literally anyone else.

I still think it's HEM or Luka. You and kay have been my tr since day 1. If we vote Luka and he's town will you consider hem tomorrow when I'm nk'd?

[Hu Tao]

Well I think you're town and I think kay is town. So that leaves the other 2.

[Hu Tao]

We can eliminate me. But just don't complain tomorrow

[Hu Tao]

I have 2 town reads that I've had since day 1, so I've won the game at this point assuming they are right.

[Hu Tao]

I'm kinda lost. I think scum has to be someone that was in a good position day 1. Because they did the kill n1.

guys is this TMIing the fact that they directly killed eiralox or a towny brain farting

I don't think you get what I am saying or I am misunderstanding you.

[Hu Tao]

Basically I'm saying that they wanted the towny scum to do the kill not jackson

[Hu Tao]

Well I think you're town and I think kay is town. So that leaves the other 2.

What would your case be against Luka? HEM?

Why would I need cases? If I have 2 town reads that I've stated over and over and explained already. The game is already won. I don't care which

[Hu Tao]

If I were to guess between the 2 I'd say hem but I've scumread them since like yesterday so idk

[Hu Tao]

I'm just gonna out it. I'm a 1 shot tracker. I said odd night so i could be nk'd. I don't want anyone complaining that I didn't say my actual role.

[Hu Tao]

Well I think you're town and I think kay is town. So that leaves the other 2.

What would your case be against Luka? HEM?

Why would I need cases? If I have 2 town reads that I've stated over and over and explained already. The game is already won. I don't care which

Moreso for the rest of us that might get something useful from a case on them. I dunno. I just wanted some help since I don’t have the townread you do on GIF and I don’t want to fuck this up lol im still recovering for the last time I fucked up in elo

I'd go HEM > Luka. But that's mostly gut

[Hu Tao]

Well I think you're town and I think kay is town. So that leaves the other 2.

What would your case be against Luka? HEM?

Why would I need cases? If I have 2 town reads that I've stated over and over and explained already. The game is already won. I don't care which

If you're town and Luka flips town, who do you think will be eliminated the next day? You or HEM?
Mafia isn't a game that can be won by read accuracy alone. You're going to have to do some convincing too.

Probably me. Since it seems you scumread me and that's all hem needs. If you're nk'd then idk whats on Kay's mind but prob me?

[Hu Tao]

Because trust me, I'd rather have people flip me today and not worry about the elo struggle as well.
But I'm still doing stuff, aren't I?

You're right. I'll try. Sorry I'm out of it today. I'll look into Jackson in a bit to see who I think he could be partnered with

[Hu Tao]

FancyPants / Luka
KayJayQueue
----
CeeJayvinoya

Is this your read list? If so, why omit Umlaut?

Do we think partner would say this to each other?

[Hu Tao]

Luka is being quite antagonistic which inherently makes me want to vote them, I don't think they're actually scummy though. This could be overcorrection but I don't think scum!luka would be this aggressive this early. Especially when immediately discounting your words like he had. It's not nice, but I don't think it's scummy

Actually no, the TMI comment is wack

VOTE: Luka

I like overcat so far. Even though they suspiciously chose a dog for an avatar as a cat

their reads reek of TMI but they're new so w/e

What part of what they're saying reeks of TMI?

towning you for effort despite 0 effort being put in from your end

In comparison to everybody else in the game, I did put effort in. The comparison to others (and to the game itself, it was page 1) is the important part, I don't think he was anywhere near town-reading me to a super confident degree hence their wording. I feel TMI is more than a stretch, do you think he's not allowed to state where his reads are?

Seems like he was really pushing at Luka early in the game. Thoughts?

[Hu Tao]

Okay but what if: distancing

Luka was being widely townread and a vote on him wasn’t going through. So was he really pushing him or just providing friction so it could be pointed to later? I dunno but I’m keeping the possibility open.

Yeah that's why I kinda thought it could be someone that was townread

[Hu Tao]

No one has buddied JV. The remaining scum distanced. That's a given.

Distanced how though?

[Hu Tao]

And what's your case on me? I'm trying to go over Jackson's post with everyone

[Hu Tao]

Because trust me, I'd rather have people flip me today and not worry about the elo struggle as well.
But I'm still doing stuff, aren't I?

After I said this, I am magically getting too busy for the weekend so I won’t really have time to look things in detail until the end of the weekend.

But the focus I had in mind was the fact that Jackson and Luka knows each other.

@Kay you said you saw Jackson scum once right? How did he tend to interact with his scumbuddy in general in that game?

Ohh I must have missed that they knew each other. That does change things

[Hu Tao]

How do you think he would act if he was scum with Luka?

[Hu Tao]

I don't think you get what I am saying or I am misunderstanding you.

So, you're saying that scum preformed the kill that they did N1 despite the N1 kill being on the bodyguard.
They could have very well killed the IC.

No. I'm saying that the scum that's still alive is the one who did the night kill. Not Jackson. Because of my report. So I'm theorizing that the scum alive did it over Jackson because they were in a better position. In the event of a tracker

[Hu Tao]

And what's your case on me? I'm trying to go over Jackson's post with everyone

[Hu Tao]

Hu Tao's got a lot of time to crack this game open

All you've done is throw shots at me. And not even answer my questions

[Hu Tao]

Hi. Was waiting for responses but guess that's not coming

[Hu Tao]

If I’m scum give me an Oscar lol actually Jack would get one too if we were scum together here. Ain’t no way. I wish I could pull something like that off though lol

I agree you're not scum. I still think last is in hem and Luka since I think gif is town

[Hu Tao]

It's not me

[Hu Tao]

I usually go off vibes. Just doesn't feel like a scum opening to me from overcat. If that read gets me miselimed then oh well

[Hu Tao]

I usually go off vibes. Just doesn't feel like a scum opening to me from overcat. If that read gets me miselimed then oh well

Who do you want to vote today since you’ve given yourself 2 options?

Hem but gif doesn't want that for whatever reason