New York 180 (Endgame)

[FakedBlogger]

Oh wow, so go after the guy who asked for replace? Being fluffy and defending people he thinks to be town are part of Grib's meta.

You on the other hand have contributed nothing. Again, going for an easy target.

And Grib,

How can he think someone is town if he's not reading the game?

[elusive]

MathBlade, yeah I joined here due to him

Also, I kind of retired the Former Names and Known Accomplices. Most likely the main one will be Estival, or Es. This site doesn't allow for name switching so its more awkward. Also, imagine if I wanted a secret alt I'd be screwed.

NakedJogger, he was reading at a point and also he knows certain players meta. I don't know why all your scum reads are so easy. Easy here is players who's natural style is not all deductive logic or psychological reaction testing.

[FakedBlogger]

LOl aight,

We have 7 hours left

VOTE: Grib
Because we have (expired on 2015-02-22 00:00:00) till deadline

I suggest everyone who know they can get in here 3 hours before and around lynch time: Vote for who you think is scummiest now. 3 Hours before deadline vote for one of the leading wagons and around lynch time consolidate the lynch.

I'm off.

[elusive]

pisskop, the people who say stuff like "tomorrow blah blah blah wagon" I think that they suffer from a heavy dose of procrastination. Get in my face now instead of waiting for night actions like all scum cowards and their underlings.

[MathBlade]

Anyway, MathBlade leading the NakedJogger wagon should tell you how reliable it is (not at all.)

Again, all these counterwagons are really dangerous and could prevent us getting a lynch today. Wake,

stop

suggesting 3 new wagons. Consolidate on the ones we have - Klingoncelt is the biggest and the best.

........ Seriously. People need to stop saying I'm unreliable without evidence to back that shit up.

1) In the 2 prior completed town games I managed to FoS or lynch scum or 3P d1.
2) In one of my two prior scum games I Fos'd scum the entire time and still had a perfect victory.
3) In the other scum game managed to avoid suspicion until an unknown mechanic bit me in the ass.

So for those of you who just say "I suck" You may take your argument and deposit in the spewing bullshit pile.

[dragonspawn]

Doing an iso of Grib.

Catching up now! Yay.

Summarize anything important I should know, otherwise I'll vote and fail to give adequate reads because too many players.

Meaning you can give adequate reads based on someone's summary. Naive town or scum testing the waters.

peeks into thread

sees Cop claim

screams

Some of you have fucking long ISOs that are 50% nonsense. I have a few townreads but a ton of nulls.

VOTE: Jared

Sheeping a PR.

That was a beautiful story, but elusive is town.

Says he peeks into the thread. Hardcore defends elusive 5 minutes later. Maybe I'm the one most suited to bitch about meta.

His #853 suggests he can play this game but is unwilling unless someone point him towards something.

#884, 886, 889 3 whiteknighting-ABR posts

This post really bothers me. For one, I'm not really a fan of the "If I were scum" approach to things. It reads to me like you're trying to make us believe scum would do the opposite of what you're doing.

The second thing is that you're literally asking us for our opinions before taking any sort of stance. That's just as bad as what Kitz did above, really.

Or that's just me trying to explain how I'm feeling w/r/t the game. I don't expect you to take my word for it, nor will I fault you for being suspicious, but at least this way it can't be said I didn't tell you so.

I'm asking to be pointed in a general direction so I know where to direct my focus. I'm trying to get engaged in what's going on currently rather than hanging around in the past, because being in a perpetual state of catching up annoys me and makes me not want to play.

"Tell me who you're scumreading so I can piggyback"

Is there any evidence to suggest I've been piggybacking, or are you just looking for an easy attack?

And why not pressure me yourself instead of FoS'ing me and hopping on the popular wagon?

AtE. Still claims to be in a perpetual state of catching up. Is accusing Aeronaut of not FoS'ing in the same post where he answers to Aeronauts questioning, preemptively defensive.

UNVOTE:

I like Kitz's last post and agree with her townreads (although they'd be more accurate if I were on it, just sayin').

Unvotes Kitz for ranting about meta. This is where I'm getting annoyed. Not only did he use pure meta to block my pressure on ellusive but goes along with the Kitz pressure and just sabotages it from within this time. Scum motivation: defend scum or get townreads from targets. Town motivation: ?

Is he annoying, or scum?

Tells a player known to troll that he's annoying. When did that ever turn out well?

UNVOTE:

I like Kitz's last post and agree with her townreads (although they'd be more accurate if I were on it, just sayin').

