MS Fantasy Camp 2: Reaper's Tale! (Finished!)

[Tim Howard]

vote cdb

Omgus

You've managed to irritate me as a collective and it's only three pages in. Please stop posting like dickheads.

Regards

Nexus.

[Tim Howard]

Also Nero Cain is blue. Colour me confused.

[Tim Howard]

Comparing me to Nero Cain is not a compliment to either Nero or I. No idea what the dig from Sixty is about given that I've had little to no game experience with either head, especially recently, but whatever.

Sangres is pretty fucking terrible though. Waiting for Quadz to get online so I can actually talk to him. I'm bad as a hydra.

[Tim Howard]

hey team

these 5 pages suck. Nexus and I are in agreement that we have no reads except "sangres is obnoxious."

IN KEEPING WITH THAT STATEMENT

VOTE: Sangres

-quadz

[Tim Howard]

Pretend we have written a long post here professing my love for UT and all of his opinions.

VOTE: Cerulean



We agree with UT that cerulean has been scummy. Pre-emptive IDGAF about inevitable OMGUS accusations because fuck you don't be a dumbass.

In other news, it may just be because sangres hasn't posted as much, but they've fallen off the obnoxious-dar.

Also, apparently making another player feel like a bad person is super pro now, awesomely well done there, sixty.

Yeah that's about all we've got for now. GOALKEEPERS OUT.

[Tim Howard]

You're all getting het up about the fact that we said that causing someone to feel shitty about their play is a pro thing to do, yet you don't see anything wrong with the way you acted? Fuck me, you were horrible enough to someone to cause them to want to replace out within the first ten pages of the game. Regardless of alignment, or what she did first, it's a shitty thing to do, and the fact you don't even feel bad is hilarious to me. It was me who forced Quadz to say it, because I felt strongly that it was a really crappy thing to do.

My current thoughts for scum are Zdenek and Cerulean. Obviously you're all gonna be like LOL IT'S COS THEY VOTED YOU but trust me, it's not

Zdenek is trying to be all town-leadery, from my pov, and I don't think he has the skill to do it, so it strikes me as odd. Cerulean I just don't like their posts. I will go through and find specific examples

if you really want

but you could just believe me and we'll be fine.

People who can go on the town pile: Nero Cain, Venmar, LLD and Plum. I've liked what I've seen from those people.

-Nexus out

[Tim Howard]

I forgot that apologising for doing something shitty makes it all better. Sorry about that!

I didn't say I thought you were scummy. You've not got us on your Town-pile, and that doesn't bode well for your alignment either! Although, Quadz is pretty insistent you're town, and given he's probably played with you more recently, I'm inclined to agree with him.

[Tim Howard]

Interesting ability I should claim: If the day ends in a no lynch (whether from running out of time, or by a majority vote on the "No Lynch" wagon). I enter 2 people into a duel, and they get to plead their case, and I unilaterally choose to lynch one!

Granted, the cases they plead are anonymous, and I don't choose a name, but rather whichever post I liked better, but that's beyond the point~.

Also,

Vote: Sixty

because KITTIES ARE BETTER WHERE IS MY MAFIA WITH THE PUPPIES 2 I WANT HOPE BACK.

Vote: LLD

For a change of pace, I'm going to irrationally defend Tierce (Sixty) for a bit.

Not compulsive.

Vote: LLD

Why?

Keep reading?

oh most definitely.

It's funny just how hurt Sangres is.

Unvote

Vote: Katsuki

holy fuckin jesus is sangres always this much of a tryhard?

Not likely.

While 99 is a post to put in their signature for Nexus, the wall gets worse as it goes down. This isn't the puppyhalf with Tammy meta, but those Cerulean posts were starting to stretch belief for me. In addition, somehow Nacho went from "I have no read on F-16" to "I have a Town read on F-16 but not enough of one to actually come forward and say it's a Town read". The Tim Howard read is indeed trying hard, as is the throwout on you (UT) - I don't mind your Cerulean vote but that's probably not significant in the long run.

What would be super-interesting would be sangres moving their vote. Anything is better than No Lynch.

And to think, I wasn't even going to read it.

Nacho, is your Vi read serious?

This is going to be stressful.

What's up with 60?

Okidoki
You?

hey team

these 5 pages suck. Nexus and I are in agreement that we have no reads except "sangres is obnoxious."

IN KEEPING WITH THAT STATEMENT

VOTE: Sangres

-quadz

SCUM DETECTED

Vote: Tim Howard

Pretend we have written a long post here professing my love for UT and all of his opinions.

VOTE: Cerulean



We agree with UT that cerulean has been scummy. Pre-emptive IDGAF about inevitable OMGUS accusations because fuck you don't be a dumbass.

In other news, it may just be because sangres hasn't posted as much, but they've fallen off the obnoxious-dar.

Also, apparently making another player feel like a bad person is super pro now, awesomely well done there, sixty.

Yeah that's about all we've got for now. GOALKEEPERS OUT.

I just love opening the thread and seeing the person I'm voting, fake scum hunting.

Katsuki votes are okay with me.


I'm just going to ignore F-16 until he's posted a bunch and then sink him with his scummy, scummy words, which he'll inevitably write if he's scum.

only scumread is a throwaway line about Howard being boring

I am definitely not voting him because he's boring.

