Mini 1747: Cinnamon Roll Mafia Endgame

[Syndesis]

Looking up this picture made me super hungry.

Spoiler: Can it be?

[Syndesis]

VOTE: Chaotic Neutrality

But...but, I brought you cinnamon rolls!

Sweet, delicious, warm, fragrant, icing-drenched, right out of the oven cinnamon rolls!

:(((

[Syndesis]

Hi everyone, I'm not too familiar with all this. Here's to a good game!

Oof, now I'm hungry.

No RVS? :((

[Syndesis]

VOTE: Hawk

[Syndesis]

VOTE: Syndesis for not stating her reason for voting me and OMGUS

caught scum

please sheep

[Syndesis]

Is everyone who uses OMGUS scum? If so, why would there be an acronym in the wiki for it if it "confirms scum"? I don't think the phrase would become as popular if that was the case.

even more caught scum :D

[Syndesis]

This is a totally serious push.

totally serious

[Syndesis]

I guess since now you have a legitimate reason for your vote against me...

UNVOTE: Syndesis

I mean, what is

this

even?

PPE:

pretty sure she's being sarcastic. unless she's just legendary going for those p1 scumpicks of l e g e n d s

totally serious please sheep

[Syndesis]

I guess since now you have a legitimate reason for your vote against me...

UNVOTE: Syndesis

Well, that is rather appeasing...

Where's your vote?

[Syndesis]

That looks like L-2?

[Syndesis]

Spoilered for size.

Spoiler: usually as the game goes on I quotewall less

@Swordsworth, explain your vote onto hawkleader3 plzerino?

This is actually the question I was about to ask.

hawkleader3's opening was awkward as hell and how he immediately backed off was terribad

Serioisly, are you me?

Just curious, is everyone here brand new?

For certain definitions of new.

Well hawkleader, you say this is the most boring part of the game and that you're eager to get it out of the way, so then you flop your vote on me? That doesn't strike me well.

I agree with the sentiments in this post but something about it bothers me.

VOTE: MoosyDoosy until I get a clear understanding of what just happened to him

This is a weird vote and a weird post.

Wasn't aware that people did it at L-2 as a rule. My vote's for L-1, that way scum doesn't get info on town PRs unless it's totally necessary to prevent town from lynching a PR.

Interesting choice of wording...?

[Syndesis]

I don't know why

, but I'd laugh at that for some reason

I swear, everyone and their weirdly scummy phrasing

[Syndesis]

My push was as serious as RVS pushes get, which is not particularly serious. It was mostly a joke until hawk reacted in a ~super scummy~ way. Now it's a serious push though.

[Syndesis]

>__>

[Syndesis]

UNVOTE: hawk for now.

[Syndesis]

Do you think he's fakeclaiming?

do you think it's a good idea to lynch a claimed PR on D1

<--- (actual question)

[Syndesis]

Why?

[Syndesis]

Anyway I've been writing this post for a while better actually post it now

Spoiler: people asking me about wording

I believe you've said this several times. Makes me wonder if you're sending those players a message of some kind.

I don't know why

, but I'd laugh at that for some reason

I swear, everyone and their weirdly scummy phrasing

Why do you find that particular phrasing scummy?

Just to get it out of the way, I know the basics of mafia, but I am entirely new to this site. At least the BBcode is intuitive.

At Syndesis' 81, I dislike your description of my post. What rubs you the wrong way about it? Are you being so general due to a gut feeling, or because you're laying out the possibility and suggestion of me not having a town agenda so that you can refer back to it later on?

FA_Q2: If I knew I'd have included it in the actual post. Sometimes word choice rubs me the wrong way. I don't think I've actually ever caught scum on word choice, which is why I didn't make more of it. Although...it sounds a bit stilted, I guess?

Sword: I dunno, maybe it's because you sound kind of omgus-y there? I'm probably reading it wrong.

probably

You just keep posting scummy posts.

This just feels like more attempts at appeasing and you are utterly ignoring the mounting pressure on your slot. VOTE: hawkleader3

NOTE: That places him at L-1

This is not a post I particularly like. Actually, wait. Ehh. It's alright.

Thank god. Claim time. My claim................is jailkeeper. That's why I was nervous before. I didn't want to be suspected of killed easily on the first day before my powers were put to good use. Oh well. It seems as if it's no use. I deal with pressure, I get voted on. I ignore pressure, I get voted on. So now it seems like everyone's just trying to find out who my scum partner is at this point because it's confirmed I'm scum. If this doesn't change your mind, I'm afraid nothing will.

Hmmmh.

[Syndesis]

the theatrics, the posturing, all the little minute details that make it looks staged as hell

I don't think this is consistent with Hawk's behavior, whether scum or town.

PPE: gaaaaaaah stop ninjaing me

[Syndesis]

Wasn't aware that people did it at L-2 as a rule. My vote's for L-1, that way scum doesn't get info on town PRs unless it's totally necessary to prevent town from lynching a PR.

Look at above post (115) (well it was above when I started typing). Look at this post.

Voila! I'm confused.

PPE: aaaaaauuuuuaaaaaaaa

[Syndesis]

Then why even post this line.

Hi! I'm Syndesis. I like to talk to myself.

Left it out because I feel like all of this is obvious -- didn't think to explain it in detail and assumed that people understood that you don't need to claim until a hammer is imminent. That is, after all, the intent behind waiting until L-1 -- to prevent revealing PR info unless it's totally necessary.

The gentleness of 66 sort of...contrasts with 115.

TheCow, ask yourself whether you think a scum player like hawk -- one who has admittedly not played in years and is therefore more or less a newb, would have a PR fakeclaim sitting around and ready to go this early in the game, and whether he would be actively waiting to post it.

Signs point to town PR, not fakeclaiming scum.

I concur.

Man, it annoys me to no end that preview-quote doesn't add post links :((

[Syndesis]

sometimes I prewrite claims as town js

[Syndesis]

Hawk's been super jittery all game and I don't think he would fakeclaim.

Oh yeah! I wanted to chase this.

