Mini 1552 - Paranoia [GAME OVER]

[GreyICE]

And yes, there's lots of scum motivation to go third party hunting and avoid making firm opinions and actually scumhunting. Look how shitty it is to fake scumhunting. Even if you win this debate with me, you'll just have one dead townie and even more questions tomorrow.

True for you.

Not in the least. If I'm wrong about muffin, I'm wrong about muffin. If I get mislynched because of it, it happens. I am quite willing to gamble the game that this sort of INTENSE discomfort at attention and behavior does not come from town.

I don't normally like to boast, MTD, because it's rude, and because I don't think that "I am the lord of scumhunting, sheep me" is in any way productive. But I am not at all bad at it. I can offer you links from the past that show exactly that. Now I have been on hiatus some time, and recently joined 4 games (this is one). Now, the following is a site rule:

Do not talk outside the game thread about an ongoing game except where explicitly allowed to do so by your role/moderator. Likewise, do not use bbcode to hide secret messages - this equates to discussion outside the thread.

You can see my other threads I am posting in and view them, along with all of my previous games by clicking this link.

I may have some confidence in my abilities. I feel I have earned it from many, many, many completed games. And this is one of my stronger scumreads.

Quoting this because I put some work into responding to MTD and I'm tired of my posts being lost in the general noise.

[GreyICE]

And yes, there's lots of scum motivation to go third party hunting and avoid making firm opinions and actually scumhunting. Look how shitty it is to fake scumhunting. Even if you win this debate with me, you'll just have one dead townie and even more questions tomorrow.

True for you.

Not in the least. If I'm wrong about muffin, I'm wrong about muffin. If I get mislynched because of it, it happens. I am quite willing to gamble the game that this sort of INTENSE discomfort at attention and behavior does not come from town.

I don't normally like to boast, MTD, because it's rude, and because I don't think that "I am the lord of scumhunting, sheep me" is in any way productive. But I am not at all bad at it. I can offer you links from the past that show exactly that. Now I have been on hiatus some time, and recently joined 4 games (this is one). Now, the following is a site rule:

Do not talk outside the game thread about an ongoing game except where explicitly allowed to do so by your role/moderator. Likewise, do not use bbcode to hide secret messages - this equates to discussion outside the thread.

You can see my other threads I am posting in and view them, along with all of my previous games by clicking this link.

I may have some confidence in my abilities. I feel I have earned it from many, many, many completed games. And this is one of my stronger scumreads.

Quoting this because I put some work into responding to MTD and I'm tired of my posts being lost in the general noise.

[zMuffinMan]

it doesn't say they're "unlynchable" anywhere - obviously i was using my own terminology

[zMuffinMan]

The Police Detectives don't count towards that "alive" population

this is what unlynchable was referring to btw

i used the word unlynchable because it's easier than saying "don't count towards the alive population"

[GreyICE]

The Police Detectives don't count towards that "alive" population

this is what unlynchable was referring to btw

i used the word unlynchable because it's easier than saying "don't count towards the alive population"

Hey MTD

I want you to say, on record, that it makes sense that he used "unlynchable" as a shorthand for "doesn't count towards the alive population"

And not from Antihero's post #48 where the moderator clearly states he's unlynchable.

This is the post in question by the way.

@muffin why vote empking after pI did?

i hadn't read the thread

it was late, couldn't be bothered reading,

saw OP, saw he was "unlynchable" in a bastard game

, figured i'd see what happens, voted, went to sleep.

Guyett, same question.

[zMuffinMan]

i'm beginning to think you're just really bad town and you genuinely think you have good reason to think i'm scum

which is saddening to the point of losing faith in humanity

[zMuffinMan]

Unvote
Vote: Dessew

[Antihero]

I dunno, I just do. I mean, just because they are mean and scary looking doesn't mean they are bad guys.

hahahafuck noone else outside (this game?) needs to know

Mod: delete the slip please

Slip deleted.

Now, I'll just go and find everyone who's read this thread and use that thing from Men in Black to delete their memories.

[Antihero]

Vote Count 1.5

Dessew - 1 (zMuffinMan)
dopog - 1 (Kovara)
GreyICE - 3 (MTD, shos, Guyett)
Kovara - 2 (Garmr)
MTD - 1 (dopog)
zMuffinMan - 4 (GreyICE, LadyLambdadelta, PrivateI, Dessew)

Not Voting: No one

6 to lynch. Deadline is in (expired on 2014-03-03 14:56:14).

