Mini 201 - Game Over!

[HezLucky]

random.org says ...

Vote: Blackberry

Let's try to get some information. Frankly, I think it's a great thing that a mafia member died regardless of who killed him.

[HezLucky]

Yeah, that and the fact that he's trying to find justification for his vote. For the time being, that's good enough for me.

Unvote: Blackberry, Vote: Eynh

[HezLucky]

More thoughts:

- EYNH seems to be changing his votes very quickly...
- he also seems extremely defensive (name calling, "what the hell?")
- we have to lynch someone today and this will probably get us some information, especially as we look at who defends him and what his role turns out to be

Vote stays.

[HezLucky]

Remember possibility vig kill tigris.

Unlikely, but possible two vigs...

Why my restriction?

vote:hezlucky

Crap logic. Post 26.

More later

And I presume you have better logic, hm?

[HezLucky]

Okay, I'll break your double post. Anything more?

[HezLucky]

Erm... yay, I'm second in scumminess. I'm so happy.

It doesn't look like EYNH is gonna get lynched. I'm still suspicious of him anyway but less so than before...

I'll see the vote count before I say more.

[HezLucky]

Yep, that's exactly what I'm saying. That's how I play Day 1.

FOS: EYNH

for being so sure that I'm mafia, even though I'm clearly not.

[HezLucky]

Heh ... a quick background check will show you that I'm <quite> new.

I need to change my plan of attack. I seem to get accused first round in every single mafia game I play to the point where people don't believe me if I claim doctor and no one counterclaims.

It's usually mafia that are on me too.. the rest follow like sheep.

[HezLucky]

Darn... double posted.

I should just have "miller" as my default role... bahahaha, that would be so perfect... I would never win a game that way.

Then again, that doesn't change anything.

[HezLucky]

Ow...

And I'm one of the people who posted on Page 3...

I'm "still here" or whatever.

Somebody do something scummy already.

[HezLucky]

Request for Vote Count

[HezLucky]

I only have two from my count. Who's the third?

[HezLucky]

Yeah, I have two.

I've gotten an FOS, a confirm vote and an unvote on top of that.

Enteryournamehere has 3 votes though, he is the current vote leader.

[HezLucky]

Whoa, you're right, it has been two days.

Thank mod I didn't get prodded.

I'm keeping my vote on EYNH. It's day one. This lynch is as good as any at the moment and he's done nothing to remove my vote (in fact, he's made me more suspicious by trying to draw attention off himself rather than defending himself). Funny considering those are his words concerning me.

Frankly, I think you're all inconsistent. You don't want four people or so to claim on the first day but you're opposed to a bandwagon.

I'm suspicious of Blackberry now for thinking EYNH's FOS on Phoenix was a bit odd and not throwing an FOS on EYNH. Could be a subtle tactic to make sure EYNH doesn't garner more votes.

That's all for now. More as I see fit (or, heh, as others request )

[HezLucky]

FOS: kadath

right off the bat. Something doesn't seem right with him.

Eh? So now I'm suspicious?

I want a lynch. I've been consistent throughout in saying that. Staying on Day 1 for too long won't do the town too good because it gives too much information to mafia and doesn't really tell us much more than analyzing the kills at Night (which can happen if we talk a bit and lynch, rather than stall as we are doing now).

I don't care what you're trying to do, voting me is a bad move unless you are mafia. That fourth vote seemed like a shameless attempt to start a bandwagon on me. Your vote is better spent on EYNH. What's going to happen is that I'm going to claim, you're going to unvote me and go after EYNH anyway... then I'll die at night because I'm a "confirmed innocent"...

Save me the trouble and lynch EYNH. If we have an inspector and he is suspicious of me, he can feel free to waste an inspection on me at night... though trust me, it's not worth it.

I don't like being the center of attention like this. It simply causes the inspector to inspect me and waste a night. Frankly, I know what will happen. I claim a non-mafia role, you all unvote me (or keep the vote on if you are scum giving excuses), inspector inspects me at night and finds me innocent, and the mafia (who are actually THINKING at this point in the game) will kill me to nullify that inspection.

Yep, seen it before. I'll see it again.