What exactly do you like about it. The AtE, the strawman, the newbie card play or the fact that she hasn't provided any argumentation for her reads?

- I think it's a fair rant.
- I've seen strawman tossed around in so many games. Elaborate or it's just a buzzword.
- I'm meh on the newbie card.
- You didn't read the last paragraph. If you ask her for reasons and she ignores you, then I'll concede this point.

He lectures me about the last paragraph, suggesting he read it thoroughly, but calls my argument a buzzword, wants me to elaborate.

Spoiler: I've said what I had to say

Why can't I call out on someone for doing mass one-liners, mass sheeping, bad sheepherding,et cetera?

I assume this is the true reason I'm actually being voted on.

Sounds like a strawman unless someone can confirm voting you for these reasons.

He acts like me saying Kitz gave a fake reason for being voted that she can easily combat, i.e.: mass one-liners, mass sheeping, bad sheepherding, etc. needs further explanation.

VOTE: Grib

so you want to lynch a replacement request? Didn't the klingon wagon start for this very issue?

[MathBlade]

Hell you can say you don't understand it. Even that you don't get it. Or that you don't like my playstyle.

But to out and out suggest I suck is a load of horse manure. I'm not the best but continuing to just go "Oh it's Mathblade" is NOT cool.

@dragonspawn -- Tbh NJ is scum.

It's easier to post a scumread about someone who can't post back than to have cajones and post your thoughts and interact with your scumread.

[FA_Q2]

Ellie claimed?

Yes, see aero's post above:

I never claimed mason. I said a missing puzzle piece could explain my posts, and that I doubt elusive would be lynched. Both statements are 100% true. Hardly my fault you guys misinterpreted.

Elusive is very unlikely to be lynched

after

my flip either.

Explain this post, please.

Ditto on wanting that explanation. That was a pretty clear indication that your death would have some bearing on Elusive's alignment. There is only a limited nuber of roles that would fit that discription that I am aware of - mostly mason or mason like roles. BTW, it IS your fault if you think we are 'misinterperting' what you said. You should have made a statment that was more clear if you dont want people to get the wrong idea. Interestingly enough, MANY people already pointed this out several times. It is not like only a few got the impression that you were soft claiming.

Of even more note is that

you have failed to correct this so called 'misunderstanding' until many many pages later AND elusive seems to have denied the connection.'

This has you pegged hard scum for me. Everything about that exchange seems scummy.

Elusive seems to deny your claim here (as others have pointed out already):

Boonskiies, I'm not sure what connection you see between me and Ellie as there is no in-game connection and idk about the rest. Wake have you played with Ellie before and know of their play style?

And for Wake's question:

@Everyone:

If you had to choose between pisskop, Ellie, and vikingfan, which would you go for and why?

BONUS:

List these three in order from most suspicious to least.

Ellie - see above
pisskop - a lot of people seem to be calling them scum but I don't see a real case here. I am null on this one.
viking - I don't believe the claim either BUT I am not willing to lynch him today. Lynching a claimed cop on day one is bad juju without solid proof they are lying.

Ellie is certainly a good lynch candidate at this time. I would change over to her wagon if there was a good chance that it would fly this late. I don't see that happening though and I am fine with a Kling lynch as well. Not seeing any good reason to switch to NJ.

[FA_Q2]

That's the thing, Klingon is the best vote for today. Her comment that town is 100% gurantee'd to lose if she's lynched is not sitting right with me at all. I've said similar things as scum. I also feel like we are very close to a NL and starting a wagon on anyone else is pointless and a NL on D1 is a bad idea. I also feel like she's already claimed and I don't want to bring someone new within claiming range with all the claiming bullcrap already taking place. Plus, I've already laid out a case that Klingon arrogantly dismissed as playing from an outdated wiki which is crap also.

I have failed to see anyone make a really good case on NJ scum. I do see the aggro play and all the vote switching. I would vote there to avoid a NL as a compromise but I really haven't sorted NJ. Beginning play seemed town, later play less so but I'm not sure if it's scum or playstyle to get reactions.

Agreed with the town looses if she is lynched comment. That is not only an asinine comment but does not seem very much like her IMHO. Something is off.

I think Klingon's town & mislynch bait. Forgets she claimed VT. Says pisskop is cop. Votes TSO over easier NJ wagon.

Voting her reads before trying to survive.

Looks like forgetful or distracted town.

