In post 447, bji wrote:Why don't you just come out and say what you think instead of hinting like this?
He's calling nickname/Ari scum. He literally calls him such.
. What you saw in sentence one was something else.
@Giffie
. Not really much I can ask you atm. Aero's posting caused my read; his attituide and approach.
Am I crazy? Do you agree with his opinion/pushes?
.There's not much I can hold you accountable for answering, save perhaps why you think your predecessor was blatently ignoring every point that didn't have a pro-town answer.
beeboy - Everyone thought this game was made to troll pie but it was really made to troll pisskop. Almost50 pisskop: Overall, that's a townie slot. Don't ask for specifics because with PK everything can be interpreted either way. It's probably WHEN he says/does things that matter, so it's more of a matter of conception rather than solid reasoning.
Lapsa wrote:Gliffie, did Aero told you his alignment from the very start of this game?
Yeah, it's all a big conspiracy.
In post 447, bji wrote:Why don't you just come out and say what you think instead of hinting like this?
I'm not voting because I want Ari to respond first. Nice theory though
SilverWolf wrote:Welcome Gliffie!!
How did Aero flip?
I couldn't really read Aero well due to catch up type posts and 1v1's with pisskop. Perhaps you could shed some light on this for us? Don't quote your role PM.
Hold up, lemme check my PM again to make sure I got this right...
Bomb: Pisskop
...err wait, I think that's wrong. I'll tell you this much: Aero was town. Pretty pleased I finally landed myself in a town slot. (I hope that wasn't
too
pretentious)
pisskop wrote:@Giffie
. Not really much I can ask you atm. Aero's posting caused my read; his attituide and approach.
Am I crazy? Do you agree with his opinion/pushes?
.There's not much I can hold you accountable for answering, save perhaps why you think your predecessor was blatently ignoring every point that didn't have a pro-town answer.
You're not crazy, despite your peculiar indenting method. To be honest I was kinda glazing over your back and forths. If you provide the points in question I'll gladly conjecture if that really is interesting. If it's just what's in 344 I don't have much to add, though I feel like questioning how a "pressure vote" works when you say they're not scum. Did you do that because bji is a newcomer who would feel pressured regardless of your reasoning? On the other hand, I have no idea what Aero was on about with the "yelling"
In post 439, Aristophanes wrote:Count Dooku, your vote is absolutely asinine. Please elaborate on this scum read and how replacing out when he was clearly busy with RL and overwhelmed by his other 3 games makes him obvious scum.
Your vote is asinine. Mine is fine. I hope you read my posts, before you voted me. I DID NOT VOTE HIM ONLY BECAUSE HE REPLACED OUT. I voted him, because he did very-very scummy things, then got some pressure, then replaced out. Replacing out by itself is not scummy. But he clearly replaced out after people started to scumread him.
And again, it is not the only reason.
In post 439, Aristophanes wrote:Count Dooku, what makes the swift following of Brain and West scummy to you? Why does it make them scummier than yourself?
1) I know that I am town. Why would anyone say something like: "I think "A" and "B", and also myself are scummy". I don't understand you...
2) I was the first one who scumread Nickname:
In post 93, Nickname wrote:Alright, I don't have time to post a lengthy reply atm because school but I thinkVOTE: pisskop seems good for now. If I'm not mistaken, he should have 6 votes now bc Lapsa's vote got removed.
And I don't like this post...
So unlike them I didn't just jumped on a new popular wagon.
-------------------------------------------
If you happened to miss this post, please take a look at it. You can find the longest explanation made for the votes on him/you. It is interesting that no one else found my vote asinine, only you. Maybe you didn't read this.
In post 392, bji wrote:Also, why beat up on a player (Nickname) who isn't even playing right now? I'd like to hear a good summary of the case on Nickname that has everyone voting him when he's not even here to defend himself.
Post 53. The only thing stood for him is your behavior. Nothing else. It is not a big problem by itself, but:
Post 93. He doesn’t talk about bji anymore. He puts back pisskop to L-1 on purpose. But doesn’t state any reasons. Just jumps on the biggest wagon, and tells us that he doesn’t have time to tell us those reasons (maybe because he was hoping for a hammer?). And remember initially he found bji scummy (or interesting) and not pisskop. But now, he votes pisskop.
