Mini Normal 2334: trees (Day 5)

[Hu Tao]

Hi.

[Hu Tao]

What does getting a red role pm mean?

[Hu Tao]

I was asking for a friend. Not myself.

[Hu Tao]

Serious question to those who have played with me: when do I get to be considered no longer a newbie? Is it measured in time, games, annoyance level?

I think time. I still felt like a newbie months in though

[Hu Tao]

Serious question to those who have played with me: when do I get to be considered no longer a newbie? Is it measured in time, games, annoyance level?

I think time. I still felt like a newbie months in though

I am still convinced you are an alt of someone from many moons ago

Also, curious on your thoughts about the elements/thomith/Madman dynamic

People thought this before I joined my first game

[Hu Tao]

I’m also working a long ass 4-day weekend and I’ve worked 42 hours and had 5 hours of sleep since Thursday. And I will be working 18 hours tomorrow. I can guarantee I will be delusional if/when I post tomorrow.

Take care of yourself love

[Hu Tao]

I think elements may be town

[Hu Tao]

Outing role DP1 for no reason is antitown as fuck. Anyone who is not disgusted at that is just as bad unless they scumread it instead of assuming Town outed.

Oberbaalysing wagons is nonsense. Town unvote scum during DP1 wagons all the time and vice versa for joining wagons on Town. This is why later votes mean far more especially in clear this person vs that person dynamics. There, voting analysis begins to matter more.

Side note, very weird choice of words for Kayjayqueue to say driving a bus since that is solely used for one scum betraying a partner. Not sure what to even think of it as it is such a brutal slip it cannot be a real one.

This seems like an overreaction. But so much of an overreaction that it may not come from scum

[Hu Tao]

No one I'd really standing out as a scumread so far I think this is the closest to one VOTE: salty

[Hu Tao]

I think elements may be town

I would tend to agree

No one I'd really standing out as a scumread so far I think this is the closest to one VOTE: salty

As much as I hate this non-committal play.....coming from you I think it kinda makes you town heh

who are you? Why do you know me so well! How did you know I was town

[Hu Tao]

holy shit i didnt even realize saltiest cactus was in this game????

UNVOTE: Thomith

VOTE: SaltiestCactus

We could say the same about you, bucko!

[Hu Tao]

Outing role DP1 for no reason is antitown as fuck. Anyone who is not disgusted at that is just as bad unless they scumread it instead of assuming Town outed.

Oberbaalysing wagons is nonsense. Town unvote scum during DP1 wagons all the time and vice versa for joining wagons on Town. This is why later votes mean far more especially in clear this person vs that person dynamics. There, voting analysis begins to matter more.

Side note, very weird choice of words for Kayjayqueue to say driving a bus since that is solely used for one scum betraying a partner. Not sure what to even think of it as it is such a brutal slip it cannot be a real one.

This seems like an overreaction. But so much of an overreaction that it may not come from scum

No it's not. It doesn't warrant a modkill itself but I'd ban her from any of my games if I were a game mod here, for sure. That kind of play is vile and has no place in mafia.

What the fuck are you even on about here??

I died LMFAO

[Hu Tao]

@KayJay
I've just noticed you haven't moved your vote since page 13, is Hu now your biggest suspicion?

I have no suspicion on Hu currently. RVS vote just chilled a little too long I guess.

Join me on

[Hu Tao]

What's your read on me, Mr. Flor?

[Hu Tao]

I think elements may be town

I would tend to agree

No one I'd really standing out as a scumread so far I think this is the closest to one VOTE: salty

As much as I hate this non-committal play.....coming from you I think it kinda makes you town heh

who are you? Why do you know me so well! How did you know I was town

I think this is kind of a weird response given I know you're pretty comfortable entering the game as noncommittal and with no reads as scum

Thanks for ruining my reaction test, Dann

[Hu Tao]

how is that a reaction test and for whom

It was for nick ro see if he's actually trying to read me with meta or just fluffing

[Hu Tao]

elements is lowkey cooking

Nokey*

[Hu Tao]

Because you respond better to being scumread than townread lol

Honestly though, you always sound convincing no matter your alignment so I can’t actually read you/your posts and feel confident either way. I like your opinion on Thom. I think I agree about Rational but unfortunately, their posts do overwhelm me a bit. I’m not sold yet on Grovyle. Cactus is null to me. I don’t have a read either way on Hu. I’ve never experienced scum!Hu so I don’t know if I’m overlooking something obvious.

Good thoughts. I'm thinking Dunn could be scum trying to eliminate me early. All 3 times he's been scum with me in the game he's been eliminated

[Hu Tao]

I think Dann is solidly town here

can you describe this read

Well for one, I can understand the post you made right after this one casing me as scum, or I mean I get where you are coming from.

And also vibes, this doesn't 'feel' like scumDann

I do disagree with you about Hu though, I know she plays somewhat similar as both alignments.....but her non committal stances here don't seem as forced as I have seen from her as scum.

I know that seems like a weird contradiction lol, but hard to really put it into words what I mean.

I don't know who you are but you feel genuine. For now you can be town

[Hu Tao]

I wanna vote in Gibdo/Salty/Rational/Hu today
In no particular order

Then why not join me on salty?

[Hu Tao]

only people with brainworms from playing on epicmafia too much think that PRs are good because the setups there are built so swingy and PR reliant despite the winrate probably going up if people stop worrying about PRs as much

OMG have you played on epic mafia before????

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: rationalmadman

This vote surprises me from you. You may actually be scum

[Hu Tao]

Rational do you have an alt account?

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: rationalmadman

This vote surprises me from you. You may actually be scum

the last time you said i had such a “holy bad vote that i might actually be scum” i was town btw

This is an interesting response. Considering you said I'm scum, but this mindset implies I'm town

[Hu Tao]

Rational do you have an alt account?

No I just get burnout and prefer other hobbies to Mafia. When I play it can go like this. It's not am emotionally rewarding game for me with Towns like this.

Okay. I think you're town

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: rationalmadman

This vote surprises me from you. You may actually be scum

if this is implying you townread RationalMadman, why do you townread him

His outbursts and such I don't usually see from scum.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Thomith

Thomith can you tell me which votes on Rational you think “stink” and why?

