Mini 1346: Flavorless Mafia - GAME OVER

[farside22]

meh I read the long post by Tammy and caught this:

Oh wait...Jun is voting Farside, why isn't Far voting Jun? Their interaction feels off and fabricated.

I believed FC scum more then Jun, there is a wagon on FC and no one agreed with me or listened. Why start a vote on someone that goes nowhere. It's useless. And yes if you fucking read the game OMGUS is a scum and town tell. I gave points in which scum use OMGUS as well.

God I hate repeating myself.

I really don't understand most of the post from Tammy, how do you go from seeing one post that Slaxx post and declare him town? Really one post = town?
Is that normal for you?

Serious Question - Do you all believe that Slaxx as scum is stupid enough to admit to needing to re-read the thread upon replacing in? Seems like an insanely stupid thing for scum to do because they would be expecting for people to go "AHA CAUGHT SCUM!!!!!!!" I can see it much more coming from town than I can from scum unless it's newbscum, which Slaxx doesn't fit.

If it was that simple then it would have been noted a lot sooner then it was don't you think?

[Tammy]

I really don't understand most of the post from Tammy, how do you go from seeing one post that Slaxx post and declare him town? Really one post = town?
Is that normal for you?

Don't know that there's a whole lot in mafia that could be "normal" for me as everything is game and mood dependent and not much is the same from game to game.

One post does sometimes do it for me, not always, but it happens. I've been known to be convinced someone was scum for weeks only to change my mind based on one post :shrug:

His post spoke to a town mindset. There were a myriad of things he could have said upon me replacing in and as scum I think it would be something a whole lot different than he's heard I'm an easy read. There was some suspicion on my slot; if he were scum he could have fed that suspicion and he could have done it in a way that was totally accurate and I wouldn't be able to refute or be suspicious of him for. Saying that he's heard I'm an easy read suggests that he's actually interested in reading my slot not that he's already determined or knows the alignment of my slot.

[farside22]

Don't know that there's a whole lot in mafia that could be "normal" for me as everything is game and mood dependent and not much is the same from game to game.

One post does sometimes do it for me, not always, but it happens. I've been known to be convinced someone was scum for weeks only to change my mind based on one post :shrug:

His post spoke to a town mindset. There were a myriad of things he could have said upon me replacing in and as scum I think it would be something a whole lot different than he's heard I'm an easy read. There was some suspicion on my slot; if he were scum he could have fed that suspicion and he could have done it in a way that was totally accurate and I wouldn't be able to refute or be suspicious of him for. Saying that he's heard I'm an easy read suggests that he's actually interested in reading my slot not that he's already determined or knows the alignment of my slot.

Yeah there was/is suspicion on your slot, some came from the person that your declaring town off of one post.
Instead there is 2 wagon's going, 1 on him and 1 on KK and I'm sure nothing short of kissing ass to a player never enters scums mind

Also most people I know when they find someone scum, just because a replacement comes in does not change a read.

At least if Slaxx is scum I may have to rethink those post from Slaxx and see a person he ignored all game....like for example Psyche. (noted for later if Slaxx is scum).

[farside22]

I should note: I'm suspicious of your slot more because of how Slaxx talked about DGL during the game, going from scummy, null, scummy and no longer scum with no reason. Usually when someone is scum they will, I notice, lightly bus their scum buddy but not go all out and try and make others look scummier, but always vote on his scum buddy if the tides turn.

[Tammy]

Are you referring to him kissing my ass or me kissing his? I don't see it in either situation, but way less so in his case if that's what you're insinuating.

When I replaced in he claimed that my predecessor had soft claimed a protective role. That shows suspicion on my slot in an attempt to get me to lie if I were scum trying to save myself.

He didn't change his read either. He said he heard I'm easy to read. He then said if he's lynched to read me and go from there on PoE. Besides, saying I'm an easy read could also be a bit of a reaction test. If I think he knows how to read me, and if I'm scum, I might get thrown off balance. He hasn't given his read of me yet. When he does, I'll be able to go from there. I'm actually quite interested in what he comes back with, especially considering that I know who told him I'm easy to read.