Post 114. „I am bad at mafia”-card. I hate it. When he does something scummy, and poeple impeach him, he can just say „Oh, sorry I am town, who is bad at mafia”.
Post 153. After the attention was drawn to Lapsa, he votes him, and he doesn’t say anything original, just states things about Lapsa that already have been stated by others.
So very little content given, and he did only scummy things.
And now he is running away, after he got some pressure.
If you still think it is asinine, please tell me why. Because nobody will buy your artificial reads if you don't give explanations for it.
- I was offered to replace into this, but I wanted to be VT for once so I passed. The first post 53 gave me really bad scum vibes and the votes are awful. Ari's post is fine I guess, but I don't agree that Johnny is good.
So, to be clear: Cheeto offered you a slot, told you the alignment, and you declined and then you took a
different role
in the same game? This game should be aborted, if that's the case.
Allegations of cheating should be handled via PM. If you should have future inquiries into such matters, please PM me or the listmod.
I will state for the record that I did not inform Gliffie as to what the alignment of the Nickname/Aristophanes slot was.
In post 421, JohnnyFarrar wrote:This is ridiculous. People replace out. Maybe he had IRL shit. Maybe he couldn't keep up with the game. Maybe all of my swearing was grating to his delicate eyeholes. This vote is arrogant and stupid.
I hate it. Again, I have to tell you guys the same shit.
His replacing out was only another reason to vote. Obviously I didn't vote him only because he replaced out. For instance, if I read him as town, and than he replaced out, I would not scumread him from then on. Yes, maybe he had RL shit, maybe he couldn't keep up with the game etc. But. Why did he sign up? Why didn't he read some other games to see whether people swear? If he knew that he will be having a lot of RL things to do, why did he sign up? Why did he request replacement only after people started to scumread him?
In post 445, Gliffie wrote:Dooku - Fine except for his Nickname vote reasoning. That's dumb
Why?
Did you read post 397?
If so, and you indeed think that my vote is bad, tell me why do you think it, please.
I did read it. I'm just very skeptical about interpreting the timing of his replacement to mean anything. You're other reasons are fine, heck, they're the same as mine. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
Count Dooku wrote:Yes, maybe he had RL shit, maybe he couldn't keep up with the game etc. But. Why did he sign up? Why didn't he read some other games to see whether people swear? If he knew that he will be having a lot of RL things to do, why did he sign up? Why did he request replacement only after people started to scumread him?
Post 106 - That is not a reason to vote. At all.
Post 143 - He unvotes, without any explanations. Maybe he noticed that nobody else votes bji, so if some one asked him to explain his vote, he should say something, so "it is better to unvote, I don't want to spend my time on making artificial reads"
Barely ever does he post anything, even then just pops in, asks at most one question, doesn't give content + I don't like lurkers. I have very bad experiences with them.
Yep, pretty much. I do think there's a decent chance that he's scum, but I also think that we get some interesting stuff to look at regardless of the outcome of the flip, which I view as ideal for a D1 lynch. The Pisskop wagon, the weird votes the wagon has gotten, the statements of suspicion (accompanied by no votes) that Nickname got, the direct defenses from some people - there's a lot here already.
Ari, from what I can tell, most of your reads are based on the wagon that's on you? Would you call that a correct statement? Also I think I answered most of your questions with the response to Johnny above.
Johnny's opinions on BJI's newbiness has made me reconsider, or at least think harder about, BJI-scum. Trying to act all voice-of-reason-y is in line with what I usually consider to be townJohnny, so that's where I'm at with him right now.
beeboy - Everyone thought this game was made to troll pie but it was really made to troll pisskop. Almost50 pisskop: Overall, that's a townie slot. Don't ask for specifics because with PK everything can be interpreted either way. It's probably WHEN he says/does things that matter, so it's more of a matter of conception rather than solid reasoning.
Aristophanes wrote:Prolapsed Brain, why the vote on Nickname? You hadn't even mentioned him prior to this. You never stated a case. Please fill me in.