Except that is only true now AFTER it was pointed out that she was essentially all over easy wagons as they appeared. She was on both the Kitz wagon where I am sure there is scum for the speed and lack of reasoning as well as the viking wagon. To say that she is avoiding the low haniging fruit is not really the case.

Of course, it is even worse now considering that a vote for TSO is essentially a vote for a no lynch as it is unreasonable to think that an effective wag0on is going to form on him at this late hour without a much more solid case. Looks even more scummy.

[pisskop]

pisskop, the people who say stuff like "tomorrow blah blah blah wagon" I think that they suffer from a heavy dose of procrastination. Get in my face now instead of waiting for night actions like all scum cowards and their underlings.

I understand that pro-action tends to trump reaction, and I'm not opposed to her wagon or Boon's vote in general. But this late in the day its going to attract a limited crowd, because everyone is now largely voting to lynch or sitting on older reads.
. I didn't have you figured as aggressive, but I could see you as very proactive and extroverted. I admit its not easy for me to always push

[Ozgin]

NakedJogger, he was reading at a point and also he knows certain players meta. I don't know why all your scum reads are so easy. Easy here is players who's natural style is not all deductive logic or psychological reaction testing.

I know this wasn't directed at me, but I am curious. Just because someone knows some players' metas, and read some parts but not all of a game, does that make them of ample mind to vote accurately?

I would venture to say that if people don't understand the context of recent events, it's hard for them to get involved in recent events. I sympathize with Grib because I'm behind too as a replacement but I know that if I don't get a grasp on these wagons and the current mindset of everyone at the moment then I'm going to fall behind and be marginalized into lurking. Simply because posting would make me look and feel really stupid if I don't know what's going on! That's my current struggle, and I can understand Grib's.

However, Grib, I don't agree with just not reading. It'll be faster to read and catch up on the main events of the recent history of the game than it would be to throw yourself into the mix and struggle until things make sense. It would take longer for you to just throw yourself in and adapt fully to the situation than it would to just ISO the vote counts and read 8-10 posts before and after each one, at least.

And even if you

can

just jump into the water and start swimming, you'll be disoriented no matter what happens. You'll inevitably swim in the wrong direction. By this, I mean even if you jump into the game and hope to find your bearing, you'll still be missing information which may ultimately result in you pushing wagons for no good reason or making yourself look like a scum.

Moral of the story, kids, is to read a damn book.

This message has been sponsored by your local library.

[Ozgin]

EBWOP:

book

thread*

-PS-

I did this EBWOP on purpose

[FA_Q2]

If you had to choose between pisskop, Ellie, and vikingfan, which would you go for and why?

Ellie.
I don't know if I trust Ellie. I do believe viking's claim, though. I can't imagine a D1 cop claim not being outed.

?

Why? That is the least likely time that a CC is going to happen. That is the entire point of scum trying to claim a really good PR after all - to get them to out themselves.

[MathBlade]

FA_Q2 -- Let me be clearer. Anyone voting Ellie better vote me first because I will defend her to my dying breath. Got it. And hence another reason VF's claim is full of shit. I should know. I have faked guilties twice believably so now I'm fucked if I ever draw cop

@Ozgin -- Ask ika post game. I'm better as a replacement than I am at the start of games. I'm a lethal end game replace.

[Kitz]

She was on both the Kitz wagon where I am sure there is scum for the speed and lack of reasoning as well as the viking wagon.

Oh god, someone with logical sense. It hurts. But really, the speed and lack of reasoning... There's definitively scum among there.

---

NJ is even more scummy for trying to avert two wagons into someone currently irrelevant, attempting to halt the votes so there won't be a lynch, or a last-ditch effort to gain towncred, when there's less than six hours left of the day.
My vote stays.

[Aeronaut]

I have faked guilties twice believably so now I'm fucked if I ever draw cop

That's awful.

[elusive]

Yeah, NJ's "scum" targets are all baby fruit that's unripe so he seems like a scum. It seems like he's trying very very hard to not be associated with any players who aren't "light." That is any major players. Afraid to flip and be associated with someone?

pisskop, I have 2 modes. Fluffy with a bit of aggression or aggressive as hell with loopy fluff. I haven't really gotten aggressive yet but I'm sure you'll miss the fluff mode.

Re: people saying stuff about MathBlade. The last game I was on a forum she had the scum team pegged and it was the stupidity of town including me that led to town losing. I've never seen her as scum so idk about that. Sometimes it can be hard to understand her hints or follow her reads because she's also a mix of emotional\intuitive especially if you're dense. I suggest people cut down the attacking playstyle anyway because that road leads to sadness and cruelty and burn books.

