Mini 1782 Game Over

[Ircher]

Mhsmith0,

Town Odd-Night Jailkeeper

, was killed N3.

Day 4 Begins!

Vote Count - Day 4 VC #1

Titus (0) -
Froot (0) -
Johnny (0) -
FA_Q2 (0) -
Heur (0) -
Plain (0) -
Lowell (0) -
Rosh (0) -
No Lynch (0) -
Not Voting (8) - Heur, Froot, Titus, Lowell, FA_Q2, Plain, Johnny, Rosh

Deadline

Day 4 will end on May 23 5:30 PM EST or in (expired on 2016-05-23 17:30:00).

Lynch Threshold

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Mod Notes

Changed PT modding color from orange to yellow. The contrast is better.
Titus is V/LA til Wednesday.

Effective Immediately: I will for now on use yellow instead of orange in PTs.

[Ircher]

*Bump. I apparently accidentally locked the thread when I posted the last VC...... Sorry.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Smooth

[a plain farmer]

Anyone else planning on getting banned?

BTW, sorry h_a, but you've replaced into a scumslot as far as I'm concerned.

VOTE: heuristically_alone

[FA_Q2]

Going through Garmr's ISO I have to agree with farmer. Garmr essentially avoided giving any reads at all. He only voted for hunter because they were essentially confirmed scum.

Anyone have any thoughts on why smith was the target over our claimed PR? That one seemed rather odd to me.

[FA_Q2]

VOTE: heuristically_alone

[heuristically_alone]

Wow, lots of replacements this game. Sounds like it's been interesting. Time for some reads. Sorry for lack of quotes since I did this when thread was locked for night.

Spoiler: pre-game

What stuck out to me most here was that weird thing going on between RC and FA and RC's supposed fake town slip in post 62. What stuck out to me even more is that mhsmith and clumsy in pre game all found RC suspicious, and the first player outside pre game in 607 to accuse RC (Nosferatu), all 3 of these players are gone dead. Could be a coincidence and, but FA herself said that she knew RC and didn't think it was scummy. Nothing I'm wanting to look to far into, but thought I'd still point it out.

Spoiler: Froot Loop

There's no single post that really sticks out, but there have been a lot of pro town posts. There has been a great mixture of some good analysis and questioning. I also like pointing out Lowell's dodging and procrastinating behavior in post 1231.

Spoiler: Johnny Farrar/Frozen Angel and Jake State Farm

I big part of my read is based from Frozen Angel. I've got to comment on the Great Jake/FA War I. Personally, I didn't see anything wrong with Jake voting FA and pressuring her as it is a common tactic to pressure your scum vote, and FA way way either took it way to personally, or was playing the game way too good to convince us she was town, but too good she got replaced. Either way, I read it as getting way too defensive and FA had to be scum.
As for the whole exchange I think it was town vs town or town vs scum, with FA as scum. If Jake really were scum, I don't think it would have been smart to keep pushing on that conversation because it calls out too much attention, and scum hate attention on themselves.

Don't worry, I got some comments on dear Johnny too.
I didnt like his entrance to the game in post 1203 "Oh dang there's a deadline. I won't have time to catch up somebody tell me who to vote and why." Of course, scum wouldn't really care who they were voting for and this is as good excuse as any to no exert any energy in voting anybody.
@Johnny in 1329 "Oh see I hear that as "scum is bad at Mafia" which is a dangerous thing to assume" When you said this I have no idea what you were trying to say.
1410 I don't trust anyone that says "If I were scum here is an example of a lie I'd tell". At best it's anti-town
1542You state you don't have a vote in mind or else you would be pushing it. How do you not have a vote in mind at this time of the game? In post 1442 you were pushing for the Maxous wagon and were voting for him before.

Spoiler: Lowell

1057I'm not a big fan how Lowell was so rude about Clumsy's posting page by page analysis when he thought he was about to get lynched to give info. It's very anti-town. Now that by discouraging it, it stopped Clumsy from giving us more info after his town flip that may have been important.
1331How can you have no leads up to this point in the game? But then 3 posts later states Rosh as scum? Rosh is most obv town for me. What happened to voting Max like in post 1266? Sure you hammered Huntress but that doesn't mean squat. Scum lean

Spoiler: Roshar

The most obv town for me. Plus claimed a roleblocker role, which which was the main reason Huntress for sure got lynched, so there is denying it, so no point in talking to much about it. Even so, Roshar has been making lots of pro town posts with great analysis and thought out points.

