Open 566: Murder on the Oriental Express (Game Over)

[Green Crayons]

Apparently having 50% options throughout the game on who to lynch should look town to GC for some reason.

I never claimed my process makes me look town. Although using POE when we had three mislynches to go through is solid strategy, it isn't alignment indicative.

I'm saying that my process doesn't make me look like scum.

[ChannelDelibird]

You need to read my links and tell me why I'm wrong.

I've read the game. A lot. GC's behaviour is not unnatural. It is reflective of a difficult game in which reads are constantly being questioned and in which we have had to compromise ever since the scrambles lynch. You are holding him to a higher standard than several other players for no good reason.

[farside22]

lol

The only lynch I have ~*~ wanted ~*~ for the past two days is a farside lynch.

I have settled for pursuing other lynches. Just like CDB did yesterday. Just like Riddle is doing today.

Riddles options were you or ckd.
he didn't list 3 or 4 people he was willing to lynch day 4 like you did and you sure have no issue with day 6 if I get lynched on pushing what CKD? Riddle? Maybe bring CBD to the ring since he stated riddle as a 2nd option after my lynch.

Let me know how this doesn't read as a game plan.

Where the fuck do I go after today?

No where and tomorrow when I'm dead you will still have your options open.

Give me a fucking break.

[farside22]

You need to read my links and tell me why I'm wrong.

I've read the game. A lot. GC's behaviour is not unnatural. It is reflective of a difficult game in which reads are constantly being questioned and in which we have had to compromise ever since the scrambles lynch. You are holding him to a higher standard than several other players for no good reason.

I'm holding him to a standard that is not freeking higher.
You have 2 scum reads.
Riddle has 2 scum reads
Titus has 2 scum reads.
I have 1.

How the fuck am I holding him to a higher standard?

[Green Crayons]

It's like you read a game where I just pulled names out of the air to make the POE scum pool.

Oh, wait, that game didn't happen. You're just ignoring how this game actually unfolded.


lol, okay, I'm scum because I wasn't able to whittle down to 2 scum candidates by today? lol

[Green Crayons]

You have 2 scum reads.
Riddle has 2 scum reads
Titus has 2 scum reads.
I have 1.

Wait, I thought you were all up in arms by the fact that I was looking at only two people: CKD and farside?

This is where I see a motive with lynches. I know I'm town so his move to CKD and saying he could convince riddle on my lynch if CKD is town makes me read lining up lynches for a scum win.

lol, already debunked:

And here's further scum logic. "You think Player X and Player Y are scum candidates. I think Player X and Player Y are town. You must therefore be scum setting up mislynches!"

This surface-level logic - refusing to consider and weigh the basis for a player's suspicions - is a great scum template, because it can be applied to anyone! Examples:

1) farside thinks GC and Titus are scum candidates. I think GC and Titus are town. Therefore farside must be scum, setting up mislynches!
2) Riddle thinks CKD and GC are scum candidates. I think CKD and GC are town. Therefore Riddle must be scum, setting up mislynches!
3) CKD thinks GC and CBD (I think?) are scum candidates. I think GC and CBD are town. Therefore CKD must be scum, setting up mislynches!

lol, double standard, these people aren't also suspicious to farside for the exact same play:

I really can't make it simpler than this, CKD.

Especially

if I thought I had more time than I did, why wouldn't I want somebody who I could still quite plausibly see as town to show signs of reconsidering and making sure that they were on the right track? How many times do I have to explain that the choice between you and Amy is essentially arbitrary to me before you accept that I'm not protraying you as Beelzebub incarnate?

No one's willing to join me on CKD. Thus, my options are stay on CKD and be a stubborn person; or compromise. You even awknowledged this stance yourself with Farside/Amy yesterday.

I already said that CKD and you are my main suspects. Voting CKD first is safer, yes, in the rare event both of you are town. But no one is willing to join me on it (bar GC who doesn't seem to be really buying CKD as scum which farside pointed out)

[farside22]

You have 2 scum reads.
Riddle has 2 scum reads
Titus has 2 scum reads.
I have 1.