But still, both of these suggest a town mindset, not scum.

Hmm...I change reads on replacements all the time. Not every time, but enough. In fact, I drove Junpei crazy in the last game we played together because I had written up a case and was pushing a wagon on someone and then withdrew my vote when someone replaced in. I refused to lynch that person that day and Junpei kept getting after me for being too ethical. Next day I was arguing for his innocence, and it turned out he was innocent.

I don't know why changing reads on someone even that much is suspicious. I change reads all the time. In fact, his changing reads on my slot throughout the game makes my town read on him stronger, especially if there's a lack of reason. Wouldn't he, as scum, at least try to give a reason for his change of reads so that he wouldn't look suspicious. It's not hard to give fake reasons for read changes or reads, and scum tend to at least do that to avoid notice.

I forgot about Psyche and need to relook at him though. I don't like what looks like active lurking.

[Tammy]

Tammy:

These were the inconsistent reads - he had a set of reads which I said at the time were inconsistent with each other. That is to say, that I felt he had reads at the same time which were contradictory.

Who the heck meta's someones' alignment based off one alignment? Before you reference my "meta" of you, the difference is that you posted a theory stance in that game which initially appeared to disagree with your stance here.

This is where you appealed to emotion:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p4155660

I claimed dayvig immediately because in such a small setup with few scum, you might claim PR to save yourself. There was zero harm in doing it. It's certainly not suspicious to reaction test someone, but go ahead with your insane confirmation bias crusade.

1. Not seeing the inconsistency or the contradictions you're talking about. Walk me through it.

2. I cleared up the meta contradiction, did I not? If not, don't compare apples and oranges.

3. As far as the appeal to buzzword. Okay, so? I don't know why you're pointing that out. You're taking a common stance I take and saying I'm appealing to something. It doesn't have anything to do with anything. Especially after you make note of remembering that I have a tendency to write irritating emotional posts. :shrug: Why bother pointing something like that out? Scum do it far more often than innocent people do it.

4. Oh hahaha...I'm in an insane confirmation bias crusade? Really Junpei. I haven't even been here for 24 hours yet, don't know that it's a crusade. I have a scum read on you. Also, what was suspicious was not the stupid reaction test, but your behavior afterwards. You don't seem like someone who is trying to determine the alignment of other people, but like someone who is trying to make others look suspicious so you can mislynch them. Your demeanor throughout the entire game has been that way.

[Rainbowdash]

RD- What is your read on Junpei?

I would be willing to lynch him I think. The fact that he called FC town early like I had and then shifted back over to that wagon when stuff started falling through really bugs me. My only problem with him is this complete derp dayvig stuff matches up well with his "im really smart" town meta that has had him forming some amazing gambit he thought he should get all this glory for and got ripped apart in MD for being a horrible move that got lucky by just about everypony. I think thats crash loss though.

I almost want to say Slaxx gets a point or two for his opening D2 post which is a stall waiting for a cop result when scum would know that one isnt coming since I presumeably got RBed last night. It may be a bit inconsequental, but I think if scum know the result is useless they would want to try and control the out the gate movement a bit instead of possibly let town do that.

Iknal I just have as townish for his second post, that I just get this town vibes off of. Again like Junepi the fact that he actually ended up on the FC wagon really irks me, and there HAS to be at least one scum on it (duh). I just am not too sure that Iknal is scum without a partner in what is now Tammy.

I need to get less townish reads I think. This is why I hate replacing and keep doing it to try and get better. I just cant figure stuff out as much if im not actively involved when they are happening.

@All voters - Can you give me a bullet point (with quotes as applicable) as to why the player you are voting is scum? For those who are not voting, I would like a reason you are not.

[Junpei]

1.

lolgic

DLG: How is this slot I quoted null-town when Deltabacon is scum for avoiding game content by posting but not posting anything which could be read as any alignment? That's exactly what Ellibereth did here.

