Open 707 - JK9++ [Endgame]

Mathdino · Post Post #1225 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:24 am

Game also works better with more wagoms
Vote Screenplay, literally everyone on that wagon except Red and sheep are town

Mathdino · Post Post #1226 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:25 am

Honestly I believe that people on the lynch wagon are probably getting shot systematically anyway

Let's look off it

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #1227 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:26 am

In post 1224, Hawk wrote:
In post 1223, sheepsaysmeep wrote:im psure scum!red wouldnt have hammered and instead have let creature claim? im not entirely sure about this tho
Why? is that a meta read? If you're not sure voice out your reasoning right it down. Why does Scum!Red not hammer and wait for a claim versus not?

This game is very slow and there's a lot to slog through so forgive me if I'm asking more questions than providing pure content myself. I find town works better when everyone is providing content and doing little things like this rather than 1 to 3 players continuously making the largest ISO dives possible.

yeah actually rethinking this idk if it means anything
he's just a trolly lolhammer type player in general regardless of alignment

havingfitz · Post Post #1228 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:27 am

@Hawk...regardless of whether we are dealing with one or two remaining mafia I still think chances are they were off the Creature lynch. Everyone alive who was voting Creature was pretty committed based on votes alone. Red's hammer could have been construed as town cred
bussing but looking further back...Red was on Creature for the bulk of D1 and including two stints at L-1. That's pretty committed...ESPECIALLY if there are just two mafia in the game.

That's why I changed my read on Red. Impede and you pretty much for similar reasons. Math and momo were less committed but I still lean town on them as well.

As for a potential SK...I suck at hunting SK's so I usually just keep going after scummy people until my game is over. Or hope mafia do it for me. An SK in the game could very well be on the Creature lynch. I know there is still mafia in the game though so that's where my focus is.

Mathdino · Post Post #1229 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:30 am

Remember btw that the Jay wagon was by far more likely than any
Red voting Creature is kinda weird given that

Someone analyse the Jay wagon please, that was equivalent to a day ending town flip

Hawk · Post Post #1230 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:32 am

Okay well then I like this more than screenplay. At least until Kop comes back and explains why he's flipping the read.

VOTE: sheep

Pedit: I'll check that shortly.

Thanks fitz that makes sense. I too am not worried about hunting SK as I suck at that too.

Mathdino · Post Post #1231 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:32 am

Tbh based on NK alone SK is probably Impede
So we should get that checked

Hawk · Post Post #1232 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:35 am

Also anonymous feel free to chime in anytime here with thoughts. I k la you're playing catchup but your slot has a lot of questions from me. Tho fitz makes valid points in your defense.

Pedit: you think??

His big "How do we know there is SK??!?!" a few posts back did feel funny to me because it seemed obvious we were assuming no one was claiming the second NK as a vig shot.

Hawk · Post Post #1233 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:36 am

In post 1232, Hawk wrote:Also anonymous feel free to chime in anytime here with thoughts. I
know
you're playing catchup but your slot has a lot of questions from me. Tho fitz makes valid points in your defense.

Pedit: you think??

His big "How do we know there is SK??!?!" a few posts back did feel funny to me because it seemed obvious we were assuming no one was claiming the second NK as a vig shot.

EBWOP

AnonymousGhost · Post Post #1234 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:38 am

@Hawk

Shoot.

Mathdino · Post Post #1235 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:41 am

like it's probably impede or una actually since they're both clearly not mafia
idk if una kills his scumreads as scum tho

and yeah fitz is weird but one of you 3 is gonna get shot i'm sure so i don't really care about looking there yet

can i get a good case on scum-motivation-sheep that makes this more than a policy lynch
he's annoying by default but that's not lynchworthy in itself. null-scum to me

reads list (for mafia not SK)

momo
Hawk
Impede
Una

fitz
sheep
Ghost (by slot not by her)

Kop
Screenplay

Kop/Screenplay would be a weird fucking team so I'm not doing the momo-style "All my scumreads are scum" thing. But Screenplay seems most likely to flip scum.

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #1236 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:42 am

can someone tldr a screen case

Mathdino · Post Post #1237 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:47 am

1. The Creature wagon looks all town and the Jay wagon does not.
2. Assemble's slot and disinterest are scummy as fuck.
3. Screenplay emerged as a brief counterwagon to Jay that lost all steam.
4. Screenplay enters by not helping out with any of the major wagons and instead barreling after me (that part in itself could be town bad at replacing in so pass).
5. Screenplay doesn't reevaluate his reads upon any of the 3 flips.
6. Only after he catches flak for it does he do the "I wanna work with you Mathdino, please give me some content and your thought process" thing when my entire ISO is my thought process anyway (and I'm not interested in being a dancing monkey lol).

Honestly could be SK too. Just a scummy slot.

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #1238 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:50 am

i'll look into his iso with that in mind later

Hawk · Post Post #1239 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:52 am

So At the time of L-1 Jays wagon was

Fitz/Sheep/Impede/Moml/Assemble/Dino.

With Math saying he was holding intent for hammer ironically.

Sheep/Momo/Impede were all on the cross wagon. As I also mentioned I probably would have put jay at L-1.

Assemble became screenplay so the slot was okay with a Jay lynch fwtw.

Case for screenplay, was in general seeming to just clearly push against the flow of the game scum reading dino on entry. Assembly looked really bad with his l-2 vote on creature. Slot in general to me feels scummy.

I'm more interested in Sheep because he was off Creatures wagon kinda but held hammer waiting for a claim. He even mentioned he thought Red if they were scum would have waited for a claim which kinda was what sheep was doing end if d1.