Wow, wallposting while not rambling is fucking hard, how do people even do this?

HI MASTIN!?

UT, should we lynch you or CBD next?

I'm reading Howard as town.

I'm all ears.

no opinion

Weird

mmmmm yes tell me more about why my laziness means I am scum

Poor Reck, caught for the wrong reasons.

Zdenek is trying to be all town-leadery, from my pov, and I don't think he has the skill to do it, so it strikes me as odd.

This just looks like you suspect me for not alignment related things at best and for scum-hunting at worst.

This is really scum hunting. Man, I need some lessons. I didn't realise the meta had shifted to just making one line statements = scumhunting.

Unvote
Vote: Untrod Tripod

Basically, he jumped to defend Tim Howard in posts 284, 285 by attacking Sixty and Cerulean and now he's jumped to attack Venmar who's attacking Cerulean and defending Tim Howard (among other things).

This is probably your best post, because at least you're justifying yourself!

[Tim Howard]

Please can someone explain to me how Cerulean's posts are coming off as remotely pro-town, because I just don't see it. A lot of what they've posted is useless fluff, and I was under the impression that both Empire and Tammy posted better than that in general. *shrug*.

(This is all Nexus).

I am, now, going to speak to Quadz before I post again.

PREDIT: HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

zdenek #1 scumhunter.

[Tim Howard]

7 different votes, on six different people. You're a good scumhunter, Zdenek.

[Tim Howard]

Sixty

I'm not going to continue this argument, because it's not going to help the game if I do. I apologise if you think I was out of line, but I really didn't like what you did, and felt I needed to say something.

From my end, I'm dropping it.

[Tim Howard]

I posted my top town reads and top scum reads and got shit for it. So I then say why I didn't put you in my town reads, and get shit for it? Wicked.

Done now.

[Tim Howard]

Hi team, I'm back wooo

Sixty

- FTR, you were being unnecessarily dickish, and I realize you apologized, but seriously guys chill the fuck out. It is just a game.

Re: Zdenek - I didn't talk to Nexus about this read, but I think I can agree / explain better. Zdenek is trying too hard to be The Best Townie, and not succeeding at being townish. Feels scummy.

Also, Reck is voting for me day 1, what a gigantic surprise. *eyeroll*

-quadzilicious def
defdefdefdefdef

[Tim Howard]

good cop bad cop

it is almost as though this hydra is quadz (good cop / chill out dudes style) and nexus (bad cop / asshole style)



whoaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[Tim Howard]

I mean meta is trash yadda yadda but I'm still not seeing any scum motivations for his reads or actions? he's poking players, asking useful questions,

his votes have been well explained

. the framer claim is weird but I really just want to shrug at it because the rest of his play looks town to me

WAHT

Exhibit A:

Interesting ability I should claim: If the day ends in a no lynch (whether from running out of time, or by a majority vote on the "No Lynch" wagon). I enter 2 people into a duel, and they get to plead their case, and I unilaterally choose to lynch one!

Granted, the cases they plead are anonymous, and I don't choose a name, but rather whichever post I liked better, but that's beyond the point~.

Also,

Vote: Sixty

because KITTIES ARE BETTER WHERE IS MY MAFIA WITH THE PUPPIES 2 I WANT HOPE BACK.

Vote: LLD

For a change of pace, I'm going to irrationally defend Tierce (Sixty) for a bit.

Unvote

Vote: Katsuki

hello all, would anyone like to lynch 60 w. me

Unvote
Vote: kkb

OFF LIMITS!

hey team

these 5 pages suck. Nexus and I are in agreement that we have no reads except "sangres is obnoxious."

IN KEEPING WITH THAT STATEMENT

VOTE: Sangres

-quadz

SCUM DETECTED

Vote: Tim Howard

Unvote
Vote: Untrod Tripod

Basically, he jumped to defend Tim Howard in posts 284, 285 by attacking Sixty and Cerulean and now he's jumped to attack Venmar who's attacking Cerulean and defending Tim Howard (among other things).

Oh, I just realized what UT meant by weather vane.

Silly Zd.

Unvote
Vote: Venamr

Unvote
Vote: Tim Howard

CDB, what similarities are you seeing between Nexus' play in this game and in Red Wedding?

I'm not saying it's a specific link between this game and that, I'm saying that my response - I know him very well, I can read him very well, trust me when I tell you he's town and look elsewhere for the time being - is the same here as it was there.

He's pretty obviously scum at this point, so I'm afraid one game of you reading him correctly isn't going to convince me.

He went from Zdenek is trying to lead the town to Zdenek isn't scum hunting and is posting one liners in the space of 23 minutes.
Then he goes to insulting me - Zdenek #1 scum-hunter.
Which is dissonant with him thinking that I'm scum.
Then he acts as though all my votes were somehow serious as a means to insult my scum hunting, and

several of my votes obviously were not serious

.

I'd say his vote on you was well explained, otherwise um...nope? Even Zdenek says his votes were generally not serious. So pls tell me what he sexplained well.

-Nexus

Quadz says: VOTE: zdenek

[Tim Howard]

Because Faraday.

Can we stop with the D1 setup spec please it is entirely useless and accomplishes literally nothing

[Tim Howard]

Reck - Fair 'nuff.