[MTD]

And yes, there's lots of scum motivation to go third party hunting and avoid making firm opinions and actually scumhunting. Look how shitty it is to fake scumhunting. Even if you win this debate with me, you'll just have one dead townie and even more questions tomorrow.

True for you.

Not in the least. If I'm wrong about muffin, I'm wrong about muffin. If I get mislynched because of it, it happens. I am quite willing to gamble the game that this sort of INTENSE discomfort at attention and behavior does not come from town.

I don't normally like to boast, MTD, because it's rude, and because I don't think that "I am the lord of scumhunting, sheep me" is in any way productive. But I am not at all bad at it. I can offer you links from the past that show exactly that. Now I have been on hiatus some time, and recently joined 4 games (this is one). Now, the following is a site rule:

Do not talk outside the game thread about an ongoing game except where explicitly allowed to do so by your role/moderator. Likewise, do not use bbcode to hide secret messages - this equates to discussion outside the thread.

You can see my other threads I am posting in and view them, along with all of my previous games by clicking this link.

I may have some confidence in my abilities. I feel I have earned it from many, many, many completed games. And this is one of my stronger scumreads.

Quoting this because I put some work into responding to MTD and I'm tired of my posts being lost in the general noise.

Great stuff, but that wasn't my point, the point is, if he is town, you have gained nothing from this day, because all you did was to convince yourself that he is scum. Your answer to this is "but he can't be town" and that is a mindset that is either scummy or really bad play.

[MTD]

The Police Detectives don't count towards that "alive" population

this is what unlynchable was referring to btw

i used the word unlynchable because it's easier than saying "don't count towards the alive population"

Hey MTD

I want you to say, on record, that it makes sense that he used "unlynchable" as a shorthand for "doesn't count towards the alive population"

And not from Antihero's post #48 where the moderator clearly states he's unlynchable.

This is the post in question by the way.

@muffin why vote empking after pI did?

i hadn't read the thread

it was late, couldn't be bothered reading,

saw OP, saw he was "unlynchable" in a bastard game

, figured i'd see what happens, voted, went to sleep.

Guyett, same question.

I agree with you (probably) that these phrases don't necessarily mean the same, although "do not count towards the living population" does seem to imply unlynchable.
however I believe the point you are missing is, that at the point in time he made that post he in any case already knew they are unlynchable, so I think him using it in retrospective does actually make some sense. Also it is well possible that at the point of him writing this he did not remember exactly

hwhat

he read in the OP, I think "not counting towards the living pop" does at least warrant the same reaction.

I know this is speculation, but why would he try to put up such a big web of lied just to back up

one

vote he could easily label "didn't read the thread at all"?

[Kovara]

VOTE: Dessew

I'm down to get this started

[MTD]

eh only just saw I messed up the italics in my last post, sorry for that.

[Kovara]

and, there is the fact that the only people that I like are LLD and Grey. everyone else is super duper sketchyIn post 324, PrivateI wrote:In post 319, zMuffinMan wrote:are you actually retarded?Just don't...do your ad hom attacks as much as you want, (and believe me, they have been noted) but leave that crap out of this game.

Grey has actually been Ad homming the entire game.

So why do you like him?

Mommy and daddy have taught me to not judge based on appearance and attitude, but on merit. I don't like Grey's attitude at all, but he has yet to do anything bad.

That was placed there if, only, because of Private and his seeming distaste for Muffins "ad hom" though, completely sheeping grey's for his

[Garmr]

@ Garmr: Do you still think Kovara is scum?
You said you don't agree with the Muffin wagon, if the reasons for it are bad, what about those willing to hop on it?

unskilled or opportunistic scum
I should really just do a list of my town reads after through as this game is really getting paranoid as fuck

Lets take a look at the people who voted or want to vote

Grey ice-He seems to be paranoid as fuck his not acting like his usual sane self town or scum. So I really don't know how to handle him as a lot of the shit his cases have been null and one or two points a little have a tiniest bit of merit at best. I don't know what to make of him so I'm leaving him unrated

Dessew-at first I thought he was a vi but his hop onto the muffin wagon was a little more suss and his action send a couple of shivers down my spine. Through I think he could just be a vi because of mara's actions but I'll put him as null scum.