Why did you vote me and now Thomith? Looks opportunistic, trying to be the 3 or 4 of 7 seeing what sticks. Very strange.

You're cooking

[Hu Tao]

I'm not sure what the point of this post was?

hu tao said that she thought I was scum trying to get her out early because in previous games where she was town and I was scum I had been eliminated

which is like, factually true, but that also implies that I'm for some reason specifically afraid of hu tao "catching me," and I was dubious that hu tao would actually believe that

Idk Dann. You're being kinda suspicious right now. Does Boo Tao scare you~?

[Hu Tao]

I actually think Elements may be scum despite how obviously antitown she has been all day. I doubted it as she seemed to be trolling me as a VT troll but maybe she is just straight up scum intentionally asking me to explain everything over and over and over and over

I've seen her be anti town as town before. But I don't really think she's being anti town here

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Rational

I don't really get the rational votes here

[Hu Tao]

Dann I think if you were town you'd have a different reaction to how I'm reacting right now

[Hu Tao]

Nooooooooo

Ahahahahaha

[Hu Tao]

I empathize with Elements' Rational vote even though I think Rational is probably town

Why

[Hu Tao]

What do you think my reaction would be

I don't want to say yet

[Hu Tao]

I did a quick read and I still want to eliminate salty. I'm getting vibes there of scum. I'm also getting small pings from gibdo

[Hu Tao]

Anyone not voting salty can they tell me why salty could be town?

[Hu Tao]

I empathize with Elements' Rational vote even though I think Rational is probably town

Why

Because I think Rational's posting is actively harmful to Town EV at worst and annoying/creating disengagement at best

Who cares? He's obvious town. Why would we want to eliminate him.

[Hu Tao]

What do you think my reaction would be

I don't want to say yet

okay, well, I just kinda think you're making that read up

I could just make something up if that was the case

[Hu Tao]

Anyone not voting salty can they tell me why salty could be town?

Haven't seen enough yet.
Seems like he is making an effort to solve in 409 and 410

Thoughts on gibdo?

[Hu Tao]

Why would we want to eliminate him.

same reason I half wanted to eliminate Random Nurse, the innocent child, in our last game

Tbf RN wasn't reading the game

[Hu Tao]

I usually see a scumread and lock in. But I don't have anything too strong right now. It's sad

[Hu Tao]

I empathize with Elements' Rational vote even though I think Rational is probably town

Why

Because I think Rational's posting is actively harmful to Town EV at worst and annoying/creating disengagement at best

Who cares? He's obvious town. Why would we want to eliminate him.

I agree about not wanting to vote Rational but I definitely see a world where scum just continues to let him cause distractions that could cause TvT issues which I think may already be happening today. I don’t know. I just know if things turn toxic again, I might step back.

Idk. He's town and possible a pr so I see no reason to eliminate

[Hu Tao]

Dann and Elements (possibly can throw in Grovyle) are thinking almost exactly as I am, seem town enough for me for now

I've played a few games with only Dannflor, and maybe I'm misremembering, but criticizing others' reads of him doesn't seem like his scum playstyle.

I haven't talked about gibdo yet but I think they lean town after these posts

For context, Gibdo is an IRL friend I invited specifically to play this game. As far as I know he has no experience in forum mafia, his experience with me is relegated to a few face-to-face mafia games we played years ago.

- I think his attempting to pull some meta (no matter how outdated it might be) from those face-to-face games is probably indicative he's genuinely trying to solve me
- I think his statement that he's thinking almost exactly how 3 other players are thinking is somewhat unlikely to come from scum. I think that framing looks kind of blatantly sheepy and pockety and I think scum, especially scum that might feel a bit awkward about this format would be hesitant to avoid that
- above all I think Gibdo not really playing or even mentioning the newbie card at all and just throwing himself into figuring things out as he goes is indicative he's just interested in solving the game rather than looking town

Good to know. I take back the slight scumread om gibdo then.

[Hu Tao]

hu tao do you have a read on awesomeming

I looked into them not too long ago and their posting seemed genuine. So I don't want them right now

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: camel

[Hu Tao]

I did a quick read and I still want to eliminate salty. I'm getting vibes there of scum. I'm also getting small pings from gibdo

I empathize with Elements' Rational vote even though I think Rational is probably town

Why

Because I think Rational's posting is actively harmful to Town EV at worst and annoying/creating disengagement at best

Who cares? He's obvious town. Why would we want to eliminate him.

i hate this thought flow it doesn't feel genuine to me and I probably should re-iso hu tao at some point and that point will be thursday goodbye chat

side note: i dont like the ccs wagon esp with elements on it, and I don't trust dann's logic for his reads so far (maybe he gets better with a flip though)

Unfortunately you cannot tell the difference between genuine or non genuine then

[Hu Tao]

I think the mentality behind 563 and the whole way Hu Tao has approached Rational and the wagon on Rational is scum indicative

I think Rational probably looks the most like untouchable obvious town to scum that are informed of his alignment. All of me, elements, Gibdo and Grovyle have voted Rational or expressed annoyance about Rational while also staying he might be town. We can’t all be scum, and I’d wager the majority of us, if not all, are uninformed of Rational’s alignment and are unable to just do a robotic “yep Rational obvtown time to ignore his posts”

also think she’d probably be more interested in searching for the scum pushing Rational if she indeed thinks Rational is obv town and any votes on him are ridiculous

Unlucky. He is obviously town

[Hu Tao]

I mostly agree, but I'm not comfortable writing off Rational as obvious town. If he's experienced as he has repeatedly claimed, it's still very possible he's just causing a huge scene now to mitigate suspicions on him later.

I largely agree, and I've gone back and forth on Rational a bit myself

Right now, I've settled on him likely being town but I've had doubts

I think Hu Tao is expressing an unnatural amount of confidence because she *knows* Rational is town

As scum there is no reason to stop an easy miselim that could go on my partner instead day 1.

[Hu Tao]

Hu Tao if you Townread me so surely, why not joing my vote on awesomeming?

Just because you're town doesn't mean you're right

[Hu Tao]

Ugh I’m feeling very off about one person that I usually always feel good about so I guess for now I’ll just listen to that gut feeling.