[MathBlade]

I have faked guilties twice believably so now I'm fucked if I ever draw cop

That's awful.

I was 3P both times But it's fun

[vikingfan]

FA_Q2 -- Let me be clearer. Anyone voting Ellie better vote me first because I will defend her to my dying breath. Got it. And hence another reason VF's claim is full of shit. I should know. I have faked guilties twice believably so now I'm fucked if I ever draw cop

@Ozgin -- Ask ika post game. I'm better as a replacement than I am at the start of games. I'm a lethal end game replace.

If you don't believe me, have ABR check me. He's a claimed tracker and can easily verify my claim.

And ugh on NJ's latest post trying to lynch someone who's already asked for replacement. You should be trying to convince us why we should vote klingon over you.

And this deadline is going to screw us over with the ellie situation .

[FA_Q2]

FA_Q2 -- Let me be clearer. Anyone voting Ellie better vote me first because I will defend her to my dying breath. Got it. And hence another reason VF's claim is full of shit. I should know. I have faked guilties twice believably so now I'm fucked if I ever draw cop

@Ozgin -- Ask ika post game. I'm better as a replacement than I am at the start of games. I'm a lethal end game replace.

You are crystal clear. Clarity is not the problem. The fact that I think you are incorrect is the problem.

I do find it strange that you are essentially saying the same thing that she said about elusive.

You are not defending her. You are making naked statements that she is town. That is not going to change anyone's mind nor is claiming that you should be lynched first. Right now, I do not read you as scum and I read her as scum hence I am willing to vote ellie and not you.

[pisskop]

Why? That is the least likely time that a CC is going to happen. That is the entire point of scum trying to claim ai really good PR after all - to get them to out themselves.

Hunh. I guess if they thought they could perform more townishly than the actual cop. And nobody tried to track them. Was that a part of the old site meta?

[FA_Q2]

FA_Q2 -- Let me be clearer. Anyone voting Ellie better vote me first because I will defend her to my dying breath. Got it. And hence another reason VF's claim is full of shit. I should know. I have faked guilties twice believably so now I'm fucked if I ever draw cop

@Ozgin -- Ask ika post game. I'm better as a replacement than I am at the start of games. I'm a lethal end game replace.

If you don't believe me, have ABR check me. He's a claimed tracker and can easily verify my claim.

And ugh on NJ's latest post trying to lynch someone who's already asked for replacement. You should be trying to convince us why we should vote klingon over you.

And this deadline is going to screw us over with the ellie situation .

No reason to screw us over. People just need to support one of the leading wagons or enough need to jump on ellie to make it a viable lynch.

[FA_Q2]

Why? That is the least likely time that a CC is going to happen. That is the entire point of scum trying to claim ai really good PR after all - to get them to out themselves.

Hunh. I guess if they thought they could perform more townishly than the actual cop. And nobody tried to track them. Was that a part of the old site meta?

?

I am confused at what you are trying to say here. It supports what I was getting at and I have no idea about the 'old' site. This is essentially my first game here

A cop claim on day one is unlikely to be CC for precisely those reasons - the fake cop can be caught without reveling the real cop at a later time. The fake claiming scum WANTS a counter claim (at least this early in the game) - then they can take out the cop before there are any confirmed townies/scum.

[dragonspawn]

Focus on the wagons. Ellie can wait till tomorrow. We will be able to talk it through an analyze more data then.

[MathBlade]

I don't believe ABR either. As said ABR fake claims too much. The only way I'll believe you is if you start playing protown and provide good results. Claiming cop and then not helping the thread is not cool. You need to hunt and investigate. Why are you so damn concerned about a player who everyone thinks "sucks" anyway huh? I think you're scum but if you are town you'd be trying to work towards a lynch instead of being defensive.

Again. There is NO ELLIE LYNCH. It will be me before her. PERIOD. And her play has been remarkably protown. Discussing her when it likely won't lead to a lynch is anti-town. I won't lynch her and if needed I will make one of the biggest walls of her towniness. Hands off the Ellie.

@Lyrium(elusive) -- Calming down process initiated. Sorry just multiple games in a row where people go "It's MathBlade" as the only reason to not listen irks me. :/

@FA_Q2 -- exactly why VF is prob scum and with that NJ. VF did that probably just to avoid a lynch and lookie here a ton of people say "we won't lynch claimed cop" *sigh*