2. I completely don't understand what you're saying, are you agreeing with me?

3. Honestly when I reread that post I don't see the AtE I saw last night. But when I said emotional posts I meant something else that I don't feel like bringing up right now.

4. Tammy - everything you have posted in regards to my suspicion has read post-decision. You read through the game and found reasons to call me scum, even when you hadn't explained why you felt I was scum in the first place. I say this because the posts you pointed out calling me scum not only are few in number, but also are erroneous. It looked like you aren't reading my posts carefully, rather reading them from a mindset that is 100% expecting me to say something suspicious.

I'd like evidence that suggests I am more interested in making people look suspicious so I can mislynch them if you got it, seeing as every other point you've made has been exhausted.

pedit: Really rainbowdash (can I just call you Llama?)... Okay well for the third time here's my Kublai Khan case from the start of the day: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p4149590

[Rainbowdash]

No. I am Rainbow Dash. Fastest in all of equestira. Anything else would probably just confuse my already multiple personality self even more.

What is your read on Slaxx though and why, lets say if I was to come out with Delta just was playing some elaborate gambit and got an innocent on KK and ive been testing the waters all day if that would change anything.

That slot is a bit of a tough read though. I think Iknal was townish, but I dont really have that read carried over by KK that much which is a bit concerning.

[Tammy]

Bullet points on Slaxx (which is really just a recap of the past 5 pages, you lazy bastards)

1. Re-reading the game after receiving his role.
   
   1. Pre-role, he was reading the game closely enough to generate scum reads (on DLG, for example)
      
   2. Post-re-read, the scum read on DLG vanished until it 'accidentally' got re-added.
   
   
2. Slaxx explains that reading and playing are different experiences, since he now has impact, is responsible for opinions, and must communicate.
   
   1. None of those reasons explains why he seemingly generated new reads and tried to throw out old reads
   
   
3. Mass claim brouhaha
   
   1. First against the idea with the reasoning that we should lynch the scum RB first
      
   2. Then changed his mind and was gung-ho on the idea.
      
   3. His tracker talk comes off as scum worried about the existence of a tracker.
   
   
4. Slaxx's response was to bring up an irrelevant game where he had unneccessarily claimed and referrenced a possible conversation where he had a meta of thinking that post-scum RB flip is the best time to massclaim.
   
   1. Slaxx definitely tried to move away from this argument/position.
      
   2. Later response was to argue that Deltabacon was reluctant to claim and therefore PR.
      
   3. This is obviously a post-justification.
   
   
5. Lack of voting record
   
6. "scum-hunting" is entirely PoE-based with little depth.
   
7. AtEs
   
   1. "Anyway since i apparently have to account for every day I'm gone"
      
   2. "nothing but tunnel me today"

Note: I really want Deltabacon and Psyche to speak up more. They are confirmed and pretty town (respectively) so they should be leading town and both of them are too quiet. Slaxx is refusing to vote now, yet will definitely hammer if someone else votes me. So consider me at L-1. Given that, I think both Deltabacon and Junpei are voting for me for a flimsy lazy reasoning given the bulk of my posts.

1. Unless you can prove he was taking notes when he was reading along and had to go back and change his opinions, I dont' know why this is an issue.

2. Are you saying they aren't different experiences? Is his thinking they are alignment indicative? Really?

3. I re-read through Slaxx to see what you're talking about. I don't see your point. Couldn't it also just as easily be read as someone who doesn't want the tracker blocked? Slaxx and I just finished a game in which the tracker claimed day two and was neutralized (by me!) for the rest of the game. Also, wouldn't scum be a little bit more careful with how they approached the mass claim thing?

4. Meh. Feels thin.

5. Okay. Still not completely alignment indicative. I've gone entire days without voting before until I hammered someone. Oh wait, I did that for almost an entire game once as an innocent.

