Mini Normal 1929 - Game Over

Mulch · Post Post #1200 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:28 pm

VOTE: Scorpious

Mulch · Post Post #1201 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:30 pm

The one thing weird to me is how he "gut scumreads" llama because to me it's the complete opposite, llama is a complete and utter scumfuck but gutreads as town to me

Mulch · Post Post #1202 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:32 pm

Scopious has really great confidence and tone, but when you look into their posts they are sorta shit and also pretty town grabby. He's also just literally refusing to do anything and is not participating at ALL and is baseing his reads off good reasons but nothing to support. I want more.

Scorpious · Post Post #1203 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:34 pm

In post 1200, Mulch wrote:VOTE: Scorpious

Sigh.. et tu brute?

All that nonsense,and you circle back to voting me..

Dude, i have a life.. check the sig

Mulch · Post Post #1204 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:34 pm

In post 1203, Scorpious wrote:
In post 1200, Mulch wrote:VOTE: Scorpious

Sigh.. et tu brute?

All that nonsense,and you circle back to voting me..

Dude, i have a life.. check the sig

Bettlejuice. Also, do something please

LlamaFluff · Post Post #1205 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:38 pm

In post 1202, Mulch wrote:Scopious has really great confidence and tone, but when you look into their posts they are sorta shit and also pretty town grabby. He's also just literally refusing to do anything and is not participating at ALL and is baseing his reads off good reasons but nothing to support. I want more.

So then they faked thinking the Vedith claim was probably real to you? Because remember scum knew it was fake immediately. I could see scum acting like it was real if they can pull it off, but it would require a new player who could feign ignorance of the role existing + know that they should fake thinking it was real in that situation.

The strongest case in that direction is how Carcalilly and Scorpious ignored each other the entire game, even then it turns into more of a "PoE if everyone else is town" thing.

Mulch · Post Post #1206 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:42 pm

In post 1205, LlamaFluff wrote:
In post 1202, Mulch wrote:Scopious has really great confidence and tone, but when you look into their posts they are sorta shit and also pretty town grabby. He's also just literally refusing to do anything and is not participating at ALL and is baseing his reads off good reasons but nothing to support. I want more.
So then they faked thinking the Vedith claim was probably real to you? Because remember scum knew it was fake immediately. I could see scum acting like it was real if they can pull it off, but it would require a new player who could feign ignorance of the role existing + know that they should fake thinking it was real in that situation.

The strongest case in that direction is how Carcalilly and Scorpious ignored each other the entire game, even then it turns into more of a "PoE if everyone else is town" thing.

I don't even remember them faking anything lmao remember I replaced in after day 1 and just skimmed the game.

All I know is that his posts are bad lol

Mulch · Post Post #1207 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:48 pm

In post 1087, Scorpious wrote:
In post 1085, Mulch wrote:Scorpious PLEASE respond to me

If you can be patient. I will..

Just got home from adulting.. wanna have a good double S,then I'll don the smoking jacket,and provide..

In post 1121, Scorpious wrote:What tbe actual fuck, bro?

In post 1203, Scorpious wrote:
In post 1200, Mulch wrote:VOTE: Scorpious

Sigh.. et tu brute?

All that nonsense,and you circle back to voting me..

Dude, i have a life.. check the sig

In post 1048, Scorpious wrote:Alban, how do you view Llama currently?

Who would you rather lynch between them and awesome?

In post 1068, Scorpious wrote:
In post 1062, Mulch wrote:
In post 1048, Scorpious wrote:Alban, how do you view Llama currently?

Who would you rather lynch between them and awesome?
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Scorpious I would love a reads list and also still am waiting for the answer to which questions of mine you felt I was overly preocupied to how I looked

Read lists are for scum

The first 3 are just him saying he will do stuff and he won't, the second and third is the type of useless "game solving" (ie, tons of questions, no analysis) that scum love, and a really townygrabby post respectively.

