Micro 151: Mafia in New-Newbie Land (Game over!)

[Majiffy]

Some people do.

Those people are idiots.

[mothrax]

I'm not a big fan of blatantly identifying all town reads no. I think it gives scum a clearer picture of who to nk. And the second part obv.

Hey Majiffy. I don't have to insult you to get my point across and I would appreciate it if you would give me the same respect.

[mothrax]

Ek, wasn't that kind of site meta a few years ago? I'm certainly not the first to say that.

[Majiffy]

Hey Majiffy. I don't have to insult you to get my point across and I would appreciate it if you would give me the same respect.

You can have my respect when you earn it. So far, all I've heard from you is dumb.

[elvis_knits]

Some people do.

Those people are idiots.

^^ Sick burn

Well I was gonna say that I only see scum say that giving townreads is a bad idea, but actually... I think I have probably seen some town saying it sometimes. But really, I have seen it more coming from scum. Scum discourage acceptance of townies as being townies because then it narrows their pool of people they can lynch. Nevermind how powerful a townblock can be, as you said.

Well, I severely dislike that from mothrax.

At first, when I was skimming, I read the whole exchange as a big pissing contest, so maybe moth is still town.

@ bork and Wisdom -- can you explain why you feel so confident that moth is town?

[mothrax]

Hey Majiffy. I don't have to insult you to get my point across and I would appreciate it if you would give me the same respect.

You can have my respect when you earn it. So far, all I've heard from you is dumb.

Seriously? We have different play styles and different theory opinions. I'm going to ask you again. Please do not continue to insult me. It is unnecessary and takes the enjoyment out of the game and I'm not ok with that. This is after all a game.

[Wisdom]

@elvis
That's the feeling I'm getting from the exchange with Majiffy.

[elvis_knits]

I'm not a big fan of blatantly identifying all town reads no. I think it gives scum a clearer picture of who to nk. And the second part obv.

Eh, scum are gonna kill somebody no matter what.

I mean let's say I'm tonight's NK because several ppl have called me town. But maybe we can make enough progress today by cooperating that we lynch one scum today and set ourselves up for a sweet win tomorrow (or the next day). Well, then it doesn't really matter that I got the NK because we were able to make a lot more progress that we would by keeping our reads secret. Secrecy is for scum. They already know who they think will be hard to get lynched because they don't seem scummy. It doesn't hurt for us to say.

Or maybe there's a doc who can protect, so scum going for the obv kill will result in no kill.

So, yeah, I think it's to our advantage to give both town and scum reads.

[mothrax]

Keep in mind I'm also used to large themes. I played in mostly reckamonic and vi games when I was here last. I think the adjustment is factor. And I've never seen that side presented to me before, I srsly remember being told not to give away all my town reads. Considering someone super town is helpful yes, but like I said it gives scum an idea of who they can't get lynched.

[Majiffy]

Hey Majiffy. I don't have to insult you to get my point across and I would appreciate it if you would give me the same respect.

You can have my respect when you earn it. So far, all I've heard from you is dumb.

Seriously? We have different play styles and different theory opinions. I'm going to ask you again. Please do not continue to insult me. It is unnecessary and takes the enjoyment out of the game and I'm not ok with that. This is after all a game.

Stop being so butthurt over words on the internet and maybe you'll find enjoyment out of the game.

My insults aren't unnecessary. They serve a purpose.

[Majiffy]

[Outting town reads] gives scum an idea of who they can't get lynched.

If scum is so inept they can't figure out who can't get lynched on their own, then they aren't going to win anyway.

[elvis_knits]

I really like wisdom's xegaras vote and think I join once I read since I'm only phone skimming now.

I’m ok with pressuring for some content but let’s be careful that this bandwagon doesn’t take on a life of it’s own before xeg gets a chance to respond.

I really dislike this.

At the time Mr. E Roll posted this, Xegarus had 2 votes on him.

I mean it's 5 to lynch right?

What is Mr. E afraid is going to happen? That we might lynch Xegarus? And how does he know that's bad? Does he feel that xegarus is town? Why caution us not to get carried away?

It just seems really weird to me.

Like either Xeg is Mr. E's scum buddy and he didn't want us to lynch Xeg before Xeg could try to talk his way out of it, or Mr. E knows Xeg is town and Mr. E is earning some town points prematurely. It just feels so weird and forced to caution a bandwagon that is small, when we've had trouble getting this game going. Finally, stuff is happening and Mr. E Roll is like "slow down again, please!"

[elvis_knits]

Keep in mind I'm also used to large themes. I played in mostly reckamonic and vi games when I was here last. I think the adjustment is factor. And I've never seen that side presented to me before, I srsly remember being told not to give away all my town reads. Considering someone super town is helpful yes, but like I said it gives scum an idea of who they can't get lynched.

OK. I do think you are might be right that that might have been the culture at one point. I just think it serves scum more than town so I dislike it.

I think I'm okay with you at the moment though.

[elvis_knits]

@ majiffy and mothrax, I think you two should hug it out.

I think that majiffy should maybe tone it down a bit and moth should try to let it go.

[elvis_knits]

So my top two suspects are Xegarus and Mr. E Roll, btw.

[Xegarus]

"your reasons for calling me scummy are insufficient" rather than a "I can't believe I'm even having this conversation" vibe from this. I see scum subconsciously having the former attitude and town having the latter.

I disagree. Saying something along the lines of "why am i having this conversation" can just sound like a deflection. His reasons for calling me a lurker were infact shit.
1. A lurker is someone who is around but doesnt post. Ive just not been around and will probably only post at around this time.
2. My last post was less than a day ago. How does that make me, to the very least, an absent player?

third was calling someone town. Correct me if I'm wrong but the object of the game is scum hunting, right? If you aren't doing that I don't see much contribution going on.