VOTE: FA_Q2

[Syndesis]

Well, that is rather appeasing...

This.

[Syndesis]

He has not constructed a 'push.' Just a rather naked vote and a post that says 'this.' Neither is something that is possible to respond to until he actually gives a reason or a case for the vote.

Fair enough, though I thought it was possible that someone would pick up on the context. Plus it was super late here and I didn't feel like typing out actual reasons >___>

The context is that I find it weird that you kind of sussed hawk without voting him, while not voting anyone at all.

Oh god I just realized that I've become that person who never explains anything unless asked whoops this is not what I was trying to do

[Syndesis]

Yes hawk I completely think that I can get your lynch off at this point in time. I am absolutely confident and serious in this.

Do I detect a hint of sarcasm

[Syndesis]

I'm pretty sure that Hawke is town, mostly due to the fact that he was far too cooperative to be scum when Cow was asking for his typing speed.

I think this is null TBH.

Nothing else particuarly sticks out to me as scummy after that though, my biggest suspect so far is Swordsworth, due to the fact that the only 2 posts where he actually does things (discounting 136) are him reacting to votes/comments on his posts. 136 seemed like he was trying to stay as neutral as possible, ready to take his vote off if the wagon fell apart but keeping it on in case the wagon could still reasonably lead to a lynch. Of course, taking into account that he has posted fairly sparsely at the moment and he's new could explain these things but I still have eyes on him.

Yeah. Swords' posting is fairly lackluster at the moment.

[Syndesis]

Swords is only a site-newbie, IIRC?

[Syndesis]

Oh, it's fine haha.

Anyway, long story short, reading Swords as purely newbtown is probably not a super great idea. I agree that his opening post makes sense in the context of a site-newbie, though.

[Syndesis]

I mean, I get frustrated when people push me without a case as either alignment, so that might be just null. That said, scum caught for the wrong reasons also tend to get frustrated, but I've seen no sign of that so far.

[Syndesis]

Not sure if Moosy trolling, sarcastic, or serious.

Not sure if I really want to think about it, either

[Syndesis]

Uh, just for the record, none of my page 1 posts were serious.

[Syndesis]

I feel like if you're scumreading Moosy for trying to swing a lynch on a claimed PR, you're seriously misjudging the tone of his posts.

[Syndesis]

Err, sorry, that was addressed to the thread in general.

Spoiler: Exhibit A: a lot of sarcasm

Oh wait, that was such a Mafia oriented post! Oh wait, he's self conscious! Mafia!

oh wait, he might be town screwing around! But he might have expected that as Mafia which is why he's acting that way!

I am being completely serious. hawk is smart and realizes that I have logical reasons for spearheading a massive push onto him that has huge impact and influence right now.

Yes hawk I completely think that I can get your lynch off at this point in time. I am absolutely confident and serious in this.

Because it is definitely the absolute right move to kill hawk.

Alright hi

Moosy, I dug through your ISO, and to be perfectly clear: you ooze scum from your pores. I can understand your initial push against hawk, but I've quickly lost faith in you being town what with your 167 and 195. They give a strong impression of attempting to get Hawk out of the way. Sure, the mafia may target him tonight, but if I was scum I'd be trying to optimize. After all, ideally, why waste a kill slot on an outed jailkeeper when you can free up that kill via lynch?

yess so lynch me sson.

bro I'm clearly scum that made a slip up trying to continue to push onto hawk which is why I'm trying to cover up for it with obstinateness. This is very clear right now.

hawk is right. D1 is an incredibly good time to deal with Moosy.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: MoosyDoosy

[Syndesis]

Actually, with that in mind, your first page posts look kind of towny. Yay context yay hindsight

[Syndesis]

Say, 3dice, could we have a prod for Birdy?

[Syndesis]

Why does giving a reason make a vote less suspect?

[Syndesis]

I find myself adrift in this game.

[Syndesis]

You know you can ask for replacement, right?

[Syndesis]

bored with my current vote so

VOTE: davesaz

[Syndesis]

Has your read on FA changed? Why vote dave? What do you think of Chaotic?

My read on FA has sort of wilted. According to my notes, I had ~feelings~ about dave but I'm not really sure where those ~feelings~ came from. I have no strong feelings on Chaotic.

[Syndesis]

The vote wasn't going anywhere.

If I could articulate my ~feelings~, I would.

[Syndesis]

In an attempt to get out of my disengaged rut:

hawkleader3 - probably town
Soapbar - gives me weird vibes
FA_Q2 - not particularly outstanding
MoosyDoosy - don't know, don't care, we're not lynching this today
toolenduso - kind of town?
TheCow - probably probably town
Metrion - not posting much
Swordsworth -

really

not posting much
lolbabe - 3x lurker combo
iraonavp - feels kind of town
Chaotic Neutrality - no particular feelings but they're still voting RVS??
Syndesis - obvtown
davesaz - I'm not really sure but I don't like him

[Syndesis]

You know what, I'm kinda down with lynching CN.

VOTE: Chaotic Neutrality

[Syndesis]

Page 7, some thoughts.

TheCow,

Soapbar

, Moosy,

Dave

look town. TheCow's thing with typing speed was fun and pretty townie, that post by Hawk did look pre-written.
Something about Sword clicked town, too, but can't remember what exactly, will look it up when i am making a post with quotes.

Tool and Syndesis are slippery as hell, something rubs me the wrong way.

Don't particularly like

FA

and Ira. The latter seems to be going with the flow.

I would like to hear elaboration on the bolded players, please?

[Syndesis]

They're all following tool blindly because he's the loudest voice.

Is this the reasoning behind your vote?

[Syndesis]

Is tool scum for the bad push or because he's leading everyone around?

[Syndesis]

Is tool scum for the bad push or because he's leading everyone around?

What are you thinking on tool at this point?

My read hasn't really changed since the last time he posted. Something of a tenuous townlean.

Did you think CN's characterization of his wagon is accurate?

Pretty much, yeah.

You sure like asking questions.