Guyyet-He makes me face palm and his a null read. Didn't this post here either

I wanted to lol hammer him to give myself time to read... then I remembered the last time I lol hammered and he was very pissed off with me for doing it.

That wasn't in response to your case, I hadn't read it at all.

Private-null-scum he just doesn't seem to give two fucks about this game.

LLD-Little reasoning to be on the muffin wagon I could not find one solid case to actually get on it null-scum



Now for the person who showed interest in the wagon yet didn't hop on


The scummy as fuck mara/kovara
So to rehash

1.

(if anyone hasn't noticed, Dessew and Dopog are both obviously scum)

Going for low hanging fruit

2.the preferred role thing she was incomplete with only one question and needed a couple of questions to get good result I feel she would of knew this. This is onlya minor peeve through and not enough to vote her on it's own.

3.

Also he made pretty stupid cases on Dessew and dopog, that are illogical at best.

(does not have a case on Dopog)

not one that is visible at least, for all you know I could be thinking he is bad because he is a dog and I am a cat and we are always fighting!

this does prove, though that you aren't really reading my posts and are assuming that I have actually made cases

I don't really even have one presented on Dessew, but hey what I do have is top notch!

Dopog- I don't like his reluctance to answer a simple question, overly paranoid as if he is scared that I might use this information against him... something that is almost exclusive to scum and has been reactive thus far. very likely scum

Like I mentioned these two post before you were trying to deny you had made any case on depog at all and I feel this a major scum point as she is deflecting and denying something she posted.

NOW HERE'S THE KICKER

she's been attacking people on the muffin wagon

I'm actually getting sold on GreyICE's "tell". It's something that I've seen, and quite honestly, done in off-site games. Is it conclusive? No.

With that in mind, and with the promise of future, more in-depth examinations of Muffin and shos specifically,

VOTE: Muffin

another vulture!

The wagon on Muffin makes sense to me now, with these explanations both from Greyice and Lambdadelta told. I'm posting from my phone, and I won't look up the votes now, if it's L-1, consider this to be an

intent to hammer

. I still don't like Korava, but we have time for that.

Shos: have you tried unvoting?

...

so many uncublike words running through my head

for example, I now kinda think that you are a third party jester. that is precisely the tell that you said only mafia do. and you..you fit to TWO possible third parties by now - a lyncher for Muffin, and a jester; I don't see how you're going up town and muffin's scum.

Also..

that doesn't work because you stated it after he explained it you silly lion you

I am also not at all fond of lynching anyone before the (what I assume to be) the major mechanic gets to come into play. I think cops are a pro-town faction, kinda

and, all I see is a flailing muffin, and I'm not really fond of most of his scum-tells at all. like, honestly, I think LLD's scum-muffin points are more alluring than Grey's one

Privates vote, and Dessew's vote in spirit are really turning me off

In post 330, zMuffinMan wrote:
kovara wrote:
This, is what I agree with.

what specifically do you agree with?


Everything except the last phrase, though I resonate a whole lot more with the first sentence than anything else there. It makes sense, and it gives a little bit of what your mindset could be but that's pretty much it.

it's weak, though and there is quite a bit of burden of proficiency, though it is still a whole lot better than what grey has given. I'm not going to join your wagon, as I'm much more interested in my scum-spects, and what sho's would have to say when he come back from interrogation (if he comes back at all)

and, there is the fact that the only people that I like are LLD and Grey. everyone else is super duper sketchy

This to me is her staying off the wagon. She seems to know he will flip town and it echos through her voice yet she keeps the option to jump to hammer if times running out. She is also setting up her votes for the next day or if the wagons falling apart. She seems to me like the typical scum off wagon.

[dopog]

Hey I be back from being away and bad net and stuff : )

Yeah so I'm having trouble trying to read this game. muffin and greyice is starting to read to me like a giant wash, null-fiesta. And really I've been liking MTD's recent posts
Think I'm realising I have a predisposition to reading aggressive playstyles as town when really I dunno... Just need to think. Like legit think.
blah blah

unvote
vote privateI

Only really scumreading private cause yeah just seems like he's trying to do nothing without being held accountable; which is what happens.
Maybe bad atmosphere/vibe about Garmr but that's it really : S

about PrivateI: there's no way scum would do that. no way. going to call that one town.