VOTE: Hu Tao

This vote hurts the most

[Hu Tao]

I think this is scum camel. As town I remember him being different

[Hu Tao]

As scum there is no reason to stop an easy miselim that could go on my partner instead day 1.

You genuinely believe you have no motivation to white knight a slot like Rational D1 as scum? that scum don't like to call controversial "easy miselims" town for cred?

Yes. Why would I do that? There is a difference between white knight and playing suboptimal

[Hu Tao]

Hu Tao if you Townread me so surely, why not joing my vote on awesomeming?

Just because you're town doesn't mean you're right

Why do you townread awesomeming?

Vibes. Seems to be solving

[Hu Tao]

I think the mentality behind 563 and the whole way Hu Tao has approached Rational and the wagon on Rational is scum indicative

I think Rational probably looks the most like untouchable obvious town to scum that are informed of his alignment. All of me, elements, Gibdo and Grovyle have voted Rational or expressed annoyance about Rational while also staying he might be town. We can’t all be scum, and I’d wager the majority of us, if not all, are uninformed of Rational’s alignment and are unable to just do a robotic “yep Rational obvtown time to ignore his posts”

also think she’d probably be more interested in searching for the scum pushing Rational if she indeed thinks Rational is obv town and any votes on him are ridiculous

Unlucky. He is obviously town

This is certainly the "easy" answer but is it the right answer?

In my mind it is. What do you think?

[Hu Tao]

There is no use to delay the vote on awesomeming

Except to vote CCS, or Thomith, or Hu

Yes I have turned on Hu

Betrayal

[Hu Tao]

look rational if i was scum and wanted to get town read by you, believe me, i could

Yeah that’s what scares me most lol

What do you think of camel

[Hu Tao]

camel what are your thoughts on your wagon

I want to talk about the camelcasedsnivy wagon. While thomith gave a remotely viable reason, dann elements and hu tao dropped naked votes on camel

within a few posts of each other

and this concerns me because perhaps the only remarkable thing about camel's posts is how unremarkable they've been.


and then later dr nick also drops a naked vote

like what the hell guys am i just not in the loop is this some site meta i'm supposed to know about?

Town

[Hu Tao]

gibdo and salty are also very unremarkable posting

Honestly so am I. I’ve felt so disconnected from this game. I feel like a lot of the game is being dictated to me and not enough is me actually participating and developing reads.

I’m really trying to figure out why I’m not feeling it and fix it.

I'm starting to sus you

[Hu Tao]

gibdo and salty are also very unremarkable posting

Honestly so am I. I’ve felt so disconnected from this game. I feel like a lot of the game is being dictated to me and not enough is me actually participating and developing reads.

I’m really trying to figure out why I’m not feeling it and fix it.

Be the change you want to be lol

Let's have a thought experiment

Gun to your head, who is the scum team

I will respond with mine as well

Oh god I don’t know. Hu, salty, awesomeming/ccs? It could literally be anyone right now except Thom, Elements, and Rational - from my perspective.

Yeah. Basically you scumread the people I've been pushing but still push me. I think you're scum here

[Hu Tao]

I can get behind a KayJay vote if anyone wanted to start a wagon there

Me.

VOTE: kay

[Hu Tao]

I think Kay has been basically going with the flow of the game. And being sus of whoever is being voted in the moment. I think that's why that leads to her scum list not really sounding good

[Hu Tao]

She basically named the last 4 people that were getting votes scum

[Hu Tao]

Elements - maybe town
DrippingGoofball - ???
DrNickRiviera - town
RationalMadman - town
Grovyle in a Fedora - idk
Hu Tao - Hu Taown
KayJayQueue - sus baka
SaltiestCactus23 - scummy
Thomith - unsure I think I want to lean town
camelCasedSnivy - scummy
Dannflor - idk as always
awesomeming327 - towny
Gibdo - idk slightly leaning towny

[Hu Tao]

i don’t really think KJQ is that scummy

I think don’t know what separates camel from other “unremarkable” posters

I want more votes on Hu Tao

I literally just explained why and you're just glossing over it. Her reads make no sense.

[Hu Tao]

Hu Tao if you Townread me so surely, why not joing my vote on awesomeming?

Just because you're town doesn't mean you're right

Why do you townread awesomeming?

Vibes. Seems to be solving

Where? All he's done is suspect me.

Just because someone is wrong about you doesn't mean they are scum.

[Hu Tao]

i don’t really think KJQ is that scummy

the thing for me is that it feels like she's hiding behind the "can't really get into this game" a bit too much

I think this is a more valid point but I think KJQ has been a little more open about it than I'd expect for scum, it's more vulnerable than defensive if that makes sense?

Did she not do this last game as scum too? Hiding behind the fact she was new a lot. Could just be a scum habit

[Hu Tao]

replacing KayJayQueue

Naur

[Hu Tao]

Black replaces KayJayQueue

Yay!

[Hu Tao]

Okay Black I feel confident reading so I'm fine with going back to camel for now

VOTE: Camel

[Hu Tao]

I think you shouldn't speculate replace reasons and just read the player instead.

Anyway rational can you tell me who else you scumread besides awesome?

[Hu Tao]

Black uses she/her

[Hu Tao]

I think you shouldn't speculate replace reasons and just read the player instead.

Anyway rational can you tell me who else you scumread besides awesome?

That's literally part of reading someone other than awesomeming.

Elements is my main scumread outside him but the replacement ramps up how Inperceive the exact things you were saying about KJ. It alsoakes me incidentally Townread you as I don't see her bussing just before quitting. So KJ scum makes me hard Townread you for that ending.

We are seeing the game so different

[Hu Tao]

Is this genuinely acceptable behaviour?

It's a meme post of another player

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

I may or may not read the first 30 pages

He's quite the character. But likely town unfortunately

[Hu Tao]

Quoted the wrong post but yeah

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

I may or may not read the first 30 pages

He's quite the character. But likely town unfortunately

What is your strongest read atm?

Probably that he is town. I also think awesome is town. I posted a reads list a few posts ago if you'd like to check

[Hu Tao]

prodding SaltiestCactus23

This is getting replaced in like 5 hours

Salty or camel I think would be a good quick iso. I think camel is probably scum

[Hu Tao]

What's your case?