Wait, I thought you were all up in arms by the fact that I was looking at only two people: CKD and farside?

This is where I see a motive with lynches. I know I'm town so his move to CKD and saying he could convince riddle on my lynch if CKD is town makes me read lining up lynches for a scum win.

lol, already debunked:

And here's further scum logic. "You think Player X and Player Y are scum candidates. I think Player X and Player Y are town. You must therefore be scum setting up mislynches!"

This surface-level logic - refusing to consider and weigh the basis for a player's suspicions - is a great scum template, because it can be applied to anyone! Examples:

1) farside thinks GC and Titus are scum candidates. I think GC and Titus are town. Therefore farside must be scum, setting up mislynches!
2) Riddle thinks CKD and GC are scum candidates. I think CKD and GC are town. Therefore Riddle must be scum, setting up mislynches!
3) CKD thinks GC and CBD (I think?) are scum candidates. I think GC and CBD are town. Therefore CKD must be scum, setting up mislynches!

lol, double standard, these people aren't also suspicious to farside for the exact same play:

I really can't make it simpler than this, CKD.

Especially

if I thought I had more time than I did, why wouldn't I want somebody who I could still quite plausibly see as town to show signs of reconsidering and making sure that they were on the right track? How many times do I have to explain that the choice between you and Amy is essentially arbitrary to me before you accept that I'm not protraying you as Beelzebub incarnate?

No one's willing to join me on CKD. Thus, my options are stay on CKD and be a stubborn person; or compromise. You even awknowledged this stance yourself with Farside/Amy yesterday.

I already said that CKD and you are my main suspects. Voting CKD first is safer, yes, in the rare event both of you are town. But no one is willing to join me on it (bar GC who doesn't seem to be really buying CKD as scum which farside pointed out)

That's today.

Day 4 you had Amy, me, Ckd and cbd
Today you said CBD and me then switched to Ckd and me.

Let me know which one I should believe since it keeps changing.

[Riddleton]

How many people has he listed as scum? Do you know I have seen scum do the exact same thing not to long ago.

Oh, a meta attack without citing the previous game.

Quick, Riddle, get in here and make sure to be as critical of this meta attack on me as you were of my "meta" attack on farside!

(insert critical non-approving post here)

[Riddleton]

I'll be doing some analysis tonight so stay tuned for that.

[Riddleton]

farside

, you have one scumread correct, in GC? Whom would you think is scum should GC hypothetically flip town?

[Riddleton]

Hey

CDB

, I noticed this and I want you to clarify:

Most questions are about farside, though, really. Again, will definitely be rereading around those things but, combined with the stuff I raised last night, this is starting to feel like something I want to explore.

I definitely want the farside-v-GC argument to go the fuck away because it's obnoxiously loud and long, and right now I'm definitely inclined to want farside gone first.

This seems to imply you see the final scum in the farside vs GC argument, correct? That it's not just town vs town noise?

[ChannelDelibird]

That's not meant to say that scum is definitely in that pair but I do think that, if neither are scum, we need their really loud conflict to no longer be an issue because it would continue both to distract them and to make the thread more obnoxious for the rest of us to read. It helps that I think that farside is now the likeliest scum - partially because her participation in the argument does not stand up as genuine scumhunting - but, if I were a player unsure about who looks scummiest, I would want to lynch the scummiest of the two.

[Riddleton]

CDB

, so was your lynch order in a later post ("Farside > Riddle > GC > CKD > Titus") a typo considering you think the likely final scum is in the GC vs farside interactions?

---

Anyway, I need to rethink about the game. I'm not so sure of the gamestate as I initially thought.

[farside22]

farside

, you have one scumread correct, in GC? Whom would you think is scum should GC hypothetically flip town?

POE: would be titus.
She's been MIA since the scrambles vote

[ChannelDelibird]

CDB

, so was your lynch order in a later post ("Farside > Riddle > GC > CKD > Titus") a typo considering you think the likely final scum is in the GC vs farside interactions?

