New York 180 (Endgame)

[Shinobi]

pedit-Yes GM on a couple issues, also I've seen your towngame once and you seemed like you didn't really want to get involved in the game at all and although I haven't played with you as scum, my understanding is you are more involved as scum than as town.

Can you elaborate on this? I've played with her as scum and I came to the exact opposite conclusion.

[SilverWolf]

pedit-Yes GM on a couple issues, also I've seen your towngame once and you seemed like you didn't really want to get involved in the game at all and although I haven't played with you as scum, my understanding is you are more involved as scum than as town.

Can you elaborate on this? I've played with her as scum and I came to the exact opposite conclusion.

Very first game I played here with her she was town and was scumread by almost everyone for her lack of participation in the game. She kept saying she didn't want anyone sheeping her because she was the IC but she didn't vote, her reads were not in depth, and she avoiding making too many comments at least D1. After that she was out as a PR and I don't remember what happened.

When I did some meta on her in that game, this was awhile ago so my memory isn't crystal clear, we are talking my first game here, I noticed she did a lot more in here scum games then she was doing in that game.

But if you've seen a more recent scum game of hers, that could of changed. I should re-meta her at any rate.

[Aeronaut]

Can I just say I have my reasons for now or?.............................................

I'm fine with that. Would it be fair for you to share them with us tomorrow, though?

Sounds reasonable.

Silver, I'd like you to answer this now.

Thank God.
VOTE: elusive

Policy lynch

I don't really feel like you're in the position to be making joke-votes.

How I feel about that:
I'll return to my initial vote outside of ABR / MB influence.
VOTE: NJ

Can you link your original reasoning for NJ?

Vote: NakedJogger

This seems pretty bizarre to me seeing you didn't even post one time for all of yesterday.

unvote]

Alright JK, wtf. Jeez, did scum cheat us out of our sense of humor as well, cmon. What's the case on me anyway? Derptroll's tunnelvision doesn't make me scum. Pisskop obvdefense doesn't make me scum. I was on the viking wagon so fucking what.. that claim was improbable at best. I hammered Klingon, who could've been scum, so I don't have to die and leave no useful information behind, since nobody really cared to argument their vote.

This is the time to let bygones be bygones and lynch some scum. As for defending myself anyone want any questions answered I'm all ears.

Again, I don't understand why you're sitting here making jokes instead of sharing your thoughts on the game state. Even in this post, all you're doing is defending yourself and saying why you're not scum, but not actually saying anything about anybody else.

Zzzzz. ABR probably lying about Math is just like the icing on the cake. I'm pretty sad with this game right now
I'm pretty okay with an NJ lynch, but it would almost entirely be on policy of I will be sad if he's scum and he's just sitting back and watching us all be fucking dumb. I'm happy to throw my vote there if that's what everyone wants to do, but I'm legitimately almost 100% convinced that TSO is scum based on how he handled ABR last cycle.

He spent a long time in this game trying to established that this was definitely ABR's towngame. Let's follow the train of thought:

ABR is so blatantly town, gm.

Fakeclaiming twice as scum? No.

His play aligns 100% with what he says, too - Shinobi and vikingfan have been clearly stated as what his role says they must be.

Actually, his constant lies point to ABR-town.

There's no way Ellie isn't scum, there's no way ABR and Ellie are teammates - therefore ABR is town.

I do not know what this means and think you want ABR-scum more than you believe it.

2824 is the first sign of any kind of possible doubt in ABR, but it's followed up with by this:

But I still think you're town because that shitty retarded gambit is what you would do as town.

You shouldn't have done it.

ANDDDD:

quite sure he's town to be honest

This is all fine and dandy. "Why does someone townreading ABR have to be a big deal?" Oh I don't know, maybe because he fucking changes his mind out of no where and becomes okay with ABR lynch on policy:

well the good news is either abr or mb is scum

"I still believe your claim":

Yeah, ABR, I am warning you - if we lynch you and you flip Tracker and this result was a lie too the entire game will blacklist you. And they'd be right to.