If you reread enough to vote someone you read enough to know my case, unless all you read was your scum chat.

That's not even remotely true

Do you want to link me to your case or not?

No. I believe you just slipped pretending to reread. You read enough to join a wagon to eliminate Hu Tao yet didn't read a building case on awesomeming.

Town can slip pretending to reread though, if lazier. What my case is lies in reading awesomeming. Read awesomeming, tell me if it seems like Town or Scum. Nobody is reading him. It's impossible to start a wagon on him yet some like Hu Tao Snivy and Thomith were almost eliminated if others joined in 4 to 5 of 7 I believe, I'm shocked they didn't claim. Even I had 4 on me at one point I think.

Awesomeming has had nobody except me on him until very recently dripping goofball sheeped me.

Black imo becomes more obvious of her alignment the more the game goes on. I think not to worry about her for now

[Hu Tao]

No. I believe you just slipped pretending to reread. You read enough to join a wagon to eliminate Hu Tao yet didn't read a building case on awesomeming.

I read the page before I joined in and that's it. I don't have to have an extensive case on someone to vote them

I'll look over ming later. Thanks for the summary

You're putting Tao in danger zone to claim or get eliminated. You aren't the first or second vote on her.

In Black's defense I've seen her do that to me when we were both town so it's NAI imo. She could do that as either

[Hu Tao]

I actually don't see Dann pushing me like this as town, so I'm leaning scum on him now. I could understand a push but a tunnel like this is not like him ever.

[Hu Tao]

Elements - maybe town
DrippingGoofball - ???
DrNickRiviera - town
RationalMadman - town
Grovyle in a Fedora - idk
Hu Tao - Hu Taown
Black - unsure
SaltiestCactus23 - scummy
Thomith - unsure I think I want to lean town
camelCasedSnivy - scummy
Dannflor - sus
awesomeming327 - towny
Gibdo - idk slightly leaning towny

Updated

[Hu Tao]

camel what are your thoughts on your wagon

I want to talk about the camelcasedsnivy wagon. While thomith gave a remotely viable reason, dann elements and hu tao dropped naked votes on camel

within a few posts of each other

and this concerns me because perhaps the only remarkable thing about camel's posts is how unremarkable they've been.


and then later dr nick also drops a naked vote

like what the hell guys am i just not in the loop is this some site meta i'm supposed to know about?

I liked this post

[Hu Tao]

You have helped Scum narrow down PRs massively by what you just did (unless you are Scum obviously). I am struggling to not violate the insult rule at this point. I'm not replying to you anymore.

Getting into an argument you can't win and backing out before it makes you look bad, got it

This post in particular seems to have been made with bad faith

rational's writing style is so goofy
it seems super stream of consciousness

Not sure what to even think of it as it is such a brutal slip it cannot be a real one.

this seems pretty unnecessary

actually to think about it the entire byplay between rational and kay about the "slip" seems really weird
like it seems too small of a deal for that big of a conversation

kind of meme but {kay rational elements} solve ez

rational's writing style is so goofy
it seems super stream of consciousness

Not sure what to even think of it as it is such a brutal slip it cannot be a real one.

this seems pretty unnecessary

actually to think about it the entire byplay between rational and kay about the "slip" seems really weird
like it seems too small of a deal for that big of a conversation

kind of meme but {kay rational elements} solve ez

She thanked me for it because people like yourself never corrected her on it. Maybe take that into consideration when analysing it.

I was referencing how many words was in the conversation. I never said the conversation was unnecessary, I said that the superfluousness of it was unnecessary.

Your post is very confrontational. Why?

As much as I would love to gehad you continue to argue pointlessly, unfortunately, this is not mafia theory discussion thread. Please play the game instead.

I liked these posts originally

[Hu Tao]

Elements - maybe town
DrippingGoofball - ???
DrNickRiviera - town
RationalMadman - town
Grovyle in a Fedora - idk
Hu Tao - Hu Taown
Black - unsure
SaltiestCactus23 - scummy
Thomith - unsure I think I want to lean town
camelCasedSnivy - scummy
Dannflor - sus
awesomeming327 - towny
Gibdo - idk slightly leaning towny

Updated

Other than Thomith and myself, I don't understand your townreads, as in what logic are you using?

You said youre unsure of Black yet you outright scumread Kayjay shortly before.

I go based on vibes. In terms of the Black/Kay slot I felt like Kay could be scum because of what I stated, but it could have been wrong. When black replaced in I'm comfortable giving that slot more time because I think I can read black pretty well, I've never been wrong about her. So given time, her alignment will show to me.

[Hu Tao]

Elements - maybe town
DrippingGoofball - ???
DrNickRiviera - town
RationalMadman - town
Grovyle in a Fedora - idk
Hu Tao - Hu Taown
Black - unsure
SaltiestCactus23 - scummy
Thomith - unsure I think I want to lean town
camelCasedSnivy - scummy
Dannflor - sus
awesomeming327 - towny
Gibdo - idk slightly leaning towny

Updated

Other than Thomith and myself, I don't understand your townreads, as in what logic are you using?

You said youre unsure of Black yet you outright scumread Kayjay shortly before.

I go based on vibes. In terms of the Black/Kay slot I felt like Kay could be scum because of what I stated, but it could have been wrong. When black replaced in I'm comfortable giving that slot more time because I think I can read black pretty well, I've never been wrong about her. So given time, her alignment will show to me.

You've never been wrong about Black?

I am curious if she will agree

I've said this before and she's never disagreed.

[Hu Tao]

I will lead this Town to a surefire victory if you would all just follow me.

K
Hnmmm that's something scum would say.

Aren't you sheeping him?

[Hu Tao]

I actually don't see Dann pushing me like this as town, so I'm leaning scum on him now. I could understand a push but a tunnel like this is not like him ever.

Your reads are barely skin deep and I haven’t felt this certain about a scum read in a long while

It’s not like I’m really known to tunnel as scum either so I think you’re just grasping at straws

No. But I think as town you'd be more reasonable and try to read others and not tunnel. I just don't buy this persona right now. You're way more level headed than this.