ISO · Post Post #1208 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:53 pm

Day 2 VC #5Awesomeusername (2) - MarioManiac4 (1026), WhyMafia (1191)
WhyMafia (1) - Alban (869)
Steel (0) -
Mulch (1) - LlamaFluff (961)
Scorpious (1) - Mulch (1200)
Alban (0) -
MarioManiac4 (0) -
LlamaFluff (1) - Steel (955)
No Lynch (0) -
Not Voting (2) - Awesomeusername, Scorpious

Lynch ThresholdWith 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

DeadlineDay 2 will end by August 5, 2017 5:30 PM EDT or in (expired on 2017-08-05 17:30:00).

Moderator NotesModerator V/LA July 24-28. Please address issues to Gamma Emerald during that time.
Steel V/LA until July 30. ((expired on 2017-07-30 23:59:59))
Have fun!

Spoiler: Current Voting History

Spoiler: Previous Voting History

LlamaFluff · Post Post #1209 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:54 pm

In post 1206, Mulch wrote:I don't even remember them faking anything lmao remember I replaced in after day 1 and just skimmed the game.

His reactions D1 to the whole claim situation seem to glaze over it initially, and when it was forced out that it was a fake his posts showed that he had actually believed the claim, which would have "cleared" his partner.

So again, you think he decided to fake believe it as opposed to a player who heard of a new role for the first time just looking it up and assuming it was real? I have a bit of a hard time buying that Scorpious saw what he knew was a fake claim, and then decided to ignore it but return to vote Vedith for fakeclaiming later trying to pass it off as he was duped when just sheeping people on the wagon would have been far easier. Its not a super strong town tell, but I don't buy that one without a strong case. Town or scum, I think his posts would be similar in trying to keep up with a game while too busy in real life.

I still think the only real reason to call Scorpious scum is that the interactions between him and Carcalilly were non-existent.

Mulch · Post Post #1210 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:10 pm

Carcalilly likes talking to their partners a decent amount as scum btw. Check out ThinkBig's mini normal

Mulch · Post Post #1211 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:11 pm

Why don't you think the quotess I just posted are damning?

And in terms of that, it's super easy to fake believing in a fake claim, so that holds no weight for a towntell

LlamaFluff · Post Post #1212 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:19 pm

In post 1210, Mulch wrote:Carcalilly likes talking to their partners a decent amount as scum btw. Check out ThinkBig's mini normal

If you buy that why are you calling Scorpious scum? They ignored each other.

In post 1211, Mulch wrote:Why don't you think the quotess I just posted are damning?

Because not having time is not a scumtell. Because asking questions is not a scumtell. The only thing that can at all be called a scumtell in what you quoted is not giving reads.

Its been day two for 72 hours. Just because you are averaging a post every 20 minutes since the day started doesn't mean everyone has time to do that. When his posting rate hasn't changed much the entire game, that is a complete null tell.

Mulch · Post Post #1213 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:25 pm

In post 1212, LlamaFluff wrote:
In post 1210, Mulch wrote:Carcalilly likes talking to their partners a decent amount as scum btw. Check out ThinkBig's mini normal
If you buy that why are you calling Scorpious scum? They ignored each other.

Because of the other scummy stuff? IDK what you want from me man. Meta is also changeable, so it's not the end all be all. But it does point towards towny points in Scorpy's direction.
In post 1211, Mulch wrote:Why don't you think the quotess I just posted are damning?
Because not having time is not a scumtell. Because asking questions is not a scumtell. The only thing that can at all be called a scumtell in what you quoted is not giving reads.

Its been day two for 72 hours. Just because you are averaging a post every 20 minutes since the day started doesn't mean everyone has time to do that. When his posting rate hasn't changed much the entire game, that is a complete null tell.

What about the LAMIST and the fake solving?

