Micro 629 - The Arena - Game Over

[123456789]

You first.

Why me?

VOTE: karnos

Nope. You don't get to have that scummy "Don't share reads" stance from Day 1 and then not be EXPLICITLY CLEAR on your reasoning for what you did.

How is it not clear?

Yesterday he said he would pick me. Amazingly, look who the scum picked: me. Therefore he is scum.

This argument us absurdly weak and full of WIFOM. Pretty weak reason to choose to gladiate someone...

I'll give reads, eventually. About to eat lunch, and my ability to post today depends on how busy work is.

TBH, I made a huge play error- the whole time yesterday, I was assuming the "dawn" phase was similar to a twilight phase, in that the thread would be unlocked and town could discuss things with the gladiator before a target is chosen.

This comment is consistent with Karnos's stance throughout the game, so I see no qualms/problems to address here.

My perspective was based on a flawed understand of the setup. I thought there was a thread-unlocked discussion period after gladiator is chosen, before he picks a target.

The entire logic behind not sharing reads on day 1 was that those reads could be discussed during the dawn phase before a target is picked.

With understanding of how the setup actually plays, of course my perspective is changed. To give the gladiator information on picking a good target, reads should have been shared yesterday before lynch. That said, it was almost perfect in that the player who didn't share reads was picked as gladiator, because town as a whole doesn't suffer then because of missing out on my reads.

Still consistent with D1 stances.

That really is an excellent question.

Why do you think that was an excellent question?

You’ve already established that you think Leon is scum. And you claim you are Town. Leon’s question ostensibly points out what is a scummy position by Numbers.

Do you see it as viable for Scum 1234 to vote Scum Leon over Town you when he could use his claimed reads as justification to vote you instead?

Why are you interjecting here instead of letting 123456789 answer the question himself?

Since 123456789 has now responded...

It's an excellent question for... the reason you gave. Leon was pointing out a potentially scum motivated vote from 123456789.

I think it's perfectly viable for scum 123456789 to vote town leon over town me while claiming to see me as the more likely scum, and then to flip things around after leon is lynched with some lame "oh, well we lynched the wrong guy i guess i was right in the first place, lets lynch karnos tomorrow".

Of course, this is a scummy read dependant on leon's flip. If leon is scum, then I would be much less likely to read 123456789 as scum.

I think we're all kinda lining up lynches which is starting to make that NAI.

To be fair, it does indeed look I'm doing that, but have you stopped and considered that just because something looks scummy doesn't necessarily mean it comes from scum? The thing I dislike about this post though is the pre-flip association you're trying to push on Leon/Me with barely any reasons to support such a notion.

[Dunnstral]

Leonshade's opinion of me this game has evolved in a way that does not indicate town

Nevermind there being a case on me, a bunch of people who were townreading me did a 180 and won't explain anything

[123456789]

Karnos's stance also seems pretty consistent with his wiki philosophy... His wiki page was created before the game began....

I still think Leon is a better lynch tbqh; again, Karnos seems to play scummy on purpose and is probably lynchbait this game.

[Dunnstral]

Are you voting leon?

[Dunnstral]

Nvm I see you are

[Frozen Angel]

Vote Count 2.5

karnos (3): MagnaofIllusion, frog, Vedith
Leonshade (2): 123456789, Dunnstral
Not Voting (1): Hopkirk

With 6 votes in play it takes 4 to lynch.
The deadline is at 15 August 9:15am EDT (UTC-4), or in (expired on 2016-08-15 09:15:00).

Mod notes:
MagnaofIllusion is V/LA till August 15.
frog is V/LA till August 15.

[Hopkirk]

VOTE: Karnos

[Frozen Angel]

Vote Count 2.6

karnos (4): MagnaofIllusion, frog, Vedith, Hopkirk

(LYNCH)

Leonshade (2): 123456789, Dunnstral
Not Voting (0): -

With 6 votes in play it takes 4 to lynch.
The deadline is at 15 August 9:15am EDT (UTC-4), or in (expired on 2016-08-15 09:15:00).

Mod notes:
A lynch has been achieved.

[Frozen Angel]

karnos has been lynched. He was

Town.

[Frozen Angel]

Night 2 begins now, and ends at 16 August 5 pm EDT (UTC-4), or in (expired on 2016-08-16 17:00:00).

[Frozen Angel]

Sorry for the delay I got sleepy early last night

Frog is the gladiator for Day 3. Frog must choose his target by 18 August 3am EDT (UTC-4), or in (expired on 2016-08-18 03:00:00)

[BNL]

I'm back from V/LA. Will start day when I get to a computer.

[Frozen Angel]

Vedith is frog's target.

Vote Count 3.0

frog (0):
Vedith (0):
Not Voting (5): Dunnstral, MagnaofIllusion, Hopkirk, 123456789, Leonshade

With 5 votes in play it takes 3 to lynch.
The deadline is at 25 August 9:00am EDT (UTC-4), or in (expired on 2016-08-25 09:00:00).

Mod notes:
Day 3 begins!
My computer is kindda dead. Again I'm really sorry for delay. Your main mod is here so it all should be fine

[Leonshade]

@frog:

Make your case for Vedith.

@Vedith:

What's your read on frog?

[MagnaofIllusion]

Yes, I would like to hear Frog's reasoning for choosing Vedith myself also.

