Open 897 - Cop 17er [DAY 6]

[yessiree]

yeah kinda
i feel like good things happen when u cook tho

[Bellaphant]

If Bellaphant has scumreads, then vote them rather than asking others who they prefer.

I did! Not sure why the issue is with my vote specifically rather than enchants or pythons, but whatever.

With furtive specifically, he isn't approaching me in good faith. Neither are you: you see my pint about gamma, FB agrees, you ignore it in order to continue to shade me. It's also just ....weak, because are you really implying that it's scummy, that I can't fake reads as scum?

Compare for example how you and furtive have discussed me compared to rce, Ney and yessiree.
Furtive: Bella's just scum because?? But I won't engage and sort her
You: Bella's scum because she's....talking to people?
Rce: Bella might be town but I tr her too easily, I'm gonna leave this to others
Yessiree: I disagree with Bella's takes. Oh, I could see this being a legit thought process really
Ney; Bella.doesnr have a ton of content but I can see solve motivation

Which ones look like genuine, thought out takes to you?

Also, I'm less convinced about the votes on Titus meaning as much as we thought, as people were trying to give her a break for RL. I am still convinced that votes on the counter wagons are scummy. I CBA to check right now but furtive deffo had some weird votes last day phase (as did Dave, I hadn't realised he'd voted me yesterday??)

[Firebringer]

i had an interesting thought before i went to sleep that i think will super help me sort Naerys.

See one of the troubling thing i find with naerys is (A) she seems genuine and (B) none of her posts takes seem like they couldn't be easily faked.

There was another thing i was thinking about in recentish. Naerys and me rarely if really ever talked about each other in this game, like she didn't react to one time i voted her, my read on her or me calling out her bad arguments. She kind of treats me like i am present but not there.

Which is a bit weird considering from even her latest posts she says im scum. But she is low effort so i was always like "okay w/e"

So challenge for Naerys:
Go through my iso and I just want you to comment on all my takes on yourself. Can be anything just what you think I am doing/ur personal thoughts on my position/is it real-fake/possible opportunism. If you think i am smelly doody head, w/e. Just give me ur thoughts on how I have read and talked about yourself. I think this will be best I get for informing my read on you.

[Firebringer]

Firebringer, yessiree and i am still torn about Hu Tao
After titus flip i will neef to recheck some stuff

This was kind of last post about the suspects she had before she responded with the dave/herself/yessire where she kind of said everyone was townie?

[Firebringer]

Okay, for today there are main three suspects: yessiree, myself, davesaz
As for myself, i am town. Whenever you feel some concer about me, feel free to throw it at me. I will answer them as best as i can, even if i sometimes yell my frustration out.

yessiree

- Well he is hard to read for me, played only one game with him, where he was alien. And i have to admit that i basically spent whole game following Flavor without paying much attention, so its quite hard for me to compare yessiree in that game with him here. I will be frank, i dont like his levity. Is he always like this? That faked hammer is giving me bad vibes.
@yessiree Who are your solid town reads and whom do you SR?

davesaz

- I am getting town vibes from dave. He is sorting people and their actions. I personally like his inputs, he is observant and calm. I dont see any manipulations or hidden agenda going on there. I need to look at why FB is voting him, beceause i dont see this dave to be scummy at all.
Dave, who is the most towny person for you?

Out of these 2, yessiree looks worse.

yessiree looks worse but the reasons again. They just seem superficial anyone can make doesn't make it fake just means I can see anyone coming up with this even a scum player.

[Firebringer]

Fresh Reads List for the New Year as I am now Town!