[Hu Tao]

While I don't think you're scared of me I do think you're cautious of me and since you know I'm town you want me eliminated before I could potentially catch you or your partners later.

[Hu Tao]

Well if you found out I was town, how would that change your reads?

[Hu Tao]

Anyone else?

[Hu Tao]

Well if you're town, you're wrong and you need to lock in. Cause you're on the wrong path here.

[Hu Tao]

Anyone else?

maybe I’d look closer at grovyle too, idk

Why?

[Hu Tao]

What if we just voted Goofball for doing nothing

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Goofball

*poke*

God Dammit

I like this

VOTE: Goof

Why?

[Hu Tao]

It's hard for me to imagine Dannflor jumping straight to counter-attacking a scummy read on him instead of trying to justify his thoughts, even if he does strongly suspect Hu Tao.

Agreed!

[Hu Tao]

Calling Hu/Rational/Gibdo for post game cred

This might be the worst 0/3 you've ever posted.

[Hu Tao]

What if we just voted Goofball for doing nothing

Goofball has done more than elements and dann who just trollvote all wagons. He's voting scum with me.

Okay this is a reach

[Hu Tao]

mostly rational being loudly wrong about everything and insulting people every chance he gets

The IRONY

[Hu Tao]

If you bring up the fact that I intentionally named myself after a race for the lolz one more time we're gonna have a bigger problem than we already have

Your reads this game are wrong. but I love you queen

[Hu Tao]

I do not want to fade hutao before getting dripping camel and salty to get a little more content in

Good news, I'm not being faded this game

[Hu Tao]

I quickly skimmed through a RM game just in case where he was scum and yeah he is different here.

[Hu Tao]

I'm leaning town on black unfortunately. I wish she could read me better, but I think her go to is to eliminate me when she's town.

[Hu Tao]

Elements I'm unsure of. Because I remember her doing way less as town before. And doing more as scum. So that changes things. I think I'd change her back to null if i didn't have her there already

[Hu Tao]

Elements - unsure
DrippingGoofball - ???
DrNickRiviera - town
RationalMadman - town
Grovyle in a Fedora - idk
Hu Tao - Hu Taown
Black - leaning town
SaltiestCactus23 - scummy
Thomith - unsure I think I want to lean town
camelCasedSnivy - scummy
Dannflor - scum
awesomeming327 - towny
Gibdo - leaning towny

[Hu Tao]

I quickly skimmed through a RM game just in case where he was scum and yeah he is different here.

you found one that wasn't a replace in?
I had a look and he's different in every game on this site

He replaced into the one I read

[Hu Tao]

I think Hu Tao would care more about being run up as town

Well this is false. I've self voted as town. Now you're just outing false reads. You've been in a game I've self voted. So now I know you're scum.

[Hu Tao]

For everyone else,

I'm so confident Naerys flips scum this game. Eliminate me and vote her out tomorrow. I agree with this.

VOTE: hu tao

She's contradicting herself. She does this as scum. She literally I'd saying the thing she did as town last game is now scummy when I do it.

This is the game I was town and self voted. To prove Dann is lying. He was IN this game. So he's just caught lying.

[Hu Tao]

Also, another thing. In this same game he said he didn't see the confidence I had in reads.

hu tao i'm struggling to believe your confidence in your notascum read is real

i don't understand the difference between notascum's entrance and KJQ's entrance for one

Yet this game he's saying he doesn't see the confidence I have in my RN read. If he was town he would have learned from these things and not tunnel and at least bring up this situation or think about it. He's just been tunneling mindlessly. This is not Town!Dann

[Hu Tao]

I mostly agree, but I'm not comfortable writing off Rational as obvious town. If he's experienced as he has repeatedly claimed, it's still very possible he's just causing a huge scene now to mitigate suspicions on him later.

I largely agree, and I've gone back and forth on Rational a bit myself

Right now, I've settled on him likely being town but I've had doubts

I think Hu Tao is expressing an unnatural amount of confidence because she *knows* Rational is town

Here from this game. Dann is not dumb, he knows what he's doing. If he was town he would reference this game or other games and have at least a little pause, but this game has been pretty much a tunnel and is very unlike town him.

[Hu Tao]

I've brought you all the evidence that Dann is scum this game, so can someone actually take it seriously. He's a good player, but he's been scummy in his contradicting

[Hu Tao]

I do not want to fade hutao before getting dripping camel and salty to get a little more content in

Good news, I'm not being faded this game

Do you not find it strange that while saying this, Awesomeing is trying to campaign for votes on you such as here? :

Dr nick, what are you thoughts on hu tao? You said before that you scumread her right

This is actually a good point. It does look like soft pushing for nick to vote me.

[Hu Tao]

have very much thought KayJay was scum the whole game

I agree with kayjay scum

I'm curious about these reads

As I am your scumread, thoughts on what I posted on Dann and how he was caught lying?

[Hu Tao]

i think im back to fully townreading dann again btw
elements actually somewhat towny in recent posts

hu tao still my preferred elim here, awesomeming is slipping a little


rational still beating the same scumread into the ground is pretty cringe but the overall readslist that finally shows some holistic thought gives them a day 1 pass for me at this point

Did you even read what I posted about Dann? What is your reasoning for town reading his contradicting?

[Hu Tao]

Hello!

The following players are town for one reason or another:

RM
Elements
Thomith
Dr nick
Grovyle
Gibdo

Probably DGB.

Leaving Awesomeming, DannF, Black, CCS, Black.

I haven't gotten a great feel for CCS or Awesomeming so I will delve in there for a sharper take over the weekend.

I had been getting scum pings from Dann and have very much thought KayJay was scum the whole game. But I do think Hu could reasonably be scum based off the recent argument Black made for it.

Let's go with Dann. I think black has a chance of town

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Dann

[Hu Tao]

I do not want to fade hutao before getting dripping camel and salty to get a little more content in

Good news, I'm not being faded this game

Do you not find it strange that while saying this, Awesomeing is trying to campaign for votes on you such as here? :

Dr nick, what are you thoughts on hu tao? You said before that you scumread her right

This is actually a good point. It does look like soft pushing for nick to vote me.

I agree, me no likey

Also, fwiw......I am back thinking you are town

Thoughts on what I said about Dann and his contradicting between both games?

