DoY I: British Monarchy Mafia (Mini 1896) - Game Over :O

[Tea and Biscuits]

Someone hammer fitz. I don't see the point in stalling this out any longer and I just want this day to be over now.

-- Postie

[havingfitz]

I'm town town. Catching up in 50+ page game I replaced into to help mod and for player list only to be forced to claim and face D1 lyching for shit reasoning is very aggravating.

I'm town.
Town needs to exit my wagon and look elsewhere.

[The Wood Cutters]

I'd be more likely to see why my reasoning is shit if you actually took the time to respond to it; if you're ignoring me because you think that I'm scum and you couldn't possibly be wrong then you're increasing the chances of you being lynched today for incredibly silly reasons.

[havingfitz]

@TWC...I haven't dialogued with you because I think you're scum. Iirc you're voting me already. If there is a question your vote is hinging on..ask it. I'm not going to pour through your ISO looking for questions or respond in entirety to the wallpost you made wrt me yesterday.

[Tea and Biscuits]

@TWC...I haven't dialogued with you because I think you're scum.

He says while dialoguing with TWC.

-- Postie

[The Wood Cutters]

@TWC...I haven't dialogued with you because I think you're scum. Iirc you're voting me already. If there is a question your vote is hinging on..ask it. I'm not going to pour through your ISO looking for questions or respond in entirety to the wallpost you made wrt me yesterday.

If you're town, this is incredibly frustrating - I am currently driving your wagon harder than anyone else in the game and am currently pushing lynches harder than anyone else in the game. If you are town, I hope you change your approach in the future once you're spoiled.

[Empking]

@Empking:

That AC wanted to deal with Mastina: Yes, very clear. That does not mean, however, that Mastina was not meant to convince everyone that's AC was an actual VT.

The only way it makes even a modicum of sense is if he's trying to hard buddy to our slot in order to fool us, but unless he's faking the whole "you're strong players and I can fool you" thing (in which case it wouldn't make sense to buddy us so hard), then making such a wacky maneuver seems like high risk for little reward. It's possible he's trying this as a gambit to look town in general, but unless his process was "do something convoluted as all hell and assume it makes me universally townread", I find that doubtful.

In other words, if mastina can actually read him, then making such an out there move is likely to draw her attention, and not all that likely to make her read him as town. If she can't, then all of the wheel spinning just to gain our confidence also seems like a huge waste of time; we'd be a good ally for scum to have, absolutely, but it doesn't make sense for *this* to be the way they go about it.

Does it make sense for *this* to be the way about finding your alignment? It make much more sense as a high-risk high-reward scumplay than a a high-risk barely-a-reward town play.

[The Wood Cutters]

It's convoluted, but it makes sense as a town gambit (and seems remarkably similar to Mastina's Gambit in DEFCON 4).

[The Wood Cutters]

@havingfitz: I would like you to explain why you're still pushing the first three points in your big wall as reasons why AC is scum when they claimed the VT claim was a gambit. I would also like you to address the reasons why they claimed to gambit as opposed to attacking them for lying period.

[The Wood Cutters]

I would also like you to defend two attacks that you've made against them for contradicting themselves.

First, you claimed that they said scum (Commander Shepherd) was saving you, then called the good Commander scum in their next post. Almost50 made the first post, Not Chara (who was disagreeing with it) made the second.

Second, Not Chara said that its reasons for scumreading TM were not activity related. You cited a post of Almost's, and used that to push that Not Chara was scumreading TM for activity.

I don't like that you take two differing opinions from two Hydra heads and go "hah! contradictions!" when two separate people will not always agree with everything posted by the other head.

Are these reasonable requests?

[havingfitz]

If you are town, I hope you change your approach in the future once you're spoiled.

I love when people (scum or town) pushing mislynches shift all the blame on the person being lynched. It's not your fault town!TWC your read on my is shit. It's my fault for being so darn scummy. Shame on me!

[The Wood Cutters]

Spoiler:

Obviously, this is information not to share with those who don't want to be spoiled, but for those who are spoiled and watching the game, you can convey to them the following:

Just for the record.
I both have, and have not, in fact, lost my marbles and gone batshit insane. There is both a madness to my method, and a method to my madness.

There is an exact 50/50 split chance between me getting lynched, and me not getting lynched, on D1. There won't be nukes on D1 from my understanding, unless my prediction of Reck changing his vote last-minute to NUKE THE BASTARDS turns true. And even if there were, they'd take 48 hours to hit, so I'll get a chance to post serious reads and whatnot before my death.