[Tim Howard]

Is this really a conducive conversation to be happening? Shadoweh, does Nero Cain strike you as scum right now?

[Tim Howard]

Reck: I VOTE ZDENEK btw UT is scum
Sixty: Zdenek is more likely to be Town. Wanna vote UT instead?
Reck: sure
Sixty: *votes UT*
Reck: *complains about some other totally irrelevant thing instead of actually trying to get things done E.G. LIKE VOTE UT*
Sixty: lol vote Reck
Reck: b'aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaw but at least I have another person to engage in a rather meaningless one-on-one over some flimsy point

It doesn't even matter at this point if UT is scum (which is not unlikely considering he actually tried to say we and Cerulean are scum together in 285) because you just showed you're only in this to take up space and defend yourself where necessary.

Is this intended to be a case / reason for your vote? Because I am pretty sure it's not one even a little bit.

[Tim Howard]

Re: Cerulean - I personally am uninterested in talking about our reads super in-depth atm. To be quite frank, neither of us are super-invested in this game right now. That should get less prevalent as the number of players decreases and the amount of information increases, but I wouldn't expect any Big Sexy Cases D1 (at least, not from me, and I wouldn't imagine Nexus feels differently).

In other news, I like Katsuki less and less as the game goes on. His Fate cosplay makes him frikkin unreadable, and while it may be in good fun, it's also something I think he would know makes him hard to read. I don't think it's unlikely to be a Kat-scum tactic.

Zdenek remains a better vote for the moment.

[Tim Howard]

combined with the fact that both heads of that hydra are pretty readable when pushed,

Have we played together? I've barely played for like a year, and I don't recall playing with either of your heads (Nexus). This comment makes me uneasy unless you can give me some meta - (unless of course you're going to turn around and say you've been reading all my old games in which case wow)

Also, to reiterate Quadz's point - I don't do the whole elaborating on town reads very often, and I'm not going to do it for someone who I think is scum. Sorry about that.

In other news, I need to re-read the game. So I'm going to do that.

[Tim Howard]

On behalf of everyone in this game I would kindly request that quadz do literally all the posting from this point on. With all that said, just barely enough of their posting has seemed unintentionally genuine enough to warrant this spot.

You (whichever one of you this is) are being genuinely unpleasant to play with. So, if that's what you want, kindly go fuck yourself. I'm out.

Faraday, this is now a quadz-only hydra.

[Tim Howard]

This is quadz.

Sixty, you realize that almost all of our posts have been co-authored, right?

Fuck's sake, why is everybody on fucking pins and needles this game. Sixty, Tammy, Shadoweh, Nexus (yes you too, buddyboy) are all so fucking prickly about goddamned everything. It either makes you an asshole, or super-sensitive to other people being assholes. Will you all just fucking quit it? It's a god damned game.

[Tim Howard]

Town (Strongest->Weakest): Cerulean, Chamber, LLD, Sangres, CDB, Zdenek, Sixty
Scum are among: {Shadoweh, Plum, Venmar, Katsuki, Nero Cain, NS, Kanye, UT, Reck, Tim Howard}

So maybe I'm misunderstanding, but are you seriously saying that you're scumreading 10 people? Because this is absolutely yelling "FALLBACK WAGONS AHOY"

I know there have been other things that happened since our last post but I needed to comment on that before bed because like daaaaaaamn.

[Tim Howard]

Nacho's recent spate of posting gives me the feelgoods inside for literally every possible reason (he's town, he has good / thought-out reads, I don't disagree with any of his logic, he thinks we're town). Sangres jumps firmly into the townlist, and I agree with his read on Katsuki in particular.

Flipping Awesome's thoughts on Plum are actually quite good. (also thanks for the explanation on the big ol' list that makes more sense.)

Zdenek wagon isn't going anywhere and looking back, he hasn't really done anything scummy in a while, so I'm fine switching off of him to go somewhere more productive at this point.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Plum

MIRACLES, eh? (This is pretty much a full sheep on Flipping Awesome's reasons.)



Also, re: the Nexus situation. Not to take away from chamber / Nacho's lovely townreads on us, but he's probably going to be a "talk to me behind the scenes" type of head from here on out, rather than a posting head. Expect most posts to come from me (quadz) from here on out.

[Tim Howard]

Wooooo

I would like to strongly encourage more dudes to hop on this awesome plum wagon. Seriously. Read FA's points on why she is a good place to put your vote!

I echo the sentiments of Nacho and CDB that I don't want to see today end in a Tim Howard lynch! It seems to me like very few people are actually scumreading us at this point, and people are just sitting on the wagon because it happens to be the biggest one.

Nexus got scumvibes off of Sixty's post about how half of Sixty doesn't think we're scum but is cool with voting us anyway. I did not because I totally say shit like that all the time as town, and I'm inclined to think that Vi (pretty sure it's Vi who isn't scumreading us) would do / say something like that regardless of alignment. I am personally pretty null on Sixty atm.

Nexus is also in favor of Shadoweh scum (he was not able to explain his reasons before he had to disappear). I would be willing to hop on the Shadoweh wagon to totally save our own bacon, especially considering the fact that Nexus thinks they're scummy, but the Plum wagon is (naturally) preferable.

My Zdenek read continues to degrade to "nullish."