[Hu Tao]

Dann if you're town and I'm getting distracted by you like I did with Naerys that last game I posted, that's going to be so annoying. But, I think you just wouldn't play this way as town. You're too good for this.

[Hu Tao]

god reading your posts is actually making me feel sick

Why?

[Hu Tao]

Why not tell me? I don't want to annoy you.

[Hu Tao]

I am glad others are starting to see KayJay-scum.

Why would Dann be scum?

You know what is a really solid scum tell? Asking me what the secret scum tell is. Why would a townie care?

I just laid out a case as to why Dann is scum

[Hu Tao]

have very much thought KayJay was scum the whole game

I agree with kayjay scum

I'm curious about these reads

As I am your scumread, thoughts on what I posted on Dann and how he was caught lying?

I'm not seeing the lie and I think you trying to paint it as one feels desperate

How do you not see it? He says my reads are unnatural last game when we were both town. Yet this time he doesn't even consider it and still calls it unnatural.

Also, why does that make you think I'm panting it that way? What about it seems desperate? Because clearly other people see it too since he has more votes on him than me now. If that's the case, what do you think of the others who voted him after I laid out my case?

[Hu Tao]

I do not want to fade hutao before getting dripping camel and salty to get a little more content in

Good news, I'm not being faded this game

Do you not find it strange that while saying this, Awesomeing is trying to campaign for votes on you such as here? :

Dr nick, what are you thoughts on hu tao? You said before that you scumread her right

This is actually a good point. It does look like soft pushing for nick to vote me.

So why aren't you voting him?

Because I think Dann is most likely scum and awesome has done 1 thing I think is scummy

[Hu Tao]

1029 is such a gross post

Why?

[Hu Tao]

like I understand why this is the route you'd take as scum but the performativity when it's very clear you don't care about solving my alignment at all actually makes me sick to my stomach

1029 has two goals

1. give Hu Tao some plausible deniability for if she get's me flipped
2. guilt me into stop pushing her

nowhere in Hu Tao's entire ISO is there any intention of trying to get my thoughts behind my actions and reads and genuinely try to read my fucking alignment, she is stuck in a position where she needs to paint me as scum or she just loses

for all the words Hu Tao has put to how I'm tunneling her, at the very least I am constantly trying to figure out what Hu Tao expects from me as town by articulating the specific reasons *why* I think she'd be acting different and giving her an opportunity to explain

she's responded by jumping on a "contradiction" and campaigning for my elimination because of it

I tried to figure out what she thought my reaction would be as town and she shut me out in 555

I responded to her scummy fucking contradiction case in as good faith as I could and the only response I got was hu tao ignoring me and campaigning for my vote

and then she has the audacity to post 1029 and 1035?

I would never intentionally guilt trip someone, I personally think it's a lame tactic. I know no one will believe me but it's true. Even so, I was more so giving you the thoughts going though my mind. Sorry it came off that way if you're actually upset

[Hu Tao]

if I try to remove myself from the emotion of the situation and look at things objectively,

I think the emphasis on me being "caught lying" and "contradicting" comes from scum a lot of the time

I think Hu Tao's read trajectory on me (going from scummy to idk back to scummy), coincidentally matching up almost exactly to me scum reading, town reading, and then going back to scum reading her again is purely political

I think Hu Tao's blase attitude when people were suspecting her was focused on looking towny and does not match how she behaved around a similar situation in a previous game

I think her only bringing up 981 at the point she did points to her read being manufactured as opposed to a natural reason she thought I was scum

This is false. I SAID THIS LAST GAME AS TOWN ABOUT NAERYS BEING CONTRADICTING LMAO. To be fair I was wrong with that one , but to say that's a scum tactic from my is confirmed false based on last game alone that I already linked here.

[Hu Tao]

there's also Hu Tao's camel scum read dropping off the face of the earth and CCS seeming to not care about it at all despite calling out hu tao specifically in 693

it just feels like distancing

idk I'm aware I'm loaded with confbias right now and I'd be very pleasantly surprised if I was actually 3/3 right now but it fits together remarkably well and explains why hu tao seems so desperate to get me limmed

Not true. I just posted a reads list where I said he was scummy, you're lying. Just cause I'm focused on you doesn't mean I don't have other reads.

[Hu Tao]

just because you've done something as town before doesn't mean I don't think it comes from scum more often or that you also wouldn't do the same thing as scum

Yes but what makes you scum is that it never crossed your mind or gave you pause about me. Or even tried to imagine a world where I am town and just on the same path as last game

[Hu Tao]

Thomith...ActionDan...Awesomeming

1 ultractive overcompensater, 2 lurkers barely trying ..

Hmm.

Thoughts on camel?

[Hu Tao]

It's safe to say that there's at least one town between Dannflor and Hu Tao from how hard they're going for each other's throats.

Agree here, neither are players to really hard buss as scum as well

How often have we played together on alts? Curious

[Hu Tao]

Thomith...ActionDan...Awesomeming

1 ultractive overcompensater, 2 lurkers barely trying ..

Hmm.

Thoughts on camel?

Time is running out and you're hyperfixating on Dannflor. You have no reason you're townreading awesomeming whatsoever and agreed he's been shady even when saying he will 'fade' you later. What exactly is it I need to say or do to shift you to join me on awesomeming?

I'm not one to vote someone just to 'save myself' I would rather vote Camel instead if I was forced to but I think Dann is scummier.

[Hu Tao]

I used to be known for bussing as scum so I'm not sure if you're just outing false meta or not is why I ask.

[Hu Tao]

Has anyone seen Dann act this way as town?

[Hu Tao]

I agree with Black that awesomeming’s attitude doesn’t really match up with his professed reads

I also think the reaction to his sudden growing wagon is a little too cool

Dannflor doing anything to stay alive today

[Hu Tao]

2 things:

1. I was gonna quick hammer awesome at e-1 but wasn't here. (No one will believe this but it needs to be said)

2. Dann, now that you're in dead thread and see that I'm town, can you agree see why I said I'm scared of trying to read you. Cause i really did think you were scum this game cause what I pointed out.

[Hu Tao]

We lost a neighborizer, well that sucks.

Prediction: awesoming was bus'ed by both their buddies. That slot was more useful as a source of town cred than alive.