Mulch · Post Post #1214 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:25 pm

In post 1213, Mulch wrote:
In post 1212, LlamaFluff wrote:
In post 1210, Mulch wrote:Carcalilly likes talking to their partners a decent amount as scum btw. Check out ThinkBig's mini normal
If you buy that why are you calling Scorpious scum? They ignored each other.

Because of the other scummy stuff? IDK what you want from me man. Meta is also changeable, so it's not the end all be all. But it does point towards towny points in Scorpy's direction.

In post 1211, Mulch wrote:Why don't you think the quotess I just posted are damning?
Because not having time is not a scumtell. Because asking questions is not a scumtell. The only thing that can at all be called a scumtell in what you quoted is not giving reads.

Its been day two for 72 hours. Just because you are averaging a post every 20 minutes since the day started doesn't mean everyone has time to do that. When his posting rate hasn't changed much the entire game, that is a complete null tell.
What about the LAMIST and the fake solving?

EBWOP

LlamaFluff · Post Post #1215 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:33 pm

You can just use

Code: Select all

[/quote]

to close off quote brackets in the future. It tends to make everything flow better than making a dozen individual points or risking more breaks in formatting by using bold.

Anyway.

Because of the other scummy stuff? IDK what you want from me man. Meta is also changeable, so it's not the end all be all. But it does point towards towny points in Scorpy's direction.

I just am wondering why even bring that up when it conflicts with your vote. Carcalilly basically ignored everyone but Vedith and MM all of day one until they were under a lot of pressure.

I have no problem asking alban about reads and even saying a "which of X would you vote" because trying to figure out the reads of others, and match that to what they are saying for consistency, is a good thing. Even more if the player in question is being vague about reads, being direct abut it is a good thing. Its not a town tell or a scum tell. Its trying to extract information which is a good thing, just not a tell either way.

The only post I you quoted I have any problem with is the "reads lists are bad" which can be true in certain scenarios, but in this case makes sense as there are a concensus group of town reads that the majority of the game holds, and given the player state it really only helps

Mulch · Post Post #1216 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:34 pm

The difference between me and you, pal, is that even if I think someone's scum I'm not going to block off and ignore all the points that point towards townyness on them and vice versa. This is what trying to read people is, not deciding someone is town or scum and conf biasing and only posting things that support your case.

I think Scorpy has a good chance to be scum, and I think that the fact they didn't interact is a towny point. I'm bringing it up because there is no reason for me to keep it hidden, dude...

Mulch · Post Post #1217 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:36 pm

This statement by you

In post 1215, LlamaFluff wrote:I just am wondering why even bring that up when it conflicts with your vote.

perfectly encapsulates all of my frustration with you this game

alban · Post Post #1218 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 4:40 pm

In post 1190, WhyMafia wrote:Yeah
I've re-read Alban's ISO
Definitely getting cold feet. If you're reading this, sorry for the tunnel Alban, but I was 99% sure you were scum, and the OMGUS didn't help ;p
Re-read Awesome's ISO, I suppose I'll go on that if we don't find a suitable lynch

IMO
Steel and Llama are pretty likely town
Mulch likely as well, but I hesitate to put him in above bracket because there's a few things that bothered me. He shouldn't be lynched anytime soon though.
Everyone else goes here
Awesome

If this isn't scum, tell me what is?
The winds changed direction after I left, and so did whymafia's tune.

Scorpious · Post Post #1219 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 5:06 pm

In post 1218, alban wrote:
In post 1190, WhyMafia wrote:Yeah
I've re-read Alban's ISO
Definitely getting cold feet. If you're reading this, sorry for the tunnel Alban, but I was 99% sure you were scum, and the OMGUS didn't help ;p
Re-read Awesome's ISO, I suppose I'll go on that if we don't find a suitable lynch

IMO
Steel and Llama are pretty likely town
Mulch likely as well, but I hesitate to put him in above bracket because there's a few things that bothered me. He shouldn't be lynched anytime soon though.
Everyone else goes here
Awesome
If this isn't scum, tell me what is?
The winds changed direction after I left, and so did whymafia's tune.