[frog]

Sure, I'll make my thought process completely clear.

To be honest, I have no idea why I was chosen to be gladiator. My relatively low post count may have to do with it; I replaced in late into Day 1 and was not as active as I would have liked to have been Day 2. Chances are, other people don't have as solid a read on me as they do for others, and scum might perceive me to be mislynchable because of this. I did have a think about reads-based reasons for why I was chosen, but that went around in circles, and after some rereading my reads remained largely the same.

Going into Night 2, my top two scumreads were 123456789 and Vedith. My earlier issues with them can be found in my catch-up post, though I do have a few things to add. With regards to 123456789, his reads list discrepancy has still not been explained (and no, stating that 2% is a little difference does not explain why he voted karnos over Leonshade, nor does saying it is for 'personal use' excuse that). Vedith, however, became more problematic, and that will form part of my case.

The reasons I chose Vedith are as follows:

Vedith channelled discussion early in Day 1 into an unprofitable course. Whilst town should have been thinking about the target, Vedith instead started discussing why scum picked the gladiator, even though this was fruitless speculation given it was Day 1. In the process he threw some serious shade on Map Wolf and contributed to his mislynch.

Vedith has been tunnelling relentlessly on Dunnstral. I asked about this yesterday to ascertain whether it was some kind of joke, but got an incomprehensible answer. There is obviously nothing wrong with focusing on a player, but Vedith is scummy because he has done this to the exclusion of all else. Seriously, a glance at his ISO will reveal that in almost every post after about post #217 finds a way back to Dunnstral and very rarely asks questions of other player (insofar as they are not Dunnstral's 'buddy'). Despite Dunnstral and others asking for reasons, none have been forthcoming.

Vedith's stance on karnos, upon rereading, looks problematic. His first post after daybreak says that karnos is 'obvious town', and in post #301 he claims to know what karnos was thinking. By post #369, however, Vedith is now voting karnos, with no reasons given for the wagon switch despite his earlier confidence that Leonshade was the better lynch (this post is also bad for the interaction with Dunnstral). As a result of these unexplained 180s and Vedith's incorrigibility, I am questioning whether Vedith's reads are genuine.

I feel like Vedith has been somewhat neglected so far as regards criticism and questioning, despite the many scummy posts and strange actions. If anybody has further questions for me, throw them down and I will do my best to answer them.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Frog - what is your read on Dunn then?

[Vedith]

@Vedith: What's your read on frog?

Idiot.

[Vedith]

I mean, how the fuck can Dunn get away with not being on here?
If he was town, I would have been picked... All I'm saying.

[Dunnstral]

[frog]

Kermit approves

Frog - what is your read on Dunn then?

I quite like Dunnstral for town.

[123456789]

Sure, I'll make my thought process completely clear.

To be honest, I have no idea why I was chosen to be gladiator. My relatively low post count may have to do with it; I replaced in late into Day 1 and was not as active as I would have liked to have been Day 2. Chances are, other people don't have as solid a read on me as they do for others, and scum might perceive me to be mislynchable because of this. I did have a think about reads-based reasons for why I was chosen, but that went around in circles, and after some rereading my reads remained largely the same.

Going into Night 2, my top two scumreads were 123456789 and Vedith. My earlier issues with them can be found in my catch-up post, though I do have a few things to add. With regards to 123456789, his reads list discrepancy has still not been explained (and no, stating that 2% is a little difference does not explain why he voted karnos over Leonshade, nor does saying it is for 'personal use' excuse that). Vedith, however, became more problematic, and that will form part of my case.

The reasons I chose Vedith are as follows:

Vedith channelled discussion early in Day 1 into an unprofitable course. Whilst town should have been thinking about the target, Vedith instead started discussing why scum picked the gladiator, even though this was fruitless speculation given it was Day 1. In the process he threw some serious shade on Map Wolf and contributed to his mislynch.

Vedith has been tunnelling relentlessly on Dunnstral. I asked about this yesterday to ascertain whether it was some kind of joke, but got an incomprehensible answer. There is obviously nothing wrong with focusing on a player, but Vedith is scummy because he has done this to the exclusion of all else. Seriously, a glance at his ISO will reveal that in almost every post after about post #217 finds a way back to Dunnstral and very rarely asks questions of other player (insofar as they are not Dunnstral's 'buddy'). Despite Dunnstral and others asking for reasons, none have been forthcoming.

Vedith's stance on karnos, upon rereading, looks problematic. His first post after daybreak says that karnos is 'obvious town', and in post #301 he claims to know what karnos was thinking. By post #369, however, Vedith is now voting karnos, with no reasons given for the wagon switch despite his earlier confidence that Leonshade was the better lynch (this post is also bad for the interaction with Dunnstral). As a result of these unexplained 180s and Vedith's incorrigibility, I am questioning whether Vedith's reads are genuine.

I feel like Vedith has been somewhat neglected so far as regards criticism and questioning, despite the many scummy posts and strange actions. If anybody has further questions for me, throw them down and I will do my best to answer them.

1) I have explained the discrepebcy and you are going to have to take my explanation whether you like it or not. Just cuz you don't agree with a playstyle doesn't mean that they are wrong or scum. STOP IT!

@Mod --> Starting August 26, V/LA every Friday

[123456789]

VOTE: Vedith

[Dunnstral]

I do have actual thoughts, by the way

[BNL]

Bump