New York 180 (Endgame)

[goodmorning]

Fighting is, by definition, a back-and-forth. Nothing of that nature has occurred between you and Kitz, and only one small skirmish between you and Ozgin. I really didn't want to have to waste my time proving it, but apparently I have to.

Sniping at someone does not equal fighting.

Even if you don't agree with Kitz (despite the fact that she's still voting me for whatever reason) there's no reason for you not to realize that the spat that happened between Ozgin and me was similar to the one between uctriton and me, even if you think it's not exactly the same.

Given that your fight with uct was long and large and loud, going so far as to be THE 1v1 for Days, and that your fight with Ozgin was small and soft and silent, and lasted only for ~7 posts from each of you...

They really couldn't be less similar if you tried.

P-EDIT: T S O

FUCKING READ

[SilverWolf]

I have yet to hear why goodmorning is town from her 'hood stuff. I want to know.

Marquis-Not that it matters now because we need to concentrate on a lynch, but I did read your scum neighborizer neighbourhood and I did see the manipulation you used there as scum. GM has not been manipulative in the slightest. I was very paranoid when she first neighborized me because I had been suspecting her before that but she has not tried to manipulate me and has not said anything in there I would associate with scum. Her reason for picking me made sense because she wanted to show herself to her townreads. She never once tried to get me to vote a certain way or try to sell herself as town to me-both of which I would expect from a scum neighborizer.

[Ozgin]

Why are people voting for Aeronaut? @Everyone

Why is Aeronauts fighting of his wagon, "Well even if I'm scum why does that make Marquis town?" Like, what the actual hell is that? @Aeronaut

Why won't Shinobi just re-state his case instead of saying "Read the thread!" over and over? Why not just do it to shut everyone up who you're claiming won't read? @Shinobi

And why does dragonspawn wanna sheep TSO's votes so much? @dragon

2 pages, that's all that I had to read this morning. And now I'm confused. I @'d all the people I'd accept answers to my questions from, so someone... please help me out here.

PEdit:

@TSO - Even if I get past my doubt, what makes Aero a better lynch than Marquis all of a sudden? Where'd your conviction go from a few pages ago? Why suddenly give up on lynching Marquis to start another wagon (which is something I brought up and was scolded by you and Shinobi for), when you and Shinobi both clearly said that the best course of action is to lynch the likely scumspect (Marquis) and free up your shot?

In other words, I guess what I'm really wondering is this: Would you rather advocate a Marquis lynch and shoot Aeronaut tonight for his shenanigans?

PPedit:

@GM - Why does my fighting with Shinobi

even matter to you?

Why does the

magnitude

of our fight even matter to you?

PPPEdit:

Guis pls stahp posting for 5 seks so i can has teh post.

[Ozgin]

EBWOP: Thank you.

[Shinobi]

@GM: Sure they could; we could have whispered sweet nothings into each others' ears while drinking tea and masqueraded that as a fight instead.

@Ozgin: I posted my reads like 50 times, so complaining about me not posting cases when I've told everyone what I thought over and over isn't going to accomplish anything.

[Ozgin]

No no no, Shinobi - I understand that. I know what your reads are. But instead of saying "Just fucking read the thread!" when someone says "Hurr gimme yo reedz," say something like, "I explained my views on players x, y, and z in (Insert post #/post link here), and players a, b, and c in (Insert different post # here)."

Because people are stubborn and won't take "Go read," as an answer.

[goodmorning]

Why are people voting for Aeronaut? @Everyone

No idea.

@GM - Why does my fighting with Shinobi

even matter to you?

Why does the

magnitude

of our fight even matter to you?

Shinobi claims that (A) there was fighting amongst the three of you (you, Shinobi, Kitz) and that (B) me medium-scumreading the three of you for completely unrelated reasons therefore makes me Scum.

The magnitude of your fight matters not at all to me, excepting that Shinobi is attempting to justify (B) with it.

[Marquis]

lynching me is bad because when i flip town, if my setup spec was wrong and tso's scum, my townflip gives him free room to potentially "doubt" his reads and shoot whoever he wants in scum interests rather than town

lynching aero, whether he flips scum or not, limits his shot choices to me, and dragon hopefully. if he shoots anywhere else it's a scumclaim and he should be lynched.

[T S O]

Marquis-Not that it matters now because we need to concentrate on a lynch, but I did read your scum neighborizer neighbourhood and I did see the manipulation you used there as scum. GM has not been manipulative in the slightest. I was very paranoid when she first neighborized me because I had been suspecting her before that but she has not tried to manipulate me and has not said anything in there I would associate with scum. Her reason for picking me made sense because she wanted to show herself to her townreads. She never once tried to get me to vote a certain way or try to sell herself as town to me-both of which I would expect from a scum neighborizer.

[/quote]

This is no good. It's too vague. I mean, you're saying her reason for picking you makes sense. Yes, you're right. It makes perfect sense from scum-gm, just as it does for town-gm. You say she has never tried to get you to vote a certain way - what would she say? "Vote here now"? She's been here for years. She's learned the art of subtlety.

[T S O]

lynching me is bad because when i flip town, if my setup spec was wrong and tso's scum, my townflip gives him free room to potentially "doubt" his reads and shoot whoever he wants in scum interests rather than town

lynching aero, whether he flips scum or not, limits his shot choices to me, and dragon hopefully. if he shoots anywhere else it's a scumclaim and he should be lynched.

Again, this move makes zero sense for scum-TSO.

[Ozgin]

@GM - Why does my fighting with Shinobi

even matter to you?

Why does the

magnitude

of our fight even matter to you?

Shinobi claims that (A) there was fighting amongst the three of you (you, Shinobi, Kitz) and that (B) me medium-scumreading the three of you for completely unrelated reasons therefore makes me Scum.