[Tim Howard]

So that entire sixty/reck discussion was interesting, but left me with basically nothing other than "boy they seem mad at each other." They both made good points and they both made bad points. Pretty much came out a wash at this point.

The justice bones in my body really want to lynch the crap out of Katsuki for ignoring the Sixty/Reck thing while it was happening. He's just completely all over the road, especially tonight. Mark me down as 'willing to vote Kats' for the Day.

I would vote Reck to save our bacon, but I feel similarly as I did in my previous post with Shadoweh - generally unconvinced either way at this point.

[Tim Howard]

acceptabru

VOTE: katsuki

[Tim Howard]

Yeah this is absolutely a thing we should lynch. I think the last time I mentioned you was over a week ago, Kats.

[Tim Howard]

I really don't like that quadz's opinion about the me vs Sixty thing seems to just boil down to, "That was interesting but here's why it's null."

I'd be very interested in hearing him expand on what he means by, "They both made some good points, they both made some bad ones." Which points, specifically, did you think were good or bad from either side?

I could go back and re-read it and quote shit, but I'm really not that interested in going back and doing an in-depth re-read of a fairly unpleasant argument near the end of the game day which did not result in significant read changes. *shrug*

[Tim Howard]

I would like to strongly encourage more dudes to hop on this awesome plum wagon. Seriously. Read FA's points on why she is a good place to put your vote!

What about those things do you think makes Plum scum?

Are these quotes helpful? Because I read both of these things and agreed with them 100%. (As a note, my Plumscumread hasn't gone away.)

Do I need to do the scummy thing and MAKE A CASE on NS for things to happen, though?

I liked the aggression in this post but I felt your response in Post 725 was underwhelming. You say a lot of stuff that doesn't resonate, then unvote and vote Tim.

Plum

feels scummy. Her walls feel fluffy and not like she is trying to drive the game forward and I am coming around to Penguin's scumread on her.

I could go back and re-read it and quote shit, but I'm really not that interested in going back and doing an in-depth re-read of a fairly unpleasant argument near the end of the game day which did not result in significant read changes. *shrug*

Okay, then I'll probably vote you?

I always find neutrality on two players arguing pretty scummy. I am giving you the opportunity to back up your words with actual content because there's always the off chance you believed what you said.

I don't have any idea why that is inherently a scummy thing to do, and it seems pretty silly to make a blanket statement like that. I might go back and read it later on in the game when I have more information and a better grasp on my reads and the incident is not in my immediate memory, but it's not happening now. *shrug*

[Tim Howard]

A) I didn't declare it town v town by any stretch of the imagination
B) I don't see why that would be a scumtell anyway

Also, it's not the time commitment. It's that I don't particularly want to read through you guys arguing about how you don't like each other again.

[Tim Howard]

TOTAL NUMBER OF POSTS THAT HAVE NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH PERSONAL ISSUES:

24.

TOTAL NUMBER OF POSTS THAT HAVE SOMETHING TO DO WITH PERSONAL ISSUES:

4. And they all occurred at the VERY END of the debate.

Yeah, I'm

really

not buying that you just "didn't want to read through us arguing about not liking each other" because it's literally four fucking posts compared to the twenty-four posts where we actually have game-related debate.

You're right, my disinclination to read that argument is clearly based in a rational / logical thought process rather than an emotional / irrational response, and thus your mathematical refutation of my argument is definitely going to change my mind.

Venmar's ability is alignment-neutral.

hey so

Kats is still a fucking awful lynch

This is actively incorrect.

Kanye continues to be completely useless, which is disappointing.

I got some odd vibes, also, when Nacho instantly called me town after I followed his vote. I'll look back on this later in the game (if I'm still around).

This is poor. Sangres' comment was clearly tongue-in-cheek since he'd just said a few posts before that you could be town if you sheeped him.

Sangres is pretty firmly in the townpile at this point.

[Tim Howard]

Instant gut reaction is that the Venmar wagon is all about :JUSTICE: (totally understandable btw) and less about actual scum motivation. Will ISO him later today.

Will look into kanye for D1 uselessness. Nexus is interested in Cerulean, so I'll look into that as well.

[Tim Howard]

Shit, sorry. I suck. Will do re-reads as promised tomorrow, for realsies.

[Tim Howard]

Upon ISO, Venmar looks pretty town to me, tbh. He's a bit quick to anger/frustration I guess, but he's got reads and explained them, and seems to be approaching the game from a town mindset.The exception is the goad for Nero to vote (and effectively hammer) Katsuki, but I don't think that scum-venmar would be able to fake the frustration he was demonstrating at that point. (I don't have any experience with it that I know of, just the impression I get from his play here.)

Kanye's ISO is tougher. He's falling on the scummy side of null atm, due largely to the fact that I remember him being more aggressive and active in prior games with him. I could be misremembering (or he could have been scum in all those games I guess?) but I don't think so.

I basically can't pick out a read on Cerulean. I'll have a conversation with Nexus about it today, if I can catch him online.


Plum's 1275 (case on UT) is solid. His response is non-useful in terms of reading him further. However, considering my townread on Venmar, the fact that UT keeps pushing him is really making me feel like he could be scum angling for a fairly easy mislynch.

Plum's posting toDay in general has been stronger than it was yesterDay.