Spoiler: FA_Q2

I've probably found the least meaningful posts from FAQ2. Currently seemingly the only player with suspicions against Titus. In posts 1297 and 1395 votes on Johnny Farrar and Lowell, 2 of my scum reads, so for that I am getting a town lean.

Spoiler: Titus/Radiant Cowbells

Because of the pre game business I mentioned the slight scum lean. I noticed that Titus seems to like to post most right after a vote count and not much at other times, and I think it gives that player a little power since they are pretty much commencing the next step in the game, it could be a power gaining role thing, similar to a phone call and the person getting in the last word having the most power, or two men shaking hands and the one that lets go first being in the weaker position. Not a scum or town specific tell, but kind of gives more leading power in my opinion if true. I would like to see more posts, but I'm feeling null slight scum lean.

Spoiler: A Plain Farmer

Another player that has given some good read lists. I especially remembering liking 499 where in the analysis of RC also talked about the timing of his posts. Town lean.

Spoiler: FA_Q2

I've probably found the least meaningful posts from FAQ2. Currently seemingly the only player with suspicions against Titus. In posts 1297 and 1395 votes on Johnny Farrar and Lowell, 2 of my scum reads, so for that I am getting a town lean.

Spoiler: Johnny Farrar/Frozen Angel/Jake State Farm

I big part of my read is based from Frozen Angel. I've got to comment on the Great Jake/FA War I. Personally, I didn't see anything wrong with Jake voting FA and pressuring her as it is a common tactic to pressure your scum vote, and FA way way either took it way to personally, or was playing the game way too good to convince us she was town, but too good she got replaced. Either way, I read it as getting way too defensive and FA had to be scum. Don't worry, I got some comments on dear Johnny too.
I didnt like his entrance to the game in post 1203 "Oh dang there's a deadline. I won't have time to catch up somebody tell me who to vote and why." Of course, scum wouldn't really care who they were voting for and this is as good excuse as any to no exert any energy in voting anybody.
@Johnny in 1329 "Oh see I hear that as "scum is bad at Mafia" which is a dangerous thing to assume" When you said this I have no idea what you were trying to say.
1410 I don't trust anyone that says "If I were scum here is an example of a lie I'd tell". At best it's anti-town
1542You state you don't have a vote in mind or else you would be pushing it. How do you not have a vote in mind at this time of the game? In post 1442 you were pushing for the Maxous wagon and were voting for him before.

VOTE: Johnny Farrar

[JohnnyFarrar]

Don't worry, I got some comments on dear Johnny too.
I didnt like his entrance to the game in post 1203 "Oh dang there's a deadline. I won't have time to catch up somebody tell me who to vote and why." Of course, scum wouldn't really care who they were voting for and this is as good excuse as any to no exert any energy in voting anybody.

Spoiler, I don't exert ever.

@Johnny in 1329 "Oh see I hear that as "scum is bad at Mafia" which is a dangerous thing to assume" When you said this I have no idea what you were trying to say.

I don't really know how to say it simpler? Positing that scum would have difficulty forming reads is insinuating that they're not good at Mafia. Do you disagree?

1410 I don't trust anyone that says "If I were scum here is an example of a lie I'd tell". At best it's anti-town

How so?

1542 You state you don't have a vote in mind or else you would be pushing it. How do you not have a vote in mind at this time of the game? In post 1442 you were pushing for the Maxous wagon and were voting for him before.

1442 was my annoyance with how fucking useless that NKA was. I was trying to get the game moving. Max was a better direction than that which was going nowhere.

[JohnnyFarrar]

That time we lynched scum and everyone stopped talking

[JohnnyFarrar]

Alright I'm bored so I'll think out loud.

People suspect that gar slot and I don't remember any solid reason for why

Froot is almost certainly town based on the Smith kill.

Lowell is still up in the air, but I doubt he's heartless enough to condemn his partner after a fake claim like that.