"I believe you made a mistake and that you're not scum"

ABR let's not get into counting your mistakes, there has been more than one.

And then this is the fucking icing on the cake. When I put forth that ABR might be scum tracker and Math might be SK, TSO instantly takes on the weirdest fucking stance. He clearly thinks that ABR is town, and then all of a sudden he starts saying that ABR is probably the scum tracker here:

Because a Scum tracker is exactly the kind of PR you want to leave alive!

And then he agrees with my analysis, but instead of voting for someone who seems like they're SK? He votes for ABR? Why? That makes absolutely 0 sense from his perspective if he's town. There's still a very reasonable chance that ABR is town tracker in his eyes and thus Math should be confirmed SK to him, but he doesn't follow through with that.

And then this is the real nail in the coffin:

I can make no sense of these interactions unless Cheetory's right - and if Cheetory's right then I'd rather not give ABR the chance to get information for the scumteam tonight.

His read on ABR has flipped for absolutely no fucking reason.
AND.
When asked about it, he can't even fucking come up with one reason as to why:

Because either he dies from vig or lynch and the vig could do better than shooting him.

Why would you go out of your way to blatantly defend someone as town, to blatantly call them scum tracker at the end of a cycle when it makes no sense to? I'll tell you why. Because TSO is fucking scum.

VOTE: TSO

While the things your talking about in this case are valid, I thinking your making that interaction a lot more of a thing than it is; To me, it sort of looks like he thinks ABR is town for awhile, then he's not sure, and then at a certain point simply decides that he's scum and that he was wrong.

Our town sucks this game. Too many people lying.

now wake is replacing out, not sure what to think of that.

I'm still not liking NJ and good morning still seems like gloating scum who just so happens to vote for me when I was calling him on his scumminess yesterday.

I'm going to watch a bit before voting.

Can you clarify what you mean by Boasting Scum? Why wouldn't scum be trying to look depressed at a mislyched, instead of boasting and looking happy?

Vote: NakedJogger

Does anyone want to lynch this guy?

Wow. Anything other erudite commentary you want to make?
NJ has spent two days being sociopathic at best.
Town has some self hatred issues it needs to work through.

Town,
Who are your top 2 scum reads today and why?
Who were you voting yesterday and why?

Ty.

Kiyz,it's possible that vig if there is one has three shots but wants to be sure and also its possible second non consec doc is doing okay and finally its possible mafia are targeting an night kill immune sk who can only be lynched.

My top two is Nakedjogger and Dragonspawn. I've said it before, but basically Dragonspawn is trying too hard to look town, and NakedJogger just isn't trying in general.

[Aeronaut]

@ Dragonspawn, what's your read on NJ
@ NJ, what's your read on Dragon?

[Kitz]

Can you link your original reasoning for NJ?

Do I have to? I think everyone knows by now, and it's not actually an original reason but quite a few reasons.
If you don't know any reasons why NJ is scummy, then you're kinda off.

[Cheetory6]

To me, it sort of looks like he thinks ABR is town for awhile, then he's not sure, and then at a certain point simply decides that he's scum and that he was wrong.

That would be valid, if it weren't for the follow-up here after I ask him why he started scumreading ABR:

TSO you said you were townreading ABR a while ago.
Why are you voting him over Math if you think I'm right? :/.

Because either he dies from vig or lynch and the vig could do better than shooting him.

That isn't deciding that he was wrong and that ABR is scum. That's him more or less saying that it's a policy vote and there's no reasoning in there as to why ABR is likely scum.

[Cheetory6]

His stance on ABR switched immediately upon the claim, and if lying made him feel like ABR was more likely to be town, I don't know why he would reverse his stance on him at that point. It really feels to me like he was trying to push through a lynch on a PR that he legitimately believed. It was safe to defend ABR when he seemed like VT. The moment that he claimed a PR he was too dangerous to be left alive.