Tbh neighborizer isn't that strong. Could be worse

[Hu Tao]

Good news is, Dann I will try my hardest to win this for you as my apology for tunneling you like that.

[Hu Tao]

I have thoughts but I want others to speak

[Hu Tao]

Camel I think is still a good vote

[Hu Tao]

We lost a neighborizer, well that sucks.

Prediction: awesoming was bus'ed by both their buddies. That slot was more useful as a source of town cred than alive.

Thomith 1156, Black 1159, Gibdo 1223, Elements 1261

Probably in there.

Hu Tao (4): Dannflor 606, Grovyle in a Fedora 736,

Black 792, Thomith 869

awesomeming327 (2):

RationalMadman 266, DrippingGoofball 594

We can just lim black and thomith and win.

I think this is a pretty scummy narrative and it feels like posturing to just push everyone on ming's wagon until they hit scum

I had the same thought

[Hu Tao]

Me thinking I'd be fighting for my life today, but end up being Town read for the night kill

[Hu Tao]

I think nick is town

[Hu Tao]

I think I agree that scum are trying to frame Hu. I don't really see Hu making that hit

this literally doesnt happen, i thought you were supposed to be one of the better scum players on the site?

I think Dann was a fine kill knowing I'm town. Especially since he was a counter wagon to awesome

[Hu Tao]

How was my day 2 start scummy?

[Hu Tao]

I stand by all those posts

[Hu Tao]

nice i accidentally embedded the word have into a quote

Waiting to see what's wrong with any of those posts

[Hu Tao]

You're missing something

[Hu Tao]

I do not want to fade hutao before getting dripping camel and salty to get a little more content in

Good news, I'm not being faded this game

Do you not find it strange that while saying this, Awesomeing is trying to campaign for votes on you such as here? :

Dr nick, what are you thoughts on hu tao? You said before that you scumread her right

This is actually a good point. It does look like soft pushing for nick to vote me.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao

One day you'll stop scum reading me every game and actually try to read me and see if I'm town or not

[Hu Tao]

Dann if you're town and I'm getting distracted by you like I did with Naerys that last game I posted, that's going to be so annoying. But, I think you just wouldn't play this way as town. You're too good for this.

This ended up being right. I'm sad

[Hu Tao]

I do not want to fade hutao before getting dripping camel and salty to get a little more content in

Good news, I'm not being faded this game

Do you not find it strange that while saying this, Awesomeing is trying to campaign for votes on you such as here? :

Dr nick, what are you thoughts on hu tao? You said before that you scumread her right

This is actually a good point. It does look like soft pushing for nick to vote me.

This made you want to hammer a townread?

Look at when the reads list was posted, and look when the post I quoted was posted. I clearly said he had a point about the soft push. (Also why nick is pretty obv town imo)

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao

One day you'll stop scum reading me every game and actually try to read me and see if I'm town or not

It's disingenuous to say I'm not trying here

Why do you think CCS is scum?

You're trying in the game, but when it comes to me your first instinct is to vote me and not actually try to solve me.

[Hu Tao]

did you think dann was scum after the awesome flip

No. I was softing on Dann but day ended before I really could post more. I was gonna go to camel or quick hammer awesome.

[Hu Tao]

I do not want to fade hutao before getting dripping camel and salty to get a little more content in

Good news, I'm not being faded this game

Do you not find it strange that while saying this, Awesomeing is trying to campaign for votes on you such as here? :

Dr nick, what are you thoughts on hu tao? You said before that you scumread her right

This is actually a good point. It does look like soft pushing for nick to vote me.

This made you want to hammer a townread?

Look at when the reads list was posted, and look when the post I quoted was posted. I clearly said he had a point about the soft push. (Also why nick is pretty obv town imo)

I'm well aware of the timing. I don't see how that post is enough to make you go from townreading him to wanting to hammer him

Why not? He did something suspicious. It's day 1. I also would not have believed his tracker claim the way he made it

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao

One day you'll stop scum reading me every game and actually try to read me and see if I'm town or not

It's disingenuous to say I'm not trying here

Why do you think CCS is scum?

You're trying in the game, but when it comes to me your first instinct is to vote me and not actually try to solve me.

If this were true then I would have voted you coming into the day instead of thinking you probably wouldn't kill Dann

Yet look where we are. It took you a few hours. New record

[Hu Tao]

Unrelated, I would never defend or soft defend a goon if they were my partner. Maybe an important PR but cred of bussing early is way better than trying to save a goon partner

[Hu Tao]

i think its wild to claim one would quickhammer a slot that claimed PR there after that slot was a townread beforehand

natural towny instinct is to believe that at first and not think "imma hammer that now"

that exchange with awesomeming does not seem to me they are fishing for votes on hu tao, it looked like fishing for a wagon outside of hu tao if anything while feeling obligated to potentially bus

This take is WILD

[Hu Tao]

Groyvle reminds me of someone I forgot their name though.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao

One day you'll stop scum reading me every game and actually try to read me and see if I'm town or not

It's disingenuous to say I'm not trying here

Why do you think CCS is scum?

You're trying in the game, but when it comes to me your first instinct is to vote me and not actually try to solve me.

If this were true then I would have voted you coming into the day instead of thinking you probably wouldn't kill Dann

Yet look where we are. It took you a few hours. New record

I wanna say something but I'm just gonna walk away instead

I still you. It's just frustrating is all. Especially since I play with you so often.

[Hu Tao]

Yall act like I can't change reads after I see something that changes my mind. LMFAO. this is crazy

[Hu Tao]

I literally said he had a good point about awesome being scummy with that post

[Hu Tao]

Unrelated, I would never defend or soft defend a goon if they were my partner. Maybe an important PR but cred of bussing early is way better than trying to save a goon partner

considering this is a Simple normal, its very likely the scum team have very little power, so this is frankly not a real point

Who cares about the game? I'm just saying what I'd do regardless.

[Hu Tao]

I should ignore Groyvle. Because it seems in bad faith. And I don't want the same thing that happened with Dann day 1 where I get distracted if they are town

[Hu Tao]

I'll step back and reset later. I think if I was scum with awesome, 0% chance I act that way with them. Anyone who has played with scum me should know by now.