Sure that the way town wins is by getting rid of scum, but getting a town is just as useful as getting a scum read. I can't see your point here.

VOTE: Xegarus

Why then of all times? About 20 minutes after your last post.
I don't usually do the whole time stamp thing but what made you vote then rather than before?

I like Pala’s vote against Xeg for lurking in principle. It’s show that Pala is ready to leave the RVS behind but hasn’t found anything particularly scummy so is voting a policy lynch.

So from this can i assume you support policy lynching for lurkers?

This is hopefully going to force scum to participate more giving us more opportunities to catch scum slips.

Care to explain this to me?
What if scum doesn't participate at all to this? Then a badtown could be seen as scum.
I honestly dont see how this would force anyone to do anything.

I want a Xegaras wagon.

Why?
For posting after being accused as a lurker?

1) Lack of any form of content.

I'll give you that.

2) Two questions that weren't needed at all. The answers to both are obvious and it makes me believe they were posted just for filler.

Weren't needed?
I honestly wanted to know what E thought about RVS. I found it odd that someone was being questioned for not randomly voting when some discussion was made. The answer to that would not have been obvious.
His answer had nothing to do with RVS but more to do with participating.

3) His tone when accused of lurking. Like bork said, this sounds like accused scum who is annoyed about the reasons that they're being accused; probably thinking "wtf I would be like this as town too".

Have already pointed out why i disagree with that.
Now lets just entertain the thought that this is how i would play for both alignments. Assuming you believe it, what then?

I wanna go charging off and vote xegaras

Why?
You sure love mentioning me, you have yet to give a legitimate reason to vote. Why even mention this if you haven't read everything? It shows you already have a fixed mindset to an ideal and probably will interprete based around that ideal. Or you're scum. Your early play about being clueless to pre game theory looked so forced, as if to try and town slip.

Heck

Xegaras #47 is slightly weird because he's defending majiffy's right not to random vote while he is also voting majiffy. But I guess it's just a random vote, so it's not super hypocritical to defend somebody you're random voting since random votes aren't that serious. Still... a bit odd.

WTF is this? This means absolutely nothing but you still mentioned it. Why?

Maybe lurking was the wrong term to use.

Probably was the wrong term to use.

The reason I voted you was that up until that point you had all of two posts, one of which was your RVS vote. You didn't even make a show of participating. This is still the case, so my vote stands.

Fair enough.

Elvis is so far the only person I have a confident read on (town, of course). Mr. E and Wisdom are looking more town with their recent posts.

Elvis is the one that i have no clue about. Early play says scum, recent play says town. A solid null for me.
Wisdom i'm leaning scum. Did not like his reasons put forth for voting.

VOTE: Xegarus

-_-
Wanna say anything about it or are you just sheeping Wisdom.
If you are sheeping Wisdom, STICK THAT UP YOUR FLOWCHART.

I'm not a big fan of blatantly identifying all town reads no.

I agree.

I think it gives scum a clearer picture of who to nk

Is that night kill or no kill?
If thats a night kill, then certainly. But it can help whomever got the read influence others.......assuming he isnt just scum with town cred.
If it was no kill, i dont quite understand.

Well I was gonna say that I only see scum say that giving townreads is a bad idea, but actually... I think I have probably seen some town saying it sometimes. But really, I have seen it more coming from scum. Scum discourage acceptance of townies as being townies because then it narrows their pool of people they can lynch. Nevermind how powerful a townblock can be, as you said.

There is also the other argumant against giving reads that it changes how people play depending on the reads given. Like say you give a scum a town read. It could give them the confidence to bus their buddy and still end up on top.

So my top two suspects are Xegarus and Mr. E Roll, btw.

Have you read everything yet?
Still feel the need to vote me?

[Wisdom]

Why then of all times? About 20 minutes after your last post.
I don't usually do the whole time stamp thing but what made you vote then rather than before?

Was my post before that related to you?

[Wisdom]

Now lets just entertain the thought that this is how i would play for both alignments. Assuming you believe it, what then?

Let's assume you lurk as town and you lurk as scum.
You are scum in one game.
Someone in that game insists that you are scum because you're lurking.
You get annoyed because you know that this reason does not mean you are scum (as you do it as town too).

Your tone in that post made me feel you were annoyed in the way described above.

[Xegarus]

Why then of all times? About 20 minutes after your last post.
I don't usually do the whole time stamp thing but what made you vote then rather than before?

Was my post before that related to you?

And thats means anything how?
A post can be directed towards more than one person. My question was why do i get the glorious honour of getting a single post all to myself.

[Wisdom]

It means I obviously reread some of the posts/did other things those 20 minutes, then voted.

[Xegarus]

It means I obviously reread some of the posts/did other things those 20 minutes, then voted.

Could have just said that then.

[Wisdom]

Nah I was wondering why you felt that the vote should have been in my previous post, when that post was completely unrelated to you.

[Xegarus]

Now lets just entertain the thought that this is how i would play for both alignments. Assuming you believe it, what then?

Let's assume you lurk as town and you lurk as scum.
You are scum in one game.
Someone in that game insists that you are scum because you're lurking.
You get annoyed because you know that this reason does not mean you are scum (as you do it as town too).

Your tone in that post made me feel you were annoyed in the way described above.

Forgive me for not getting the point here, but are you trying to say that getting annoyed at being called a lurker is a bad thing?

Nah I was wondering why you felt that the vote should have been in my previous post, when that post was completely unrelated to you.

In my past experiences, i have posted and then voted later due to hesitation. Just wanted to get your view.

[Quilford]

BAMP °<°

[Quilford]

BIMP BOMP °<°