[Cheetory6]

@Kitz

, I wouldn't mind a fresh re-iterated case on NJ. I really would rather be able to trace someone else's scumread on him than try to sort through his ISO again with no specific reference points to look at.

[Cheetory6]

basically Dragonspawn is trying too hard to look town

Could you give specific examples of where you're seeing this?

[Aeronaut]

Can you link your original reasoning for NJ?

Do I have to? I think everyone knows by now, and it's not actually an original reason but quite a few reasons.
If you don't know any reasons why NJ is scummy, then you're kinda off.

Yea, I know why I think NJ is scummy, but I was curious what your personal reasons were though. I can just look use ISO though.

His stance on ABR switched immediately upon the claim, and if lying made him feel like ABR was more likely to be town, I don't know why he would reverse his stance on him at that point. It really feels to me like he was trying to push through a lynch on a PR that he legitimately believed. It was safe to defend ABR when he seemed like VT. The moment that he claimed a PR he was too dangerous to be left alive.

See, but then he could have just said "yea let's lynch this fucking guy" so much earlier then. Why fight it so long?

[Cheetory6]

Because he hadn't claimed yet?
ABR basically admits the copclaim was bullshit, thus implying that he's VT and TSO remains a believer in townABR.
ABR claims tracker and then suddenly TSO becomes much more interested in the lynch.

[SilverWolf]

Can I just say I have my reasons for now or?.............................................

I'm fine with that. Would it be fair for you to share them with us tomorrow, though?

Sounds reasonable.

Silver, I'd like you to answer this now.

He picked up on something that I think scum would of handled differently than he did.

Is there something specific about him you want me to look at? I have played with him a few times.

[FakedBlogger]

Vote: NakedJogger

Does anyone want to lynch this guy?

Wow. Anything other erudite commentary you want to make?
NJ has spent two days being sociopathic at best.

Alright stop talking to me, you are pissing the shit off of me

Spoiler: NSFW

and have been doing so consecutively for you past 100 posts.

Town has some self hatred issues it needs to work through.

Town,
Who are your top 2 scum reads today and why?
Who were you voting yesterday and why?

Ty.

Have you got any idea how fucking dumb this sounds? Town this town that. Coward Scum stop picking on little ol Grib. People are trying to think here ffs and your posts are notorious for chiseling off IQ points

Kiyz,it's possible that vig if there is one has three shots but wants to be sure and also its possible second non consec doc is doing okay and finally its possible mafia are targeting an night kill immune sk who can only be lynched.

Unlikely. Math is dead to get a lynch on me or TSO rolling. We need to start using our brains people and if elusive stops talking to me I will succeed I promise.

[FakedBlogger]

VOTE: good morning

the more I think about her the more nor my instincts tell me she is boasting scum.

add to that that I didn't like the slot prior to her subbing in, it just feels right.

elusive my second choice is NJ.

I'm also little annoyed with wake this game. He hammers Viking out of the blue. Isn't answering alot of questions and now wants out because town is lying. We wouldn't be Herod not for his bad play

Scum cocking his slingshot back .. he knows goodmorning won't get any traction and he'll wind up lynching me. Fucking disgusting.

[Aeronaut]

Can I just say I have my reasons for now or?.............................................

I'm fine with that. Would it be fair for you to share them with us tomorrow, though?

Sounds reasonable.

Silver, I'd like you to answer this now.

He picked up on something that I think scum would of handled differently than he did.

Would there be harm in telling us that thing?

Also, @Cheetory/Silverwolf

Spoiler:

the

So it's scummy for a pressure vote on a suspected scum now? Because I said it was for pressure?

You must be really pushing to vote for the people who were on the tso wagon then.

I already told you

Viking was a gut call. There are plenty of reasons to vote for him at this point.

My reason is trusting my instincts

Yea..... no.

