Newbie 1368 - Will there ever be a title? (GAME OVER)

[homertve]

Homer, are you planning on reading the other game?

Do you think I need to do it? Will it give me any information about this game?

[Ravenpaw]

Hi everybody. Sorry for brutally crashing the last game into the ground!

VOTE: Ravenpaw

Calling me darling gives me bad vibes.

And yet you said nothing at the time?
~
A lot has already been said about this post so I won’t go into it too much but I find Crand's vote very scummy, mainly because in a game where I said something (as town) he says it is now giving him bad vibes in a completely new game? That doesn’t compute.

[Ravenpaw]

I'm voting Crand because I found it suspicious that his RVS reason to vote Raven was based on a post made two weeks ago. I didn't know why that stuck in his mind and I was pressure voting him. Now I'm thinking about it, this was his response:

I have some problems with this. You ask where she called me darling, then 25 minutes later you say you can't see it in Title Pending. ISO button makes it really easy to see all of Raven's posts and one of the only interactions we had between one another was the one where she called me darling. Its really not hard to find if you looked in that thread (which you said yourself you did) especially not in 25 minutes.

I think your first statement that its only sensible to check the last few messages is flawed. If you think its not important to check the thread than it wouldn't have been so important for you to not find it there. Without doing the search how would you know if she said it or not? Why do you assume its from the scum QT without reading the whole thread?

When I was doing an RVS at the start of this game i didn't want to vote Grim right away to avoid getting him too close to L-1 without any discussion. I saw Ravenpaw's post and decided to vote her as my RVS. It was the only thing I really remember about her from last game.

Also Cand why do you keep putting the third vote on people so quickly without discussion? You've done this twice already in this game alone and I don't like it.

His response was interestingly defensive. I mean, it was an RVS vote, so why get so defensive about it? In this post, Crand:

• Attacks Grim for not noticing that Raven called Crand darling in the previous game (note, I had already done so and over half his post is dedicated to lashing Grim for not noticing/not properly using search tools)
  
• Defends his RVS vote by explaining he wanted to vote for Grim but didn't want to put him at L-1 (nobody asked him this question, so why is he answering it, again overdefensive)
  
• Asks Cand why he keeps putting the third vote on people (it looks like a deflection, note how he implies Cand is scummy for putting people at L-2)

So, all in all, I'm pretty happy with my vote where it is.

I agree with this.

[Ravenpaw]

Unvote: Grimgroove

Vote: Crandanja

I'm leaning town on Homer and Syr currently.
Grimgroove is a bit iffy to me. His jump on Crand for the 'QT slip' is something that I can relate to (but can't talk about because it's ongoing), but the fact he said he checked the old game but was proven that he didn't really does seem a wee bit suspect to me.

[Grimgroove]

Grimgroove is a bit iffy to me. (...) but the fact he said he checked the old game but was proven that he didn't really does seem a wee bit suspect to me.

You make it sound as if I didn't check the old game. Why?

[Grimgroove]

I revise my opinion on LnGrrrR after his last post.

UNVOTE:

[Ravenpaw]

Grimgroove is a bit iffy to me. (...) but the fact he said he checked the old game but was proven that he didn't really does seem a wee bit suspect to me.

You make it sound as if I didn't check the old game. Why?

Because apparently you only looked at my last few posts (which would've been post-game comments, not actual game play).

Also, this is why I feel so iffy about it:

I can't see this anywhere, neither here or in the "title pending"-game.

That above sentence is troubling me because of the word "anywhere". You implied doing a thorough search when you said that, but your later story of only looking at my last few posts doesn't correlate with that.

[Ravenpaw]

I revise my opinion on LnGrrrR after his last post.

UNVOTE:

What made you change your opinion?

[RachMarie]

wait a minute Cran did you seriously vote someone for calling you darling? Or was that an RVS joke vote?

Cause edearments is a personality thing not a scumtell I use endearments all the time.

[Crandaja]

Guys it was an RVS joke vote. Was that not obvious? I have absolutely no reason to believe Raven is scum. In regards to my overly defensiveness. I was trying to be offensive towards Grim since I believe his deduction of me was really scummy. His attacks on me were very decisive yet he didn't do the research. It felt very scummy to me so I wanted to push it. That being said
VOTE: Grim
He is the only real scum read I have thus far.

