Newbie 1732 [Game Over!]: InnocentVille

[AstralFlare]

PP, why do you want an implosion lyncH over a Cass one?

[AstralFlare]

You're scum reading them both if I'm not wrong.

Also half your evidence relies on pre flip association. Do you have further reason to individually scumread the two?

[PenguinPower]

PP, why do you want an implosion lyncH over a Cass one?

I keep questioning my Drone/Cass read...though recently I'm leaning more to Cass. Implosion seems to be constant between the two.

[PenguinPower]

Do you have further reason to individually scumread the two?

Which two?

[AstralFlare]

implosion/Cass

[implosion]

You realize this is what you are doing with Cass? You keep citing reasons why you lean scum or read scum behavior, but you never vote. You never question, and you never push. Cass promised a long post on you, but never delivers. Instead, most of her posts are about townreading AF and why, even though the behavior she describes as towny for AF is similar to your behavior. Of course, Cass voted you so that's a little different...but it also looks like she's trying to pocket AF.

Leaving my vote where it is right now.

1, my point isn't necessarily that acting in that way is scummy; simply that her saying "Drone and I distanced, so we can't be scum together" is invalid.
2, it isn't what I'm doing with Cass - I haven't

questioned

her per se but I've gone one step farther because I've been heavily criticizing most of her posts in the past few pages... so I question your description of my play. I haven't voted her but I pretty much have done everything up to it; the only real exception was my saying I saw reason to townread her but I don't think it's strong enough to balance out the points in favor of her being scum.
3, Cass voting me isn't a little difference from my example, it's a major difference; the whole point was that neither of us in the game I mentioned ever committed to voting each other, only speculating on it.
4, well, I'm about to vote Cass so.

Ok, all I'm seeing is Imp subtly pushing Chrimi back towards my lynch and his win.

I fail to see how asking her if her reason to townread you is in any way pushing her towards your lynch; it's a simple clarification and her elucidating it isn't going to change her reads.

He says things like, 'Cass does this thing, it's not really a tell, but, hey, maybe you still want to lynch her, Chrimi?'

This is incredibly misleading; I have made plenty of posts where I explicitly call the things that you've said scummy. But, no, I guess you can really sum up my rhetoric on you by saying that the things you've done "aren't really tells."
This post is just such a horrible horrible misrepresentation of my play this game. If you are town then this goes beyond the point of passive bias or a filter and into the realm of you looking for ways to perceive what I've said as scummy.

So taking risks, provoking responses, forcing others to talk, is in towns interest.

Conflating these is very silly; provoking responses and forcing others to talk (both of which I have done today, notably towards you) in no way entail taking risks (which I have not done because there has not yet been a need to).

At this point there really isn't any reason for me not to be voting Cass. She keeps saying things that I disagree heavily with and that seem too underhanded (rhetorically and in terms of misrepresenting me) to be from town, and I don't think I'm going to be able to get past those.

VOTE: Cass

[AstralFlare]

Do none of you honestly have any reaction to my vote on Cass, who I have been town reading for many a page?

[AstralFlare]

UNVOTE: but still FoS Cass.

I'm town and imp is town, so on the off chance Cass is town as well I don't want scum hammering.

[AstralFlare]

Cass is AtEing me hard I think

[Cass]

Only because I'm convinced you're town, and I don't want to lose us the game. With that unvote there, I'll just stop doubting it. AF = town, Chrimi = town. But you should be even more paranoid, because Chrimi would vote me too and she's town and PP (who has to be scum in that scenario) is readying the hammer.

That post by PP was seriously scummy (assume for a moment he's scum and knows I'm town...). If that's right, it's PP/Drone or PP/Implosion - I think the latter, so I'm leaving my vote on. Hope I still have time to read up (not now, gtg, alas).

[implosion]

Are you seriously saying that the mere fact of PP changing his main suspect for my scum partner from Drone to you is "seriously scummy?" Are town not allowed to have reads that change over the course of the day? Or are they just not allowed to have reads that change over the course of the day to be more suspicious of you? Or should every townie automatically suspect people who become more suspicious of them, since each townie knows that they are town, and therefore can see intrinsic scum motivation in suspecting them?

Or is there something else to that post that makes you think it's scummy? Please elucidate.

[Drone]

Do none of you honestly have any reaction to my vote on Cass, who I have been town reading for many a page?

I am a bit too late to that very party. :V

UNVOTE: but still FoS Cass.

I'm town and imp is town, so on the off chance Cass is town as well I don't want scum hammering.

Is that an arguement at all? And.. for what?

You're trying too hard to look like town;
"Im town" statements shouldn't be even said for crying out loud! They sound like a desperate attempt at being convincing.
and if you are town, you should at least answer the post that you made me do :V


@pp

PP, why do you want an implosion lyncH over a Cass one?

I keep questioning my Drone/Cass read...though recently I'm leaning more to Cass. Implosion seems to be constant between the two.

Cool stuff, why aren't you voting either of em?



@Cass

Only because I'm convinced you're town, and I don't want to lose us the game. With that unvote there, I'll just stop doubting it. AF = town, Chrimi = town. But you should be even more paranoid, because Chrimi would vote me too and she's town and PP (who has to be scum in that scenario) is readying the hammer.

That post by PP was seriously scummy (assume for a moment he's scum and knows I'm town...). If that's right, it's PP/Drone or PP/Implosion - I think the latter, so I'm leaving my vote on. Hope I still have time to read up (not now, gtg, alas).

Where do I begin...?

Trying to get out of the mess she's in by directing firing wherever she can? :V
And she's been accusing ME for being obvious? :V

@Cass
Im so tempted to change my vote, but you have enough pressure on you already, I dont want the day to end yet.

