Newbie 1079: Feed the Lynch Mob (Game Over)

[Equinox]

Vote Count 3.01

tarsonisocelot (1) - pandabear

Not Voting (4) - GreyICE, tarsonisocelot, Traveller, Voidedmafia

With 5 alive, it's 3 to lynch.

The deadline is Monday, May 23, 2011, at 11:59 PM EDT (UTC-4).

[Voidedmafia]

I stopped thinking thil13 was lurking scum and considered them as possible bored town when they replaced out. I was nervous about lynching Nacho just after they claimed Cop with a verdict I knew to be correct (though I suppose mafia would always know which players are town aligned in this set-up). Then Nacho got lynched and was scum. Will look and see who would make a good buddy for them in a bit.

So, how did you know it was correct again? I do need to finish up my re-read that got cut short cuz of the Nacho lynch, but explain that for me, please?

[tarsonisocelot]

I stopped thinking thil13 was lurking scum and considered them as possible bored town when they replaced out. I was nervous about lynching Nacho just after they claimed Cop with a verdict I knew to be correct (though I suppose mafia would always know which players are town aligned in this set-up). Then Nacho got lynched and was scum. Will look and see who would make a good buddy for them in a bit.

So, how did you know it was correct again? I do need to finish up my re-read that got cut short cuz of the Nacho lynch, but explain that for me, please?

...Nacho claimed to have an innocent on me. If I didn't know my own alignment I'd be in trouble.

[GreyICE]

Would Nacho have the sheer balls to claim Cop and clear his scumbuddy with the perfect knowledge that if she ever screwed up badly enough that him and Tarsonis would go down together?

I mean he would absolutely, 100% stake his win on Tarsonis being good enough that no one ever went 'wait if Tarsonis is scum then nacho is scum because...'

[tarsonisocelot]

Would Nacho have the sheer balls to claim Cop and clear his scumbuddy with the perfect knowledge that if she ever screwed up badly enough that him and Tarsonis would go down together?

I mean he would absolutely, 100% stake his win on Tarsonis being good enough that no one ever went 'wait if Tarsonis is scum then nacho is scum because...'

The first half of that post is a question, the second half not so much. I'm not quite sure what you are asking/saying. Could you clarify please?

WRT Nacho
My guess is that I was picked for the fakeclaim because I was town that wasn't on his wagon yet and therefore was more likely to give him the benefit of the doubt.

[GreyICE]

The second half is basically because the gambit is INSANELY risky. ReaperCharlie has pulled it, to my knowledge, but it's few and far between.

Basically, if someone finds you scummy enough to lynch, it immediately becomes 'lynch nacho.' With nacho already under fire, that risks him getting 1-2ed for an auto-loss.

I'd really like to hear more from VoidedMafia. If you're not scum, someone is bussing, and Thil was a MESS yesterday. I can't entirely give someone a pass for their predecessor's play. Voided is a much better player than Thil, but they got the same role PM.

[pandabear]

Right, thil13 was very difficult to read prior to Voided, but I still think he's town

@grey: but regarding what Nacho did with tars, I still think it's WIFOM because you know about it and thus he may have expected you to dismiss the possibility that tars was actually Nacho's partner...
@tars: I don't think Traveller necessarily meant vote tallies, just that you never gave Nacho a vote during bandwagons or after convincing arguments by others. RVS vote doesn't really count

[Voidedmafia]

Grey: Anything in particular you wish me to chip in on?

I wasn't exactly feeling up to it yesterday, what with celebrating my birthday and all. But I'm better able to focus today.

Happy birthday! (Equinox)

[GreyICE]

Grey: Anything in particular you wish me to chip in on?

I wasn't exactly feeling up to it yesterday, what with celebrating my birthday and all. But I'm better able to focus today.

Nacho's lynch, scum suspects, who looks good and bad from yesterday's wagon.

Honestly I don't get Thil = town. Town replacing out because they don't like the pressure, or scum replacing out because they don't like the pressure? I dunno. The slot is a total and utter mess, and not having much to contribute today isn't helping.

Also this is a lot of PoE here. Tarsonis seems like an unlikely nacho partner.