6. Pot-Kettle. Except you're not doing PoE. But, you've got your toes in the shallow end.

7. Personality thing. Not alignment indicative. In fact, I tend to see this as more town anyway. Emotions are town.

[Junpei]

What is your read on Slaxx though and why, lets say if I was to come out with Delta just was playing some elaborate gambit and got an innocent on KK and ive been testing the waters all day if that would change anything.

Slaxx is town leaning scum. I remember towny scumhunting which makes him look well town. On the scum spectrum he's leaning because of a few points against him I like. However, as with Tammy, many of the points against Slaxx I can't endorse.

I don't do townhunting though - I look for mafia.

[Tammy]

1.

lolgic

DLG: How is this slot I quoted null-town when Deltabacon is scum for avoiding game content by posting but not posting anything which could be read as any alignment? That's exactly what Ellibereth did here.

2. I completely don't understand what you're saying, are you agreeing with me?

3. Honestly when I reread that post I don't see the AtE I saw last night. But when I said emotional posts I meant something else that I don't feel like bringing up right now.

4. Tammy - everything you have posted in regards to my suspicion has read post-decision. You read through the game and found reasons to call me scum, even when you hadn't explained why you felt I was scum in the first place. I say this because the posts you pointed out calling me scum not only are few in number, but also are erroneous. It looked like you aren't reading my posts carefully, rather reading them from a mindset that is 100% expecting me to say something suspicious.

I'd like evidence that suggests I am more interested in making people look suspicious so I can mislynch them if you got it, seeing as every other point you've made has been exhausted.

pedit: Really rainbowdash (can I just call you Llama?)... Okay well for the third time here's my Kublai Khan case from the start of the day: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p4149590

1.

That's

your grand contradiction? Oh Junpei.

2. That I seemed to make a different stance? Telling someone not to claim as vanilla for no reason and unprompted on day one of a 26 player game because it's stupid is different than claiming vanilla upon replacing in when there are 7 players and having been asked to claim. The fact that you went to that game, found that quote, and tried to compare the two is part of where your behavior is suspicious. You tried to find a contradiction to make me look bad when the situations couldn't be more different.

3. It's okay. I'm part emotional player...it results in emotional posts from time to time.

4. Junpei - When you read someone everything you read is made post-decision. I don't get your point. Yes, I was leaning scum on you from your behavior upon replacing in and none of your behavior changed that read as I read the game. Don't tell me how I operate. This is making you look even scummier Junpei. I didn't read through the game with some preconceived notion that you were scum and therefore looked for reasons to validate what I thought. That's a ridiculous notion, and fits with scummy behavior. In fact, you have experience with me Junpei; you know that I'm not fixed in my reads. You've seen me change my mind enough to know that I don't hunt for reasons to find people scum without reason.

In fact, if you were paying attention, I called Slaxx town last night upon replacing in from something he said. Then in my reads I twice said that I didn't know what to make of his alignment because I have trouble reading him. That should tell you that I didn't start reading with biases in place.

Why did you get so worried that in my first post upon replacing in I called you scum? There was absolutely no way I could have a scum read on you, so for you to get all upset about it and want an answer makes you look really suspicious. Even if you don't get sarcasm, you get logic right? Because logically there's no way I could have any type of read on you at that point.

[Rainbowdash]

Slaxx is town leaning scum.

Yeah even with other words I dont get this unless you are trying to say "I dont know" in which case just SAYING that makes more sense than doing whatever you rae doing here.

[farside22]

@RD: The reason I am voting Slaxx can be found here, my bullet points are found here


*looks at the wifom from RD's post about what scum would or would not do and laughs*

[Junpei]

Rainbowdash: Slaxx is a town read right now - but there are aspects of his play that are suspicious.

Tammy: First things first: I don't know your playstyle that well. If you want to keep playing this game then recall GvE CvL and how I replaced in and how I lurked for quite a bit and slowly found my ground and reads. I didn't interact with a lot of the game till later.

1. It's page THREE!

2. Okay - I saw you hold a ridiculous stance at first glance, and went to look into your games to see if you made it up or not on the spot. The stance you took seemed so wrong to me at first glance that I felt for sure you were lying. You later explanation did not come to mind.