Rosh obvtown duh

I don't have an opinion of fack, plain or Titus. Anyone that does should talk about it.

[Ircher]

Vote Count - Day 4 VC #2

Titus (0) -
Froot (0) -
Johnny (1) - Heur
FA_Q2 (0) -
Heur (2) - Plain, FA_Q2
Plain (0) -
Lowell (0) -
Rosh (0) -
No Lynch (0) -
Not Voting (5) - Froot, Titus, Lowell, Johnny, Rosh

Deadline

Day 4 will end on May 26 5:30 PM EST or in (expired on 2016-05-26 17:30:00).

Lynch Threshold

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Mod Notes

Deadline extended 3 days.

[JohnnyFarrar]

Still here

Points stand

[Lowell]

I don't at all remember what's happening this game. Other than I owned some chump's fakeclaim.

[FA_Q2]

Can barely recall where this game is going after that long outage.

APF - what do you think of HA's catch up post?

[FA_Q2]

Froot is almost certainly town based on the Smith kill.

Why is that?

[Froot Loop]

Back! Thank goodness.

My reads in this game have basically been poo, which is nice.

Anyone else planning on getting banned?

BTW, sorry h_a, but you've replaced into a scumslot as far as I'm concerned.

VOTE: heuristically_alone

Is this primarily because of the vote analysis?

The most obv town for me. Plus claimed a roleblocker role, which which was the main reason Huntress for sure got lynched, so there is denying it, so no point in talking to much about it. Even so,

Roshar has been making lots of pro town posts with great analysis and thought out points.

(my bold)

Can you point out some specifics here?

My read on APF is a little out of date but I did get a good feeling from their posts when I last did an ISO (1276.) FA_Q2 questioned Titus' vote on Max, which gives me good vibes.

[Lowell]

Had to ISO myself to remember what was happening.

Rosh is town, because there's no way that claim/fakeclaim with huntress was an orchestrated bussing. I don't quite see johnny calls Froot town. And I

certainly

don't see why, if he is so cavalier in calling froot town based on kills, he somehow wants to pretend I'm "up in the air."

Here's a tried and true way to catch scum. If, at any point in the game, Lowell becomes obvtown, try to find the person saying "hmm he may be town but gosh I just don't know yet, we'll see." That's the person whose plan to string me along for the easy mislynch was foiled and can't quite accept it.

VOTE: johnny

Also, fwiw,

fos titus

. I'm going to be right about her. You'll see. Even if it's from beyond the grave.

[Titus]

VLA today

[a plain farmer]

Anyone have any thoughts on why smith was the target over our claimed PR? That one seemed rather odd to me.

If scum knew smith was a jailkeeper, it would've made a lot of sense. I didn't see any role crumbs by smith and actually had him pegged as a VT, so I assume this would be because scum have a role cop. Rosh was almost certainly smith's target last night, so if they knew he was a jailkeeper they'd know she'd be protected.

This explanation hinges on the probability that scum have a role cop, and that they used it on smith. The chances of this seem initially pretty low, but the fact that smith is dead raises them somewhat.

Other explanations: smith was right about Titus (maybe, but it's WIFOMy), Rosh is faking it (not likely).

APF - what do you think of HA's catch up post?

It's the best post the slot's made all game, but not enough to ease my suspicions.

Is this primarily because of the vote analysis?

Largely, but Garmr and shaddow's posts look like those of one who's trying to hide, and also not like those of one who's trying to find scum.

Rosh is town, because there's no way that claim/fakeclaim with huntress was an orchestrated bussing. I don't quite see johnny calls Froot town. And I

certainly

don't see why, if he is so cavalier in calling froot town based on kills, he somehow wants to pretend I'm "up in the air."

Here's a tried and true way to catch scum. If, at any point in the game, Lowell becomes obvtown, try to find the person saying "hmm he may be town but gosh I just don't know yet, we'll see." That's the person whose plan to string me along for the easy mislynch was foiled and can't quite accept it.

You're not obvtown though. :/

[JohnnyFarrar]

Froot is almost certainly town based on the Smith kill.

Why is that?

If I recall, Froot went hard at Smith Yesterday and I don't typically see scum doing that to someone they're about to kill.