I feel inclined to agree..

Are you staying?

alban · Post Post #1220 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:03 pm

awesomeusername · Post Post #1221 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:03 pm

In post 1189, MarioManiac4 wrote: i really don't like awesome's chaining up of llama -> alban i'm not particularly feeling scum in either which is what i was saying earlier

What do you mean by "chaining up"? Or is the problem just that you disagree with my reads?

In post 1195, LlamaFluff wrote:@AUN - Why did you not ever vote near the end of the day?

I didn't want to put Carca at L-1 while she was on V/LA, and I wasn't ready to lynch yet anyway.

@Mulch 1196: Maybe I shouldn't be reading into it quite this much, but alban in particular really replaces out a lot as town. But if you think it's NAI, why'd you move your vote?

@Mulch 1198: Hrmm, I could kind of tell it was at least partially premeditated. That's why I'm not town reading the rage. It's interesting that you think Llama's intentionally making stuff up but are still town reading him. :/ Like I guess making blanket assumptions based on a "tell" is bad but I'm not sure how you can ever get inside someone's head that deeply.

Also, just in general, I'm having a really hard time getting inside your head, thought I'd let you know. I think at least a part of it is experience gap. Can you explain why, say, Scorpious not interacting with Carca indicates town while alban's emotions are NAI? They both just seem like meta to me - I don't see a difference.

@Mulch 1201: The gut scumread might honestly just be intimidation, combined with the fact that he's pretty manipulative. Actually, I'm kinda coming around to him. His reads are evolving, which is good to see.

Also, I don't think Scorpious is scum. What's beetlejuice?

In post 1218, alban wrote: The winds changed direction after I left, and so did whymafia's tune.

I noticed that, too.

@Mulch: How certain are you on your read on WhyMafia right now?

@alban:

In post 1187, awesomeusername wrote:@alban: Can you present a case on WM-scum please? I don't really see reasons in your ISO beyond "he's not doing anything" and presumably that his case on you is bad.

Also, you said he has "no thoughts." Can you clarify what you mean by a thought? Because he's giving stances and reasons, regardless of how good or bad you think they are.

alban · Post Post #1222 (ISO) » Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:25 pm

Mulch,
1. What makes you say Carca pocketed Io? Carca may have attempted to do so, but to say that Io got pocketed doesn't seem likely. Io is a clever player. Have you played with Io before? You think it's likely? You joined the game coz you thought Io's analytical ability was amazing. How likely is it for a player to be that and then get pocketed so easily? Io could be town, but your reason for justifying Io's stance on Carca is worrying, coz it seems like you want to defend your slot. It doesn't make any sense why otherwise you would keep bringing up the 'pocketing'.

2.

In post 1107, Mulch wrote:You can't win in a deathtunnel against me when I'm ACTUALLY TOWN. You can't win when I am scum and you definitely aren't winning when I actually have the valid points to discredit and I don't need to bullshit with bad reasoning like I did in Vedith in 203. It's LIBERATING to be fucking RIGHT in this situation

In your tirade with Llama, this seemed like one genuine post. Confidence of a townie. But everything else in that exchange seems a bit forced. I don't even know why you short-fused. If it's 1109-1110, I think you overreacted. Care to lament?

Wait. In1014, you mention the explanation behind that exchange. Points 2 and 3 are okay, but what's with 1? Why are you bothered to display the trueness of your anger? Now, that bothers me. Anyone with me on this?

Your point by point refutation on Llama's notes 1131 - I like. It's the first time I read you as town.

Do you not see a contradiction between your 1159 and 1160? If the situation is so dire as you make it out to be, how can you be fluid at such an important juncture?