I mentioned before that the rhetoric was deliberately overstated. I am a believer in actions eventually shaping thoughts and attitudes

say it til you believe it

wow

that's some next level shit, Plum

is the rest of the game still indulging the fantasy that this isn't in dire need of rope?

UT's ISO mentions plum in 4 posts - This one, Post 1039 in which he says "plum is ripe for a lynch" and says nothing else, post 1190 in which he is responding to something she says, and post 1267 in which he says he won't answer her questions. Why, exactly, is plum in dire need of rope? Can't tell from looking at anything he's said.

Yeah, I'm actually gonna go here for now

VOTE: Untrod Tripod

[Tim Howard]

adorbz

[Tim Howard]

Well, since nothing was happening today, I got bored and read 3 other completed mafia games (rereading ADWD is always fun for me, I can be like 'oh did that actually happen? I didn't remember I posted that.') I also took the time to reread Day 1 with a better emotional disconnect so I could actually look at words being typed.

VOTE: Tim Howard

Can you explain to me where your read on Plum is coming from? The way you treat your reads in general is very odd to me. To explain:

People who can go on the town pile: Nero Cain, Venmar, LLD and Plum. I've liked what I've seen from those people.
-Nexus out

Presumably something Plum said in her first posts turned out town to you, okay.

Flipping Awesome's thoughts on Plum are actually quite good. (also thanks for the explanation on the big ol' list that makes more sense.)
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Plum
MIRACLES, eh? (This is pretty much a full sheep on Flipping Awesome's reasons.)

Considering there's not much explanation for why you thought she was town in the first place, it's pretty easy to change your mind, but Flipping's reasons that you quote for changing your mind are literally "Plum feels scummy. Her walls feel fluffy and not like she is trying to drive the game forward and I am coming around to Penguin's scumread on her." If I'm townreading someone it generally takes more for me then 'This person actually feels scummy' from someone who I'm not actually townreading to convince me to vote them. (In #787 you accuse Flipping of making fallback wagons, not something you say about a strong townread.) Your last comment on the issue yesterDay was that your Plum scumread 'hadn't gone away'.
And come today:

Plum's 1275 (case on UT) is solid. His response is non-useful in terms of reading him further. However, considering my townread on Venmar, the fact that UT keeps pushing him is really making me feel like he could be scum angling for a fairly easy mislynch.

Plum's posting toDay in general has been stronger than it was yesterDay.

You're sheeping her because her posting is 'stronger'? That doesn't actually change anything she did yesterday so.. you changed your mind because she made a case? How is his response non-useful in reading UT? I don't think that actually means anything, he's reacting pretty snarkily and annoyed (A little like you yesterDay but less rude) and I'd think you'd try to get a handle on thaat better if you actually cared? Your suspicions in my eyes seem to follow this pattern of not actually giving any opinions of your own, declaring someone else's case is good, and sheeping that read until it becomes convenient to switch to another wagon. I don't actually believe you have any reads of your own at all. You throw out town/scum reads, true, but they don't seem to mean anything two posts later or when it's time to actually vote someone.

The first post was Nexus' thoughts. I was pretty null on Plum until I read Flipping Awesome's comments on her, which I agreed with. Later posts from FA seem to say that they weren't all that confident on their Plum read, but that doesn't change the fact that I thought the reasoning given was good and worth voting.
The post about her posting being 'stronger' - I'm using stronger to mean 'townier' in that sentence. Sorry if that was unclear. My read on her changed because I thought the case she made was A) good and B) seemed to be from a townish mindset.
Also, my reads tend to change semi-rapidly as I read the game, yes. I have a hard time holding my thoughts/reads on everyone in the game static in my head over the course of days/weeks/months, and it's just not the first thing on my mind 98% of the time.

Not impressed with UT's sheepy OMGUS vote on us and I approve of the additional votes on him!

[Tim Howard]

seemed to be from a townish mindset.

What aspect of it?

She didn't hop on my wagon, which she had every excuse / reason to at that point. Instead, she basically kickstarted a new one on UT, who there was no serious wagon on at any point D1. Shadoweh had already voted UT, and Plum had voted him prior to making the case, and that was it. Not only was it a fresh new wagon, but she approached her post / scumhunting from a perspective that felt like town actually looking for scum, not like scum looking to invent something scummy.

[Tim Howard]

Nero, your last four votes were naked. Please explain why.


-Nobody Special

This is worth repeating

[Tim Howard]

Not impressed with UT's sheepy OMGUS vote on us and I approve of the additional votes on him!

quadz is Nexus even posting in your hydra anymore?

Also you know better than to use OMGUS as a scumtell so this is just gross.

No, as I said before, I'm now the primary posting head and we talk occasionally about what we think of the game.
Also no I don't


God dammit CDB WHY MUST YOU FLAKE ALLATIME

LLD might be scum for her interaction with sangres early in the game.

What about it?

That is, I am saying Regfan would only replace into slots he thinks are town and if Cerulean are town. If either condition isn't met, he wouldn't replace in. Cerulean feels town so.

This is shitty and bad. Stop it.

I didn't really understand where the kanye votes were coming from, but the points made in 1313 and 1318 seem pretty strong and I'm not sure why the kanye wagon basically collapsed soon after this. Kanye says he moved his vote away from Tim Howard because (1) nobody was interested in voting for him and "even Venmar was a bigger wagon" and (2) he didn't realise how close deadline was. Zdenek and Shadoweh point out the conflict between this and the actual vote counts / what kanye said at the time and the result is ... general indifference?