Also I understand Kop/Screenplay make a a lot of sense Math but I'll just point out I that I want to hear what about the day flip has Kop town reading screenplay.

Pedit: Yeah see. Math makes so much sense but I want to hear Kop defend his opinion that screen looked good on day flip.

Hawk · Post Post #1240 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:54 am

In post 1239, Hawk wrote:So At the time of L-1 Jays wagon was

Fitz/Sheep/Impede/Momo/Assemble/Dino.

With Math saying he was holding intent for hammer ironically.

Sheep/Momo/Impede were all on the creature wagon. As I also mentioned I probably would have put jay at L-1.

Assemble became screenplay so the slot was okay with a Jay lynch fwtw.

Case for screenplay, was in general seeming to just clearly push against the flow of the game scum reading dino on entry. Assembly looked really bad with his l-2 vote on creature. Slot in general to me feels scummy.

I'm more interested in Sheep because he was off Creatures wagon kinda but held hammer waiting for a claim. He even mentioned he thought Red if they were scum would have waited for a claim which kinda was what sheep was doing end if d1.

Also I understand Kop/Screenplay make a a lot of sense Math but I'll just point out I that I want to hear what about the day flip has Kop town reading screenplay.

Pedit: Yeah see. Math makes so much sense but I want to hear Kop defend his opinion that screen looked good on day flip.

EWOP: fixed Momos name and somehow my phone changed creature to cross in the 3rd sentence

Mathdino · Post Post #1241 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:02 am

In post 1239, Hawk wrote:With Math saying he was holding intent for hammer ironically.

This is an objectively correct interpretation of my actions and I am glad that I am being recognised for my pure irony

In post 1239, Hawk wrote:I'm more interested in Sheep because he was off Creatures wagon kinda but held hammer waiting for a claim. He even mentioned he thought Red if they were scum would have waited for a claim which kinda was what sheep was doing end if d1.

Doesn't add up.

1. He was entirely on the Creature wagon. He moved off to sheep me when I started up the Impede wagon again. After that he wanted to wait for Creature's last will/defence/claim which I think is consistent with sheep's general thought process/meta.

2. Scum doesn't often call people scum for doing the exact things they're doing. Hypocrisy is not a scumtell.

Honestly the best evidence against sheep is that he took the bait and went after Impede when I and A50 made a shitty case on Imp. Is attributable to laziness. And like, I'm

somewhat

okay with pressuring him to do stuff for us, but I don't think votes are quite the way to go to do that. Just threaten him or push him around or something. (although, caveat, if sheep is your primary scumread and you are not voting, please seriously vote, people)

yessiree · Post Post #1242 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:03 am

VC 2.4

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch

Srceenplay (3) -

havingfitz, momo, Mathdino

Mathdino (2) -

Srceenplay, UnabombaH

sheepsaysmeep (2) -

Impede, Hawk

AnonymousGhost (1) -

Kop

Not voting

- AnonymousGhost, sheepsaysmeep

Day 2 ends in (expired on 2018-01-23 20:00:00)

Hawk · Post Post #1243 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:14 am

That's a fair point.... Hmmm....

UNVOTE:

Math why are you town reading Unah again all I have down for Unah is Forgettable posts. ISO later. PoE slot potential later. So I don't have a case one way or the other...

AnonymousGhost · Post Post #1244 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:15 am

Day One

Spoiler: big post

{Impede, Hawk}
{Screen, MathDino, fitz}
{Kop, Una, momo, Sheep}

@Una

- Without looking at D2 content, what happened to your A50 + momo case?

@Kop

- What's up w/ 322? You explained Jay, but left out Red.

@Sheep

- Why didn't you want people to come up w/ their own scum teams in 443?

@momo

- Do you really believe what you said in 385?

Day Two

Spoiler: kinda big post

{Impede}
{Screen, MathDino, fitz}
{Una, Sheep, Hawk}
{momo}
{Kop}

Hawk · Post Post #1245 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:17 am

Oh also I noted that you cleared us because of ignorance but PoE me una fitz and now you have all of us in the top half of your read list? Well fitz is null but still higher than 3 others and you're specing impede is SK if SK was on the wagon.

Pedit: Thank you will address that shortly annoymous.

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #1246 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:19 am

im just not a fan of d1 preflip associative hunting
it's a waste of time if no one's actually flipped red yet

AnonymousGhost · Post Post #1247 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:20 am

@Sheep

What about D2 associative hunting? D1 wagon flipped red.

sheepsaysmeep · Post Post #1248 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:23 am

yeah that's entirely different and fine with me

also i had impede at nullscum originally but i originally thought my vote being there wouldnt do anything

Mathdino · Post Post #1249 (ISO) » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:50 am

See that's how you do a catchup. Welcome to the game, Ghost.

@Ghost:

I'm concerned with your IIoA though. Please give reasons for each reads list as of the time you made them.
- With more explanation for the unpopular opinions. In particular, Impede being so high, momo being so low, Screenplay being so high.
- Your momo read is uninformed I think by the context of his conversation with Jay. Check my, momo's, or Impede's ISOs to find it and read it in context. I said something like "momo just rocketed to the top of my townlist". Let me know what you think.
- Why did Hawk jump down on your list?
- Do you have any thoughts on VCA and the different wagons yesterday? Primary ones were Jay, Red, AssembleScreenplay, and Creature.
- If you're into setup spec/logic/mafia theory, it'd be nice to have someone else to talk to on this. Especially regarding the list of roles that I'd like claims from.

I challenge you to push a Kop counterwagon/case since I'm clearly not the one to do it.