The magnitude of your fight matters not at all to me, excepting that Shinobi is attempting to justify (B) with it.

Well I never really fought Kitz, and my skirmish with Shinobi was relatively small (At least compared to like, Math/ABR fighting). I must have missed where you scumread us three, can you direct me to where you did that, or refresh me on what those "completely unrelated reasons"?

@TSO - Answer my question from earlier please.

[goodmorning]

She's learned the art of subtlety.

Since when have I played the subtle game?

I mean, I guess I'm a fan of the sleight-of-hand redirect, but that's about it.

I must have missed where you scumread us three, can you direct me to where you did that, or refresh me on what those "completely unrelated reasons"?

It was in my last reads post which is slightly outdated at this point. The reasons will be in various places if I did so choose to share them.

[Shinobi]

No no no, Shinobi - I understand that. I know what your reads are. But instead of saying "Just fucking read the thread!" when someone says "Hurr gimme yo reedz," say something like, "I explained my views on players x, y, and z in (Insert post #/post link here), and players a, b, and c in (Insert different post # here)."

Because people are stubborn and won't take "Go read," as an answer.

Okay.

Well I posted them and reiterated them anyway, so.

[Ozgin]

The reasons will be in various places if I did so choose to share them.

If you did so choose to share them? So you don't wanna share your reads?

[Ozgin]

So you don't wanna share the reason for your reads?*** -Fix

[Ozgin]

Also, I just read the votecount again, and Shinobi is at L-2, Marquis is at like L-5 with TSO hopping to Aeronaut and with dragon sheeping right behind him, and Aero is at L-4.

I don' like any of the 3 wagons. If I wanted to start a new wagon (Which I think would be ludicrous at this time) it would be on dragonspawn for the relentlessness of his sheeping. However, since TSO would probably drill into my anus if I did that (because I'd be attacking his pet sheep), it's probably not wise to go after dragonspawn today.

I like the Shinobi wagon more than either of the Marquis Wagon, but I'd be willing to vote Marquis if TSO and his pet would hop back onto him, because I think both Marquis' and Shinobi's wagons are better than starting a wagon on Aeronaut, who I've never really scumread.

I also wanna hear TSO's answer to my question about pushing Marquis.

[goodmorning]

So you don't wanna share the reason for your reads?*** -Fix

Some of them, no. Some of them, yes.

[Ozgin]

Why not?

[elusive]

Tso if there is a mafia doctor, its possible that who you target may be protected. Who are the top three people you think might be good targets (2 real and 1 fake to throw off the scent).

Shinobi, your reads aren't convincing that is my main issue with you. You also do bounce back and forth quite a lot, for example with Kitz, which I wonder about.

[Shinobi]

Tso if there is a mafia doctor, its possible that who you target may be protected. Who are the top three people you think might be good targets (2 real and 1 fake to throw off the scent).

Shinobi, your reads aren't convincing that is my main issue with you. You also do bounce back and forth quite a lot, for example with Kitz, which I wonder about.

I explained Kitz. I explained everything. You not thinking I'm convincing is irrelevant towards gauging my alignment.

[Shinobi]

Shinobi-You've been calling Kitz scum for awhile now, even going so far as to say it would be fun to kill her here: 4600 and 4601 and these post show you were suspicious of her as well 4628 and 4682

It was all about her reads that you didn't like. Then today suddenly you completely changed your mind and said she's town here 5169 and 5195.

But her reads have been like that all game so why suddenly is she town for having weird reads when you've been pretty sure she's scum up until recently?

Mostly because I can't imagine a world where scum actually calls you scum.

Afaik that was the first time she's done so. A lot of the time I play off of omgus, which gets fueled pretty hard when someone tunnels me all game. Normally I doubt that most tunnelers are mafia, especially since I tend to be a really popular target for newer players for some reason, but I usually love trying to kill them because it makes me feel better about getting tunneled.

I wouldn't say I was "pretty sure" at any rate. I'm sure I postured like it but there's a reason I don't blow the thread up trying to kill Kitz every time she calls me scum, which has been basically the entire game.

The explanation is right here, in case you somehow missed it and are still looking for whatever reason to come after me.

[Shinobi]

Aero still doesn't have a reason to be on my wagon afaik. I just mosey'd onto his scumlist out of the ether and it doesn't seem like he cares about my answers to anything.

[Shinobi]

Also, I just read the votecount again, and Shinobi is at L-2, Marquis is at like L-5 with TSO hopping to Aeronaut and with dragon sheeping right behind him, and Aero is at L-4.

I don' like any of the 3 wagons. If I wanted to start a new wagon (Which I think would be ludicrous at this time) it would be on dragonspawn for the relentlessness of his sheeping. However, since TSO would probably drill into my anus if I did that (because I'd be attacking his pet sheep), it's probably not wise to go after dragonspawn today.

I like the Shinobi wagon more than either of the Marquis Wagon, but I'd be willing to vote Marquis if TSO and his pet would hop back onto him, because I think both Marquis' and Shinobi's wagons are better than starting a wagon on Aeronaut, who I've never really scumread.

I also wanna hear TSO's answer to my question about pushing Marquis.

Sheeping is a terrible reason to scumread someone.

[Ozgin]

Sheeping is, however, a great reason to identify someone who is a terrible townie and is only helping scum by being so easily controlled, and are a dire threat to town's success at this stage of the game.

[Shinobi]

Sheeping is, however, a great reason to identify someone who is a terrible townie and is only helping scum by being so easily controlled, and are a dire threat to town's success at this stage of the game.

You can't get scum lynches without sheeping cases. Not every single townie in the game is going to have ironclad cases on mafia. I'd wager almost 90% of skill in mafia relies on sheeping.