Newbie 1723 - Game Over!

[Nachomamma8]

or terseness.
that's good too.

[Nachomamma8]

Suspicion: reading this back it sounds like you knew e_is_cool was town.
"more likely" - how do you know which stance is the "more likely" actual position?
Did your early town-read of e_is_cool make you lean "more likely" townie with incorrect theory?

I didn't think that saying e_is_cool misrepresented you was exactly fair; you asked a couple of questions, and he asked the motivation and behind them and assigned a possible scum motivation to them, whereas for me, misrepresentation in mafia is more looking at a set of events and warping them in a tangible way. I thought that type of questioning was more likely than not to be coming from town simply because it was so far out of left field; seemed unlikely to me that scum would stick their necks out so far attacking a townie so early in the game. I don't remember if I had a significant townread on e before then, but I do remember liking that post specifically.

Again, this feels like a soft defense.
It seems like you know which points I raise are either valid or invalid.

Do you think that the point that I brought up was invalid?
I didn't have a read on Faalcon at the time, but I thought your criticism on his reads list at the time was a bit harsh.

[Nachomamma8]

I thought you were purposefully playing conservatively because you were a town PR.
What benefits have you gained from choosing to "play this game more conservatively than usual"?

Not a ton, but that's more to blame on my schedule than the style in general.
What I had hoped to gain from playing a bit more conservatively was taking over the game less and being able to look at this with a more objective view; it's not at all unreasonable for my persuasiveness to outweigh the strength of my reads and by playing more conservatively I hoped I could lose a little persuasive, gain a little insight. The fact that I look a bit more PR-ish doesn't hurt either.

[Nachomamma8]

Your exhaustive discussion with Skold regarding 'scumlean-neutrality' was extensive.
What did you draw upon it regarding Skold's alignment?

Nothing at all, which wasn't exactly my expectation.
The premise of the argument was that "scumlean" is not that far from "null"; it's not a read that you're likely to stand behind or stick your neck out for. Skold's response was "you're wrong you're wrong you're wrong you're wrong you're wrong". I don't feel like not getting anything meaningful out of the interaction was my fault.

[Nachomamma8]

However, you were least articulate on this suspicion/read:

My reasoning wasn't overly complicated and could be found in my "stop shitposting" post; Vecna as town who was a fairly engaged player before didn't seem like the type who would be happy to give all up communication for no real reason, and, unfortunately, there have been players who sandbag as scum in a fairly ridiculous fashion. I don't think there could be more substance in the read than that.

[Ircher]

Day 3 Deadline #9

Vecna (0) -
Harry (0) -
Faalcon (0) -
Morning (1) - Nacho
Nacho (0) -
Not Voting (4) - Vecna, Harry, Morning, Faalcon

Lynch Threshold

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch!

Deadline

Day 3 ends on August 19, 2016 5:30 PM EST DST+1 or in (expired on 2016-08-19 17:30:00).

Mod Notes

None.

[goodmorning]

dh you should probably put the pedal to the metal slightly

[Vecna]

Also note, no quickhammer since Nacho's vote made on Sun Aug 14, 2016 12:19 am.
This tells me there is guaranteed scum in Nacho and goodmorning (singular or both).

Seeing how thus much time has passed without any action it seems very likely. The thing that worries me slightly is that theyre attcking eachother quite heavily. Whether that means theres only one scum there or they decided in nightchat to start bussing eachother as a hail mary remains the important question.

[Vecna]

At any rate there is zero chance of no scum in the two. Dh and falcon wouldve already quick hammered by now and i cannot see any way for the two of them to be a team.

Disregarding my read on dh, a gm plus dh team could be a far off possibility where gm came up with a bold scum gambit to attack dh as soon as entering the game. However if this was the case they would have been attacking abd pushing nacho by now is what im expecting. Maybe this is still xoming but for now this seems like one of the most unlikely scum pairings. Especially since dh doesnt need any more towncred.

The same applies to a falcon and gm pairing but in a slightly lesser sense. Would they really chose a bussing strategy here? If it comes down to a three way between faalcon, dh and me his survival is quite uncertain so i dont think faalcon would be pushing his partner here.

The most likely scum pairing that includes gm is him with nacho. Since both of them are largely scumread, it does make sense for nacho to be bussing here since they both know one of them is getting lynched here. The last nightkill combined with this bussing stategy is likely to be the only way they could still win the game by getting one of them at least some towncred while discrediting other players. Even in this scenario though it is quite strange that gm is no longer attacking dh, or falcon, but i guess they might be trying to set me up instead.