[Candillan]

I think Candillans meta is to start every game with a scummy statement. I don't like the "Oh no not a wagon again on me for a scummy RVS", because it tends to disarm thoughts of actual scumminess. Additionally, in ISO he looks fishy: he votes Crand, then unvotes three posts later because he doesn't always want to be the third vote on a wagon. Seems very self conscious about his votes, and if he thought it was good to put pressure on Crand, why take it off? If he is worried about L-2, he could just ask for no claims at this time.

Also, Candillan hasn't scumhunted at all. Just look at his ISO, no challenges, a /barn here or there...

VOTE: Candillan

Bahahahahahahano
The truth is that I have an aura of scumminess around me that makes me an easy wagon for scum to hop on and town to follow.
Meanwhile, you're commenting on my meta when I told you that I hate meta arguments. You're speaking in hypotheticals as to what I'd do, and I don't like that.

For the record, I am assembling reads. I currently read you and Crand as scummy.

Your push on me based on a meta argument doesn't make sense. Also, that isn't my scum meta, if you were to look at the last game. I don't like your case, and it seems as if you're pushing on me to make yourself seem active.

I'm not so vote-happy because then it gives my votes less impact when they're actually laid down. I'm not afraid of putting someone to L-2 or whatever, that was purely coincidence.

All in all, this case is bad, and you should feel bad.

VOTE: LnGrrrR
Other posts coming in a minute.

[Candillan]

(On an aside, Cand is uncomfortably close to Crand. It keeps getting me confused.)

[Candillan]

Homer, are you planning on reading the other game?

Do you think I need to do it? Will it give me any information about this game?

I'd read it so you can understand what we're referring to if we reference the other one.
I wouldn't read it for meta though.

[Candillan]

The great shaboostein has returned... stay tuned for an actual post.

And c'mon, its been like a day since the game started. Give a guy some slack

Shabooooooooo

[Candillan]

For the record, I was pointing out that it was odd that Syryana posted all that about Grim then voted Crand. I didn't say it was scummy.
I don't feel as if I have enough of a feel on people to make a reads list yet, but soon, hopefully.

Grim, I'll echo Raven's question. What made you change your mind on LnGrrrR?

[Candillan]

Guys it was an RVS joke vote. Was that not obvious? I have absolutely no reason to believe Raven is scum. In regards to my overly defensiveness. I was trying to be offensive towards Grim since I believe his deduction of me was really scummy. His attacks on me were very decisive yet he didn't do the research. It felt very scummy to me so I wanted to push it. That being said
VOTE: Grim
He is the only real scum read I have thus far.

It hurts to have a wagon on you because of an RVS vote, doesn't it. ;-;

[Crandaja]

I cannot get a read on Shaboo or Rach if they don't post anything which is making this pretty hard to contribute to.

And yes... Yes it does.

[LnGrrrR]

Bahahahahahahano
The truth is that I have an aura of scumminess around me that makes me an easy wagon for scum to hop on and town to follow.

Remember that comment I made about excusing scumminess ahead of the fact? This is what Im talking about. "I can't help that I have a scummy aura, but Im town this time!"[/quote]

Meanwhile, you're commenting on my meta when I told you that I hate meta arguments. You're speaking in hypotheticals as to what I'd do, and I don't like that.

So because you don't like it I should stop then? Also, could you point out to me where you mentioned this dislike of meta arguments?

Your push on me based on a meta argument doesn't make sense. Also, that isn't my scum meta, if you were to look at the last game. I don't like your case, and it seems as if you're pushing on me to make yourself seem active.

I thought you disliked discussing meta, yet here you are doing it. As far as your "scum meta", you also started out last game with the "oh no not a wagon on me for RVS comments!". What do you think is the difference between your scum and town meta?

I'm not so vote-happy because then it gives my votes less impact when they're actually laid down. I'm not afraid of putting someone to L-2 or whatever, that was purely coincidence.

If you weren't vote happy, why vote him in the first place? If you don't care about putting someone to L-2, why did you unvote?

[Candillan]

Bahahahahahahano
The truth is that I have an aura of scumminess around me that makes me an easy wagon for scum to hop on and town to follow.

Remember that comment I made about excusing scumminess ahead of the fact? This is what Im talking about. "I can't help that I have a scummy aura, but Im town this time!"

'twas a joke.

Meanwhile, you're commenting on my meta when I told you that I hate meta arguments. You're speaking in hypotheticals as to what I'd do, and I don't like that.