[Hu Tao]

So because I've done it as scum, it means it's impossible to do as town correct?

[Hu Tao]

I've regarded most of Hu's posts today as sleazy regardless of alignment. And if she is scum I think it probable her reads are bolstered by private info (Nick town, CCS scum). All that's to say, let's fade CCS first.

Why sleazy?

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: black

I think she's town

[Hu Tao]

people like you have inconsistent methodology and think you're gods gift to mafia but refuse to consider being fully accurate. you might notice I personally showed skepticism on your alleged read on awesome because I don't take shortcuts that don't actually always work. (nevermind the fact your reasoning was completely coincidental and likely just part of awesome's mimicking of his town play rather than something scummy)

and its insulting to claim such credit on awesome when people changed their mind on their own due to awesome falling off - not because of some magical case you made. awesome dug his own grave, not you at all. in fact, you did more to potentially help him go free due to being annoying about it than


so yes, it is nonsense to me when you claim things like that hu tao is town because dann died with no critical thought beyond that, something that insults Dann's and I's reasonings we have developed for hu scum.

hell part of me still thinks you're a player who selfishly thought awesome was dead weight and hellbussed them and are now just tunneling your way through the game and defending a scum hu here.

so frankly, back up your shit and don't give me cheap shortcuts

I think this is probably town. Grovyle is spittin fire here

I wouldn't Town read a post like that so easily. Since it's more about 1 person than the state of the game, I can see scum faking that.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: CCS

[Hu Tao]

Just letting it known if anyone wants goofball elimination, I am more than down.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: black

I think she's town

Your reads haven't been accurate so far.

She is the most likely vote based on placement and how Awesomeming gave up and didn't vote Dannflor at all, to be the scum bussing him.

In your opinion was KJQ scum?

I thought so but I think black is town

[Hu Tao]

Let's just ignore, no need to elim

[Hu Tao]

Go ahead, sabotage yourselves.

All I say is drivel, angry or mad after all.

For me it's just the spamming. Just put it in one post if you're not replying to people please

[Hu Tao]

@drippinggoofball
@hu tao
are you open to vote Elements?

HT Townreads Black, I scumread both Black and Elements equally.

I'm ok voting elements

[Hu Tao]

If I wasn't townreading the vibe of nick I'd be scumreading him.

[Hu Tao]

If I wasn't townreading the vibe of nick I'd be scumreading him.

This needs some splaining

It makes sense to me. Your vibes are towny, your actions are not

[Hu Tao]

Idk they just are at times. Seems you switch things to quickly. Why vote who I scumread when you scumread me for 2 days

[Hu Tao]

Idk they just are at times. Seems you switch things to quickly. Why vote who I scumread when you scumread me for 2 days

Are we talking about Dann again?

I'm voting ccs and have scumread them for 2 days. But you're fine jumping on the wagon after others do. Yet not sus of me pushing there even though I'm your top scumread

[Hu Tao]

Grovyle reads like a soliloquy, it feels fake. Could just be his style of posting though

[Hu Tao]

This may be the first game where I'm sus of so many people, I'm not sure where to go or what gut read to listen to.

[Hu Tao]

Force replacing RationalMadman.

Not all heroes wear capes

[Hu Tao]

OUR DIFFERENCE IS THAT I AM IRRATIONAL.

My favorite genshin impact player

[Hu Tao]

Idk they just are at times. Seems you switch things to quickly. Why vote who I scumread when you scumread me for 2 days

Are we talking about Dann again?

I'm voting ccs and have scumread them for 2 days. But you're fine jumping on the wagon after others do. Yet not sus of me pushing there even though I'm your top scumread

Well thanks for assuming my reads

How is it assuming your reads when it's literally what you said?

[Hu Tao]

So game comes alive only when i post okay

Honestly after what we all went through with your predecessor I think it's a good idea to let the game breathe a little

True!

[Hu Tao]

I am tired of pretending i know how to play mafia can you just case it

cases are for nerds

I literally play dnd

At least you don't play league or valorant

[Hu Tao]

I am tired of pretending i know how to play mafia can you just case it

cases are for nerds

I literally play dnd

At least you don't play league or valorant

*hides*

[Hu Tao]

I am tired of pretending i know how to play mafia can you just case it

cases are for nerds

I literally play dnd

At least you don't play league or valorant

Hey! I'm also a League and Valorant enjoyer!

Caught!

[Hu Tao]

That's a fair take

[Hu Tao]

We can wait for snivy replacement

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

I forgot you were in this game

This means you abd your partner aren't planning on killing me

[Hu Tao]

I'm on Page 20 and I'm tired

Scum is Thomith and probably one of {Black, ActionDan, Gibdo}

I'll try and find out more tomorrow

Out of these maybe I'd vote thomith

[Hu Tao]

UNVOTE:

I forgot you were in this game

This means you abd your partner aren't planning on killing me

I'm on Page 20 and I'm tired

Scum is Thomith and probably one of {Black, ActionDan, Gibdo}

I'll try and find out more tomorrow

Out of these maybe I'd vote thomith

You think Elements and Thomith are likely partners?

I think a lot of people can be scum

[Hu Tao]

I'll make one later

[Hu Tao]

I'm on Page 20 and I'm tired

Scum is Thomith and probably one of {Black, ActionDan, Gibdo}

I'll try and find out more tomorrow

Out of these maybe I'd vote thomith

Why do you think I'm scum?

You're the worst out of that group, never said you were scum

[Hu Tao]

I would not be surprised at all to find out that RationalMadman is a Random Nurse alt

No way lmao

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: groyvle

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: groyvle

this reaction tells me that the game is already won

Same

[Hu Tao]

It's weird that Hu had an issue with Nick voting for CCS but she didn't care when I did it

I think the townread is more likely a tactic to try and get me off of her

Have I ever been wrong on you? No. I just know how you act as town and as scum. I don't know DrNick is, so I don't know how they would act as town or scum. So I need to read more into them than I would you.

[Hu Tao]

VOTE: Hu Tao

I think we should do this

At least you lasted a few days this time before going back

[Hu Tao]

Last 2 scum feels like it's in groyvle, elements, Thom.