[Vecna]

I guess i should also be looking at possible nacho plus faalcon/dh combinations. However if either of those is the case i really dont see a way of how town can still win this game, with gm playing the way he has been since he's just too scummy to ignore from here on out.

[Vecna]

Also i didnt forget about my statement that is respond to gms jokepost, but im still on vacation without acces to a computer to do the required quote magic to dismantle his arguments

[Dirty Harry2]

Yes, hypothetically if there is scum in Dirty Harry2/Vecna scum have won.
The game was finished as soon as this day started.
I felt like the player(s) we were lynching was inevitable.
That is what troubles me.

Must finish my Nacho re-read.
Looking at his replies to my points,
I am still thinking:

Currently thinking: it will be hard to lynch Nacho.

Every reply is calm and well-worded.
I.e good defense.

[Faalcon]

It wouldn't be difficult to find things against nacho

Then why don't you give it a go instead of jellyfishing around?

Because, you know, I'm not the one pleading for a quickhammer since the end of the last day then refusing to explain anything.
I like how this is the only part of my post you're answering to, though, it makes the rest of it truer.

Okay everyone, why is this day dragging on ? It's been eleven days and neither of us has changed it's mind, we've spent out time between reading goodmorning's posts, responding to her and making weird theories on the different scumpairs there could be.

My two cents on those pairs, by the way :
-gm/nacho : this is the more believable pair here. They're my two scumreads, and their dynamic makes sense, both as nacho/parabola and nacho/morning
morning/DH : it may make sense, but it is far fetched. Morning would sacrifice herself for Harry's towncred. He didn't need it though, so I don't know why the hell this would happen.
morning/Vecna : same as above, except if doesn't make sense from the start
I don't believe in nacho/DH. Nacho/vecna might have happened, but there are next to no clues favouring it. And if DH/Vecna flip scum I'll gladly lose because they'll have been so good.

[goodmorning]

@DH: Of course he's calm, he's about to win the game with little to no effort.

@Faalcon: I've never asked for a quickhammer. I've also explained everything. You said you think Nacho is Scum, I want you to explain why. Or are you refusing to?

[Faalcon]

[quote="In post 888, "goodmorning"]@Faalcon: I've never asked for a quickhammer.[/quote]

- Goodmorning's latest position on Nacho +1

Latest position: can we quicklynch him?
(I know this is going to look like OMGUS, guys, I'm not dumb. It's not OMGUS. You can either believe it or not.)

Oops.

Want my reasons for voting nacho ? Get my reasons for voting nacho :
First, his "yeah I'll totally give reads" posts through D1.
Then that bad habit he has of defending himself instead of scumhunting, when in one of his IC posts he said to do just the contrary to be townread.
He has the best scum-dynamic with you.
I townread DH and Vecna, and you're only 4 for 2 scumslots.

Now you're satisfied, I realize your only reason for downvoting nacho is "meta" when because of that meta you townread him hard earlier in the game.

Now I'm tired of this bullshit.
VOTE: goodmorning

[Vecna]

VOTE: vote goodmorning

[goodmorning]

oh look

quelle surprise

vecna is scum

probably with nacho

o k .

[Dirty Harry2]

Well played.

[Vecna]

GG. Why didnt u force me to bus nacho though gm? Clearly i expressed the desire to lynch either of you two

[Faalcon]

Well, gg.

[Dirty Harry2]

Was anyone going to lynch Vecna?
No.
MVP.

[goodmorning]

I was trying, but there was no way Faalcon was ever going to change his mind on me, and DH wasn't here so there wasn't much I could do.

p-edit: I would have tried! Didn't you see my associative post???

[Dirty Harry2]

Did you honestly scum-read me, or did you want to enter the game scum-reading the popular town-read (tactical decision)?

[goodmorning]

I honestly scumread you.

[Ircher]

Day 3 VC #10

Vecna (0) -
Harry (0) -
Faalcon (0) -

Morning (3) (L-0) - Nacho, Faalcon, Vecna

Nacho (0) -
Not Voting (2) - Harry, Morning

Lynch Threshold

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch!

Deadline

Day 3 ends on August 19, 2016 5:30 PM EST DST+1 or in (expired on 2016-08-19 17:30:00).

Mod Notes

A lynch occurred.