There are many people here who think I am scum for what I am doing. (I asked Andrius to only convey this message to those who are spoiled, because it makes it obvious that I'm not.) There are many people who for this play would policy lynch me.

But like most mastina plays, this is a calculated risk: I am gambling on the lynch not materializing. And I know that in this play...there will be mostly town who want to lynch me, with some scum. There will be some who defend me that are town, and some who defend me that are scum. Perhaps the more valuable one is that those who are on the fence are more likely to be scum, with maybe a few town.

Of course, if I know this. The default assumption would be, "well, that makes it a worthless play, right?". I mean, there's a reason Slayer's Gambit doesn't work. You have to know what you're trying to gain, and I just laid out how scum will be equally divided in their reactions, with mostly town involved. So surely, useless, right?

...As it turns out: no. What I'm gauging here is psychology, essentially. I'm not reading the players off of the expectation of "scum will do this, town will do that". I'm reading the players off the basis of, "That action looks like it comes from LLD as scum", and "that action looks like it comes from Cephrir as town". (Both true reads, btw.)

Of course, the tricky thing here is...I'm not an idiot. I know that the moment I change my tune, I am a deadwoman. I know that even if I play seriously for 3/4ths of a day phase, what I have already done will totally discredit any chance of my reads being taken seriously once I am gone at the hand of the town.

So, how, then, am I to convey to them the useful information?

The answer is...with subtlety. I'm looking for people who understand the situation. I'm looking for people who can grasp what I'm doing. And I'm looking to synchronize with those of them who I see as town. In essence, while I may not be able to directly convey important stuff, I'm hoping that I'll be able to relay it to key players who CAN convey the important stuff.

In other words. I'm looking to rattle feathers here, and reflect on subtle things. It's not the surface stance which matters. It's the tone, the intent, behind the stance which does. I cannot guarantee that I can read that...but the hope here is that I do decently enough to fuck the scum over.

I KNOW it is a big fucking huge risk.
If to nothing else, my reputation! Even if the players alive read this message (I'll be seriously pissed at Andrius if it isn't conveyed), would they actually believe me?

I mean, those that know me should. I'm MASTINA. Of course I have a plan. Of course it's a gambit. Of course it served a deliberate purpose. Of course I am still actually playing the game. Of course I was playing towards my wincon.

But to those who don't, they're just gonna see the shitty play and assume shitty player.

But I do know what I'm doing. I'm broadcasting my alignment, if people know what signs to really read. I'm looking for those who have read those signs...and for those who are faking knowing those signs. So like I said: method to madness, madness in method. Calculated risk. I'm HOPING for a payoff here, but we'll have to see.

If I fail, I do owe everyone that apology.

This is the Mastina Gambit from DEFCON, which, shortened, meant that she was playing oddly in order to draw a wagon and read people based on their responses to her play.

This Gambit, while less convoluted, has similar intent (do something wacky to read someone). It's something that 99% of people just won't do as scum because while sometimes it gets people to townread you initially those people won't be the majority and ultimately getting the majority to townread you is far more important than getting just a couple of people to townread you as scum.

[havingfitz]

Are these reasonable requests?

Sure.

While I do that...remind me of your reasons for voting TM. Not for leaving your vote there and the questions you're asking me. Your initial TM vote.

[The Wood Cutters]

If you are town, I hope you change your approach in the future once you're spoiled.

I love when people (scum or town) pushing mislynches shift all the blame on the person being lynched. It's not your fault town!TWC your read on my is shit. It's my fault for being so darn scummy. Shame on me!

If you're town, the Lion's share of the blame falls on me. However, your blame could have been minimalized if you didn't shut me out because you had a scumread on me.

Do you understand the point I'm making here?

[The Wood Cutters]

Gin voted TM because he thought that TM lurked as scum. I left it there because I was losing faith on Wraith and generally don't mind lynching useless slots early.

[The Wood Cutters]

ThinkBig specifically***

[CloudKicker]

Intent on fitz, will read stuff before

[The Wood Cutters]

Still talking with him, don't hammer.

[CloudKicker]

My @vanity wagon" is because i was busy irl

[The Wood Cutters]

What are your reads?

[CloudKicker]

I dont like prism posturizing pretty much and i dont want chara from the little i convwrsed with her

[CloudKicker]

Its also too late to move the wagon outside those two and my vote is needed, fitz was also my entry fos along with shaddow

[CloudKicker]

I prefer the fitz wagon over chara's by far but shadow late vote

[CloudKicker]

Deadline in 8 hours, i will hammer fitz before it forces nl

[The Wood Cutters]

What are your reads?

???

who would you lynch if you could lynch anyone?