If I die, be aware of the following people:
Kadath
EYNH (but only if I die before I can claim)
Whoever throws the second-to-last vote on me.

They are the third and fourth to vote me and that's how bandwagons on innocents get started.

I think the mafia would've lynched EYNH by now if he weren't mafia as he has had votes for a while now. Interesting how they will all jump on me now and I will die. Then you will all start again, totally clueless about who mafia could be but in a much worse position than you were before.

If you want the town to win, don't lynch me. Just don't. Stop, find another target, inspect me tonight if you have to (and if you find me not-innocent, which you won't, then go ahead and accuse me), but don't lynch me.

That was all off the top of my head. If there is anything specific you'd like to ask me (besides my role), I'd be able to respond provided I'm not lynched before I can see it.

[HezLucky]

Scummy actions do not indicate scum. Look closer and you will find your scum.

He did seem defensive to me. I didn't like his reaction at the time and still don't. Remember, <someone has to start the bandwagon>. There is very little to go on during Day 1 ... how else do you expect to get someone lynched? All of these people defending EYNH seems awfully fishy to me ... though its possible that one of the mafia has voted him.

This seems to be why I often get lynched early. I start a lot of bandwagons. My reasoning is that the person's defense can tell us about their alignment and frankly, I didn't like EYNH's defense (it didn't seem citizen-like to me ... read between the lines and you might see why ... If I were to tell you why, I'd be accused of "crap logic" ... whatever that is.).

To nullify blackberry's argument on me: Notice that I have not switched my vote from EYNH at all since my first random vote. That's over 100 posts of people posting and me not switching my vote. Do you seriously think that I'm throwing a vote on EYNH RANDOMLY? I'm not. Take the hint.

Re-reading the thread quickly, I get:

Post 82: EYNH claims that he would vote for vikingfan ... earlier he accused me of bandwagoning and now he wants to do the same thing. I look through the thread and find others arguments on vikingfan to be pathetically weak. He doesn't mention me or his vote on me in this post, possibly to make sure that he doesn't get a reaction out of me.
Post 101: EYNH throws an FOS on DP for voting for him even though DP said it was nothing personal ... he seems to take a lot of things personally for someone who is "not mafia"... Blackberry found this a bit odd, I find this downright disgustingly obvious... I can't believe you aren't jumping on EYNH already.

Confirm FOS: kadath

I'm starting to grow more suspicious of kadath at the moment ... but I will keep my vote on EYNH. There is no point in switching it now.

Respond to me! I want to say more! I feel that I haven't done my argument any justice.

[HezLucky]

Yes but that argument would only be truthful if he weren't mafia.

[HezLucky]

Well, it looks like kadath is trying to get some information out of me to help his scum. Well, I'm only going to give you enough to help the town so too bad:

First of all, why isn't EYNH talking? It seems like he's lurking scum right now hoping that I'm going to say something so that he can twist my words around and say I'm scum. It's July 7, he hasn't said anything since July 2... C'mon now, who would you rather vote for? a lurker or someone like me who posts who you can get information out of later (regardless of my role)? I say get rid of him now. None of you can make sure that he isn't mafia and if you lynch me instead of him, he can just keep flying under the radar until the end of the game where his mafia squad will win. Kadath, you're my next vote just simply for the fact that you can't pick up on these clues (call it an OMGUS vote or whatever) ... I've FOSed you a couple of times already I think this calls for a default vote on Day 2.

[grumbles] I can't believe I have to do this on Day 1. Blame Blackberry and kadath if you must. [/grumbling]

(1) I re-read now and see that it was sa random vote. I did not believe this at the time. However, I've played a few more day ones and see others doing this as well so I cannot base my vote on that.

(2) I just answered 1.

(3) However, with that being said, I still don't like his response. The way I see it, if someone changes their vote within three minutes, they aren't paying much attention to the game. I interpret this as "I can vote for whomever I want because I'm scum so it doesn't matter who I vote for so long as I lynch a citizen..." ... careless voting can be citizen-like but I see it as scum-like.

I think he over-reacted slightly as well ... you claim that frustration = townie but remember that anybody with a computer can type any set of words conveying any emotion they like. A scum cuold've just as easily typed that. Perhaps had he typed paragraphs and paragraphs I could've believen the frustration = townie but to convey frustration in two lines takes little effort and anybody with any role could do that.