4. I maintain that your posts look like stretching to call me scum, and there's no reason to argue that point with you obviously. List reasons I'm a scumread before this conversation that you still think are fully valid.

Obviously you can't have confirmation bias on every single read. I didn't expect you to be joking around... I still don't like the sarcasm and joking culture that is growing in mafia games. I thought you were serious. I then logically came to the conclusion that there should be no reason why you have that read - but I initially thought you to be the type of player I really respect (logical, serious, thorough) so I thought that you would have a response.

[farside22]

@Tammy: In regards to post 654; saying someone is easy to read = town mind set? I'm just more confused.
I'm going to disagree with most of your post here. You think people can't fake a read? You just going to ignore everything in this game and base it on how a person thinks now is just plain dumb.

In regards to replacement reads changing, I think my best example of what I mean about your views not changing when you have a scum read on someone when another replaces in the same slot was how I was in here where I welcomed the person saying hi I believe your scum, welcome.
I was being cute, but damn serious.
This game Slaxx has been ever changing reads with no reason's behind him. I see a lot of following from him and no aggressive scum hunting what-so-ever.

Wouldn't he, as scum, at least try to give a reason for his change of reads so that he wouldn't look suspicious

Wouldn't he as town have reason for why he changed his views? Really. It's easy to follow along and give agreements and credence when you see people already suspicious of a player.
Are you saying you never never did that as scum?


Oh look who is not here during this exchange of talks in the game.....Slaxx/Psyche.

*Note for later* look to see if this was a trend all game long.

[Tammy]

Rainbowdash: Slaxx is a town read right now - but there are aspects of his play that are suspicious.

Tammy: First things first: I don't know your playstyle that well. If you want to keep playing this game then recall GvE CvL and how I replaced in and how I lurked for quite a bit and slowly found my ground and reads. I didn't interact with a lot of the game till later.

I don't get your point. I remember your entrance; we were nearing deadline. I had just gotten into an argument with someone and jumped off of the wagon I had been pushing for two weeks because I decided at the last minute he was probably innocent. You read through my ISO and determined I was likely town (and not a VI!) and tried to convince me to get off of my wagon of one and onto another wagon. It was all very natural as was the way you interacted with people. Now, I'm not a big meta person, but I'm not getting the same feeling of naturalness here. I, like you with me, don't know your playstyle that well. In fact, I wouldn't from just one game anyway and wouldn't think I would. My playstyle changes so often that I don't expect people to act the same way either. But, there is a general voice or underlying behavior that has some consistency.

1. It's page THREE!

Good then we agree it's not that important.

4. I maintain that your posts look like stretching to call me scum, and there's no reason to argue that point with you obviously. List reasons I'm a scumread before this conversation that you still think are fully valid.

Obviously you can't have confirmation bias on every single read. I didn't expect you to be joking around... I still don't like the sarcasm and joking culture that is growing in mafia games. I thought you were serious. I then logically came to the conclusion that there should be no reason why you have that read - but I initially thought you to be the type of player I really respect (logical, serious, thorough) so I thought that you would have a response.

I will, in a bit. I have some work to do.

There is no reason why people can't have fun with mafia. And I am logical, serious, and thorough most of the time (when I'm not being emotional and irrational), but I'm also extremely light-hearted and like to have fun. Also, I don't know that you can fault me for what I said, when you pulled a fake dayvig gambit. Perhaps, I was reaction-testing you by asking if you were scum in my first post. (I wasn't, but still.)

[Tammy]

@Tammy: In regards to post 654; saying someone is easy to read = town mind set? I'm just more confused.
I'm going to disagree with most of your post here. You think people can't fake a read? You just going to ignore everything in this game and base it on how a person thinks now is just plain dumb.