Spoiler: New List

Firebringer - Lord of Fire. God Town. Lost his sanity to the Trickster Aristeia
Aristeia - Lady of Dreams. Very Likely Town. She stole firebringer sanity and won't return it. She doesn't have the effort in this game as others ive seen but I believe her thoughts are pure.
Gamma Emerald - Lady of Emerald. Strong Town. I've sort of lost my earlier feelings on Gamma but I believe i correctly sorted her early and I am not going to go back and reread to figure out why I think she is town. I want her head more in the game and solving but I think she is town even if lowe effort.
Doctor - Lord of Chaos. Black was town and Drew interacted with me here how he would as town. We have disagreed but if he was scum those disagreements would look very different. Our fights feel very much like in the latest boon game where we couldn't see eye to eye.
Python - Ruler of Order. Strong Town This one seems to want to sort game the most in here. If high effort scum can deep wolf for all I care. I did recently play a marathon and could be underestimate capabilities as scum but I think headspace is clearly on solving and not trying to throw town through loops.
Meuh - Lady of Meuh. She was confirmed town was already townreading her earlier though. Not much to say. Bad leader though. Please overthrow.
Bellaphant - Lady of Phants. Pretty Decent Town. I like her day 2 performance much more than day 1. More solving/engagement. I approve the poking she does and attempts to dig. I mean she could be scum just now getting into the game. I don't think so. Might do a deep dive to give less generic thoughts on this. She feels townie to me with her effort and thoughts.
Theta - Queen of Physics. Probably Town. Ive gone back and forth and now I just believe they believe what they think of me. This is probably best I get with them regarding how they operate/think. Its all clouded in my head because feels abstract thinking most of time.
Hua Tao - Lady of Moon. Probably town. I don't think she was faking her posts or fronting earlier. I think her interactions with Titus are actually clearing too. A bit. I think I was stronger on her town before but absent makes me forget strong reasons or vibes.
Furtive - Lord of Whosvile. Maybe Town. Ask me again later. I will deep dive him at some point and review what I thought about him earlier after deep dive see how much I agree with past firebringer.
yessiree - King of Vibes. Maybe Town. i got nothing but good vibes from the dude on 90% of it which hasn't helped me sort because he takes such a easy going approach that you can't feel an alignment from most of his posting but I feel his insistence on his stance that scum were off-wagon is townie by him. I mean why not just bend the knee on that unless all scum were on the wagon. I guess his actual reads are okay.
Enchant - Wizard Mercanary. Weak Town. I didn't have a good grasp on gob. Enchant hasn't changed much other than I think scum him would try to care how he looked more. Maybe he needs pressure to see how he cares about how he looks in practice. I don't know if this is an actual good method of truly sortng him.
RCEnigma - Ruler of Darkness. Very very weak scum. He could be scum lost motivation. He could be town who just doesn't have time. He seems genuine in his dealings with me. Maybe thats fake. I don't know. Willing to give him another day.
Nayers - Queen of Sloth. Possible Scum. Not feeling great about it. See my questions and stuff at her above posts.
Davesaz - Ruler of VCA. Maybe Scum. I am still not extremely confident. I could do a pros and con list on him. The cons just feel stronger right now with the lack of actual analysis on the votes he claims to focus on. The lack of actual scumreads beyond the hiding on VCA. The only pros i think are somewhat townie are hostility to others and his sorting of furtive. I mean those aren't that good

In a more neat organized less wordy format
Firebringer
Gamma/Drew/Meuh/Python
Aristeia
Bella
Theta/Hua Tao
Furtive/yessiree
Enchant
RCEnigma
Naerys
Davesaz

[furtiveglance]

Hmm it looks like everyone on my wagon is 1) openly apathetic and 2) openly looking for a counterwagon to the only conftown's push.

It's hard to say whose involvement is the most egregious. I think I'll go for 'Lord of Darkness' RCEnigma. Calling me passive this game is such blinding hypocrisy, it has to be scum, right?

The thing is I don't know whether it's better to vote him or to just get on Naerys in the aim of 'playing optimally'.

Meuh, could you vote RC? Or give a shortlist of players you could vote? Or just tell me if you're set on Naerys and I'll sheep it.

[Bellaphant]

It's shocking to me that you are putting such store in the Ney case.

Rce is doing fine.

[RCEnigma]

Hmm. You don’t want to like. Maybe weigh in on the other two reasons I brought up? Or refute Bella’s reasoning?

Or discuss why you might have fallen into a blind spot and I’m wrong?

Also meuh can be conftown and wrong on every single read. Not saying they are but also I don’t like any of the wagons that have popped up today except this one.

[RCEnigma]

RCEnigma
usesPython
DragonEater70
Naerys
Theta Alpine
furtiveglance
davesaz
Bellaphant

^^^ Not voting Titus.
Python seems insistent to not vote here for ~reasons~ which I haven't read or care about. Maybe ari has a point on trying to split the wagon but I think Python is most likely town.

Everyone else if ur not voting Titus I want to hear why she is solid town to u. Give me town-reasons not just a weak sauce defense of "theres better votes" or "not that scummy" or anything that isn't your willing to call a strong to die on a hill strong on calling town.

Come on

You can not vote a wagon while still not being solid town on them.

There was a Titus mention I missed the first time I ran through the iso. This and furtive saying they could hammer but won’t.

[RCEnigma]

I also like the idea of letting the apparent Cop inno decide today's elimination, but I'll still chime in with my own thoughts.

Pretty sure Firebringer and Python are town. So with Meuh that could be a good towncore.

I still think gob was fairly towny (now Enchant).

I don't think Drew calling Titus obvtown clears him, but I'm not getting major scum vibes either.

RCE selfing is weird, could be scum for sure.