[Syndesis]

The way I understand it, CN thinks that tool is solely responsible for pushing his wagon, but this contradicts what I'm actually seeing in the thread. FA_Q2 actually started it and has done at least as much. CN is completely ignoring FA (and the other votes too) and focusing only on tool. What do you make of this discrepancy?

This is a good point but I'm too sleepy to do anything with it right now

[Syndesis]

Actually I just iso'd FA again after reading 378 and I dunno if I'm confbiasing but he looks kind of scummier now than a couple of days ago. I was going to see if CN would crack a bit more but deadline is looming so.

VOTE: FA_Q2

[Syndesis]

A scattering of quotes from FA's iso I don't like. I also saw a bit of chainsawing of dave but pre-flip associatives bad, etc.

Spoiler: Quotewall

I guess since now you have a legitimate reason for your vote against me...

UNVOTE: Syndesis

Well, that is rather appeasing...

Quietly susses hawk without voting

in RVS

.

You just keep posting scummy posts.

This just feels like more attempts at appeasing and you are utterly ignoring the mounting pressure on your slot. VOTE: hawkleader3

NOTE: That places him at L-1

I don't like this post.

I don't know why

, but I'd laugh at that for some reason

I swear, everyone and their weirdly scummy phrasing

Why do you find that particular phrasing scummy?

Is this question going anywhere?

@toolenduso: do you have any thoughts on moosy?

I do! But I am not giving them out atm.

....

You ask others for opinions on a slot that has posted thus far rather chaotically but refuse to actually share your own thoughts or even why you are asking. Are you trying to gauge how town will take your push...

More sussing?

If what doesn't change our minds? Blank claims with nothing whatsoever in dealing with your wagon?

Seems like you are trying to blame everyone for voting you because you didn't want to deal with the fact you are posting like scum.

???

[On the subject of 26] At the time I believed a vote on him would not be constructive. his wagon was building fast and I didn't want to see it progress any further from a single post. Then he made another scummy post and I decided it was time to put my vote there.

That single post was a really weak reason to vote him when his wagon was already mounting. I wanted to see further reactions.

???

That makes no sense. Scum can make up reasons just as easily as town could, and they'll often look better because they're paying attention to how people read them.

Placement of the votes and motivation matter a hundred times more than reason.

I don't like this post one bit.

You cast doubt on Dave's statement but fail to complete your statement. If placement mattered so much more then why did you not bother to address those that jumped on where you consider scummy placement? I would also state you are completely incorrect. Placement matters but scum can just as easily manipulate that as they can come up with reasoning. Reasoning is a powerful tool for town - as the game rolls on scum tend to reveal themselves with inconsistent reasoning and in the motivations behind those reasons. .

This is actually kind of a bad reason to dislike this post.

[Syndesis]

I'm sorry I'm not in logical mode right now!

not

[Syndesis]

That solves the I-can't-engage-with-this-game problem, I guess!

not so much the everyone-is-really-slippery-and-hard-to-read-right-now problem

[Syndesis]

I really just have no idea what I'm doing in this game anymore except kind of flailing.

Another attempt at reads incoming.

[Syndesis]

Actually, this first.

Spoiler: to Soap

Back, Anyways my vote on Syndesis is mostly because his jump on to FA felt really rushed

It was spur-of-the-moment, yes. I find my opinions rather capricious in this game (which might have actual importance behind it; revisit this?).

and it feels really out of place with his posting that feels apathetic. And his reasoning supports this conclusion, it all feels like he's stretching for reasons to make his vote valid

It's not so much apathy as an inability to get a hold on this game. I admit to being very vulnerable to confbias, but the scummy impression came before the vote.

Like the first quote on that wall I can understand, but then the second one is just a gut reason (Why don't you like it?). The third one is just an idle question (You made a vague statement and he wanted clarity, and he wasn't the only one). The fourth one I can see as scummy (as it's literally just stating the obvious), and the final one is really vague (why is it a bad reason?).

I promise I'll try again tomorrow, yell at me if I don't.

tl:dr his vote is rushed and supported with vague and unexplained reasons

It's not rushed, per se, though I don't really support the CN lynch, so there is that deadline pressure. However, bad explanations do not a scum make.

I think at this point in the game, people need to start putting votes down before the day ends. I think she is grasping because she wants to start a wagon on FA. Syndesis's thought process may be that at this point, it's not who looks scummy, but who looks the scummiest because someone has to get lynched.

Yes.

...maybe the reaching is because I'm trying too hard to reason out a gut read right now.

[Syndesis]

Reassessing 96, at least. I have a nasty habit of picking up on phrasing stuff and now, with a better recall of the context, that question looks legitimate. 291 is, I feel, an unfair reason to jump on CN mostly because it's a post I can see myself making as town.

[Syndesis]

why did you vote CN?

Leading wagon, deadline, not a townread, etc.

[Syndesis]

Merry Christmas to those of you that celebrate it!

[Syndesis]

I'm also willing to compromise onto CN at this point.

I think? we need 3 more votes on one wagon. I realize holiday VLAs and all but ugh. (Why are there 3 people not voting even?)

[Syndesis]

What's your preferred wagon, then?

[Syndesis]

This sounds like you have no true scum reads at all?

Could say much the same about you. (Or, in fact, much of the playerlist.)

[Syndesis]

I assume you didn't read 431 despite it just being an hour ago?

...well. Okay, I only sort of read it. My bad. (Although, to be fair, up until that post your iso is fairly stance-light.)

[Syndesis]

CN reads as apathetic town right now but IDK

[Syndesis]

I may not be around at deadline but I should be here for another 4-ish hours at least. Will anyone be around closer to deadline to hammer?

[Syndesis]

Alright.

VOTE: Chaotic Neutrality

This is L-1.

[Syndesis]

what

[Syndesis]

>____________>

[Syndesis]

should I have made it size 400

should I have included the "don't hammer yet" part

[Syndesis]

I mean, I thought "don't hammer yet" was pretty implicit but ok

[Syndesis]

let us cry sad tears

[Syndesis]

now let us hope that was a scumflip

[Syndesis]

Swords looks like a viable vig shot TBH

[Syndesis]

that sure is some impresssive work right there

[Syndesis]

I don't see an SK killing Swords, honestly. I don't see this kill pattern as being (two-team) multiball, either.