Context is everything, and I know the context from where he's coming. He said "A little birdie told me Tammy is easy to read." Yeah, I see that as a town mindset. I know it comes from Team Mafia and I know that it comes from someone on his team. If I'm right about the person who it is, it's someone who can read me really really well. I replaced into a scum slot in that game. If he was scum, why go for the "I heard she was an easy read" why not mention me being scum in the game we previously played together? Especially since it's under similar circumstances - me replacing into a game that has some suspicion already. It just seems like it would be the more natural reaction for scum to say something other than "I hear she's an easy read" in this situation, and I wouldn't even be able to fault him for it.

Of course people can fake a read. I'm pretty sure that I said faking a read is extremely easy to do. I also said I'm interested in what he comes back with. How he reads me should give me better insight into his thought process and allow me to evaluate him better. I'm not just going to accept a read at face value.

In regards to replacement reads changing, I think my best example of what I mean about your views not changing when you have a scum read on someone when another replaces in the same slot was how I was in here where I welcomed the person saying hi I believe your scum, welcome.
I was being cute, but damn serious.
This game Slaxx has been ever changing reads with no reason's behind him. I see a lot of following from him and no aggressive scum hunting what-so-ever.

Okay I see what you're saying. (Hey! You were playing with Gertrude in that game. We play together at another site) Still, he basically voiced his suspicions of me when he said that my predecessor had soft claimed a protective role. And I still think his "Tammy's an easy read" thing demonstrated suspicion of me.

When I re-read him, I'll pay attention the scum hunting aspect. I still don't see a big deal about changing reads. Once someone tunneled on me for an entire day, tried unsuccessfully to get me lynched, and the next day called me his strongest town read for no reason whatsoever. It happens.

Wouldn't he, as scum, at least try to give a reason for his change of reads so that he wouldn't look suspicious

Wouldn't he as town have reason for why he changed his views? Really. It's easy to follow along and give agreements and credence when you see people already suspicious of a player.
Are you saying you never never did that as scum?


Oh look who is not here during this exchange of talks in the game.....Slaxx/Psyche.

*Note for later* look to see if this was a trend all game long.

I don't know. I sometimes don't have reasons for why I have reads or change my reads. Sometimes I just read something genuine in a post and I have a read. I don't even know how to pinpoint it sometimes. And yeah, I've had people give me crap for it. But because it's something that I personally do, I can't fault someone else for it.

Hmm...I've actually only played scum 3 times, so it's kind of hard to say what I've never done as scum. But, actually as a general tendency, no. Though I have exploited general opinion, I'm more inclined to go against general opinion when scum not with (though I do this as town too).

Psyche being absent is troubling, and I'd like to know why so many people have such strong townreads of him.

[Kublai Khan]

Ugh. Catching up and there's a whole mess of text that I've been skimming on my phone. I see that Tammy has declared every point I made against Slaxx was a town-tell, so... that's fantastic.

I'll put up some sort of wall later I guess. Right now the first impression is that Tammy is just ratcheting up a wall of noise as a sort of distraction (away from what? I'm not totally sure, but there's a definite push to move suspicion from Slaxx to Junpei).

Maybe it's just a playstyle thing, so I'm going to be a dick and demand that she just make a concise bulleted point post of reads.

[Tammy]

Maybe it's just a playstyle thing, so I'm going to be a dick and

demand

that she just make a concise bulleted point post of reads.

Oops. I don't follow demands. I was actually going to do this later after I iso'd, but meh, my stubborn button has been triggered. I'll get to it eventually.

[Junpei]

Good then we agree it's not that important.

What? You're changing the subject. The point was that you called me scummy for saying that it was scummy to have inconsistent reads. Don't dance around the topic - you were wrong on your suspicion of me. And knowing you I'm going to have to say the same thing once you make your "case".

You need to hurry up and vote Kublai Khan. Your townread on Iknal makes no sense and neither is your nullread on Kublai Khan.

Maybe it's just a playstyle thing, so I'm going to be a dick and

demand

that she just make a concise bulleted point post of reads.

Oops. I don't follow demands. I was actually going to do this later after I iso'd, but meh, my stubborn button has been triggered. I'll get to it eventually.