Bella's reaction to my vote has dominated her posting since, I'd like more opinions on other players. I'm not sure how I feel about her anymore, maybe slightly less suspicious but not convinced she's town by any means.

I forgot all the other alive players, be less forgettable guys.

Furtive your last post seems like a disconnect from this philosophy in regards to meuh. What changed with meuh that the play is to sheep her wherever they vote?

[RCEnigma]

I do like that the response to my issues isn’t hedgy at least.

[Naerys]

Okay, for today there are main three suspects: yessiree, myself, davesaz
As for myself, i am town. Whenever you feel some concer about me, feel free to throw it at me. I will answer them as best as i can, even if i sometimes yell my frustration out.

yessiree

- Well he is hard to read for me, played only one game with him, where he was alien. And i have to admit that i basically spent whole game following Flavor without paying much attention, so its quite hard for me to compare yessiree in that game with him here. I will be frank, i dont like his levity. Is he always like this? That faked hammer is giving me bad vibes.
@yessiree Who are your solid town reads and whom do you SR?

davesaz

- I am getting town vibes from dave. He is sorting people and their actions. I personally like his inputs, he is observant and calm. I dont see any manipulations or hidden agenda going on there. I need to look at why FB is voting him, beceause i dont see this dave to be scummy at all.
Dave, who is the most towny person for you?

Out of these 2, yessiree looks worse.

yessiree looks worse but the reasons again. They just seem superficial anyone can make doesn't make it fake just means I can see anyone coming up with this even a scum player.

Yet its all i thought its all that could be said. I am not person of many words or huge posts. If you call this slack, then you can kindly fk off.

[Naerys]

Firebringer, yessiree and i am still torn about Hu Tao
After titus flip i will neef to recheck some stuff

This was kind of last post about the suspects she had before she responded with the dave/herself/yessire where she kind of said everyone was townie?

I didnt say everyone is town. I consider yessiree suspicious.

[Naerys]

So challenge for Naerys:
Go through my iso and I just want you to comment on all my takes on yourself. Can be anything just what you think I am doing/ur personal thoughts on my position/is it real-fake/possible opportunism. If you think i am smelly doody head, w/e. Just give me ur thoughts on how I have read and talked about yourself. I think this will be best I get for informing my read on you.

I am not going through that million posts of yours. I refuse to be bullied into this.

[furtiveglance]

I also like the idea of letting the apparent Cop inno decide today's elimination, but I'll still chime in with my own thoughts.

Pretty sure Firebringer and Python are town. So with Meuh that could be a good towncore.

I still think gob was fairly towny (now Enchant).

I don't think Drew calling Titus obvtown clears him, but I'm not getting major scum vibes either.

RCE selfing is weird, could be scum for sure.

Bella's reaction to my vote has dominated her posting since, I'd like more opinions on other players. I'm not sure how I feel about her anymore, maybe slightly less suspicious but not convinced she's town by any means.

I forgot all the other alive players, be less forgettable guys.

Furtive your last post seems like a disconnect from this philosophy in regards to meuh. What changed with meuh that the play is to sheep her wherever they vote?

I personally don't really think Naerys is scum anymore, and I want to at least make clear what I think, even if I do end up sheeping Meuh. I want to try and persuade her first and have a dialogue.

[furtiveglance]

blegh
As I said, I would like her to make/restate the case for why furtive is scum. That seems like the most productive option

VOTE: Furtive

Bella can give her own but I think Furtives scumminess boils down to:

-The hyperfixation on specific slots. Bella being the main one. But if you iso Furtive it’s just 80% calling out Bella or responding to statements from Python. It’s even more scum indicative of it happened that way in reaction to a read from Bella but I didn’t go back that far in the game for the context of when it started because I wasn’t specifically looking for it, just kinda popped out.

-personally I find furtive more as a passive scum player, not so much that way as town. I had one brief moment in day 1 I thought furtive could be town for the way they were pushing an opinion against the grain of their own townreads. I think it’s a little more difficult for scum!furtive but the majority of the game has been passive voting and reactionary reads.

-Literally no mention/interaction with anything kyouko/Titus related. Which is convenient in a way… but also pretty suspicious. I get not being around for every event that pops up in game, but not even like a quoted post in passing or any commentary on anything that had anything to do with the slot that flipped scum is a red flag I didn’t know was there till I did an iso read through.

Ok, I'll respond then.

What you're calling a hyperfixation on slots is actually the reverse, those are the players that have mentioned/interacted with me most, hence I obviously reciprocate.

Have I been that passive this game? I was on D1, but it's a massive game and it takes time to get into it. I have a group of townreads that I'm fairly happy with now, just not sure which of the poe players are scum yet. Also, I just haven't found the game super interesting yet. But it is getting more interesting.