<snip>
Brain, why the unvote? I don't really see any progression in arguments, so what changed?
I know this was spoilered, but did you read my post at all? Mind responding?
@Silverwolf
Okay, so I reread your 368.
Nickname put PK at L-1, voted Lapsa because (as I read it) he saw him as active lurking and deterring from the game, and didn't want to advertise other mafia sites.
The latter is null and I don't see how it effects a read. weird, yes. Scummy, no.
Lapsa's posts had me confused until that one where he brought it all together and my mind blew a bit. I fail to see how that vote is scummy, even if I don't support it.
The L-1 thing is okay I guess, but is it a reason to lynch? Is that all you found that was scummy from him? Do you find myself scummy as well?
@Gliffie
Johnny seems to be doing his regular poking. I like his poking. I see nothing wrong with him this far.
He's a null-town lean. I'm not super town reading him for anything, but I don't see anything wrong with his posts, which makes me like him.
@PK
Aristophanes wrote:PK, why the push for Nickname but no vote? The wagon was started for you, yet you still don't jump on? Did you, at this point (directly following you & Aero's yelling match), find Aero or Nickname more scummy? If it was Nickname, why keep your vote on Aero? If it was Aero, why the push on Nickname instead?
I might also add to the questions "Why did you unvote Aero when it appeared he was behind/not reading because it was a wasted vote, yet not unvote him when he requested replacement, which meant he was reading nothing. What made the latter a non-issue when you were okay with unvoting him for merely being behind?
I'm reiterating these because I feel like, having been spoilered, nobody bothered to read all of my post.
@West
Yes, I would agree that my post focused on the votes and voters who targeted myself/Nickname. I replaced into a spot at L-2 and felt that was the best place to start.
I am not trying to hide this in my post at all.
What do you gain from this?
Spoiler: Dooku ISO
Starts with a RVS vote. That's fine.
Some mechanics stuff, alright in context.
Asks questions that are very surface with no follow-up.
Like, other than the eyebrow raising in my direction (with no vote until the wagon got bigger) until his 29th post, 371th of the game. Even that he followed up only with a gut read.
Nickname vote only happens because he is replacing, or "running away". I still say that's dumb.
Your post 397 does finally state your case, but:
In the first two posts, he is clearly too busy to make a proper post. I respect IRL commitments. I believe people wouldn't lie about them. Does that make this slot scummy?
I can agree that the "I suck at Mafia" card is crappy, but why is it SCUMMY?
Lapsa vote is boring, yes, and the only point I can see holding water, maybe with the L-1 and "wagon jumping", but that was not your argument.
I still don't like 399. I know you wouldn't say YOU are scummy, but from my perspective, I see all three of these as potentially scummy votes.
Also, when you addressed my question, I don't think you quite got it.
You only voted once a wagon was forming and Nickname was replacing. Brain and West did the same. I don't see how you can call them scummy when you did the same thing.
As well, stating you don't like a post and stating you think its poster is scum are two totally different things. And if you thought Nickname scummy, why no vote until so late in the phase?
So yes, I think it is a crappy vote, and I do think you scummy for what I honestly see as empty posting.
Please address the above stated (spoilered) points.
Okay, so I reread your 368.
Nickname put PK at L-1, voted Lapsa because (as I read it) he saw him as active lurking and deterring from the game, and didn't want to advertise other mafia sites.
The latter is null and I don't see how it effects a read. weird, yes. Scummy, no.
Lapsa's posts had me confused until that one where he brought it all together and my mind blew a bit. I fail to see how that vote is scummy, even if I don't support it.
The L-1 thing is okay I guess, but is it a reason to lynch? Is that all you found that was scummy from him? Do you find myself scummy as well?
OK, I explained my scumread of Nickname in 368 and 444 in my response to you. As far as you are concerned, I feel like you are doing a little too much worrying about your predecessor's play. What I mean by that, is yes, you should address things that are brought up against him regarding votes but you are spending quite a bit of time explaining the reasoning for things he did and I sort of find it scummy when someone concentrates too much on what people think of the person they are replacing instead of just making new content/reads and trying to better the slot. Hopefully, this makes sense.
