[Game Over] Newbie 1784 - Escape Room

[BlackVoid]

I'd like to summarize my issues with each slot and have you do yours and we go over as much as we can while we have this uninterrupted time together.

Sure but you should start. I did this for most slots over the past few hours.

StealthyNoodle: 2585 (you responded to this), 2639
TesXX: 1634. This was a while ago. 2701. Recent thoughts are that he is likely town. I'm probably placing a bit less emphasis on Pine's quote than you are and a bit more emphasis on the tone difference between his scumgame and this game than you but overall I think we're on the same page.
Srceenplay: 2427, 2428, 2566
Alisae: 2677, 2692

I haven't said much about WhyMafia and Chronicle/Aristophanes but I'm waiting for Aristo to catch up before digging into that and I'm still scumreading WhyMafia but am scumreading Alisae more. I'll go into these two later.

Pedit: I'm not really sure what to make of it.

[nancy]

Noodle
- all scumhunting outside Pine seems to be exaggerating NAI shit as scum!indicative
- prewritten post at daystart
- total lack of cooperation and belligerence all game
- plastic read on Chronicle
- hard defended WM Day 1 then flipped his read on him (see first point)

May be forgetting stuff? That is off the top of my head.


WhyMafia
- response to being wagoned has been largely anti-town
- pushed CWs when Drixx was being lynched


Srceenplay
- scumhunting has felt totally vacant
- has basically sheeped all game
- hasn't followed through on contributing today
- survivalism / opportunism hasn't done any favors
- votes Pine early Day 1 as first interaction, does nothing with vote, doesn't interact with Pine further except asking blandly for a readslist


Ari
- Chronicle's Pine associatives are gross
- lurking??


Aslan
- lots of stuff I don't think we need to talk about this further atm

[nancy]

Like, I've talked about most of these in-depth at various points and can go back and grab quotes and such for you as needed, lmk.

[nancy]

Mmmm also for Noodle was that PR softing shit.

[BlackVoid]

Pretty much agree with everything except Noodle. But I was actually somewhat worried about Noodle backing up my WhyMafia push today and wondered if it wasn't WhyMafia, whether it could be Noodle but I still think the interactions with Pine/Drixx overall point to him being town. The others, I'm just waiting on their responses.

Yeah, I thought the PR softing was weird too. But then again, I felt like Drixx thought he was softing too and was trying to out it.

[nancy]

Well those are the things I'm wanting to try and resolve with you, if you have any particular feelings about them we can run over them like we've done with Aslan.

[Srceenplay]

Just got to work. A lot to catch up from overnight. Will do it later.
I'll do this first since I said I would first thing.

@Srceenplay, here's an easy-to-respond list of questions:

1) Why did you vote Pine in 283 with the reasoning "he's not around the defend himself?" You never explained this properly.

2) Where did your scumread on Pine come from in 306 to the point where you said you would kill him?

3) Nothing about 323 makes any sense and you dodged the question when people asked you to clarify why you voted Pine.

4) Why did you suddenly move from Pine to nancy in 339 i.e. what specific reasons were you scumreading nancy for?

5) In the quoted I showed of 333 and 341, why are you fishing around asking people whether they were trying to say that Pine isn't mafia? It almost seems like you knew Pine was mafia and you were trying to make them look bad by associating them with Pine.

6) In 841, you agreed with me that doc should cc nancy. Then in 900, you say that we all agreed that doc wouldn't cc. Why did you contradict yourself?

7) How did you have so much confidence in the Drixx lynch in 1110 that you say "one down" like he's definitely flipping scum despite your only reasoning for voting him being that you were sheeping me?

My vote on Pine was just for fun and reactions. My post around Pine at the time were contradicting shows there was no seriousness to it. I said it easy to kill someone who can't defend themselves. When asked why I want it like that I said I don't. Asking someone if the think "know" if Pine is mafia is because I was looking for reactions to suspicious people.

That first nancy vote may have been a bs vote as well,iirc. Later I did in fact scum read her though. The exact reasons I can't recall unless I go back and reread.

6) I got lazy I wasn't paying attention. For the most part you post was good and that is what I was liking.

That Drixx vote was a fake hammer.

[nancy]

But then again, I felt like Drixx thought he was softing too and was trying to out it.

That wasn't my take. Why would Drixx want to out it? He'd just back quietly off and take the shot that Night. The way I was looking at it he was reading the room either unsure of whether pushing it to L-1 for a claim would look bad or whether he'd be able to strongarm the lynch, or he was hesitating on bussing.

[BlackVoid]

But then again, I felt like Drixx thought he was softing too and was trying to out it.

That wasn't my take. Why would Drixx want to out it? He'd just back quietly off and take the shot that Night. The way I was looking at it he was reading the room either unsure of whether pushing it to L-1 for a claim would look bad or whether he'd be able to strongarm the lynch, or he was hesitating on bussing.