Panda still has a town read, even if I wasn't fond of the behavior on the wagon yesterday. Newbies are newbies.

Traveller has been a town read all game, and I'm not going to vote for him outside of LyLo.

That leaves Thil/you.

So yeah, I'd kind of like some reads on the rest of the players.

[Voidedmafia]

Grey: Anything in particular you wish me to chip in on?

I wasn't exactly feeling up to it yesterday, what with celebrating my birthday and all. But I'm better able to focus today.

Nacho's lynch, scum suspects, who looks good and bad from yesterday's wagon.

#219: First Nacho vote from D2 from Traveller, based on reasonings given from D1. I'm only looking at D2 reasons right now, and will look over his D1 reasons later, so this is null at the moment.

#248: Second Nacho vote from D2 from Hero. Seems that the main reason he voted from this post is because Nacho didn't question those who voted after him on Snipe. More of his reasonings come after this post, mainly with the Nacho/Hero back and forth

Also, I would like to note that between D2's start and Hero's vote, Tars pretty much focused all on Thil, including a vote to pressure him. Nacho did inform Tars about pressure voting, and while Nacho DID turn out to be scum, he's also the IC and may have said that from an IC vantage point, though we can't really confirm that. I'll also note that Tar's request for people to vote Snipe D1 off of Nacho could be seen as Nacho's buddy trying to take votes off of Nacho himself. She says she wasn't intentionally mislynching, and I can see that she would want to get a lynch that day, but still.

#312: Third vote on Nacho by you, Icey-boy. Presumably because of Hero's case and from something that Tars said that I'm not entirely sure about. That, or you just quoted Tars for some reason that I don't know.

So far into D2, with three votes on Nacho:
Tars looks scummy.
Hero and Nacho look null (unlike what was pulled on KoH and such in D1, I don't consider Hero's and Nacho's back and forth to have given anything big yet. THere is that misrep about Hero's Snipe WIFOM, but I'm not quite sure how big that is, so both of them are null)
You're town bordering on null for not giving clear reasoning behind your Nacho vote. I'm not saying it's good or bad, just that it's not easy to see why you voted.
Traveller is town
Thil is null and newbtown, srsly.
Panda's town/null.

#317: Your unvote, Grey. Understandable that you'd be worried about town vs. town argumentation, since I would agree that I don't see anything yet that clearly pointed to either of them being scum.

#333: Thil's vote, which has absolutely nothing behind it. really, absolutely nothing. If I replaced in at this point (not for Thil) and saw that after reading his previous posts, I would've voted him right there.

#348: From Panda, and well...you said it best right after, Grey:

What the FUCK was that vote?

If I had been able to reach this point in my original re-read, this WOULD have gotten a true vote from me, not just me saying I would've voted him but couldn't cuz it was from way before I was in the game like with KoH.

But...then you Revote right back in #351, mainly because you're angry about the lack of participation from Nacho. And seriously, at this point, he's been away for pretty much no explained reasons. I still wouldn't furiously vote him for lurking as a general rule, but I can see where you're coming from.

Then, at this point, hi, I'm VM, hello all!

#385: Nacho's claim and innocent on Tars. I wouldn't have believed the claim anyways, and said as much, and with Nacho flipping scum and there apparantly being no cop, I'm even less likely to believe it.

#403: Hero revotes, dissatisfied apparantly with how easily we accepted the claim (not that we didn't believe it, of course, but you still have to treat it with caution). He also outlines the pluses of Nacho's claims if he's scum (which Nacho turned out to be).

#406: Glass votes, very much agreeing with Hero, and then Panda hammers (Also, keep in mind that everything post-Nacho's claim happened while I wasn't on. Just wanting to point that out).

So, overall:
Hero obviously came out the better man, pushing Nachoscum to his lynch. I suppose him being the NK is a revenge thing, or something.
Skimmed over Glass's posts, but what she did as Traveller's fill-in looked town, and supports your own townread on Traveller, Grey.
Panda came out looking scummier than he went in, with the out-of-nowhere vote. He's getting some towncred back with a good push on Tars D3, but that killed his town/null-read.
You're frustrated town. Heavily frustrated, by the look of things. Also very wary of town/town, but I'd bet that was shaken from Nacho flipping scum (after all, you held Nacho to be town pretty much all of D2 until his activity waned). Does this mean you COULD be scum? Certainly, but I'm not sure that's true.
And then, Tars. Both Panda and Traveller bring up good points against her, and while I could see Thil being bored town, I'm not so sure about how replacing is pro-town. Most of what she did D2 just does not look town at all.