So because you don't like it I should stop then? Also, could you point out to me where you mentioned this dislike of meta arguments?

You don't have to start, but don't expect me to take your case seriously.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 7#p4925707 <--- That's one example.

Your push on me based on a meta argument doesn't make sense. Also, that isn't my scum meta, if you were to look at the last game. I don't like your case, and it seems as if you're pushing on me to make yourself seem active.

I thought you disliked discussing meta, yet here you are doing it. As far as your "scum meta", you also started out last game with the "oh no not a wagon on me for RVS comments!". What do you think is the difference between your scum and town meta?

I'm saying that even if you were to go from how I was playing last game, your case is inaccurate. Your case doesn't match up to the "scum meta" you have.
The difference lies in how I want to play the game. I change how I play from game to game, not from scum to town.

I'm not so vote-happy because then it gives my votes less impact when they're actually laid down. I'm not afraid of putting someone to L-2 or whatever, that was purely coincidence.

If you weren't vote happy, why vote him in the first place? If you don't care about putting someone to L-2, why did you unvote?

I unvoted because it was a vote for pressure and a vote for reactions. When I had gotten both, I unvoted.

So, all in all, this isn't scum behavior, nor is it typical of my playstyle. I don't think your case has any foundation considering you base it on meta, and I don't live up to a meta.

[Candillan]

I cannot get a read on Shaboo or Rach if they don't post anything which is making this pretty hard to contribute to.

And yes... Yes it does.

I agree.

[LnGrrrR]

To be honest, it's not even a meta tell Candy. If anyone said, "Hey guys, I always seem a little scummy but that doesn't mean Im scum" I would be suspicious of them.

You say it was a vote for pressure and reactions; Crand only had one post of note afterwards (in response to Grim). Does mean this post cleared him as town for you?

You also say you don't like to throw your vote around, but voting Grim and Crand just for pressure/reactions IS throwing your vote around. Throwing a vote on someone only to remove it after one post doesn't feel like you're trying to generate a lot of pressure.

[Candillan]

I didn't say that this game, and the only thing close to it was a joke.

Yes, I was 'throwing my vote around', but I wasn't known to have a habit of doing that. That's why I like to defy my 'meta'. Crand took my vote seriously because I wasn't known to do that often, and therefore likely assumed it was a serious vote. (which is was, but not because it was an actual scum accusation. It was for pressure. I saw a good opportunity, and I took it.)
My Grim vote, however, was RVS. You can't count that.

I didn't say I was clearing him as town. I'm still reading him. To be honest, the case on him is dependent on Raven being scum, as the whole case revolves around his RVS vote on Raven seeming suspicious. You can't call it scummy unless Raven is scum, as it's an associative tell.

I feel as if that's hit a sort of a dead end, as we don't know if either one is scum. If you're recommending a Crand flip because it'll be helpful, that's a different story. I haven't seen anyone say that yet, so I feel like people actually think he's scummy. Yet, on the other hand, I have seen no one challenge Raven.

The case is flawed, and thus I'm not pushing it.

[Crandaja]

I was under the impression that the RVS was just that. Random. This is still (technically) my first game of forum mafia anywhere.

I wasn't really expecting to get a wagon for making a joke. I'll remember that for my next game.

[Candillan]

Meh, I got a wagon on me because I didn't know what RVS even was.

[LnGrrrR]

I didn't say that this game, and the only thing close to it was a joke.

So the "aura of scumminess" and "easy wagon" lines from post 85 were jokes too?

Yes, I was 'throwing my vote around', but I wasn't known to have a habit of doing that. That's why I like to defy my 'meta'.

I said nothing about your voting in regards to your meta, only the "Oh no an RVS wagon!" comments.

You yourself said you werent vote happy but you were acting vote happy.

Crand took my vote seriously because I wasn't known to do that often, and therefore likely assumed it was a serious vote. (which is was, but not because it was an actual scum accusation. It was for pressure. I saw a good opportunity, and I took it.)

To me, one post from Crand doesn't feel like you provided a lot of pressure.

I didn't say I was clearing him as town. I'm still reading him. To be honest, the case on him is dependent on Raven being scum, as the whole case revolves around his RVS vote on Raven seeming suspicious. You can't call it scummy unless Raven is scum, as it's an associative tell.

Could you please explain this further? Also, if his case depends on Raven being scum, why not put pressure on Raven?