Actually I'm overthinking this.
Ruling out just one partnership already gives a confirmed scum (I've just reread 693-704 and I already think its too natural for SonS) and feeling good enough about a townread gives both.
Main challenge today will actually be convincing said person I'm town, generally not my forte.
It's hard to describe because it's not incredibly obvious.
You're very reserved for most of earlygame compared to everyone else (though none of you were very involved early) and most of what you've given feels retaliatory (to sim earlier, then to red) instead of pro-active.
A few things too like how you kinda egging seth on and less "at the fore-front" of the wagon on red than me or hoppic are positions that would benefit scum to take too.
My biggest problem with you is you've mostly argued people on what feel like technicalities and "anti-town" things instead of scummy things (not the same) and you don't look into motivation behind actions or deeper thought as much as I'd expect from someone like you.
That said a lot of these things apply to alpaca too when I think about it. I think it's PROBABLY you/alpaca but I thought that on red and radiant and I really don't want to confbias fuck up yet again.
Yeah actually, you and hoppic having that exchange had you actually treating it defensively the same way as you treated sim and red (and hoppic seemed to treated it seriously too) goes back to that negative association and makes me want alpaca today atm.
In post 857, Raskolnikov wrote:It's hard to describe because it's not incredibly obvious.
You're very reserved for most of earlygame compared to everyone else (though none of you were very involved early) and most of what you've given feels retaliatory (to sim earlier, then to red) instead of pro-active.
A few things too like how you kinda egging seth on and less "at the fore-front" of the wagon on red than me or hoppic are positions that would benefit scum to take too.
My biggest problem with you is you've mostly argued people on what feel like technicalities and "anti-town" things instead of scummy things (not the same) and you don't look into motivation behind actions or deeper thought as much as I'd expect from someone like you.
That said a lot of these things apply to alpaca too when I think about it. I think it's PROBABLY you/alpaca but I thought that on red and radiant and I really don't want to confbias fuck up yet again.
1. Red - Not to get defensive, however you've cast a shadow over my play, I pushed Red hard to admit his agenda. Once he did, it became more than obvious to me what his intent was. Hindsight shows I had a huge misread. Semantics aside, I was scum hunting 100%. That's not retaliatory since he wasn't even voting for me. I actually was quite proud of my efforts to expose what I believed to be a scum.
2. Seth - I wasn't reading Seth as scum. I did call his play anti-town, repeatedly. With that said, Yes, I did egg him on after he lost it and came at me on a personal level. I found it funny. Still do. I only wish he'd have come full force and not pulled back. Love me some troll. I didn't care for his style and said so.
I'm not sure why you'd say any of that is weird. It's very transparent and obvious. And I honestly feel like I've put in much more effort that the rest of you.
Okay, that's not a bad response.
My complaint is still that a lot of the problems you had with red were on semantics, definitions and on him being "upset" which isn't necessarily wrong but feels like misfocus. Saying he was contradicting himself and making mistakes is fine but I feel like you were more beating him personally in an argument than explaining why you thought he was scum or trying to get others on board. Honestly I have some trouble following it because it got so complicated at times and I wish if you were town you'd have periodic "summaries" posted because it's hard to judge how your overall read is changing when you're so focused on the exchanges/back-and-forth themselves in all the details.
I was scumreading red for the exact same "focus" thing though so ugh.
When I'm talking about tone and I just say you read weird to me in that way it's kind of standalone though, gut and feeling can't really be spoken into that much or debated since it isn't logical to begin with... But that's more a passing remark than what I'm trying to figure the game on though.
I'm not sure if I should go into WHY it's a good response before people post reads since it would be pretty much teaching scum how to respond townily...
Ugh even alpaca has those few posts that make me second guess though. FTR I'm actually really impressed with whoever 2 of you are scum this game, win or lose. If kala wasnt PR I'd have kept thinking he was scum too and we'd have 100% lost this already.
Yeah but we only really need 1 townread we feel confident in too to get scumteam so it's not a lost cause either, kala being conftown helping the cause a lot compared to traditional 5p.
It's definitely advantage scum but I still have a lot of hope here
Okay, I've read the entire thread twice now. Once to recap and the second time to try to figure out pairings.
Whomever you both are, you've done well to disguise yourselves. And for the record, Kal if not for your claim, and the lack thereof a counterclaim, you'd still be my strongest scum read.
Hop - You have been listed as suspect by just about everyone that is dead. You've managed to straddle the fence while being the hammer on both lynches. Uncanny. You also spent most of D2 rehashing Seth's play.
Alpaca - You have been universally read as town by almost everyone for the entire game. You've engaged in direct conversations while presenting a town front. You definitely have come across as Teflon. Almost too polished.
Ras - I've read you as null for most of the game. Although I've agreed with you a lot, there is an underlying current of distrust I cannot shake. With that said, you've been the most engaging D3.
There is a common thread between two of you that continues to evade me.
What I'd like is for each of you to give an assessment of each of the remaining players.
In post 645, wgeurts wrote:Also quoting over half the player-list and saying there's likely one scum in there is a bit silly, as that's basic probability theory which I can show you if you insist. Also I literally stated I think both scum are on separate wagons as I stated I think KS and Hoppic are scum, Hoppic is the worst of the two as I'll explain and the one I'm more confident in seeing flip read. By what logic is Murph|Town+RC|Town=KS|Prob-Scum?
Anyway here's my reads list which I'll elaborate later:
{wgeurts}
{Rask, Murph}
{Alpaca, RC}
{KS, Hoppic}
In post 647, wgeurts wrote:Also I started scum-reading Hoppic yesterday, don't you dare accuse me of it being sudden as that's blatantly false.
RC, it's your turn to rally the town, in a situation where they all turned against you, all of this, because of wgeurts.
You have to try RC.
In post 426, RedCoyote wrote:I'm pretty good with Ras/Sim/Alpaca being town and scum being in wgeurts/Hoppic/Murph. Everyone else is in the middle.
In post 776, RedCoyote wrote:As I've alluded to, I think KS is probably the best lynch today. I feel a little blind about it because of how lurky he is, but, on the other hand, I'm becoming more and more convinced Murph is town. I don't readily see his latest string of posts as optimal scum strategy. If it is, he's doing well, I think.
In post 592, Simoyd wrote:@wgeurts: why is hoppic so low in your list?
In post 870, Murph wrote:Ras - I've read you as null for most of the game. Although I've agreed with you a lot, there is an underlying current of distrust I cannot shake. With that said, you've been the most engaging D3.
This is a huge towntell that you couldn't have known about; this is by far the feeling I incite in most town if they actually force themselves to make any judgement at all. Scum usually either townread me for no reason or scumread/push but the classic uneasiness/paranoia is what especially newbies get from me, when people actually give a read on me at all (i.e. not just ignoring me which I often get from both).
Spoilering in hope this doesn't get seen in a quick meta skim and abused too much, though only newbies could really use this.
In this case what I said earlier in 867 applies and me townreading this directly influences me feeling good about hoppic/alpaca scum in turn (and I'm actually fine with just that process) though I'll go over alpaca/hop for kala and you anyways.