Vote: Tarsonis

Honestly I don't get Thil = town. Town replacing out because they don't like the pressure, or scum replacing out because they don't like the pressure? I dunno. The slot is a total and utter mess, and not having much to contribute today isn't helping.

Is that last line directed at me or Thil?

In regards to the slot itself, I wholly understand how you feel. Thil was anti-town bordering on scum throughout his play. But I hope I've been making it better.

Also this is a lot of PoE here. Tarsonis seems like an unlikely nacho partner.

Despite his anti-town play, Thil doesn't, either. Like I said, I agree on the fact that Thil was heavily anti-town, but it's not anti-town that translate to scumminess like with Tars

So yeah, I'd kind of like some reads on the rest of the players.

Given above.

[Equinox]

Vote Count 3.02

tarsonisocelot (2) - pandabear, Voidedmafia

Not Voting (3) - GreyICE, tarsonisocelot, Traveller

With 5 alive, it's 3 to lynch.

The deadline is Monday, May 23, 2011, at 11:59 PM EDT (UTC-4).[/area]

[Traveller]

OK, the newbie is taking the hammer and calling for a quicklynch. If TO is scum, as I suspect she is, we're done. If not, we used our last free lynch and I have a good idea who the scum is.

Vote: tarsonisoscelot

[Voidedmafia]

You think it's me?

[GreyICE]

Meh well
Okay
I'd have liked a hell of a lot more discussion
But... water under the bridge
Not like I didn't think she was scummy

Traveller - for future reference if this doesn't work out: longer days usually benefit the town (hell even if it does work out it just means you got lucky not that it's a good idea).

[Equinox]

Vote Count 3.03

tarsonisocelot (3) - pandabear, Voidedmafia, Traveller

Not Voting (2) - GreyICE, tarsonisocelot

With 5 alive, it's 3 to lynch.

The deadline is Monday, May 23, 2011, at 11:59 PM EDT (UTC-4).[/area]

[Equinox]

Every morning at the crack of dawn, tarsonisocelot made her jog along the stream. She believed in an active, healthy lifestyle, and nothing could keep her away from her daily exercise. One could go so far as to say that not even a murder could stop her, but there was no way of knowing... was there? At any rate, tarsonisocelot began this day like any other. When she stepped out of her house, she felt nothing strange. There was none of the dread she'd felt yesterday, moments before they'd found the first victim. Perhaps there would be no deaths this time, not after the town had killed one of the threats that had kept them living in fear for so long.

Feeling good, tarsonisocelot started to run. Earbuds in her ears, she scarcely heard the barking of the dogs or the shouting of her neighbors. She didn't notice that something was wrong until she reached the waterfall toward the end of her jogging course. There, she found a small group of her neighbors, all of whom stood around what appeared to be a pale and bloody Herodotus. tarsonisocelot's arrival interrupted their silent vigil. They glanced up and, together, had a good look at him.

Their movements were strangely synchronized. All it had taken was one sentence:

"It was her!"

They were known as the lynch mob, yet it seemed that they did more vanilla killing than lynching. This was particularly true today, when they decided to throw tarsonisocelot into the river to die just as Herodotus had, except tarsonisocelot did not have the swift mercy of a bullet. Eventually, the splashing in the water stopped... and then nothing.

tarsonisocelot,

townie

, was lynched on Day 3!

Night 3 begins now. The deadline is Friday, May 6, 2011, at 9:30 PM EDT (UTC-4).

[Equinox]

"If tarsonisocelot is not the one, then I have a good idea of who it might be."

The words haunted Traveller's dreams.