VOTE: Dragon

If there are plenty of reasons to vote him, why are you calling it a gut call?

I suppose that's possible, I found more meaning in the content of his post than the subject of it.

you are being way too friendly this game house.

fos

Looks like the Viking wagon id picking up. As he is one of my gut scum reads at the moment in going to jump on and see if more pressure will shake something free from him.

VOTE: viking

This is NOT a good jump. He joins the growing wagon because 1. "It's picking up", and 2. It just so happens to be one his gut-scumreads all of a sudden. That pings for me.

The thing that's more bothersome to me is him defending himself once his wagon forms; it simply sounds like someone trying

very hard

to be calm and collected, to keep making jokes under pressure, etc. It doesn't seem like a natural progression to me, just that he's inserting things all over to make him look less nervious. It's fabricated.

dragon-You seem to be making a lot of excuses for not providing content D1.

Hold your horses. I'm doing more than you realize. I think I'm doing more than you might realize.

See like, what's the point of this post? You're just trying to shove it in our faces that you've been doing things

So a vigilante or serial killer killed our first scum. Good job.

Going to check out some iso posts

This post doesn't sit well with me, really, just the way it's worded. It's like something robotic spewed out a very generic response to the kills, followed by a generalized "I'm gonna go read ISOs now"

I leave one day and you rush a lynch. Wake what the heck was that hammer?

I cannot believe vf was telling the truth. That story was bs.

and Ellie was the deputy? WTH! How does her flipping that make us less likely to lynch elusive when she couldn't investigate till vf was dead and had no way of clearing elusive. Those crumbs were absolutely stupid. Is this town a bunch of morons?

we should be looking at abr and wake today imho

Why are you putting blame on everyone else for being on the VF wagon, when you were on it too? That looks to me like your trying to show us how you weren't here for the lynch, so the blood couldn't possibly be on your hands. Then, you try to justify yourself by saying "That story was BS". Seeing the flip, it really was not. This whole opening post was dedicated to trying to clear yourself of any responsibility for yesterday's lynch, even though you spent the whole day pushing it to happen.

Dragonspawn, where is your vote? Why isn't it on ABR?

vote abr

if anything holds true in this game he is probably town.

This should put up a red flag for more people than it has.

I want ABR dead in multiple ways but I don't want town to end until everyone has spoken and made a reads list.

I agree wholeheartedly to this.

dragonspawn

:

Scum, for reasons stated above, and I stand by my reasoning on him from day 1; Not a fan of how he sort of got away from a lynch by people saying that "looking scummy is his meta". To be honest, a lot of his posting is reminiscent of the Newbscum I see when I'm ICing newbie games. He needs rope.

[FakedBlogger]

I'd be willing to compromise on NJ, but it'd be one of those sad "I don't actually feel strongly about this" compromise votes.
I feel really really good about TSO scum right now.
The way he's reacting to people feels like he's trying to discredit anyone who's giving any possible credence to the idea of him being scum right now. I actually kind of also remember that kind of reaction to people earlier in the game as well. Might take a look for that when I dive Shinobi/TSO interactions.

Silver, what's making you lean town on TSO?
Do you disagree that his transitioned read on ABR is ridiculously sketchy?

I'll look over what you wrote about him in context and in detail when I have more time but this is mostly a feeling of frustrated town I get from him because a lot of his frustrations/annoyances are pretty much in line with what I'm thinking.

His transition on ABR was interesting lets say. I think because I pretty much agree'd with that lynch, I didn't think much of it. I also don't have good meta on TSO so I guess I need to look into that more as well if I try to flesh out this read some.

This smells like scum chatting with scum to consolidate a town-town lynch spectrum.

[FakedBlogger]

@dragon-Can you elaborate on why you think GM is a gloating scum? Why is voting for you gloating?

And this is scum helping scum ease off scum.
Presto.

[FakedBlogger]

pedit-Yes GM on a couple issues, also I've seen your towngame once and you seemed like you didn't really want to get involved in the game at all and although I haven't played with you as scum, my understanding is you are more involved as scum than as town.