I feel pretty confident in the presence of scum on or driving FA's wagon, and I don't like ira's posts in that region (see 450 for an example of ~*~stuff I don't like~*~).

VOTE: iraonvp

Will look at Met again later.

[Syndesis]

he [Swords], FA and Syndesis were pretty much confirmed town players

Explain?

Will get to reread probably tomorrow? (both busy and feeling lazy)

[Syndesis]

Reread notes:

-Tool looks town in light of the ire CN directs towards him.
-End of lolbabe's 371 ("Oh wow, Dave is scum.") sounds slightly contrived, though that might just be me picking up on irrelevant syntax.
-

@ira, 372

: Could you clarify? Why would scum reach to defend, especially to defend town?
-Ira and lolbabe are the main people countering the CN wagon.
-Soap is also driving a counterwagon on me, but it's not a particularly promising one, so I don't think it's a "save my partner!!" counterwagon.
-Dunno how to feel about his abrupt vote hop in 399, though.
-Davesaz's indecision in 427-428 basically resembles my state of mind at the time. Not really sure how to read it; could go either way.
-450 is interesting and I'm not sure why.
-Is 467 consistent with "you accidentally hammered my partner"?

Thread is a bit slow, isn't it?

[Syndesis]

Re: lolbabe's 371 that might have been right after I told Moosy to play to wincon. Unless that was a bit later, haven't looked... Regardless of when it happened, did you follow the discussion that it generated?

Yeah, you're thinking of the right spot. Still sounds somewhat contrived. I did follow it, but not very closely.

When I look at the ira posts you refer to, I'm reminded of how scummy they looked in the moment. The main reason I was asking ira about his Metrion read was to determine if there was substance to it or if it could be a distancing read, or perhaps the kind of soft foundation read that scum use to look like they are scumhunting without making any waves.

Err, which post are you referring to? >___>

[Syndesis]

His [davesaz's] vote on CN is very likely to be bussing scum I feel.

Why? Can you detail this a bit more?

[Syndesis]

466

...are you

sure

?

Aw man we're all splinter-y again.

Clarify?

[Syndesis]

The activity overview is quite depressing

[Syndesis]

Well, here we have it!

Usually it is customary to request a claim before hammering

, so please do not do that again, Swordsworth. I can understand that you might be new to mafia and not know that, though.

Did you really expect a claim from CN at that point in time?

[Syndesis]

Well, here we have it!

Usually it is customary to request a claim before hammering

, so please do not do that again, Swordsworth. I can understand that you might be new to mafia and not know that, though.

Did you really expect a claim from CN at that point in time?

Yes, I've read other games and isn't that usually what happens? Put someone to L-1, then someone else states intent to hammer, then they ask for a claim.

Wasn't deadline within...a couple of hours at that point? It was very likely CN wouldn't get a chance to claim.

[Syndesis]

I am personally somewhat frustrated at being the main wagon at this point. I feel it is a direct result of

me being incorrect (and the most vocally so) about Chaotic Neutrality's alignment

.

Do you think this

isn't

scummy?

[Syndesis]

They end up putting the L -1 vote on CN and then their reaction when Swords hammers, which is completely ironic that they pointed out in #511 that Ira's response is in line with "accidentally hammering my partner" when theirs are rather similar.

For the record, I now think Ira's reaction isn't really consistent with that, on a surface level at least. It does feel not a little...stiff? But it might just be the way that they write.

[Syndesis]

There's a lot to read Ira off but I'm not sure how to read it.

[Syndesis]

Let's do some pseudo-VCA while I painstakingly reread! How likely is it that...

...CN was bussed?
...scum was setting up to bus CN but did not get a vote on the wagon?
...there's scum on FA's wagon?
...there's scum off both wagons?

[Syndesis]

wow the deadline suddenly looks disturbingly close

This thread could use more Cow.

I've been oscillating on ira for the last few days TBH.

[Syndesis]

I kind of want to vote Ras honestly.

Spoiler: a bunch of lolbabe quotes

Intrigued now, what did CN do so fast that he's at L-3 (??)?

FA and CN can't both be scum but it certainly feels that way -_-

I doubt his buddy defended him really much

he [Swords], FA and Syndesis were pretty much confirmed town players

Also, would

Metrion

please elaborate on the Soap scumread?

[Syndesis]

VOTE: Raskolnikov

is a more interesting lynch I think

[Syndesis]

I'm just sort of low hanging fruit for mislynch

Why do you believe this?

[Syndesis]

@Everybody on the ira wagon: Why is ira a better lynch than Metrion?

Ira was the most vocal defender of CN. Metrion didn't stick out. I'm not so sure now, though.

[Syndesis]

I do not trust the Metrion wagon, other than tool, but I'm also having second thoughts about irawagon.

[Syndesis]

Ira was the most vocal defender of CN. Metrion didn't stick out.

This is part of the reason I'm still pushing metrion instead of ira. It makes sense to me that a partner would try to stay out of the spotlight rather than vocally pushing against their partner's lynch. Scum don't want their partners to be lynched (unless it's a designed bus), but they also don't want to be super obviously associated with their partner if their partner does end up getting lynched.

I agree, which is why I'm no longer on ira's wagon. However, the presence of Ras on Met's wagon does give me pause.

Definitely willing to lynch Met if need be though.

[Syndesis]

Hello replacement~

[Syndesis]

VC please?

[Syndesis]

TheCow/Burning_Earth

Why?

[Syndesis]

FA, which of the current wagons do you prefer?

[Syndesis]

moosy

moosy please

[Syndesis]

Got any other input?

[Syndesis]

:////////

[Syndesis]

Hmmmmmh...

[Syndesis]

also

~~Flubber is at L-1~~

[Syndesis]

no not really

[Syndesis]

Syndesis, you haven't been sounding very sure of yourself lately. What concerns you?