I really don't like Tim Howard's 1337. UT's 1340 captures my reaction to that fairly well. Reasoning like "I think X is town, Y is pushing them so might be scum" just seems ... off. Who scumhunts this way? (Also, Tim says they don't think

Venmar

could fake frustration but they still can't get a read on a hydra with

Tammy

in? After Tammy's big replace out post in day 1? This doesn't make sense to me.)

Kanye wagon died because he lurked it away, basically.
Wanna explain what else you don't like about that post? You mention one thing in particular I said ("considering my townread on Venmar, the fact that UT keeps pushing him is really making me feel like he could be scum angling for a fairly easy mislynch.") which I think is a solid additional reason to scumread somebody given the context (namely D1 which you have not read). I'm not going to argue that I'm having a million original thoughts with my pushes and cases this game, cause I'm not and I realize that. Heaven forbid I recognize good cases and followup on thinking that they're good.


Yeah, my vote stays on UT for now. Nothing's happened since my last post to change my opinions on anyone, with the exception of reminding me that I could vote Kanye still and that Plessiez is probably town (not so much a change as a confirmation of our opinion on CDB).

[Tim Howard]

1) The one thing I see off about the Reck/UT interactions, on a reread, is that sometimes I feel as though UT is talking to Reck as if he already knows Reck's town. It's hard to describe but it's like UT is trying to play Evil Chancellor to Reck in posts like #1073 and the ensuing ones. I want to go over what Tammy thinks tomorrow when she feels better (she told me she's sick/exhausted from work and can't really post today) since I know she's felt really strong on her UT townread. On Reck's end, the interactions with UT seem pretty much in line with what I've seen in the past.

You should vote UT then! It's good for the soul.

Heh, well, I guess however we're interpreting it, we're both concluding CDB-slot is towny, so I'll take it.

But F-16 and I keep playing chicken with one another saying the other's welcome to move our vote onto Tim Howard, so.

VOTE: Tim Howard

--PA

You are such a card. plz remove thx

quote="In post 1538, Plessiez"]that makes me worry I'm just conflating "I don't like this approach to mafia" with "this slot is probably scum".[/quote]What do you think is off about our approach to mafia? Cause I'm not really doing anything in my approach that I don't usually do, soooo.

I feel like we have become the fallback wagon. Nobody thinks we're thaaaaaat town, but nobody reeeeeally thinks we're scum (except for one or two people). UT wagon is the only one that's gained traction today with like, actual cases and scumminess today, but it appears to have gotten stuck in the mud, so people are going 'eh, fuck it, we'll just lynch this kinda null guy I guess.' Nooooot a huge fan.

As to claiming - we'll do it when we find it necessary, or at the very least when more than just shadoweh is asking us to. *shrug*

[Tim Howard]

dammit quotes

[Tim Howard]

Heh, well, I guess however we're interpreting it, we're both concluding CDB-slot is towny, so I'll take it.

But F-16 and I keep playing chicken with one another saying the other's welcome to move our vote onto Tim Howard, so.

VOTE: Tim Howard

--PA

I'm really bad at looking at wagons so I won't be much help here. Only thing of note to me is his placement on the Tim Howard wagon when I believe he was still scumreading my slot.

"Him" is meant to be UT, right?

I'm rereading day 1 again at the moment and I don't think UT ever voted for Tim Howard then. I'm ... actually not sure if UT was scumreading you as of 745 or not. (On the one hand he says you've "been towntelling lately"; on the other hand your early posts are said to be "incredibly scummy" and he says he'd support a wagon on you. And after this he doesn't really talk about you again, except for a throwaway line about not having played much with Tammy.) But I haven't got the impression UT was scum-reading you today.

Or was "he" meant to be somebody other than UT?

What are your updated thoughts on Tim Howard? Part of me really wants to trust CDB's Nexus read but it's like every bone in my body aches to see them lynched whenever I read the slot's posts. Would also be interested in your thoughts on their meta's.

This is pretty close to my current thoughts about Tim Howard. On the one hand, it feels like this is probably the wagon that should have happened on day 1 (the Katsuki stuff really came from nowhere much in the last couple of RL days; Tim Howard had been a solidly popular wagon for a lot longer than that). But CDB was very confident in his town read on Nexus and sangres also had Tim Howard as a "solid town read" (in 821) and that makes me worry I'm just conflating "I don't like this approach to mafia" with "this slot is probably scum".

(On the subject of meta, I don't suppose you have a good links for town- and scum-Venmar?)

Would vote Kanye. Lurked his way through D1 and lurked his way out of the beginnings of a wagon on D2, which is unlike the kanye I've seen elsewhere.

(1) the way you attacked Sixty for upsetting Tammy, without ever seeming to acknowledge that you thought Tammy was scum or that you actually thought Tammy was doing the very thing Tierce claimed she was doing at the start of that whole exchange

Going back it looks like I never actually said this in thread, but our response to Sixty there had nothing to do with whether they were correct about Tammy's behavior, and everything to do with the fact that they were assholes about it. Not sure why this was a scumtell anyway, since that entire conversation was pretty tangential to the game anyway; we mentioned more than once that it wasn't alignment-indicative in any way.