The reason Cass ain't hammered yet is not because scum are already on her, it's because she's scum. :V
Otherwise a quickhammer would have been done.

The only reason I'm not voting Cass is because I am very curious of PP and AF, just for clarity.

[Drone]

Sorry for being missing.. but not much changed anyway.

[PenguinPower]

That post by PP was seriously scummy

Because my read on you changed? You started D3 with a gut scum feel and have gotten scummier, while Drone has remained even. I'm not sure between the two of you, which is why my vote is still on implosion.

Only because I'm convinced you're town, and I don't want to lose us the game. With that unvote there, I'll just stop doubting it. AF = town, Chrimi = town. But you should be even more paranoid, because Chrimi would vote me too and she's town and PP (who has to be scum in that scenario) is readying the hammer.

This is what I'm talking about - I'm going to use some of your wording here - assume for a moment that you are scum, and you know AF is town. You are trying to buddy up to him by declaring how towny he is (forget for a moment that you still haven't adequately described the difference between AF and implosion between "playstyles") in an attempt to get him to sheep you. You're also worried that you may be lynched, so you appeal to his emotion and state how bad it is because conf!town Chrimi would vote you and that scummy PP would hammer for the win - why couldn't Drone be substituted in for me there?

This is what you have been doing D3, and it is why I've started changing my read on you.

Cool stuff, why aren't you voting either of em?

I'm voting implosion...post 895

[AstralFlare]

Is that an arguement at all? And.. for what?

You're trying too hard to look like town;

It's explaining why I unvoted. I look like town because I'm town.

If you mean my thoughts towards PP, I think he is on the towny side of null. He has some really towny things that are hard to get past (his latest post is pretty much what I'm thinking), but if (and only if) Cass flips scum (which looks increasingly likely), then by PoE yeah he's scum.

[Drone]

@PP

My bad, misread the votecount.

[Chrimi]

PP/Drone or PP/Implosion

inb4 it's Cass/AF

I have literally no information this game and it's distressing. All of our lynches were wasted on players who didn't help us out much. Our PR got nk'd for claiming for no damn reason.

I believe a no-lynch might be the best move.
UNVOTE:

Hear me out. If scum hit whoever JK protected last night, then I still have a bulletproof. In that case, we'll be in the same situation tomorrow but we'll have more time and we'll know for sure whether or not scum hit me or TNE N1.

If scum hit me N1, then I die tonight. What this means is, the surviving town can look at my Day One reads and find out why I was targeted for the NK, and we get some information.

Thoughts?

[AstralFlare]

If scum hit whoever JK protected last night

They didn't. Why would they hit TNE?

why I was targeted for the NK

I think I've already speculated that.

Overall, I think it's a bad idea. All we're going to end up with is a 3-2. Which again requires all townies to cooperate, and then get 2 consecutive correct lynches in a row.

The only time I would advocate for no lynch is if we still can't agree on someone to lynch- and it looks like most of us can agree on Cass

[Chrimi]

If scum hit whoever JK protected last night

They didn't. Why would they hit TNE?

why I was targeted for the NK

I think I've already speculated that.

Overall, I think it's a bad idea. All we're going to end up with is a 3-2. Which again requires all townies to cooperate, and then get 2 consecutive correct lynches in a row.

The only time I would advocate for no lynch is if we still can't agree on someone to lynch- and it looks like most of us can agree on Cass

You were the one who originally said a no-lynch might be pretty good?

[AstralFlare]

I think a no lynch is okay if we do not come to a consensus. What you're saying is true, but I think going into a 3-2 is better than jumping onto someone we are unsure of, which potentially gives scum an instantaneous win.

What I said is the same as what I'm saying.

[AstralFlare]

4 days

[implosion]

Hear me out. If scum hit whoever JK protected last night, then I still have a bulletproof. In that case, we'll be in the same situation tomorrow but we'll have more time and we'll know for sure whether or not scum hit me or TNE N1.

If scum hit me N1, then I die tonight. What this means is, the surviving town can look at my Day One reads and find out why I was targeted for the NK, and we get some information

The advantage of lynching today also lies in the (unlikely) case where you still have your bp shot; it would mean scum can't safely kill you tonight (as that would give us a free mislynch) and would need to kill a different townie. The only real advantage of that is that you'd be alive in 4p though which isn't really mathematically an advantage.

I don't really think there's a very meaningful difference between NLing and lynching. I agree it may settle the difference between you and tne being shot n1 but then scum have a lot of options. And I don't think that knowing for sure which of you was shot n1 will help me personally scumhunt much better, at least. Both the upsides and downsides of lynching and of no-lynching are pretty incremental.

[AstralFlare]

VOTE: Cass

Town Cass would be pushing another lynch

[Drone]

Unvote

VOTE: Cass

Tired of this vote-unvote party, I'll get us closer to one of the day's goals.
If the general activity was a bit higher, I would have kept waiting for an answer from AstralFlare. It's no the case.
And I am not going to get it apparently.

Clarification; while a NL would have been optimal to get more space for questioning and answering, this game isn't all that active, no one's talking at all..
Cass didn't provide much of a solid defence. Cass did however, share what she felt N1 about Shannon (no, Cass. That's not a solid defence).

Now the option is up to the rest of you.
L-1 doesn't seem to be enough to get Cass going in the right direction... Maybe intent to hammer will?
If Cass wouldn't have been scum, she would have been quick hammered already. Her, or Imp (whom she was on, so that couldn't technically happen).

We can also wait three days for the remaining time to elapse, i ain't gonna vote NL. I really don't think it's a good idea.
If scum did target Chrimi n1 and she'd die this night, we'd be a bit screwed. Not risking that.

[Drone]

@AF whom would she be pushing a lynch on? :V