"lately"

I'm concerned that I'm unconsciously confbiasing, or seeing patterns or scummy behavior where there are none, or seeing the wrong side of things, which is basically all the time.

[Syndesis]

Awfully quiet mmmm

Lynch Ras for a better tomorrow

[Syndesis]

The only person who can tell me I'm wrong is myself.

[Syndesis]

Is it bad if I'm only townreading ~2 slots?

[Syndesis]

Soapbar, if you see this before hammer:

- Are you still scumreading dave?
- If Flubber flips town, who will you go after next?
- What's your read on Moosy, Ras, and ira?
- Actually some reads in general would be good.

PPE: Calculus sure is delicious, man.

[Syndesis]

Should Flubber flip scum, I think Soapbar (of the people off Flubber's wagon) appeals the most as a wagon-dodging scumbuddy candidate.

[Syndesis]

Every time you post I want to lynch you more ;-;

[Syndesis]

I bet lynching FA could be interesting!

[Syndesis]

I mean, I bet lynching ira could be pretty interesting too.

[Syndesis]

Do you know I want to push onto you iraonavp?

why aren't you voting them then

[Syndesis]

It's important that we lynch correctly today

Why?

[Syndesis]

Soapbar, if you see this before hammer:

- Are you still scumreading dave?
- If Flubber flips town, who will you go after next?
- What's your read on Moosy, Ras, and ira?
- Actually some reads in general would be good.

Still validish!

[Syndesis]

That brings me right back to moosey and rask.

VOTE: moosey

I tire of this slot getting a pass for no reason. Mossey was also off the one scum we lynched and on the one town we lynched.

What changed your mind on ira?

[Syndesis]

so I have only one serious townread

which is based on a player who no longer occupies that slot

which might be a ~problem~

[Syndesis]

VOTE: Soapbar

you feel

slippery

to me

[Syndesis]

Who are you scumreading Ras?

[Syndesis]

Additionally:

- How does ira look in light of Flubber's flip?
- What issue do you have with my Soapbar vote?
- Do you think Flubber's wagon was scum-driven?

[Syndesis]

Ras: do you see scum Dave hopping on CN's wagon instead of a very viable counterwagon?

[Syndesis]

VOTE: Raskolnikov

[Syndesis]

I doubt dave vs iranvp is TvT. I note soap voting dave last day, and dave joining the metrion wagon late but not last.

Why

[Syndesis]

Syndesis, I really am not feeling your Raskolnikov vote at all, and you haven't made much of an attempt to explain why you think he's scum-aligned. I don't know what you expect to happen with that vote but it's not doing anything. If you showed your working here perhaps the game could move forward and maybe we could even make an actual wagon somewhere!

You and Ras are moving with disconcerting sync.

Will case shortly.

[Syndesis]

Also,

Ras

, answer 771 please?

[Syndesis]

Also,

Ras

, answer 771 please?

Also 768.

[Syndesis]

Spoiler: Quotewall on lolbabe/Ras

Please note, it's not a clumsy town slip, i could've asked the same being scum. I just didn't see any setup information in the first posts.

Mmmh this sounds so self-conscious.

Oh wow, Dave is scum.

This quote is here to represent the whole "scumslip" business, which, as I've said, sounds contrived.

[misc. counterwagoning CN]

It's really bad that Swords was killed as after the hammer

he, FA and Syndesis

were pretty much confirmed town players. It could be not so, but it's not the time for paranoia.

[...]

I also want to point out that CN was a very probable lynch so

I doubt his buddy defended him really much

so we should look among those who were uncertain about him, placed their vote on someone else or did not vote at all.

Bolded bits just feel a bit uncomfortable.

What's interesting about it? It would be weird of me to try to defend my predecessor and so I'm just sort of low hanging fruit for mislynch at this point. I'm not sure you'll even be able to analyse the wagon around it very much because I haven't been here that long. Ugh.

Feel free to call it bad or good but please don't pretend it's "more interesting".

I find it odd you see yourself as "low hanging fruit" and that you says there's little to be gleaned from your wagon.

Same sentence, my friend. If you want to lynch based on lolbade you are essentially prosecuting an absentee, which I think is inarguably rather easy to do.

Untrue. Should I just disregard your predecessor's posts?

Why are you even speculating that if you think I'm scum?

This is not really a good response.

I'm not sure about today. I know the metrion wagon was legit because me and tools are/were town so

it's not like scum counterwagoned

, in other words iranvp isn't necessarily scum.

It takes 6 to make a wagon.

[Syndesis]

Davesaz voters, why do you think he would choose to vote his buddy over a wagon of equal momentum?

[Syndesis]

davesaz

, who's scum?

[Syndesis]

That hard townread between ira and Ras mmmm

[Syndesis]

What is with this game.

Spoiler: quotewall for Ras

I'm having a hard time with the associations because I wasn't there for the CN wagon and I'm not sure I can judge it as well as you guys have. I know I didn't like TheCow but his replacement isn't here yet, and you guys are confusing to me. OK dave went on CN's wagon instead of the counterwagon, I've done this as scum before.

I think Cow's tone when questioning hawk just oozes town, but I understand it's hard to pick up things like that as a replacement. I think it is rather unlikely that dave chose his scumbuddy's wagon over a presumably town wagon, but it is possible (and dave's play in later days hasn't been reassuring). I guess you could see the posts leading up to his vote as scum indecision, but it could also be town indecision... The most outstanding possibility I see for davescum is actually dave + FA, but FA's interactions with CN make that less likely.

FA_Q2 went hard for CN so he's prob town but I don't get a town vibe from his posts.

This sums up my feelings on FA pretty well.

I haven't seen him vote or try to get scumhunt so far today either (d3), though it is a minor tell i have seen town even in these situations wait back a bit for more info before deciding.

Bothers me too.