That's not what I just said. I think farside is likely the final scum. I think GC is probably town, though less certain of that than I am of Titus and CKD. The order was not a typo.

[curiouskarmadog]

Hey

CDB

, I noticed this and I want you to clarify:

Most questions are about farside, though, really. Again, will definitely be rereading around those things but, combined with the stuff I raised last night, this is starting to feel like something I want to explore.

I definitely want the farside-v-GC argument to go the fuck away because it's obnoxiously loud and long, and right now I'm definitely inclined to want farside gone first.

This seems to imply you see the final scum in the farside vs GC argument, correct? That it's not just town vs town noise?

this....this is why I think Riddle is town. furthermore, this is an excellent point.

[curiouskarmadog]

Hey

CDB

, I noticed this and I want you to clarify:

Most questions are about farside, though, really. Again, will definitely be rereading around those things but, combined with the stuff I raised last night, this is starting to feel like something I want to explore.

I definitely want the farside-v-GC argument to go the fuck away because it's obnoxiously loud and long, and right now I'm definitely inclined to want farside gone first.

This seems to imply you see the final scum in the farside vs GC argument, correct? That it's not just town vs town noise?

this....this is why I think Riddle is town. furthermore, this is an excellent point.

when I first read that, it sounds like an opinion of someone who thought X and Y were town. Who cares if the argument is obnoxiously loud and long. info can be obtained through that "long" argument. You (CDB) "feel" like one person in that argument is scum. Shouldnt you be pouring over it to see if a.) you are on the right track and b.) what you scum suspect is saying and not saying? what else is being discussed today that is MORE important in your eyes?

[ChannelDelibird]

We've already been over the fact that I've skimmed some of the longer posts at times and missed things being discussed (the no-majority-necessary-to-lynch-at-deadline rule, for example). That's the kind of issue that I'm getting at with arguments like this.

Now please also bear in mind the fact that I since

have

been poring over said argument in the process of reevaluating both farside and GC. But I've always been fairly upfront (in this game and in others) about the fact that I find excessively long posts a pain in the arse and will sometimes not read them, at least initially.

Also I don't really know how you got that I was saying that both of them were town in that post because it is one of several around that time which pointed out that I was increasingly suspecting farside.

[curiouskarmadog]

usually in games. when someone says, "I think the argument between X and Y is loud/obnoxious/distracting/whatever" is because they are not interested in the argument because X and Y are town (or perceived town). Who cares about two townies going at it? When someone I think is scum is posting. I am fucking reeeeaadddding their posts. Looking for slips or trips. Looking for lies to add to my case. looking for mentions that I can meta or follow up on. Or looking for insight...seeing how others are attacking them. REadjusting my suspects if needed. Are they scum or an easy target?

[ChannelDelibird]

Sure, but I don't really understand where your problem is. For a long time I thought both of them were town and so I found their argument merely an annoyance (and, as others picked up on, it distracted me from noticing some of the things discussed in their posts, like the deadline rules). I've always wanted it to go away. Before it was because I thought they were both town. Now it's because I think farside is scum.

[Baezu]

Vote Count 5.08

(L-2)

Farside22: (2) Green Crayons, ChannelDelibird

(L-2)

Green Crayons: (2) Farside22, Riddleton
Riddleton: (1) Titus

Not Voting: Curiouskarmadog

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Deadline: (expired on 2014-11-25 17:49:00)

Mod Notes:
None

[/area]

[farside22]

I'm not going to keep going back and forth with GC.
I made my point. I don't know why cbd disagrees with me.
I'll go 1 for 1 with GC.
I just want cbd to think about what I said when I flip town, in case he's around during end game.

[Green Crayons]

Nothing new to post.

[curiouskarmadog]

so if all things stay constant, you will be lynched GC..thoughts?

[curiouskarmadog]

I just want cbd to think about what I said when I flip town, in case he's around during end game.

why post this sentence...as of right now, you are not going to be lynched.