The only defense you all seem to provide against me is that "but this doesn't mean he's scum" ...

... I could just as easily provide the counterargument in that anything that I have done up to this point "indicates I'm not scum" for future games ... simply because I'm not.

Anything more I say I have said in previous posts. Please RE-READ my previous stuff.

and vote for EYNH... His lying low disgusts me and I don't see how you couldn't have figured it out by now. A citizen would defend himself, not lie low like scum in the face of two bandwagons (one of which is on him).

I won't talk more until I hear from EYNH. This is disgusting. Vote for him already.

[HezLucky]

Put it this way ... too many people are defending EYNH for my liking.

Your comment just sweetens the deal.

[HezLucky]

yeah lets prod the mafia

[HezLucky]

Before I say anything,

request vote count

.

[HezLucky]

EYNH can wait, what kadath did was absolutely ridiculous and therefore he is too dangerous to keep around, townie or not.

unvote, vote: kadath

That last point makes it seem like he doesn't have a strong role so I feel that I can safely put a fifth vote on him. He doesn't need to roleclaim, he's too dangerous in the first place to have around.

[HezLucky]

Ditto, we need prods.

[HezLucky]

I don't understand this ...

Why hasn't he been lynched yet?

This is ridiculous.

[HezLucky]

Ho ly crap!

I wonder if the way they were killed has anything to do with who killed them.

Maybe someone has a role like that?

This looks like lynch-or-lose to me.

[goes to the wiki to look up the role 'neighbourhood watch']
^ woot british spelling

[HezLucky]

And neighbourhood watch seems to be ...

an investigative type role.

Maybe someone has some information for us, hm?

[HezLucky]

Oh, darn, see... I forgot completely about the night one results. We caught a mafia, which is super good ... but our neighborhood watch is gone, which is bad.

So here's how I see it:
Roleblocker
Serial Killer
Vigilante
Doctor
Mafia
1 other role

If vikingfan is telling the truth about the roleblock, I think we have only two bad players left. (the way I see it, three mafia, a serial killer AND a traitor is way too one-sided against the town)

Else, we might have three.

I'd like to hear what vikingfan has to say.

In the meanwhile, I'll make notes on the remaining players:
vikingfan - claimed roleblocker
Blackberry -
Yanqush -
Phoebus -
HezLucky - I know my role, I know I'm innocent, I did not have a night action last night and that's all I'll reveal for now (I was not roleblocked).
Someone - he was roleblocked, and didn't have a role ... very interesting. But with the roles above, I can't really see what he could possibly be and get beaten up ... unless he was the mafia who didn't make a choice.

Any thoughts on the various players, everyone?

[HezLucky]

I know I was not roleblocked because I have not been beaten up and I do not have a night action.

[HezLucky]

I think vigilante should claim

[HezLucky]

Don't know if you have read what they say on day 1, but you don't go asking for a claim right off the bat...... that is just soo infomation mining (scummy)......

On the contrary, I think it does nothing but benefit the town if the vigilante claims.

There are 6 people. The following roles seem to be what we have:

Mafia
Serial Killer
Vigilante
Doctor
Vikingfan's role (assuming he's innocent)
My role

So if someone claims a role that's not one of the ones listed above, we automatically know either they or vikingfan is lying.

On the other hand, if someone claims vigilante, the mafia and serial killer will either have to make up a role to get vikingfan lynched (if he's innocent) or all claim doctor or vigilante on the spot.

Someone claiming vigilante would drastically reduce the number of potential roles out there.

FOS: vikingfan

- I thought about that scenario, Yanqush, especially when I saw someone was beaten up and that happened to ring a bell ...

FOS: Blackberry

- You seem too sure of whose "innocent" and "guilty" in your mind ... gives me an uneasy feeling.

No vote from me yet, though. I need to hear a lot more.

[HezLucky]

I'd just like to add one thing to vikingfan:

Your role is cleared.

You are not.

(Translation: I believe your role claim, but not necessarily your alignment. I can't trust that you are pro-town)

[HezLucky]

Erm .. vikingfan, was that FOS intended for me?