Looking back soapbar's kind of similar minus the waffling. He was very apathetic day 2 and I feel like here too he's sort of complacent. I guess he was afk but he just sat on his dave vote which was clearly not going anywhere at the time and he barely interacted with the other events. He like dave also as a small positive went on CN instead of the viable FA_Q2 wagon, and again I don't know how much credit to give them for it. I know for example my slot was on the wrong wagon at that point so I don't want to weigh whether someone joined the CN wagon around halfway/past or if they didn't for too much.

Soapbar, as I said, is slippery. He really hasn't done a whole lot. The same can be said for davesaz, though. I think Soap's vote is the most liable to be a bus, honestly, but I'll check that again.

I haven't ISO'd syndesis but from the time I've been here I like his posts and even his effort/methodology on his wagon on me despite it being wrong. He'd be even better but idk why he townreads dave and doesn't like soap. A tiny bit of him not liking soap seems to even be because soap doesn't like dave which is a weird reason to not like soap for. Now that I think about it if we get dave and he flips scum syn will be worse off, I'd personally still rather go for TheCow(slot) than dave if the guy was here though.

Soap: see above. Also yeah the whole randomly pushing dave is weird; do you not think it's a bit weird? TBH my townread on dave is probably just me sheeping tool on that front

so if I'm wrong blame him

.

davesaz

, who's scum?

Two out of Soapbar, Raskolnikov, Cow slot. If only one in that set then the other is most likely Moosy.

Explain?

[Syndesis]

Luckily for you, there's not all that many pages...

[Syndesis]

I think ira is town, or at least that ira + Ras is rather unlikely. I'm probably confbiasing myself into a deep dark hole with Ras...but whatever. I still lean town on Cow but it would really help if that slot weren't next to empty.

Not sure how to give this game some life, honestly. Hopefully the replacement can help?

[Syndesis]

You see, you reinforced your scum reads after a SCUM slip - a scum slip that you had a town read on.

Sorry, could you clarify? I seem to have missed this.

[Syndesis]

Additionally:

- Why aren't you voting?
- Do you really think CN's attitude towards Moosy on D1 reflects them being on the same team?

[Syndesis]

I missed two whole posts before 801. Whoops.

[Syndesis]

Your vote on me based on this lame misconstruing of my action + not liking my slot on game is pretty garbage and you should reconsider.

It's pretty much the same as mine. Is mine garbage/why are you not calling out the originator of this push?

[Syndesis]

On the one hand, FA's push looks like a bit like opportunism.

On the other hand, Ras's reaction is rather defensive wow.

[Syndesis]

But there is, I think, a subtle distinction between town doing that and scum doing that.

[Syndesis]

I also don't think that Rask's reaction to pressure has been very defensive...

Wrong word, perhaps. It's a strong one, at the least.

[Syndesis]

Reads! In order of how much I'd be willing to lynch them.

Cowslot

- soulread for town. Please exist again.

ira

- hard-defending CN seems like a townie thing. Was spiritually on CN wagon.

Moosy

- interactions from CN... could be a bus. Will revisit.

FA

- interactions to CN. Otherwise not super townie. Was on CN wagon.

dave

- interactions to CN. Lurking. Was on CN wagon.

Soap

- lurking and constantly off lynches, period. Saw a glimpse of towniness earlier, will reexamine. Was on CN wagon.

Ras

- I've been ranting and raving about this for quite long enough.

[Syndesis]

LIFE

LIFE

PRAISE

[Syndesis]

Do you mind spoilers?

[Syndesis]

One correction: ira

was

pushing Met mid-D1, to little avail.

[Syndesis]

Soap is town.

Why?

iraonavp likely scum.

Why

I assume the defense of CN?

page 14. FA is still scum!

Whyyyyy

[Syndesis]

A soulread is like a gut read but

deeper

Glimpse of towniness is 767 but even looking at it now I'm not sure it's something I can townread.

[Syndesis]

How did you get a read of any kind on cow?

His hawk-related actions.

[Syndesis]

For whom?

Scum,

clearly

[Syndesis]

How do you think this is helpful?

It probably isn't, but it

does

sum my feelings about your conversation pretty well.

It is, for the record, not entirely sarcastic.

[Syndesis]

How 'bout them replacements? Still keeping that read?

Burning_Earth was lackluster, but didn't do anything overtly scummy in his, what, 5 correction:

7

posts, at least that I can remember. Not really a reason to doubt my townread.

The frightening breakfast item was doubtless intimidated out of existence by the magnificence of these cinnamon rolls (so vastly superior to all other forms of morning comestible, and in fact all comestibles), and thus is impossible to read.

My heart says TSQ is town. Or wants them to be, at any rate .-.


What's your read on TSQ?

[Syndesis]

I don't get all the Cow hate TBH.

[Syndesis]

In your last, not all that old readlist, you had FA above Soap. Is this indicative of your reads changing?

[Syndesis]

The two people I would most like to lynch today are both on the same wagon! Coincidence?

[Syndesis]

That seems rather appeasy, but it can wait.

VOTE: Raskolnikov

Why?

[Syndesis]

Do people even read what I write?

no

davesaz

, who's scum?

Two out of Soapbar, Raskolnikov, Cow slot. If only one in that set then the other is most likely Moosy. I'm having a really hard time getting any traction.

^^ scum read, duh

Why are you scumreading Ras? What catalyzed your vote?

The two people I would most like to lynch today are both on the same wagon! Coincidence?

And those two would be?

FA_Q2 - (2) raskolnikov, Soapbar (L-3)

Perhaps "the two people I would most like to no longer be alive in this game" would be a more apt descriptor.

[Syndesis]

Are you sure you wouldn't rather be on Ras's wagon~?

[Syndesis]

In your last, not all that old readlist, you had FA above Soap. Is this indicative of your reads changing?

@

Ras

[Syndesis]

we only have 1 mislynch left

Slip or nah?

[Syndesis]

Looking at FA's 922, it

is

reminiscent of frustrated town. (I said this about CN too, so take that with a grain of salt. ) However...I'm not sure what it is about it that's bothering me, but

something

is. Could just be tonal, though.