[Kublai Khan]

Too bad. Because right now I feel that you're the one just running around hitting buttons. You're trying to up turn the table because you didn't like the way it was set when you walked in. Why? Did you get the impression that scum had the upperhand?

It's possible you have a point. So I'll retract my demand and just ask nicely. Could you please make a single focused bulleted post?

[Tammy]

Good then we agree it's not that important.

What? You're changing the subject. The point was that you called me scummy for saying that it was scummy to have inconsistent reads. Don't dance around the topic - you were wrong on your suspicion of me. And knowing you I'm going to have to say the same thing once you make your "case".

You need to hurry up and vote Kublai Khan. Your townread on Iknal makes no sense and neither is your nullread on Kublai Khan.

I'm not changing the subject. It is a really shallow and scummy thing to suspect someone for. I told you I didn't see the inconsistencies, you pointed them out, I said they weren't as strong as you thought they were, you said it was page 3. Were you not admitting that it was too early in the game to have these strong feelings that you suggested? If you were, then I'm agreeing that the inconsistencies you noted were not important. If you're still sticking to that, then no we don't agree because I don't see the strong inconsistencies that caused you to suspect my predecessor right? I honestly don't even know who the suspicion was directed at by this point.

LOL! Junpei how can you say in one post that you don't know my play style enough to determine some things and then in the next say "knowing you" blah blah blah. What do you mean, you're going to have to say the same thing again? I'm trying to figure out what you're trying to imply and why you're preemptively discrediting me.

I'm not dancing around anything, and of course you're going to tell me I'm wrong in my suspicion of you. Do you think I'm expecting you to agree with me?

And, I don't need to hurry up and vote anyone. I haven't iso'd KK yet and barely had any interaction. Deadline's not for over a week so there's no rush, and I'm not going to vote for someone that I'm not sure of.

Why you pushing?

[Tammy]

Too bad. Because right now I feel that you're the one just running around hitting buttons. You're trying to up turn the table because you didn't like the way it was set when you walked in. Why? Did you get the impression that scum had the upperhand?

It's possible you have a point. So I'll retract my demand and just ask nicely. Could you please make a single focused bulleted post?

If by making noise and pushing buttons, you mean interacting with as many people as possible, then yes that is absolutely what I'm doing. I tend to be very active and interacting with people is how I get my reads.

Someone I have a working town read on is set to be lynched, of course I'm going to try to figure out why and try to turn the table if it's scum pushing it or determine if my read is wrong. And it's my duty to try to change the course if scum have the upperhand. I'm not sure of your point there.

Yes, I will. I have some iso's to do and will try to finish them up tonight, but it might be tomorrow.

[Junpei]

Sigh.. why did DLG have to replace out..

When I said "knowing you.." I was referring to an arrogant [redacted].

This is like when someone starts attacking someone for something stupid in RVS and you go "LOL WTF THAT'S NOTHING BIG!". YOU said:

"Bullshit! Inconsistent reads show a sign of someone who changes their mind based on new posts not faulty lines of thought. It is absolutely faulty to think that mafia do this kind of crap. Mafia are less likely because they typically re-read what they write to make sure these things are missing. Inconsistency is actually a town tell. (Slaxx will probably disagree with me on this because he said a post of mine in another game was stupid regarding contradictions, but whatever)."

You attacked the validity of my attack. I expressed that it was a valid attack, and you concurred with me with the disclaimer that it wasn't important. A contradiction of that level is important enough to note and I believe that it is a scum tell. I will argue in MD if you want after the game but you trying to throw dirt on me for thinking having contradictory reads is a scumtell is crazy. What's even worse is your "it's not worth those STRONG FEELINGS". I had strong enough feelings to keep voting him on page 4.

What's the matter, are you nervous that I'm going to attack you with old DLG scumpoints? You're quick to discredit anything against your slot and label me scummy for attacking it. Your tone and attitude is annoying me which is doubly upsetting because this game was calm and mature previously.