I know my role is not verifiable. I was more posting that so I could organize my own thoughts and so the town could see them.

Huge FOS: Phoebus

for the reasons discussed above.

Vikingfan, you're cleared ... I doubt an SK/Mafia has more than 1 night choice .. though you could be SK, I think it's better for me to start going after others who are more likely to be evil.

Looking at the lynch scene, I see only two people without night choices ... the probable doctor and whatever the hell I am. I trust vikingfan's role meaning Yanqush is cleared from yesterday as well ... among Someone, Blackberry and Phoebus, this simply means we have a mafia, a serial killer and a vigilante.

But Someone was blocked... so he's not the serial killer obviously and neither is he the mafia (unless Tigris made the kill or something) ...

Someone's not quite cleared, but I like him more htan the other two right now.

FOS: Blackberry and Phoebus

Not confirmed guilty (hah!) but guilty enough to vote for them...

but just incase Someone is a member of a mafia family who didn't make the kill, I have to hear these two so that I'm not randomly choosing between them and can choose the more evil of the two.

And yes, vikingfan, I am aware that almost all of the above assumes my innocence. But so far, my story checks out:
- I have no night choice
- I said that before you said I wasn't blocked.

Of course, there are other scenarios you probably have to consider (ie. what if I lied about the first?) but so be it, that's why you're just gonna hafta play the game. I wish I could confirm my role but nothing short of providing you with the password to my account so you could see for yourself would do that.
And, of course, that's not allowed now is it?


SUMMARY: Blackberry and Phoebus both appear guilty, vikingfan and Yanqush appear to be clear unless we have more than one mafia remaining, Someone is not serial killer, though he could be mafia. Blackberry and Phoebus look like they're in the worst shape at the moment.

Hit me with your analysis, guys!

[HezLucky]

That's exactly why I can't prove my innocence.

There's one thing that doesn't check out though.

Could you please repeat your roleclaim, vikingfan? (Yes, you)

When ,exactly, does someone get a post restriction?

[HezLucky]

k, You two first.

It's strategically better for me and the town if I claim last.

[HezLucky]

Huh?

You're both claiming vig?

[HezLucky]

Hey Phoebus, I'll ask this again.

Don't dodge the question this time.

Are you claiming vig?

[HezLucky]

You're assuming we have two scum left in making me claim.

I will not. We don't have two scum left.

We killed a scum and a traitor.

We have a scum and a serial killer.

2 scum, traitor and serial killer is enough badness for the game.

What we have left?
vikingfan's role
Doctor
Serial Killer
Vigilante
Mafia
Other <-- there's my claim, I'm not any of the above.

[HezLucky]

Thought just occured to me...

vikingfan
HezLucky
Someone - not vigilante
Yanqush - not vigilante
Phoebus - mafia OR vigilante
Blackberry - mafia OR vigilante

That may have nothing on you but it will after my analysis:

IF vikingfan is telling the truth: Someone or Yanqush is doc, by process of elimination, the other is serial killer. Yanqush was blocked and thus can't be serial killer ... it doesn't make sense. Therefore, Someone is our last evil.

HOWEVER, if Someone is our last evil, why would he choose not to kill on Day 1 as serial killer? The only explanation? Blackberry/Phoebus = serial killer and we have a mafia roleblocker on our hands.

FOS: vikingfan

Sorry, you aren't cleared. Thus, my claim is unsafe.

[HezLucky]

Good, we'll let it drop until tomorrow.

For now, I'm re-reading to see if I can pick up clues.

Maybe someone can come up with a strategy that makes it so that we aren't guessing...

[HezLucky]

Oh, and Someone's claim tomorrow will be VERY interesting as it will automatically clear someone.

[HezLucky]

Well then, I hope one of them's the SK and not Mafia then

Or else there's a big gap in your logic.

[HezLucky]

Can we infer anything from the fact that Phoebus didn't vote for Blackberry?

[HezLucky]

I'm afraid at this point I believe Phoebus more than I do Blackberry.

Blackberry kept hinting at who she thought was vig and never really "hinted" at herself.

That makes me think the roleclaim was out of the blue.