Your reasons in 1162 for voting for me:
1. Scum are more likely to maintain their vote on 1 person throughout. Since Alban had his vote on Vedith throughout, he is likely to be scum.
2. Scum are more likely to have shallow reads. Since Alban has fakeable shallow reads, he is likely to be scum.
3. Alban doesn't have satisfactory reasons for his play on D1.

These show that you have not grasped the game completely. I am not trying to be patronising. I believe these are pretty trivial reasons and are nai.

Some more towny points for 1196.

In post 1128, WhyMafia wrote:I mean, I'm not really concerned about getting lynched. I think people calling me scum don't have enough to formulate a good case, but to anyone interested:
viewtopic.php?f=50&t=71612
viewtopic.php?f=55&t=71848

WhyMafia, why aren't you bothered about getting lynched? If you are a town, you should be. Plus, anyone who says they are not concerned are very concerned imo.

In post 1129, Mulch wrote:mentioning that you aren't concerned is scummy.

Exactly.

Llama,
How do you think Carcalilly died on N1? The whole point of 1158 is that we will enter MYLO/LYLO. Why would there be 2 NK on D2?

Awesome, while I was reading your 1185, I kept thinking this has to be a scum. The post is a classical example of IIoA. Till I came to what you wrote about me. It's a bang on description of my game. You have taken efforts to go through my past games? And extract this much info? I am impressed. At this point in the game, it would have been pretty easy to go after me, and I think a scum wouldn't try this hard to analyse people. I hate going back on my original reads, but I may have to reconsider how I read you. I hate going back coz original reads are the most unadulterated, but maybe this is how you play - a bit scummy.

About your question regarding WhyMafia, just read his post 1190after I said I am leaving (P-edit: which I see you already have). There was a complete turnaround. He has been doing that throughout the game. He is keeping both Mulch and Llama happy, who are active players, and who need to be on his side if he needs to survive. There's a possibility he could be town, but that's too slim.

Since a lot of discussion is centred around 2 or 3 scums. I think it's safe to assume that there are 3. 2s:9t is unbalanced and pro-townand could be balanced only through extra powerful scums. Carca was a mere goon, which makes the life aweful if there's only 1 more scum, coz they would be awfully powerful. In favour of balance and even the powers, it is more likely that there are 3 scums. Also, it's better to be prepared for a 3 scum scenario.

My reads: People I think better about since the last read are marked with +, and those who have maintained are 0s. No one has become worse.
Town: Mulch (+), Steel (+)
Null: Awesome (+), Llama (+), Scorpious (0), Mario (0)
Scum: WhyMafia (0)

I am least sure about my reads on Llama, Scorpious and Mario. Llama coz I am not sure how correctly I can read him, and maybe those townreading him can explain it to me; Scorp and Mario coz there's not much to go by but perfunctory appearances.

WhyMafia · Post Post #1223 (ISO) » Sat Jul 29, 2017 2:12 am

In post 1222, alban wrote:About your question regarding WhyMafia, just read his post 1190after I said I am leaving (P-edit: which I see you already have). There was a complete turnaround. He has been doing that throughout the game. He is keeping both Mulch and Llama happy, who are active players, and who need to be on his side if he needs to survive. There's a possibility he could be town, but that's too slim.

Because I felt guilt and your replace out made me doubt myself? So you're saying I'm appeasing the others? Is someone not allowed to re-think the game?? You haven't even made a scum case on me apart from "he makes a bad post or two bahh"
I do that every game. Get original and SR me for something other than tone. I changed my mind again. You're scum. VOTE: alban

WhyMafia · Post Post #1224 (ISO) » Sat Jul 29, 2017 2:15 am

@mulch @llama
This is blatant manipulation from Alban
He freaking makes me feel guilty for getting him to replace out, then turns out not to replace out and gain the sympathy of town??? If you cause someone to replace out due to anger, you should re-check and think about what you've been doing. I THOUGHT his anger was genuine. It seems not. He just used that replace out