Mini 1918: Paint Mafia Threequel! Game Over!

[MaxwellPuckett]

Hey I asked for purple wtf is this, recount
VOTE: jjh

Pedit Im p sure jjh's colour was changed by something

[Bomberman]

And you believe that change is indicative of Mafia?

[jjh927]

Yeah, I'm not. I'm actually a VT. I was mostly expecting me to be blue, but I'm not sure if it was the egocentric or realistic side of me expecting scum to have recoloured me red. Now I'm a mixture of both.

[MaxwellPuckett]

No i voted him for the flip because I think he's scum, why'd you vote him
Scum or 3p made that change, either he's blue and scum/3p made him purple to obfuscate that or he's red and scum changed him to purple because they figured he'd be flipped after the Twoface mafia flip

[MaxwellPuckett]

Also the two posts after the colour flip are bugging me

[Bomberman]

No i voted him for the flip because I think he's scum, why'd you vote him
Scum or 3p made that change, either he's blue and scum/3p made him purple to obfuscate that or he's red and scum changed him to purple because they figured he'd be flipped after the Twoface mafia flip

I am feeling the former, mostly because that begs the question why they didn't change TwoFace's color if they had that power

When I said it felt like indy, I meant how his color changed

[Bomberman]

You have to be making leaps and bounds to believe that Mafia would be given such an ability to repaint their roles, even if it was X-shot

Is your vote based on that premise? Otherwise I'm pretty sure JJH should be taken as clear

[jjh927]

I wouldn't say I'm clear. Blue would be clear. This is clearly a night action and the voices in my head were right when they said that I would be a target of some kind of colour changing thing.

[MaxwellPuckett]

I'm assuming it was a night power, Bomber.
Have you read the previous games in this series? Mafia had colour-changing abilities.

[jjh927]

Max, I haven't- I'm most interested right now in how many they get.

[Bomberman]

You just said you were VT and originally Blue, and hammered yourself based on the assumption you would be

Max, I did not read the previous games but alright

[MaxwellPuckett]

Jjh lmao that avatar

Pedit well you all should have at least read Varsoon's wallposts on the subject at the beginning of the game

[MaxwellPuckett]

I don't even know why I'm waiting for him to respond. I've never been conftown before and the prospect is exciting.

VOTE: jjh927

I'm what

Yeah, I'm not. I'm actually a VT. I was mostly expecting me to be blue, but I'm not sure if it was the egocentric or realistic side of me expecting scum to have recoloured me red. Now I'm a mixture of both.

These posts dont follow imo, either you expected to be recoloured or you didnt, and this looks like fake surprise

[Bomberman]

At the least I see where you're coming from given that JJH was so certain he was going to be clear, but now wants to postulate that he isn't for whatever reasons

[MaxwellPuckett]

Just went back to make sure--in the first game, the scum team could paint a player blue once per game and had infinite uses of painting a player red, green, orange, yellow, black, white and purple. There was also a mechanic revolving around 'freshly' painted players where several roles could figure out if a player had just had their color changed.

Cheetory didn't like the 'bastard' elements of painting a player red/blue and also didn't like how some role interactions could allow town a very easy victory (one player could check what the total color of players were of each color at night and another could remove one player from that check, essentially letting town, if coordinated, color-check players each night as well as each day).

The second game was scaled down to a 13 player setup and the 'wet paint' mechanic was removed. Town roles were made more direct/straightforward, too and scum power was taken down a whole lot. In that game, the mafia could only paint players as Black, white, red, orange, green, yellow or purple.


So, why bring all this up?

I was thinking about my first post here and started to recall that scum could paint players a lot of different colors, then realized that in the first game they could even paint players red and blue. In the design topic for the game, I recall telling Cheetory that I thought Mafia might, outside of gambits, only paint players blue/red because that's most effective at throwing a wrench into town strategies based on public mechanics.

While it's clear that between game 1 and 2, Cheetory removed painting players blue, the ability to paint them red stayed in.

That said, I would still trust that Red = Scum unless we have any provable role-claims that can show us otherwise.

And for D1, Red definitely equals scum and Blue definitely equals town.

Just flip the script here from what I said previously:

BLUE players are very, very likely CONFIRMED TOWN unless someone can prove that players can change others blue.
RED players are likely to be CONFIRMED SCUM in the EARLY GAME but we can't rely on that as much moving forward.
Again, this is somewhat speculative, as Cheetory could've changed some core things between the second game and this one, but
I do NOT see Cheetory giving Mafia the ability to paint players blue, since he really didn't like how much that could skew things in scum's favor in the first game and was essentially 'bastard'.

This is the relevant post Bomber

But yeah it's that, the post-colourflip posting is just awkward and he's not challenging my scumread

[jjh927]

I don't even know why I'm waiting for him to respond. I've never been conftown before and the prospect is exciting.

VOTE: jjh927

I'm what

Yeah, I'm not. I'm actually a VT. I was mostly expecting me to be blue, but I'm not sure if it was the egocentric or realistic side of me expecting scum to have recoloured me red. Now I'm a mixture of both.

These posts dont follow imo, either you expected to be recoloured or you didnt, and this looks like fake surprise

It's not quite that simple when your gut tells you one thing and your brain tells your gut to stop being so self-absorbed

[jjh927]

I'm not challenging your scumread? What actually is there to challenge rn?

[MaxwellPuckett]

Why were you expecting scum to have recoloured you red, and why was purple more surprising than either red or blue?
Pedit: idk, i said why i thought you were scum, do you have thoughts or why im wrong or something abt trying to stop the twoface wagon

[jjh927]

Okay, right, I'm done with my thinking thing and have collected myself. What needs to be figured out is- if scum painted me, then why am I purple and not red?


Having just read setup shit from paint 2, the sneaky thing there was that scum had no blue paint, but town were not told this. How do we know scum have red paint and what would this mean for balance?

[jjh927]

Purple was far more surprising than red or blue because I was blue and was expecting, if recoloured, to be red. I felt those were the only two realistic outcomes.

Could you outline again why you think I'm scum because I must have missed it.

[Aristophanes]

I'm so far behind. Did we flip anyone yet?

[Bomberman]

It'd be a bastard game and I'm pretty sure this was not advertised as one

[jjh927]

Why would scum not having red paint be bastard?

[aptil]

This was not what i expected when i went to sleep last night .

[jjh927]

We flipped me and I'm purple, Ari.