But I am not confident in this logic so I will not vote.

I want to hear from the four non-"vig" people

[HezLucky]

This would be a lot easier if the mafia or serial killer could counterclaim to prove that Blackberry wasn't the one that killed LML... :p:p:d

j/k j/k

Phoebus, who'd ya kill?

[HezLucky]

Actually I think your kill method makes you seem like the innocent one.

Stabbed sounds like a serial killer.
Beaten up sounds like mafia.
I don't think the mafia would strangle anyone with a pillow ...
though the serial killer could ...

then again we could have a deranged mod ...

BUT ...

Berry could be tellign the truth about killing LML but could be mafia using a twisted method ... and LML could be a bully vig like viking...

hmm...

aah...

confusing. help me out.

[HezLucky]

Then why would he get a post restriction?

Does vikingfan's post restriction work no matter what?

[HezLucky]

I only believe Yanqush at this point.

Blackberry/Phoebus - one is scum, one is not
vikingfan/Someone - one is scum, one is not
Yanqush - cleared by everyone
HezLucky - innocent, I know ... I can't prove it to you in any way though as I don't really have a night action ... Leave this for tomorrow though.

I am not voting until I feel comfortable with a vote on a person ... something which is not the case. I don't want a lynch, I want as much info as possible.

So if you get a quick lynch it's going to be because of Someone and not me.

[HezLucky]

Basically, here's how I see the game:

MAFIA, SERIAL KILLER, VIGILANTE, DOCTOR, TWO OTHER ROLES

Scenario 1:
Mafia/Serial Killer/Vigilante (in some order): Blackberry/Phoebus/Someone
Doctor/One Alternate Role: Yanqush/Hez
Roleblocker/Other Alternate Role: viking

Scenario 2:
Mafia/Serial Killer/Vigilante (in some order): Blackberry/Phoebus/Viking
Doctor/Alternate Roles: Yanqush/Hez/Someone

Yes, you could probably come up with a scenario that puts me up top somewhere but I'm writing this to help myself and considering myself up top when I know I'm not simply doesn't help me in figuring out what's going on.

So yeah, Yanqush is fine. He's either doctor or another role, depending on what you believe I am. Viking's role will be interesting too ... whether he's pro-town or not.

[HezLucky]

Oh, and with 6 alive ...

If we lynch correctly here, I suggest the vigilante kill no one and we have a no lynch next time around.

[HezLucky]

Crude plan?

Is it worth telling at this point?

[HezLucky]

I can't outline the Blackberry over Phoebus for scum logic because I do not have an opinion on that.

But Yanqush is cleared because:
there were 3 kills last night
vikingfan blocked yanqush
hence, yanqush didn't make one of these kills
therefore, yanqush has a non-killing role

This is all negated if the SK cannot be blocked but LET'S USE OCKHAM'S RAZOR WHY DON'T WE.

[HezLucky]

...unless he part of a two-person scum group...

But yeah, for all intents and purposes we can assume he's town. However, we lynch scum tonight, and there are still two kills, we can't discount the fact that yanqush is not completely cleared.

And that's why the vig shouldn't touch his gun tonight.

[HezLucky]

Kickbutt!

..unless you are the scum.

But if you aren't, kickbutt!

[HezLucky]

6 alive now
5 alive by night with 2 killers
4 alive tomorrow with 2 killers
3 alive by night with 1 killer
2 alive and we lose

damn

trying to no lynch:
6 alive now:
viking blocks one of them and sees how many kills there are, 1-2 kills this night
and we are left with 3-4 alive by night with 1 killer ... the 4 is interesting.

Either way, it depends on us lynching or viking blocking...

So we have to lynch correctly here.

Alternative: Vote no lynch and have the vigilantes kill each other.

Let's let the scum who claimed vigilante be known as "scumvig"
Let the scum who didn't claim vigilante be known as "scum"

Assume "scumvig" doesn't plya along and kills someone other than the vig.
Worst case we are left with: vig, scum and two others (choosing from some combination of doctor,lucky and viking)
Best case he kills the scum and we win:

Assume the "scumvig" does play along and kills the vig...
Assuming scum kills someone different, we enter endgame with three people; one of which is mafia.