But if Drixx thought StealthyNoodle was either doc or BP, that's not enough. Knowing which one he is is pretty crucial to night actions. If BP, then tracker should be shot. If Doc, then Doc should be shot first. So, he can't really back off and go to night while not knowing where to shoot.

[nancy]

Noodle claimed not BP, I doubt he'd have thought anything else.

[BlackVoid]

@Srceenplay, a couple of follow up questions: 1) Were you suspicious of Pine or not? You say that your vote on Pine was for fun and reactions but then you also say that if you could kill one person, you'd kill Pine and you ask two other people why they don't suspect Pine. 2) In your 841, what exactly did you like about my post and why? And how did you later assume that we agreed that Doc shouldn't claim? I need a bit more elaboration here than "I got lazy and wasn't paying attention. 3) Can you link me to previous games of yours where you made bs votes as town?

[nancy]

Idk I get the same feeling from it as you. Drixx treating Noodle as Town.

[BlackVoid]

Noodle claimed not BP, I doubt he'd have thought anything else.

That's actually a good point. I'll re-assess Noodle after I finish catching up.

[nancy]

I'm going to sleep within the hour btw.

[Srceenplay]

@Srceenplay, a couple of follow up questions: 1) Were you suspicious of Pine or not? You say that your vote on Pine was for fun and reactions but then you also say that if you could kill one person, you'd kill Pine and you ask two other people why they don't suspect Pine. 2) In your 841, what exactly did you like about my post and why? And how did you later assume that we agreed that Doc shouldn't claim? I need a bit more elaboration here than "I got lazy and wasn't paying attention. 3) Can you link me to previous games of yours where you made bs votes as town?

1 any time I was on Pine was not serious. I said I would heal my self(can't do that) and kill Pine. That shows lack of seriousness. I was fishing for reactions.
2 I don't remember your post without rereading it. What I recall was it was well reasoned thought out and logical. Later I wasn't paying attention. I thought nancy was doctor though. That's why I said I would have killed that spot as scum. I even pm'd the mod at that point and said she better be the doctor.
3 this was my previous newbie game. I used no lynch for reactions. viewtopic.php?p=8857937&user_select%5B% ... 9#p8857937

I'm busy at work but have a break in about a hour.

[nancy]

I believe Srceenplay and I am going to treat him as locktown along with Tes going forward.

Pending hearing back from Tes, I think slots that make sense as scum by the lack of a night kill are {Ari, Aslan, WhyMafia}.

[Srceenplay]

Caught up 10 pages.

I don't think there was a buss.
Iirc the lynch came in the final hours. I put my vote down right before I went to sleep to make sure there was enough votes for a lynch.

[StealthyNoodle]

@StealthyNoodle, can you explain your Pine vote in 633? Up until this point, you didn't seem to have much suspicion of Pine other than your "shredding Pine's wall" post.

Well I pretty much gave you a

gift-wrapped

Pine in the posts that followed.
(Ofc. nancy states that she's the one who carried that lynch)

Shredding Pine's Wallpost - Part 1

[...]

I never got any response on this. Not sure if people just ignored it, but here starts my case on Pine.
For a Town IC, I don't like Pine's Wallpost at all. His arguments are simple and pretty pointless, a bunch of them are just rephrasings of other players' posts.

*Edit: Not sure what happened, but THIS is the correct post. Ignore the previous one.

Page 1

-Post 17 (and subsequent posts) leads me to think nancy is Town.

Page 2

-Not much to observe here, nancy continues to come off as Town.

Page 3

-Pine enters, nancy interaction is pretty obvTown.

Page 4

-Stealthy's entrance looks like newScum [...] votes nancy as the most dynamic player present. [...] exaggerating charges against nancy.

Page 5

-A little concerned about LoopDan's push against non-claimers in the BP strategy. [...] Also not a fan of his dig at nancy about her statement about teaching>wincon[...] As a player new to SE-status, nancy is allowed to be wrong about meta.

Page 6

[...]TRs (Town reads) include nancy and Chronicle.

Page 11

-Noodle attacks on nancy continue to be trying to make something out of nothing.
-Tentatively agreeing with nancy 314, LoopDan looks like stubborn Town SE sticking to bad reads.

Pretty much brushes away every argument towards nancy as useless. Puts up an effort to make me look more scum with useless arguments. Might be tunneling, but concidering Pine's an IC with 11k+ posts and likely a lot of games behind him, I'd doubt it. Also, his reasoning should be way better than this! An experienced town player would at least take others' opinions and reads into consideration - Pine simply doesn't. He just brushes them away as "obvious" scumreads.

Taking down a Town IC and dynamic SE would virtually guarantee a scum win.

Not sure why this is mentioned by an IC at all. It's a bad argument to avoid getting lynched, and shouldn't be used if one were an experienced town-player.

I'd also like to think that Pine would've had more insight as an IC, than to tunnel me from beginning till end. Not

once

did he see any of my posts as slightly townish, and avoided mentioning the posts that weren't scummy enough. As town, I'm pretty sure he'd be more open to more views.