[Syndesis]

It's really bad that Swords was killed as after the hammer he, FA and Syndesis were pretty much confirmed town players. It could be not so, but it's not the time for paranoia.

Hmmmh.

[Syndesis]

Experimenting with reading your iso with avatars turned off.

[Syndesis]

A votecount would be awesome.

[Syndesis]

That is an unconventional way of cpnsidering things, but I don't see how it could constitute a slip.

It could be a slip

if

Ras was implying that today is LyLo.

[Syndesis]

Every time I reread D3 I want to lynch Ras more ;-;

[Syndesis]

but VOTE: FA_Q2 since I'm pretty sure Ira is town

Can you help me find the previous places that you've mentioned FA_Q2?

I find this question highly relevant:

PPE: the answer is (mostly) lolbabe

[Syndesis]

I find this question highly relevant

.

Punctuation is difficult, sorry.

[Syndesis]

I'm kind of starting to feel the davesaz wagon though.

[Syndesis]

946 replied to in actual depth:

Spoiler: Quotewall on lolbabe/Ras

Please note, it's not a clumsy town slip, i could've asked the same being scum. I just didn't see any setup information in the first posts.

Mmmh this sounds so self-conscious.

Oh wow, Dave is scum.

This quote is here to represent the whole "scumslip" business, which, as I've said, sounds contrived.

[misc. counterwagoning CN]

It's really bad that Swords was killed as after the hammer

he, FA and Syndesis

were pretty much confirmed town players. It could be not so, but it's not the time for paranoia.

[...]

I also want to point out that CN was a very probable lynch so

I doubt his buddy defended him really much

so we should look among those who were uncertain about him, placed their vote on someone else or did not vote at all.

Bolded bits just feel a bit uncomfortable.

What's interesting about it? It would be weird of me to try to defend my predecessor and so I'm just sort of low hanging fruit for mislynch at this point. I'm not sure you'll even be able to analyse the wagon around it very much because I haven't been here that long. Ugh.

Feel free to call it bad or good but please don't pretend it's "more interesting".

I find it odd you see yourself as "low hanging fruit" and that you says there's little to be gleaned from your wagon.

Same sentence, my friend. If you want to lynch based on lolbade you are essentially prosecuting an absentee, which I think is inarguably rather easy to do.

Untrue. Should I just disregard your predecessor's posts?

Why are you even speculating that if you think I'm scum?

This is not really a good response.

I'm not sure about today. I know the metrion wagon was legit because me and tools are/were town so

it's not like scum counterwagoned

, in other words iranvp isn't necessarily scum.

It takes 6 to make a wagon.

Spoiler: and more!

I haven't ISO'd syndesis but from the time I've been here I like his posts and even his effort/methodology on his wagon on me

despite it being wrong

.

Probably a wording thing, but this just sounds weird.

Your vote on me based on this lame misconstruing of my action + not liking my slot on game is pretty garbage and you should reconsider.

Now

this

sounds like scum caught for the wrong reasons.

IDK. I like FA's last post but it might actually be too late. The thing is if syn/fa are both town and are only going to push me it's actually impossible to get the voting power to lynch a scum. If they are town (and my read on syn is pretty strong) then there's the rest of us 6, and 4 of us town when it's 5 to lynch.

I just don't like this post.

Syndesis you're probably town so please reconsider your approach. Your #1 is me (town) and your #2 is a lurker which would essentially be a gamble to lynch when we only have 1 mislynch left.

Maybe it's the way you keep hitting me over the head with "I'm town".

[Syndesis]

hi :)

[Syndesis]

Eh, I still stand by all of these posts. I think you're making a mistake in scumreading based on disagreement, and even if you think you are right and I'm wrong on all things you are missing the point if you think the measure of how town someone is, is based on how right or wrong they are or how good at the game they may be.

[...]

And this is you finding my posts weird or strange which I can't really do anything about.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Okay about half the points in the first spoiler are confbias-y and dumb but I stand by my assessment of the reasons that I am, rightfully or wrongfully, scumreading you.

[Syndesis]

Okay about half the points in the first spoiler are confbias-y and dumb but I stand by my assessment of the reasons that I am, rightfully or wrongfully, scumreading you.

That sentence was barely coherent, sorry.

[Syndesis]

Hi Soapbar

Why aren't you voting

[Syndesis]

(expired on 2016-01-28 15:48:00)

-___-

[Syndesis]

Too many scummy people, too few lynches.

[Syndesis]

Hey RC! Let's lynch Ras~

[Syndesis]

Spoiler: unofficial vc, not guaranteed to be correct

Soapbar - (0)
FA_Q2 - (2) raskolnikov, Thestatusquo

(L-3)

MoosyDoosy - (0)
Thestatusquo - (0)
raskolnikov - (3) Syndesis, FA_Q2, davesaz

(L-2)

iraonavp - (1) MoosyDoosy
Syndesis - (0)
davesaz - (1) iraonavp

Not voting: Soapbar

[Syndesis]

927 Unofficial vc has a mistake is all.

I'm terribly sorry :|

[Syndesis]

That looks disconcertingly like rolefishing.

I don't think it necessarily is, though.

[Syndesis]

Spoiler: for the mod

@

Everyone

: who would you be willing to compromise onto? If applicable, why? Is there anyone you will absolutely not vote?

[Syndesis]

Why are you scumreading Ras? What catalyzed your vote?

Outstanding question for

dave

!

[Syndesis]

If you don't like Ras for a lynch then push someone other than me and I'll happily join in.

If addressed to me, I'm

on

Ras.

Sounds a smidge survivalistic TBH. Does no one especially appeal to you?

[Syndesis]

RC please

be the hero this game needs

[Syndesis]

Dave

, reads and justifications please?

Last time I was a hero in a game with you town utterly ignored me and we didn't lynch scum.

I'm not a hundred percent sure that I'm reading this sentence correctly, but ;____;

[Syndesis]

That looks disconcertingly like rolefishing.

I don't think it necessarily is, though.

Why?

I cannot see that as anything but a roll fish.