Can you elaborate on this? I've played with her as scum and I came to the exact opposite conclusion.

pedit-Yes GM on a couple issues, also I've seen your towngame once and you seemed like you didn't really want to get involved in the game at all and although I haven't played with you as scum, my understanding is you are more involved as scum than as town.

Can you elaborate on this? I've played with her as scum and I came to the exact opposite conclusion.

Very first game I played here with her she was town and was scumread by almost everyone for her lack of participation in the game. She kept saying she didn't want anyone sheeping her because she was the IC but she didn't vote, her reads were not in depth, and she avoiding making too many comments at least D1. After that she was out as a PR and I don't remember what happened.

When I did some meta on her in that game, this was awhile ago so my memory isn't crystal clear, we are talking my first game here, I noticed she did a lot more in here scum games then she was doing in that game.

But if you've seen a more recent scum game of hers, that could of changed. I should re-meta her at any rate.

Scummy. Why? Because when a dude asks you a simple question you don't write 3 paragraphs and close it with 'I should re-meta because everything I've said is proabably bullshit'

[Aeronaut]

:/

Why do you think every player is scum?


P-edit: unless you're Mastin

[T S O]

Because he hadn't claimed yet?
ABR basically admits the copclaim was bullshit, thus implying that he's VT and TSO remains a believer in townABR.
ABR claims tracker and then suddenly TSO becomes much more interested in the lynch.

ABR claimed Tracker day one.

[FakedBlogger]

NakedJogger just isn't trying in general.

If any of Kitz or Grib are scum I'm a genius and was doing my most sexy work day1.
Fuck it I'm not going to enumerate all the townie things I've done. I'm just going to say it's not fair to say I'm not trying when there wasn't anything to try with Math and elusive bashing my every post. Who the fuck can siphon the strength to overpower a waterfall of stupid shit using mere logic, reason and common sense? I can't I'm sorry. I'm no masochist

[elusive]

I was taking to Shinobi in that post so whatever.

[SilverWolf]

Can I just say I have my reasons for now or?.............................................

I'm fine with that. Would it be fair for you to share them with us tomorrow, though?

Sounds reasonable.

Silver, I'd like you to answer this now.

He picked up on something that I think scum would of handled differently than he did.

Would there be harm in telling us that thing?

I think it would be a distraction at this point in the game and not really help move the game forward really. I think there's been enough of that for awhile.

[SilverWolf]

pedit-Yes GM on a couple issues, also I've seen your towngame once and you seemed like you didn't really want to get involved in the game at all and although I haven't played with you as scum, my understanding is you are more involved as scum than as town.

Can you elaborate on this? I've played with her as scum and I came to the exact opposite conclusion.

pedit-Yes GM on a couple issues, also I've seen your towngame once and you seemed like you didn't really want to get involved in the game at all and although I haven't played with you as scum, my understanding is you are more involved as scum than as town.

Can you elaborate on this? I've played with her as scum and I came to the exact opposite conclusion.

Very first game I played here with her she was town and was scumread by almost everyone for her lack of participation in the game. She kept saying she didn't want anyone sheeping her because she was the IC but she didn't vote, her reads were not in depth, and she avoiding making too many comments at least D1. After that she was out as a PR and I don't remember what happened.

When I did some meta on her in that game, this was awhile ago so my memory isn't crystal clear, we are talking my first game here, I noticed she did a lot more in here scum games then she was doing in that game.

But if you've seen a more recent scum game of hers, that could of changed. I should re-meta her at any rate.

Scummy. Why? Because when a dude asks you a simple question you don't write 3 paragraphs and close it with 'I should re-meta because everything I've said is proabably bullshit'

Shinobi-If you need any further details on this you can check newbie 1532.

[Albert B. Rampage]

GO TOWN GO!!!!!

See you in the afterlife!!!