@Shos can you just flesh that out a bit when you come back? Wanna hear WHY you say that!

@Kovara: don't think you're scum @@@

@Guyett: hi; how much of the thread had you read before #347?

cyaaaa

[Guyett]

Its guyett not gayett

[Guyett]

I read a bit... enough to see the muffin wagon is pants on head retarded

[Garmr]

I read a bit... enough to see the muffin wagon is pants on head retarded

Will def agree with this.

[Kovara]

So, the people I'm pushing are null-scum... Am I betraying my pridemates, or something?

I've only attacked three people (Private, Dog, Dessew) and only one of which I attacked while he hopped onto the wagon, the other two was prior two that and, if I was going to attack people on the wagon anyway, there was nothing stopping me from attacking Grey, LLD, and NS none of which are to incredibly hard to attack though, in the same post you call people on the wagon Opportunistic scum or dumbtown and find it strange as to why I don't want to be on that wagon in the first place..?

I've also never been shy of my suspicion on Dessew prior to him joining the wagon, hell I'd be a much happier cub if he was voting me. I would at least know that he is trying to scum-hunt and not go for the easiest target there is, he hasn't even tried to explain why I'm a bad cub.

I've not once said that I will hammer, just that there were a few things that I agreed with vs a whole lot that I don't. You're unwilling to go on the muffin wagon based on composition, how do your scum points on me not apply to you? aside from your grey, LLD, and me scum-read our thoughts are pretty much the same as are our uneasiness's with the game

speaking of Grey, where are you getting the notion that this isn't his normal play? This cub has only played with him once, but he feels exactly the same as he was in that one game and he was town. I've never seen scumgrey, but that's more than enough for me to town-read him

why would I try and deny I did something as scum, vs town when the best way to make yourself look good is to make cases? (and scum is all about looking good and getting mislynches and yaddayaddayadday)

I've denied making a case, but I didn't deny making the passing comment and explained the difference between the two when you originally brought it up

[Kovara]

(also, if anyone didn't catch my claim before, I'm hated)

[MTD]

(also, if anyone didn't catch my claim before, I'm hated)

Yeah, got that, but why do you feel the need to point that out especially at this point?

[Kovara]

Because quick hammers always seem to happen when this cub is fast asleep and I don't want that to happen again

[Garmr]

So, the people I'm pushing are null-scum... Am I betraying my pridemates, or something?

I've only attacked three people (Private, Dog, Dessew) and only one of which I attacked while he hopped onto the wagon, the other two was prior two that and, if I was going to attack people on the wagon anyway, there was nothing stopping me from attacking Grey, LLD, and NS none of which are to incredibly hard to attack though, in the same post you call people on the wagon Opportunistic scum or dumbtown and find it strange as to why I don't want to be on that wagon in the first place..?

I've also never been shy of my suspicion on Dessew prior to him joining the wagon, hell I'd be a much happier cub if he was voting me. I would at least know that he is trying to scum-hunt and not go for the easiest target there is, he hasn't even tried to explain why I'm a bad cub.

I've not once said that I will hammer, just that there were a few things that I agreed with vs a whole lot that I don't. You're unwilling to go on the muffin wagon based on composition, how do your scum points on me not apply to you? aside from your grey, LLD, and me scum-read our thoughts are pretty much the same as are our uneasiness's with the game

speaking of Grey, where are you getting the notion that this isn't his normal play? This cub has only played with him once, but he feels exactly the same as he was in that one game and he was town. I've never seen scumgrey, but that's more than enough for me to town-read him

why would I try and deny I did something as scum, vs town when the best way to make yourself look good is to make cases? (and scum is all about looking good and getting mislynches and yaddayaddayadday)

I've denied making a case, but I didn't deny making the passing comment and explained the difference between the two when you originally brought it up

1.The difference is I was defending a town read and you weren't you were preparing to lynch if you had to and then attack others on the wagon.
2.I played with grey town before in my newbie games and he wasn't like this.
3.I never said you were ever shy about dessew were are you coming up with this notion?
4.You didn't have to say a thing about hammering I could tell by the way you were setting it up your posts as that's what I would do as scum.


To be honest I can't see anything town since you joined the game. My guts been churning ever since your first serious posts.

[Antihero]

shos is back from questioning! He can post in the thread again.