He had spoken them with such confidence that morning, yet he was at a loss for words when they fished tarsonisocelot from the water. It was easy to claim to know who was the scumbag among them, but it was much harder when faced with the consequences of being wrong. After realizing that tarsonisocelot was innocent, none of the townspeople there wanted to continue accusing; instead, they ended the day early and retired to their respective homes to reflect upon what they had done. Traveller had spent his afternoon deep in thought, and he went to bed when he felt he couldn't think anymore.

His conscience would not leave him alone. Sn1pe29 and tarsonisocelot went in and out of his dreams as they wished, as did Traveller himself, repeating those same cursed words. The faces of GreyICE, pandabear, and Voidedmafia also came unbidden, each appealing to him to make the right decision, yet not even in his dreams did Traveller know if he was certain enough to make that call...

Fortunately, Traveller's troubles were interrupted by a noise. He jolted awake. Despite feeling more relief than shock, Traveller couldn't help but feel that there was something wrong. He grabbed a flashlight and stepped out of his bedroom to investigate. As he made his way through the hallway, the noises continued; he determined that they were coming from the kitchen. Traveller stopped when he reached the door to his living room. There was no telling who was breaking into his house at this dead hour.

Indeed, there would be no telling. The door opened, and before Traveller was a very familiar face that was now twisted in a cruel smirk. In this person's hand was a gun aimed at Traveller's face.

Traveller,

townie

, was killed on Night 3!

Day 4 begins now.

Vote Count 4.00

Not Voting (3) - GreyICE, pandabear, Voidedmafia

With 3 alive, it's 2 to lynch.

The deadline is Friday, May 27, 2011, at 11:59 PM EDT (UTC-4).

[GreyICE]

So I'm the closest thing we have to an IC so I'll field this one. This is called LyLo - Lynch {Correctly} or Lose.

We have one scum and two town left. If you're town, and you vote for town, scum will hammer the townie for the win.

SO DO NOT LIGHTLY TOSS DOWN YOUR VOTE.

If you're not sure you're voting for scum, you should not be voting. Period.

If someone votes for you, and the other player posts and does not hammer you, the person posting without hammering is confirmed town. So don't vote for them dammit. The only possibility is (if you're town) that scum is voting for you as soon as the vote stays there long enough for the 3rd player to hammer you.

Will have more to say later, but for now? NO DAMN VOTES.

This article should be helpful:
http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Lylo

[pandabear]

K. I understand.

my question is, WHY DID YOU NOT DIE, ICE?

you are indeed the closest thing to an IC among us and very experienced, so scum should have killed you. But seeing you alive and TRAVELLER (least likely person I thought would be NKed) dead is really confusing right now.

As for Thil/Void, Thil WAS indeed scummy as you mentioned last day. However, my point stands with him that him saying replacement and voting Nacho knowingly as his mafia partner would be too much of a gamethrowing/jerk move even for a bored, frustrated player. I had a town read on Thil since then, and Void has continued to give me a town read.

so my FOS is on ICE (i won't vote yet)

[GreyICE]

It's a good question. Usually when "very good, townie" players are alive in LyLo it's worth taking a good long look at how town they were.

My best guess is either:

OK, the newbie is taking the hammer and calling for a quicklynch. If TO is scum, as I suspect she is, we're done. If not, we used our last free lynch and

I have a good idea who the scum is.

Vote: tarsonisoscelot

Which voided thought meant him, and the idea that someone wants to use the argument 'you're too good to be alive' against me (which is... kinda hard to respond to tbh. Sorry I didn't make the scum NK me?).

Or the argument "you're too good to be alive." Possibly my reads have been horribly off.

[Voidedmafia]

It's a good question. Usually when "very good, townie" players are alive in LyLo it's worth taking a good long look at how town they were.

Re-readin' time -_-

My best guess is either:

OK, the newbie is taking the hammer and calling for a quicklynch. If TO is scum, as I suspect she is, we're done. If not, we used our last free lynch and

I have a good idea who the scum is.

Vote: tarsonisoscelot

Which voided thought meant him,

Well, I was going off the assumption that you both would've harped on me from the L-1 vote (which is what it looked like Traveller was going to do near the end before Panda hammered). Though, I'm not sure if he's calling me a new or calling Panda a newb.

and the idea that someone wants to use the argument 'you're too good to be alive' against me (which is... kinda hard to respond to tbh. Sorry I didn't make the scum NK me?).