Does anyone see any problems with the bolded strategy above?

[HezLucky]

You're wrong.

We have 4 left the next day.

Look again.

[HezLucky]

I like my no lynch plan better viking.

Your plan relies on us picking the right one.

50-50 shot.

I also don't like Blackberry's plan

because that assumes vikingfan isn't an evil roleblocker.

[HezLucky]

Alright. I'll

Vote: No Lynch

as well since it was my idea...

TO BLACKBERRY: If you are vigilante, kill Phoebus tonight.
TO PHOEBUS: If you are vigilante, kill Blackberry tonight.

[HezLucky]

I'm lost.

Vikingfan, any information on your side?

I'll roleclaim in a second.

[HezLucky]

OH!

I didn't catch that.

It's Phoebus that's alive.

And he's our vig
Well... that makes my decision really easy. I won't say anything yet though... I wanna see if Phoebus wants to say anything first.

[HezLucky]

We might be able to because of my role.

But that requires trust.

And if you trust me, you're better off lynching Someone anyway.

I don't want to claim my role before Someone because if he claims the same role as me it is pretty much a tossup.

[HezLucky]

We might be able to because of my role.

But that requires trust.

And if you trust me, you're better off lynching Someone anyway.

I don't want to claim my role before Someone because if he claims the same role as me it is pretty much a tossup.

[HezLucky]

I'm not weaseling out of a claim Someone.

I will claim immediately after you do.

I simply can't afford to have you say "oh that's my role" after I claim.

[HezLucky]

If you refuse to claim without going second, I'm going to prove you are the SK without claiming... then I'll claim later if Phoebus requests it ... but I claim second, not first:

Exhibit A:

Night 1 Deaths:
Tigris - Mafia goon (Fell from a great height, night 1)
Nightfall - neighbourhood watch (shot dead night 1)

Exhibit B:

Someone now has a posting restriction that means his posts can only be 25 words long.

Exhibit C:

Iin mafia terms, I'm a protown roleblocker. I can beat one person up at night and block them (if they have an ability).

We can generally take Exhibit C to be true... except for the pro-town part.

Combining Exhibits B and C means that vikingfan blocked Someone Night 1.
The Mafia clearly killed Night 1. It was either the vig or SK that did not. The mafia would not kill one of their own, therefore they killed Nightfall.

So either the vig or SK killed Tigris. And for that, I present to you Exhibits D and E from our vig himself:

Exhibit D:

IS isn't playing. No other vig ('cept ZONEACE with IS playing) would kill night one.

This one I find ironic. And Exhibit E just takes the cake:

Exhibit E:

It's a bit too vehement for my liking.If you ask me, Yanq - it's very possible, as well as probable that someone targetted Tigris with a purpose. She is quite solid and can very well be a thorn in someone's side. To disregard this aspect completely is strange.

And I know you like reading, so here is Exhibit F just for fun:

I just said that it's probable and possible that Tigris may have been (may, not has been) killed with good reason.

Combining the last three exhibits with the first three, we arrive at:
Phoebus killed Tigris Night One (and did an excellent job of hiding clues)
Either the SK or Vig did not kill.
The Vig did kill, therefore the SK did not.
Someone was blocked, therefore Someone is the SK.
Q.E.D.

We arrive at three possible scenarios, ordered from most likely to least likely (the last one is not true at all)

MOST LIKELY: Phoebus killed night one, Someone did not because he was blocked, hence two kills.
IN THE MIDDLE: Phoebus did not kill Night One and Someone is an unblockable SK.
LEAST LIKELY: Phoebus did not kill Night One and I did the killing.

Here's an exercise for ya Phoebus, go look for my claim. It's not in the blue but you might be able to find it before Someone does.

And Someone, now YOU are on the hot seat. You claim first.

[HezLucky]

With Yanqush dead, I am your back-up doctor. (which essentially makes me your new doc)

I could not claim earlier (ie. when viking asked) because it would make my role utterly USELESS.

I could not claim before Someone because if he claimed back-up doc then you would be stuck.