(2) town-reading Venmar for "frustration", again ignoring Tammy's whole angry-replace-out thing

They're different people. I've seen Tammy get frustrated multiple times before, it's null on her to me. She's kind of an easily frustrated person, so far as I can tell. Venmar doesn't come across as someone who gets frustrated like that a whole lot.

(3) saying that Tierce and Reckoner had both made "good points" in their day 1 argument, but refusing to say what those points were

I've covered why I did this already in my discussion with Reck. If you're gonna call that scummy, then it's your right to call it scummy, but you're stupid for doing so.

(4) apparently scum-reading people purely because they've said they're suspicious of your town-reads (I say 'apparently' because I have a memory of you denying this but I haven't gone back to check yet)

I did deny this you are correct sir!

(5) your reasons for pushing Katsuki seem ... well, hypocritical at best.

Katsuki ignored it while it was happening. He posted

during the argument

and didn't mention it at all. Meanwhile, I read it later, and don't particularly want to read it ever again. There is a difference.


Shadoweh, L-1 is not Magical Claim Zone (shocking I know). I said we'd claim when we feel it necessary, and I meant it. Stop being obtuse.

P-Edit: for fuck's sake, NS, will you do a goddamned thing? Ugh. And no, not claiming for captain lurkpants either.

[Tim Howard]

I don't know why the first two posts quoted were in that post. wtf MS

[Tim Howard]

I don't remember how many games I've played with Tammy, tbh. At least a couple, and I've modded for her in a couple of others. I've found her hard to read in the past, IIRC, and the fact that Empire isn't posting isn't making things easier for me.

Too bad.

No, it doesn't seem odd to me

because they happened at different times

. The situation is completely different.

I don't recall off the top of my head, but I don't think I really had one?

[Tim Howard]

Ugh, this game is no-reveal. Fine, I'm claiming cause if I do get hammered I want to make sure our ability is public.

We're

CDB

. We have two abilities:
Creator of the Deck - Allows us to send 1 person per day phase a random card. That card grants them an ability. We have a laundry list of potential cards, all taken from the Great Idea deck, that can be given. Each one can only be given once. Some of them are useful, some of them are not. We are told what card they receive. On Day 1, we gave a card to CDB (now plessiez). On Day 2, we gave a card to Flipping Awesome. I don't want to reveal what cards were given because I don't know if abilities were used or not and I don't want to nullify their use in case they can accomplish something.

Tzar of 62 - Allows us to choose one person, once during the game. That person takes 1 extra vote to lynch for that day phase. We cannot choose ourselves.


woooo.

[Tim Howard]

I don't remember how many games I've played with Tammy, tbh. At least a couple, and I've modded for her in a couple of others. I've found her hard to read in the past, IIRC, and the fact that Empire isn't posting isn't making things easier for me.

... but Empire is the one doing most of the posting .

No, it doesn't seem odd to me

because they happened at different times

. The situation is completely different.

Let me try this from a different angle. What would you have expected a town!Katsuki to say about the Reck/Sixty posts?

>_> so he is. ummmmm... ok so I apparently suck at reading either one of them. I learned something new today, team.
And I would have expected town!Kats to say

something

about it, not just ignore it and pretend it wasn't there.

*sigh* NS and chamber continue to barely contribute. I don't have a read on either of them because they haven't really said anything.

VOTE: nero

This still feels bad man

Then why are you voting him?

It appears that the UT wagon has entirely disappeared. I guess I should re-read Nero and attempt to formulate an actual read on him. >_<

[Tim Howard]

ISO'd Nero Cain. I don't like lynching him, seems town. Commencing reading up on the last few pages I missed now!

Not surprised NC doesn't have a reference to the doublevote in his role; it's Venmar's role, not his. (not alignment relevant)

We chose our targets according to who we thought was town.

kanye, my buddying on you in fire and ice was because I think you are a pretty damn good player, hence my scumread on you in this game for being super-useless

How many times have you seen me get that frustrated as scum?

Dunno? Not really an alignment thing, like I said, you just seem easily frustrated.


UT wagon is clearly not happening today, which is
VOTE: kanye
would vote venmar if that wagon gets bigger soon. will vote nero if I absolutely must to get a lynch today.

[Tim Howard]

That's pretty much the entirety of the reasoning? And we had given the card prior to the claim, but it gets sent through the mods, so timing/delays/etc

[Tim Howard]

plz kanye lynch over nero

plz

[Tim Howard]

Chamber, what was the point of the short-lived switch to kanye?

This. Please explain.

[Tim Howard]

Nero is Thor, hence blue name

and seriously reck, RTFT

[Tim Howard]

SO VOTE HIM PLZ

[Tim Howard]

We'll read back and take a look at wagons and shit today. Need to try to get a read on LLD, it seems.

[Tim Howard]

God dammit I was 3 hours behind stupid getting shit done

Anywho, still not a fan of the Venmar wagon. I like the LLD wagon after re-reading her ISO (hasn't really taken hard stances since D1 / I feel that town-LLD would be pushing to accomplish shit in the midst of a lackadaisical town), but I'm not interested in putting her at L-1 as of yet. I want to see what her actual supposed upcoming content has to say.

Trying to re-feel out my Plum and UT reads as well. They've flipflopped a couple of times over the course of the game and I want to try to get a better handle on them.