Now, can we vote Pine?

[Alisae]

I'ma address this game in a bit, but BlackVoid makes me want to replace out. Not going too though.

[Alisae]

First off BlackVoid, fuck off. Like, you genuinely piss me off here because apparently, I'm fucking trying to "Manufucature Strife" when I am trying to encourage townplay. You're doing better now, thank fucking god, but it's bullshit like this that makes me want to replace out. But I'm trying to "Manufacture Strife" WHEN I AM JUST TRYING TO ENCOURAGE GOOD TEAM PLAY.

And I addressed this multiple times. I don't know how Day 1 went. I didn't read it. I catchup by reading individual iso dives.
And my anger is inaccurate? Fuck off.

Secondly, I don't care about Loopdan's play. Trying to figure out what my predcessor did, and giving thoughts or talking about it. It's all fucking pointless to me. It may help you, but I can't help with that. Sorry. How about you go metadive

me

. Because that's a lot more productive then going to go metadive my predecessor, who's play I can't really comment on, because if I were to comment on it, it would be a WASTE OF TIME.

Thirdly, yeah, it's advantagous for me to talk to conftown about reads. Good. Fucking. Job. YEAH, IT IS ADVANTAGOUS. YOU WANT TO KNOW WHY? WELL MAYBE BECAUSE BOUNCING OFF READS OFF OF CONFTOWN WINS GAMES. Like, are you okay? Do you understand how teamwork works? I don't get it dude ;~;

Fourthly, Being happy with a townread is litterally the defiintion of NAI. Town can do it. Scum can do it too.

Let's address even more bullshit that BV is throwing at me because why?

Wait. You're saying you haven't done anything to suggest otherwise?!?!?! ARE YOU FUCKING SERIOUS? YOU LITTERALLY RUINED THE MOST BEAUTIFUL ROLESWAP ON MAFIASCUMDOTNET. ARE YOU FOR REAL HERE?

And yeah, I am going to NO KILL when nancy would have powerlynched me for that at that time. ARE YOU FUCKING SERIOUS?

[StealthyNoodle]

I still have 3 or 4 pages left to read, but I gotta say. The fact that some of you or so easily persuaded by nancy's shit-reads saddens me.
Not a single one of you even went back to see her reason for voting me was, and check whether she was right or wrong.
@Alisae You're just appearing more and more scummy from licking nancy's boots. Just like Chronicle did at one point.

I'll respond to your post about me later BlackVoid. For now, thanks for actually acknowledging my wallpost-read(your pretty much the only one who did); I truly appreciate it.
Also, regarding whether I played before: No - This is my first game except for playing in Meat World.

[StealthyNoodle]

I still have 3 or 4 pages left to read, but I gotta say. The fact that some of you are so easily persuaded by nancy's shit-reads saddens me.
Not a single one of you went back to look into her reason for voting me, and check whether she was right or wrong.
@Alisae You're just appearing more and more scummy from licking nancy's boots. Just like Chronicle did at one point.

I'll respond to your post about me later BlackVoid. For now, thanks for actually acknowledging my wallpost-read(your pretty much the only one who did); I truly appreciate it.
Also, regarding whether I played before: No - This is my first game except for playing in Meat World.

Edit*

[BlackVoid]

The fact that some of you or so easily persuaded by nancy's shit-reads saddens me.
Not a single one of you even went back to see her reason for voting me was, and check whether she was right or wrong.

Who are you referring to here specifically?

[BlackVoid]

Asking someone if the think "know" if Pine is mafia is because I was looking for reactions to suspicious people.

So, what you are saying is that you were suspicious of Pine and was looking to see how people reacted to you asking them if they don't suspect Pine? That doesn't make sense with your following post:

1 any time I was on Pine was not serious. I said I would heal my self(can't do that) and kill Pine. That shows lack of seriousness. I was fishing for reactions.

I still don't get it. Were you or weren't you suspicious of Pine? If you weren't serious as you say in this quote, why would you choose Pine specifically and ask people questions like whether they don't think Pine is mafia?

[BlackVoid]

I caught up on stuff that happened since I replaced in. nancy's moves so far have been really suboptimal if she's town. It's possible she claimed 1-shot BP as scum to bait a doc claim.

If that's the case, the doc counterclaiming at this point is actually the best idea.

Then we lynch nancy, the doc is nightkilled. Since there is no roleblocker and only one scum would be left, whoever I track tonight will be cleared. So, even if we mislynch D2 and I get killed N2, there will be a tracker clear on D3. I don't want to risk lynching nancy if she's actually a 1-shot BP and the value of keeping a doc hidden at this point isn't much higher than just counterclaiming.

If you are town, please don't fake-claim

(I don't know why this needs to be said but it's been happening so often in recent games I've played or modded in).

Agree

@Srceenplay, here is the quote in case you forgot. If you thought this was well-reasoned and logical, how can you suddenly forget about it and push the opposing viewpoint?