As it stands right now, if you want to try some funky scenario that involves the use of my doc powers, go ahead ... but as I said previously, I can't think of any scenario that works unless you trust me ... and if you trust me, you're better off lynching Someone anyway.

Read my entire post Phoebus and tell me exactly who made the kill on Tigris Night one. It might help with this "material" you're requesting.

I'm off to the wiki to check what neighborhood watch is again.

[HezLucky]

The fifth word in Paragraph 5 should read Phoebus, not Someone.

[HezLucky]

I can.

2 things for Phoebus to keep in mind:
- Neighborhood Watch is, by definition, 2 people.
- If you made the kill on Tigris night one, then there is absolutely no question that Someone is the serial killer.
- If you didn't, you'll have to take my word that he's unblockable.

[HezLucky]

Why do I have to be unblockable?

I was never blocked anyway...

[HezLucky]

Thank you for clarifying my (your) role.

I don't see how any progress can be made to this game until Phoebus starts askin us some questions though.

[HezLucky]

So you are denying killing Tigris night one?

In that case, viking's roleblocking has some effect I am unaware of ... such as that of an unblockable SK (Someone).

Let me find your questions:

I did not ask you whether you killed Tigris because you-might-be-a-night-one-killing-vig but rather because you have hinted many times that you were the one to kill Tigris. Did you read my previous post? If you did kill Tigris, then you can stop the analysis now and vote Someone. If you didn't, then you definitely have some sleuthing to do.

Not blocked but got a posting restriction? Yeah, that makes sense... seeing as Yanqush got a posting restriction but we don't have any idea who his target was. For all we know, maybe he wasn't blocked and just got the posting restriction instead. That might make some sense... On the other hand, maybe Someone was given the posting restriction as a game-balancing act from the mod in order to make sure that viking didn't find out that he was the SK.

I can't claim doctor ... Yanqush is the doctor. I'm his backup aka. the new, current doctor.

[HezLucky]

Yeah, making them up and checking the entire game to make sure there are no inconsistencies is too much work for our serial killer here.

[HezLucky]

See Exhibit E and to a lesser extent Exhibit F in my Post 323.

[HezLucky]

What... does that mean?

[HezLucky]

I'm finding a flaw:

The chance of success for neighborhood watch decreases as the watch starts to die.

You lost a watch on Night 1 and another on Night 2.

I find it hard to believe that all of your watches were successful based on that.

[HezLucky]

I also find it weird that you would choose Blackberry ... especially since they were both dying anyway.

It would've been better if you had chosen vikingfan or myself, no?

[HezLucky]

Even after Blackberry admitted he was evil? Frankly, I woulda cleared Phoebus as vigilante at that point. No true vig would admit he's evil.

I wonder how Phoebus is doing with his rereading ...

Just like to point out that I proposed the no lynch and that the game would be lost without that. So whether I'm scum or not you might wanna thank me once its done .

Of course, I'd like to thank both Someone and Phoebus for each killing a mafia last night. If Someone wasn't such a psychopath (in game terms), we could all live amongst each other.

Oh well, it's 2 to lynch.

[HezLucky]

This is a regular mini.

Back-up doc is a regular role.
A third night watch is not.
Do I have to spell that out for you?

I'm assuming you didn't kill Tigris, because if you did then you have got to be one of the worst mafia players I've ever seen.
If you'd like to try some sort of scenario at night I'm also open to that.

It is possible for scum to win. You shoot me and Someone knifes you and I feel like such a jerk that I don't protect you... but that won't happen.
The scenario would be you shoot me, I save you, someone does whatever the hell he wants it doesn't really matter and we're left with a vigilante and a serial killer; draw.

On the other hand, assume I'm evil. What the hell do you have to lose by shooting me? The same you have to lose by lynching me ... that is, it will be a draw between yourself and a serial killer.

The only way you can win is by lynching Someone. If you lynch me, it will be a draw unless the SK is unnightkillable.

If that is the case, I truly hope that you lynch Someone.

And that's the best I can come up with at the moment seeing as you seem convinced that my late claim is a scum tell.

Why do you think I was so upfront and pretty much revealed Yanqush as the doc? Cuz I didn't give a damn if he died because scenarios could exist wherein I could shock the town by saving and then revealing mafia for all... that would've given us the immediate win.