Sounds like WIFOM to me.

Or the argument "you're too good to be alive." Possibly my reads have been horribly off.

Well, it seems the only main scumread you've had is on me/Thil, is it not? You contested me when I called Panda scummy for certain actions around the Nacho lynch.

Though, I WOULD like to point out how the part about "the person not hammering is confirmed town" is WIFOM because scum can just not hammer right away. 'Course, that goes against their wincon that would be completed if they did lynch right away. You may not really see it, and it IS really counterproductive unless you've got some zany plan to pull out, but I figured it's a small tidbit worth pointing out.

my question is, WHY DID YOU NOT DIE, ICE?

WIFOM ahoy. Not from you, but the NK action.

you are indeed the closest thing to an IC among us and very experienced, so scum should have killed you. But seeing you alive and TRAVELLER (least likely person I thought would be NKed) dead is really confusing right now.

Now, if that would be confusing, then a.) The scum is VERY confident about getting Grey voted or to vote with him, or b.) Grey wasn't killed because HE is the last scum.

As for Thil/Void, Thil WAS indeed scummy as you mentioned last day. However, my point stands with him that him saying replacement and voting Nacho knowingly as his mafia partner would be too much of a gamethrowing/jerk move even for a bored, frustrated player. I had a town read on Thil since then, and Void has continued to give me a town read.

I can see where some of that scumread came from, what with completely ignoring the fact that Hero/Nacho (or someone else, can't remember who exactly he was referring to) had a case and saying they didn't. However, I think that most of his play has just been anti-town, and as a whole does NOT translate to scummy.

WHERE ARE THE AWESOME FLAVORS, EQUINOX?! DON'T SHUNT US AND NOT GIVE US FLAVOR WORTHY OF NEWB 1060!!

O_O (Equinox)

[pandabear]

okay, I reread, and have changed my mind. My FOS is now on Voidedmafia. GreyICE just seemed way more town during the Nacho lynch and every post I've reread with him just said "pro-town." (I would quote the important ones but maybe later since it's late). I liked how he L-2 voted Nacho and I also liked how he opened up the next day asking for cop. That was a very pro-town move and one that would have probably resulted in town win if cop was there (because doc would have been there also). Now, he may also be WIFOM-ing us by being overly pro-town the whole game, but I doubt it, since if he was scum, he wouldn't have pushed Nacho's lynch so hard. I know there's bussing, but that bus could have been easily avoided and flipped to Hero instead of Nacho. However, Grey led the charge, but thil, on the other hand, was pretty passive the whole game.

Voidedmafia gives off a scum vibe because he did not vote back after Nacho claimed cop. Did you really think he was cop?

I mean honestly, it's 50/50 but I think it's leaning more towards Void now.

Won't vote yet, I want to hear from you guys again.

[Voidedmafia]

Voidedmafia gives off a scum vibe because he did not vote back after Nacho claimed cop. Did you really think he was cop?

May I remind you that, at the time, I was:

a.) Giving a page-by-page reread of the game, and therefore wasn't excactly looking at the recent events, and
b.) As I had pointed out, I was ASLEEP and AT SCHOOL when everyone piled their votes back on Nacho. I mean, I said so right at the end of where I noted your hammervote:

(Also, keep in mind that everything post-Nacho's claim happened while I wasn't on. Just wanting to point that out).

I mean, sure, you could give me scumpoints for that, but why give me points against for something I could not have possibly foreseen, and was completely unable to participate in?

[pandabear]

K Voided, thats true.

Well could you both answer this question: if you were scum, why would you kill Traveller?

Also, can you guys put a fos on someone?

[Voidedmafia]

Well could you both answer this question: if you were scum, why would you kill Traveller?

Hmm.

As you know, both Grey and I had pretty solid townreads on Traveller, so it would make sense to get rid of the last "true" townie ("true" in the sense that he is essentially the last townie that we knew to be town without a flip; all three of us here aren't in that boat). It muddies the water because then there's no clear-cut choice for the lynch--or at the very least, there's one person that the other two KNOW won't be lynched in LyLo.