I can see myself making that post as town more out of frustration.

[Syndesis]

@

Mod

: Your last VC has two instances of Ras :(

[Syndesis]

Soapbar

, reads please. Particularly on Ras and Dave.

[Syndesis]

I don't even know what to think about this game any more because

everyone looks so scummy

.

I'm sort of feeling the FA wagon though.

@

Dave

: why did you choose an already developed wagon?

PPE:

RC

, can you convey what you see in Soapbar at all? Please? ;-;

[Syndesis]

ira please crop your quote pyramids ;-;

[Syndesis]

How's this?

Not enough cinnamon.

Is there any one action that you don't like from Soap? How much confidence do you have in this read, anyway? Do you have any townreads?

[Syndesis]

Okay, that's cinnamon, but it's not roll.

[Syndesis]

Do you have a window full of cat pictures open or something?

Also, are you planning to answer the questions?

[Syndesis]

@

Dave

: why did you choose an already developed wagon?

Are you being dense on purpose? Because I do not want a no lynch

:(

Let me rephrase: Why was your vote linked to the existence of a wagon when we still had days until deadline?

VOTE: Syndesis

To be honestly if I was to pick one wagon based on it's likelihood to hit scum over any other factors, this is it.

:(

That 'be the hero this game needs' line just makes me so averse to lynching her but I do think that she's scum.

Will you hurt me if I ask why that line makes you averse to lynching me?

TBH the whole doubtcast everything approach is one of the reasons I can't even commit to a Syndesis townread.

-___-

[Syndesis]

RC, what do you think of below quotes? [Added further comments in brackets.]

Spoiler: Quotewall on lolbabe/Ras

Please note, it's not a clumsy town slip, i could've asked the same being scum. I just didn't see any setup information in the first posts.

Mmmh this sounds so self-conscious.

Oh wow, Dave is scum.

This quote is here to represent the whole "scumslip" business, which, as I've said, sounds contrived.

(misc. counterwagoning CN)

It's really bad that Swords was killed as after the hammer

he, FA and Syndesis

were pretty much confirmed town players. It could be not so, but it's not the time for paranoia.

[...]

I also want to point out that CN was a very probable lynch so

I doubt his buddy defended him really much

so we should look among those who were uncertain about him, placed their vote on someone else or did not vote at all.

Bolded bits just feel a bit uncomfortable.

What's interesting about it? It would be weird of me to try to defend my predecessor and so I'm just sort of low hanging fruit for mislynch at this point. I'm not sure you'll even be able to analyse the wagon around it very much because I haven't been here that long. Ugh.

Feel free to call it bad or good but please don't pretend it's "more interesting".

I find it odd you see yourself as "low hanging fruit" and that you say there's little to be gleaned from your wagon. [Whether or not this is actually a reasonable reason remains to be seen.]

[...]

Why are you even speculating that if you think I'm scum?

This is not really a good response. [It just sounds off to me.]

I'm not sure about today. I know the metrion wagon was legit because me and tools are/were town so

it's not like scum counterwagoned

, in other words iranvp isn't necessarily scum.

It takes 6 to make a wagon. [I have no idea what my point was here but at some point I didn't like this statement so I'll trust in my past self here]

Spoiler: and more!

I haven't ISO'd syndesis but from the time I've been here I like his posts and even his effort/methodology on his wagon on me

despite it being wrong

.

Probably a wording thing, but this just sounds weird.

Your vote on me based on this lame misconstruing of my action + not liking my slot on game is pretty garbage and you should reconsider.

Now

this

sounds like scum caught for the wrong reasons.

IDK. I like FA's last post but it might actually be too late. The thing is if syn/fa are both town and are only going to push me it's actually impossible to get the voting power to lynch a scum. If they are town (and my read on syn is pretty strong) then there's the rest of us 6, and 4 of us town when it's 5 to lynch.

I just don't like this post...

Syndesis you're probably town so please reconsider your approach. Your #1 is me (town) and your #2 is a lurker which would essentially be a gamble to lynch when we only have 1 mislynch left.

...maybe it's the way you keep hitting me over the head with "I'm town".

[Syndesis]

Will you hurt me if I ask why that line makes you averse to lynching me?

Well I don't want you to be seeing my replace in and remembering me pinning both scum in our last game together and be like 'OH MY GOSH RC WILL SAVE THE DAY HERE!!!' and then I come in and vote you and you're heartbroken and have to cry yourself to sleep for the next few nights about how RC failed you and lead a mislynch on you.

That said, I'll reread Raskol. Your quote wall is interesting.

Literally laughing out loud. Thank you ^____^

Why are you pretending to be a delicate flower though?
What do you think I'm going to do punch you in the face via internet if you ask me a question?
It rubs me the wrong way.

I mean if we're going off avatars I

am

a delicate flower

That said, I can foresee it possibly being an annoying question and I like to minimize non-alignment related annoyance to other people <3

If this flips town I think I deathtunnel Syndesis for the rest of the game, assuming I'm alive to do so.

I will probably go fall off a cliff somewhere ^figuratively if Ras flips town so that will probably solve your problem for you.

PPE: then 5 posts suddenly appeared...about which I have nothing to say right now. :D

PPE x 2: and then

[Syndesis]

~~Ras is at L-1~~

I think

[Syndesis]

Syndesis, what's your read on myself/Moosy and why?
If you had to put a read out on TSQ, what would it be?

Knew there was a quote I was missing.

Townread on your slot. CN directs a post at Moosy that doesn't look like a scum interaction at some point early game. Plus, Moosy's play reminds me of the way someone else I know plays town.

Still townreading TSQ, probably. Haven't really reevaluated recently but Cow's posting WRT hawk was really good.

[Syndesis]

Where'd Syndesis go?

I went to go cry into my notes and feel conflicted.

[Syndesis]

I'm not conflicted about Ras, more about you two -____-

[Syndesis]

Just having a "what if I left scum out of my associative pool" moment.

[Syndesis]

I do think you're both town but in case you haven't noticed I am

really paranoid