Also, I thought we already had the immediate win. But apparently you didn't kill Tigris, so Someone is unblockable.

If he's unblockable, maybe he's unnightkillable as well. Heck, maybe he wins in tiebreakers too.

I can't think of anything at all to prove my innocence at the moment. Can you? Because if you can, we might have this one in the bag.

[HezLucky]

I think it makes perfect sense.
I refused to claim because if I did, my role would be absolutely useless.

Why is this so hard to believe?

Of course I'm not going to consider the possibility of a backup doc, why on earth would I do that? That would just be giving my role away early. I refused to claim and not considering the possibility that my role exists is consistent with that.

If you don't believe I'm the backup doc, you can test it out at night and confirm me. You simply can't do that with Someone's role.

Your argument about looking back at the game is bogus: heck, I coulda claimed neighborhood watch and it woulda checked out. Look at my interactions with DP. He was voting EYNH along with me. Never once did he vote for me.

If I coulda done what you're doing, then your argument holds no water. I mean, I could make up random facts that don't actually support my position easily. Here, I'll do it right now:
- Notice that NOBODY on my bandwagon at the beginning of the game was a good guy... this includes Someone. We have some mafia members and a traitor, as well as our SK here ... and EYNH, who I don't blame because I was voting for him.

So heck, it would make more sense for me to be a neighborhood watch then it would for you. If I can argue that successfully, then your argument holds no water.*

*Not claiming to be a neighborhood watch. Duh. I'm a back-up doc. Sorry, THE back-up doc.

And I'd like you to specifically find an inconsistency. There aren't any. This whole time, I admitted that I had no night choice. I did that BEFORE VIKINGFAN REVEALED WHO HE BLOCKED. [then he confirmed that he didn't block me] Why would I take a gambit like that when its unnecessary?

So much for your theory that I made it up on the spot.

Post 191 is ironic as well. Check that out. Someone had information and didn't reveal anything at all that could've helped us. This is a moot point at the moment. There's not much he could've said. But he hints at nothing.

I'll type more after a response.

[HezLucky]

There is no plan that can confirm me without Phoebus trusting me. [unless Phoebus can come up with something]

Glad to see you've missed some of my posts. Trust me, I would've never guessed in a million years that you would've claimed a THIRD neighborhood watch. Especially considering I've never played with the role before so I trust what the wiki says.

As for the whole neighborhood watch business that you didn't understand, I'm just saying... say hypothetically that I claimed first and claimed neighborhood watch. All my actions would check out (except for the "no night choice" dealie) ... meaning you can't really say that your actions check out because if I can claim the exact same thing, then you really have no argument.

A simpler equivalent were if you were to vote for me on some sort of logic and I could turn that logic around and use it on you. That would nullify your logic. The same goes for the whole "neighborhood watch - my actions make sense" dealie. Had I claimed it [which I wouldn't have, but still, think hypothetically], I probably could've passed it off as a reasonable claim too.

My roleclaim was planned to be drawn out as long as possible from the moment I got my role pending some sort of scenario where I was one from a lynch. Right now, I'm one from a lynch so my role claim cannot be delayed any longer. I would not have changed anything had I claimed two days ago or now. There is no flaw in my logic. There is no gaping hole in anything I say. Anything you use against me is a result of twisting my words around or a misunderstanding. I have not done anything inconsistent. The only reason I could possibly be voted on now is because Phoebus finds my late claim suspicious. I can't do anything about that. If you win this game, it's because you have out-argued me (as mafia games tend to be won). But if I can find a scenario that ensures that you cannot win, then I will go for it.

And I have hinted at my role's powers before today (ie. no night choice). You, Someone, have not. Who is making it up on the spot? Not I.

More coming after someone else posts.

[HezLucky]

I'd have no problem with you lynching both of us. Can we vote aye on that?

[HezLucky]

Vote: Lynch Both Someone and HezLucky simultaneously

or if that's not allowed...

Vote: Someone

[HezLucky]

Heh ... I actually AM back-up doc, not townie.

I have no idea how Phoebus made the right call there. If I were in his shoes I probably woulda screwed that up.

Good job man!

Good game all!