[Tim Howard]

I think an LLD/Kanye scumteam is not only possible but also likely

This bothers me a lot. Not going to advocate flipping instead of LLD or anything but getting it out there.

I am reading. You people argue a lot.

Yeah, this LLD feels like she's tryharding to avoid a lynch.

VOTE: LLD

So what do you think of her content so far, also your tomorrow's wagon feelouts reads on the other two? More importantly, you know everyone wants to know who you're giving your card to. To me. Give me something to do. I hope you're not just planning to give it to Flipping again, he's already gotten a turn.

Haven't had time to do a re-read on them, but what I've seen from them today have given me slight townvibes on Plum and no alignment-feelings at all on UT.
I gave the card to Chamber, as we're fairly confident in his townishness at this point, and his claim seemed like a thing we should take into account.

I think an LLD/Kanye scumteam is not only possible but also likely

This bothers me a lot. Not going to advocate flipping instead of LLD or anything but getting it out there.

Why does this bother you / what bothers you about it?

I am reading. You people argue a lot.

Christ on a bicycle, WILL SOMEBODY PLEASE SHOOT HIM FOR GOD'S SAKES. Or do something useful? Ugh.

[Tim Howard]

??? = I decided I want you lynched


whoaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[Tim Howard]

Yes LLD, you're right, I am voting you because I am afraid of you. *eyeroll*

Also, I read through the whole LLD post on UT, and literally every time she talks about how he's manipulating Reck, my response was "no that's just how UT talks." I mean, you're not necessarily wrong that he's trying to manipulate Reck, but if he is, it's more subtle than what you've pointed out, I think.



P-Edit: It's not inherently alignment-dependent, I suppose. It's primarily that none of your tryhardy posts have made me feel any better about your alignment, I think.

[Tim Howard]

LLD remains the correct vote here. She's trying to shout down UT's rebuttals, rather than taking corrections and altering her case / opinions as necessary. None of her posts since the wagon jumped onto her have made me feel any better about her alignment.

I'm fairly certain Reck's vote on UT was a jokevote or something, but I'm not really sure cause trying to read tone via text is harrrrd.

LLD is the lynch today, plz.

[Tim Howard]

World Cup preparations are under way, but we're here.

We need to chat, though.

[Tim Howard]

frack, sorry we've remained useless. New job means I can't get on aim at work to

harass

talk to Nexus about shit, so I haven't had a chance to actually think through pretty much anything in the thread. We will accomplish shit tonight or tomorrow morning, promise.

[Tim Howard]

LLD remains the correct choice. Would vote Venmar to prevent no-lynch.

[Tim Howard]

Content is neato, and currently boils down to "gee whiz nothing of much interest has happened in since the site came back up neat!"

[Tim Howard]

Everyone is agreed the Venmar's hammer was scummy as fuck, then? Cool.

I really need to develop more reads. All of my townreads keep getting NKed.

[Tim Howard]

I agree with Shadoweh and Reck re: venmar's ability. Not exactly the towniest play as someone who is heavily suspected to not attempt to eat the scum NK intentionally.

[Tim Howard]

IN FACT

VOTE: venmar

[Tim Howard]

Card recipient has been sent to the mods.

[Tim Howard]

Need to talk to Nexus to respond to FA's questions. Will come back with a real post probably tonight.

[Tim Howard]

TIM HOWARD HAS RETURNED AND SHIT

Nexus says he called plum out as town because basically the rest of the game was pinging the scumdar, and she specifically was not at that point.

I am pretty much out of fucking reads. I've re-read, I've looked at VCs, and I'm not getting goddamn anything meaningful at fucking all. *sigh*

[Tim Howard]

Can we get Nero Cain replaced or something if he doesn't post regularly? Indefinite V/LA is shit.

IN OTHER NEWS

If we're the lynch today, then so be it, but I don't think anything useful will actually come of it. Not gonna be a scum lynch, and not even very good as an information lynch either. *shrug*

Reck, why are you voting us? Like, with reasons and shit.

[Tim Howard]

hmmm, Tim Howard didn't appear to be town reading me, so why they would send me a one-shot Ninja is a bit odd.

Care to inform me who we were townreading at that point? (Answer: nobody cause we don't have any fucking reads)

[Tim Howard]

We don't pick what card gets sent

[Tim Howard]

my case

acceptabru

VOTE: Nobody Special

[Tim Howard]

hmmm, Tim Howard didn't appear to be town reading me, so why they would send me a one-shot Ninja is a bit odd.

Care to inform me who we were townreading at that point? (Answer: nobody cause we don't have any fucking reads)

Then why are you sending cards at all?

Your question is a good one and I don't have a good answer (i.e., probably shouldn't have sent one yesterday).

[Tim Howard]

It is unlikely that we would run out of cards.

[Tim Howard]

also for the sake of staying in character with our avatar FUCK YEAH EAT IT GHANA WOOO

[Tim Howard]

Card sent

[Tim Howard]

If I had reads, I'd give them to you. :/ I've been reading and trying to pick up anything at all and am just getting nothing from this game.

[Tim Howard]

I'm voting for Nobody Special primarily because he's provided 0 content for the entire game and will continue to provide 0 content, and thus remain completely unreadable, whereas other people might actually do something readable in the future.