That said, if I was going to switch my vote, I'd consider Prolapsed Brain because of this post which I hate 385 which looks like lining up lynches. Plus, I fail to see a post anywhere in his ISO that shows he's producing any content of value so meh......................
TMJ-completey null at this point, Lapsa-I don't have a clue unfortunately, Victor-aggressive scum hunting at first, but need to see more from him
bji has been pinging scum to me for awhile now only because it seems like he's found something scummy in almost everything everyone has done in this game and I'm going to have to re-ISO and point out examples because it is very odd. Here's an example 408. I just really didn't like that post. It was so exaggerated and just really looked fake I guess is the right word or unbelievable is another I guess.
Dooku-I've played with him before, his game is not the same here as in the last town game he played, something is off, I need to look into this more, one thing I can point out is this 467 where he kind of targets a lurker and reads a lot more into those posts to make them scummy then he should really.
People I like and reasons:
Aero was null but I like Gliffie's posts since replacing in. There is very much a carefree town type of feel. I still like Johnny mostly due to the pokes he's doing and the kind of easygoing attitude of his posts, evil pacman-especially because of his 208 which looks very town to me, West9 specifically because he was willing to ask for and look at a meta example from me which just looks more like town looking to figure out a person rather than scum looking for a reason to keep a vote on someone, pisskop does the most to keep the thread active and asks good questions.
Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that.
I apologize for that. My aim is not to defend him but to analyze the wagon that formed.
I realize that is doing so I am making some calls about his play,and I will dial that back.
That is nowhere near the entirety of my posts, but I had to enter on the defensive.
Regardless, I like your posts and am getting all around town vibes from you.
You seem to have decent analysis in your posts and I don't disagree with most of your points.
I'll be back late tonight/tomorrow again. Just fyi everyone.
In post 471, Aristophanes wrote:Like, other than the eyebrow raising in my direction (with no vote until the wagon got bigger) until his 29th post, 371th of the game. Even that he followed up only with a gut read.
False. I didn't wait until the wagon got bigger. If I would have indeed waited for it, then why didn't I vote right after SW voted? I voted him, because he was very scummy, and than he... wait, I have already told you guys several times, so if you don't mind I won't finish the sentence…
In post 471, Aristophanes wrote:Nickname vote only happens because he is replacing, or "running away". I still say that's dumb.
Yup, "that was the last straw". I still don't think my vote is dumb. You are the only one who called my vote dumb. Maybe because my vote is on your slot?
In post 471, Aristophanes wrote:In the first two posts, he is clearly too busy to make a proper post. I respect IRL commitments. I believe people wouldn't lie about them. Does that make this slot scummy?
Maybe he lied. Maybe he didn't lie. Maybe he was too busy indeed. But maybe he used that excuse to run away. Btw, yes. He states in his first 2 posts that he is busy. Then why didn't he replace out right then? Why only after people started to suspect him? Because he was scum. So thank you. You gave me one more reason to scumread that slot.
In post 471, Aristophanes wrote:I can agree that the "I suck at Mafia" card is crappy, but why is it SCUMMY?
That can be alignment indicative. For instance I used it in my first game on this site (I used the newbie card, but that is quite similar to the "bad at mafia card") and I was scum. Obviously I wouldn't read anyone as scum only because he used that card, but there are other more scummy things he did, and also this one, which is definitely not towny, that is null or scummy.
In post 471, Aristophanes wrote:I still don't like 399. I know you wouldn't say YOU are scummy, but from my perspective, I see all three of these as potentially scummy votes.
BUT EVERYTHING I SAY IS FROM MY PERSPECTIVE.
In post 471, Aristophanes wrote:Also, when you addressed my question, I don't think you quite got it.
It seems that
you
didn't get my answer. I got everything.
In post 471, Aristophanes wrote:You only voted once a wagon was forming and Nickname was replacing. Brain and West did the same. I don't see how you can call them scummy when you did the same thing.
Again. Take a look at the paragraph before last one.
Also.
I have never said that they are scum. Please read my posts, before you vote me. Thanks.
-----
Did you read it?
If you still think that I said that they are scum because they jumped on the wagon, let me help you:
