Mini 1446, Generic Mafia (Game Over)

[JacobSavage]

Votecount 2.3

Zhero [4]

- Bacde, Fegelein, roflcopter, Horus[/color]

T S O[2]

- Human Destroyer, Zhero[/color]

Horus [1]

- Infinity 324[/color]

Not Voting [3]

- Palmar, BeastCharizard, T S O

With 10 alive, it takes

6

to lynch. The day will end in (expired on 2013-05-23 06:25:38)[/i][/area]

[Bacde]

Yes, that part I mainly got from Ankiamus, who felt like he was trying to find reasons to vote fegel. He's still A gut town read though, so I'm hesitant to vote him now. Basically, I just read through and took notes and didn't have time to analyze it. Explanations:

Zhero - town: 212 in particular was really anti-opportunistic and anti-OMGUS. He also brought up a good point about the CES wagon and I can see how everything he posts could be written from a town mindset. Also gut.

Horus - fegelein: 82 felt like it was trying to dismiss the Horus wagon as an RVS-ish wagon, and moving on, which everyone kinda went along with

Bacde - palmar (idk how I missed this): Basically 61.

Rofl - Bacde: Gut based on the exchange where Rolf convinced Bacde to vote CES, however only really relevant if it's scum-scum, which it isn't.

Horus - palmar: Normally when two scum are on an equal level of scumminess, they either bus or buddy each other. Horus had his vote on Palmar, but palmar had a town read on Horus, making me feel like one is town.

HD - Horus: second paragraph in 177

Horus - zhero: Similar to Horus/palmar, Horus voted zhero but zhero had a townread on Horus.

Beastcharizard - Horus: Horus gave bc a townread without explanation, which is unusual for what I've seen from Horus so far. It seems like buddying to me. (Also I didn't find that post particularly towny) Here is Horus's post.

On my phone & don't have time, I'll finish later.

if you aren't going to believe your own reads why are you sharing them?

eg why are you not voting fegel? How can you see this connection but not be voting on it?

If you see a connection between animakius and fegel, but are unwilling to vote fegel due to gut townread, why should I believe ANY of the connections you see between players?

[Infinity 324]

Infinity, I did jump onto the Horus wagon at the very beginning and then changed later due to better evidence. Horus's post isn't all that well made I will agree with you there but putting us together based on a single post is a little obscure if you ask me. Perhaps you are trying to come in and take any slight scum tells that IFM had done and sweep them under the rug with your super aggressive approach. While that may not be the case it is still a large possibility. Also, I know opinions can change but at first you said Horus and I were not aligned and then you switched to that we were. That is weird to me.

I still hold that you are not aligned. I think Horus was trying to win over your support by calling you town. Scum often give town reads with very little reasoning to try to "buddy" townies like that.

I still think fegel is scum, just I believe my gut scum read on Horus more.

[Infinity 324]

I gave a good reason for why zhero is town, why do people think he's scum.

[roflcopter]

infinity's positions are mildly contradictory. i'm just gonna ignore him for now. more zhero votes.

[Infinity 324]

Sorry, what are condradictory about them?

[Infinity 324]

Um...I don't really remember why I said ankiamus and tso were not aligned. Sorry. Keep in mind that this:

Horus - palmar: Normally when two scum are on an equal level of scumminess, they either bus or buddy each other. Horus had his vote on Palmar, but palmar had a town read on Horus, making me feel like one is town.

HD - Horus: second paragraph in 177

Horus - zhero: Similar to Horus/palmar, Horus voted zhero but zhero had a townread on Horus.

Beastcharizard - Horus: Horus gave bc a townread without explanation, which is unusual for what I've seen from Horus so far. It seems like buddying to me. (Also I didn't find that post particularly towny) Here is Horus's post.

was about people who are

not

aligned.

I'll check out the zhero case, but I

really

do not think he's scum.

[Infinity 324]

There's no wonder Hoopla died then. I have to agree with you on TSO and Zhero.

I feel more confident putting my vote on Zhero though, he kept trying to reinforce the point that I was scum, when it was Ankamius doing all the talking. It came across as backseat enforcing.

UNVOTE: Beast
VOTE: Zhero

I really dislike this logic. You assume the scum are idiots. You can try to push wagons on people you think are scum even if someone else comes up with the arguments, and scum are not more/less likely to just follow their partners. Also (this applies to HD's logic too) I thought Zhero actually brought up a good point about CES lynch. Why else is zhero scum?

[Infinity 324]

Also in a way the above quoted post is OMGUS.

[Palmar]

I just read through roflcopter's filter.

Why on earth do you not explain anything you do? The main criteria I use for finding scum is that it's very hard to manufacture a believable read, since you already know what the result is. It's hard to read the game analytically enough as scum to come up with actual reasoning which is why it strikes me oddly when you randomly proclaim that "Palmar and Fegelein are town". Your vote on Zhero today has no reasons at all. Help me along here buddy, I can't tell if you're not giving out reasons for anything because you're lazy or because you don't have them.

[Palmar]

tbh the same question to bacde.

[Fegelein]

Infinity, why so flip-floppity? I thought I was a null read, now I'm your second highest scum read?

[T S O]

what I like just posted bs

anyway

UNVOTE:
VOTE: CES

sheeping rofl

and I already said stuff earlier and I don't feel like repeating go away

You know, I was just doing ISO's on random people and I found this. Looking through the game it's very easy to miss, but up until that point HD had not interacted with CES once, or "said stuff earlier". The bit at the end makes it worse - he's never even made a case on CES and to get round that, he says he doesn't want to repeat.

Also, looking through Hoopla's ISO, he seems to read Horus/Zhero as scum the whole game, I appreciate this is WIFOM, but it's still worth stating.

[T S O]

Infinity is probably town, and TSO is still the best vote. His CES vote was pretty opportunistic, and Ank's vote on him at the end of the day looks like a bus to me.

VOTE: TSO

This is pretty bad, as they go. "My vote looks opportunistic?" There were 2 people being lynched, and it was me and CES. I know I'm a Townie and I didn't know the alignment of CES, so it was a 100% chance to lose a Townie for me, as opposed to a lower probability to CES. I don't understand what you would have had me done - kept my vote which had been placed on the RVS and allowed myself to be lynched?

And then there's the good old CES town/Zhero scum CES scum/Zhero town tell. He flipped town, didn't he?

But then voting you would be putting you at L-1 so early, and I'm not a fan of L-1's. I'm going to place a vote after I re-read.

[Human Destroyer]

but up until that point HD had not interacted with CES once, or "said stuff earlier". The bit at the end makes it worse - he's never even made a case on CES and to get round that, he says he doesn't want to repeat.

VOTE: CES

No such thing as a boring wagon.

Sup Bacde

I'm rereading entirely and now I think CES looks kinda bad in his exchange with you

He just gives me that "I'm slapping on reasons to call you scum that don't really exist" vibe

Do you agree?

Would you like to try again, this time with something that makes sense?

[Fegelein]

TSO's really being opportunistic at the moment, stating he'll jump on the largest wagon today, while also jumping on the largest wagon yesterday that wasn't him to save his bacon.

[Infinity 324]

Infinity, why so flip-floppity? I thought I was a null read, now I'm your second highest scum read?

Yes, but I reread the thread, and I feel like ankiamus's attack on you was a bus, and early on you were trying to dismiss horus's wagon and move on, when the wagon actually had good reasoning. Also, PoE kicked in, because I changed my read on zhero to town. Keep in mind that there are only two scum left, and you and horus are the only people I have a scumread on.

[Infinity 324]

And then there's the good old CES town/Zhero scum CES scum/Zhero town tell. He flipped town, didn't he?

Yes, but would you vote for someone if you didn't think the people on the wagon believed in their scumread of him?

I'm going to place a vote after I re-read.

Yes, and please reread this post in particular and tell me zhero is scum. He's just so anti-opportunistic, so anti-OMGUS in that post that it really only makes sense if he's town.

TSO's really being opportunistic at the moment, stating he'll jump on the largest wagon today, while also jumping on the largest wagon yesterday that wasn't him

to save his bacon.

Spoiler alert: Most people think the largest wagon is scum. You, rofl, and bacde were also on the largest wagon yesterday. Also he gave an explanation for the bolded which makes sense imo.

TSO could still be scum, though. Sorry for all the spamming and disorganized thoughts.

[Infinity 324]

It would make sense for TSO to be the 3P who shot ankiamus.

[Infinity 324]

Hey, has anyone played with fegel-scum before? If so, is he good at dealing with pressure?

[Fegelein]

I've actually never been scum on site.

In fact, my only scum game was off-site, and it was an OC game. I was still a newb then, but I got Inspector voted off.

http://pokemon-online.eu/forums/showthr ... a-Postgame

[Bacde]

tbh the same question to bacde.

what part of my explanations have been lacking?

w/ context and my posts I feel like my reasoning this game has been fairly transparent

[Human Destroyer]

It would make sense for TSO to be the 3P who shot ankiamus.

yeah if he feels like getting himself murdered

[Bacde]

VOTE: infinity

[Infinity 324]

It would make sense for TSO to be the 3P who shot ankiamus.

yeah if he feels like getting himself murdered

What do you mean?