[heuristically_alone]

Sweet. Glad to see site is back up. VLA today. Just want to make sure I'm still in the game.

[JohnnyFarrar]

It makes even less sense in this game specifically because you've got folks (not me) saying not having solid reads at this point is scummy, so for Froot to go hard at Smith only to kill him and say things like

My reads in this game have basically been poo

doesn't really make sense as scum

[Roshar]

Was out all day, and won't be able to post something much, yet can't prod dodge either. Will post my current thoughts later, but here's what I'm feeling based on the the posts above me. Johnny and Froot town.

So scum let me live. I considered this as I wouldn't be able to use my ability last night anyway. I'm going to have to get it right tonight.

@APF, I'm not too familiar with set-ups, but assuming scum thought there may be a watcher role in the game, then I can see why avoiding me would be ideal. Your version of things is very possible though. It would explain the mhs kill.

VOTE: Lowell

Huntress keeps mentioning she finds Lowell scummy, but never provides reasons or pushes his lynch. His vote on Johnny doesn't resonate with me either and is so conveniently placed after Heuristically, that it makes me question that association. Three other dead town found him scummy as well (Nos, max, clumsy). Then there was the time when Huntress thought Apf was distancing himself from Lowell (when APF unvoted lowell), i.e, there's a foregone conclusion that Lowell is scum.
His attitude when I was questioning him was not of someone who wants to clear/explain himself, rather, it was of someone who wants to avoid getting into debate.

During the debate between myself and him, he later admits that I'm correct, yet, still wants to lynch me anyway.

Go back and look at Lowell's posts and tell me what part of it makes you think they're coming from town.


@Heuristically, welcome to the game. You say I made some good points, are any of those points in reference to Lowell?

[Roshar]

Also, throwing shade on anyone who may think you're scummy is so very convenient. Self-preservation is a scum trait to me.

[Froot Loop]

Is this primarily because of the vote analysis?

Largely, but Garmr and shaddow's posts look like those of one who's trying to hide, and also not like those of one who's trying to find scum.

Are there any posts in particular you can quote/point to? I had a look through Shaddowez' ISO and nothing jumped out at me.

I also had a look at Huntress' ISO to see if there's anything interesting. Some notes:
- Her initial scumreads were me, Roshar and Clumsy. I believe Roshar's town, so this is a totally town pool (bearing in mind that I know I'm town.) This might have some bearing on her subsequent pool (1464.) Again, we've got Max and Roshar (town) but also Lowell and APF. She also subsequently speculated about Lowell and APF being scumpartners (1597.)
- I remember thinking at the time that her questioning of Titus' VC post was weird and unnecessary. Now it can be viewed as fabricated content but it's an interesting choice.
- I searched her ISO for Johnny and there's basically nothing. Johnny asked her about when she was going to post and she said she watched him on N1. From a search, there's also nothing on the Shaddowez/Gamr slot.
- She posted positively about FA_Q2's play (1586) when asked, but similarly about mhsmith, so this isn't indicative for me either way.

So, Huntress posted an all-town lynchpool and she stated strong scum reads on Roshar and Max, town players. I think this indicates that she's likely to avoid her scum partners in-thread. This puts Lowell and APF in a better light for me. Her questioning of Titus is odd and I think it's possible that this was designed to allow her to question another player safely when she was under a bit of pressure from Roshar.

Also, this point:

Probably Titus's move onto Huntress after Roshar's push deserves the most scrutiny, given the claimed NK block and the plausible outcome that Huntress had been caught by a PR.

We need to remember that throughout D3, scum would have known that Huntress had been caught. Titus voted for Huntress very early following Roshar's posts, possibly to avoid being seen defending her. Titus also came out saying that she'd wanted to push Huntress during D3 but hadn't said anything about her previously.

Vote: Titus

(voting now for reasons above even though she's V/LA)

@Roshar/Everyone

Considering scum players would have known Huntress was caught, do you think it's likely that a scum player would come out and townread/defend her during D3?
You said that it was likely that scum would already know who you are, which is fair, do you think it's likely that a scum player would push you the way Lowell did? Bearing in mind that it was likely you were subsequently going to be revealed as (very likely) town?