I did mention Titus a couple times, including a post you've now quoted. I wasn't sure on Titus, and I probably wasn't active enough on D1 to pick up on whatever made her apparent 'obvscum'. I didn't strongly townread her either, but I'm not the kind of player who justs sheeps the big D1 wagon on a nullread.

[furtiveglance]

Spoiler: me and Bella

Bella could be scum, 362 especially but not a strong read

I still think Bella's scum

I'm gonna vote a player who hasn't got enough scrutiny so far.
VOTE: Bellaphant

I don't think anyone's even acknowledged my vote, or Bella's presence in the game so far

How old is black really?

I read the last few pages and I basically tr everyone, which is an issue.

Dragon, Ari and rce specifically

Rule of 3

I dunno how I feel about python and gamma

setting up/encouraging tvt

I have read like 50% of this game but I haven't liked any posts from yessiree.

Can someone give me the tldr?

VOTE: yess
.sorry, I am having a shit week and can't keep up but I've skim read and am basically sleeping dragon, plus the last time I engaged with this thread yess was my only SR.

P-edit I thought theta was fairly town.

voting on a pretty popular wagon

Tbf furtive's random push on me should be looked at again: firstly, it's super common for scum to see me as lhf day one, but also furtive should know they are shit at reading me. Like, it's /such/ a weird move

furtive should know they are shit at reading me.

Based on which games?

furtive should know they are shit at reading me.

Based on which games?

Mainly the weird one that was split over the three threads? But I'm sure there are others. Also, do you wanna like engage on your read on me?

The relevant game in which I played badly (I'd say shit is excessive, I did have a hard time choosing between Bella and Nona)

furtive should know they are shit at reading me.

Based on which games?

Mainly the weird one that was split over the three threads? But I'm sure there are others. Also, do you wanna like engage on your read on me?

Ok so 1 game. I've read you correctly in at least 1 game - Newbie 2091 when you replaced in.

Wdym engage on my read? I called you scum, gave reasons.

I actually meant Newbie 2101 - I was town and Bella was scum. Interesting that she didn't pick up it was the wrong game tho.

@furtive, you seem to be sr me for....mentioning people? And scum reading yessiree. Also, how do you know gamma and python are t v t?

@furtive, you seem to be sr me for....mentioning people? And scum reading yessiree. Also, how do you know gamma and python are t v t?

That's just my read on it

Cool, me too. But I didn't then. I can't read abrasiveness at all. It always makes me go ????

Anything else you wanna chat about. You don't seem to wanna sort me

Bella's reaction to my vote has dominated her posting since, I'd like more opinions on other players. I'm not sure how I feel about her anymore, maybe slightly less suspicious but not convinced she's town by any means.

Theta, furtive, gamma, python are solid town for me. I never tr furtive though so maybe I am drunk

VOTE: further glance

Following my new lord and saviour

Bella sheeping Enchant instead of Meuh seems very weird, she also called me 'solid town' a couple days prior in #3340.

I'm not sure why Python voted me, they've taken up similar positions to me for most of the game (especially recently).

We're bored and voting literally anyone in our POE, this day is taking forever

This.

@furtive, I did say I was drunk though!! It's also pretty clear that I don't think nearys is scum and the wagon on her is sketch. I'm honestly not that hard to read.

With furtive specifically, he isn't approaching me in good faith.

Compare for example how you and furtive have discussed me compared to rce, Ney and yessiree.
Furtive: Bella's just scum because?? But I won't engage and sort her
You: Bella's scum because she's....talking to people?
Rce: Bella might be town but I tr her too easily, I'm gonna leave this to others
Yessiree: I disagree with Bella's takes. Oh, I could see this being a legit thought process really
Ney; Bella.doesnr have a ton of content but I can see solve motivation

Which ones look like genuine, thought out takes to you?

Also, I'm less convinced about the votes on Titus meaning as much as we thought, as people were trying to give her a break for RL. I am still convinced that votes on the counter wagons are scummy. I CBA to check right now but furtive deffo had some weird votes last day phase

Hmm it looks like everyone on my wagon is 1) openly apathetic and 2) openly looking for a counterwagon to the only conftown's push.

It's hard to say whose involvement is the most egregious. I think I'll go for 'Lord of Darkness' RCEnigma. Calling me passive this game is such blinding hypocrisy, it has to be scum, right?

The thing is I don't know whether it's better to vote him or to just get on Naerys in the aim of 'playing optimally'.

Meuh, could you vote RC? Or give a shortlist of players you could vote? Or just tell me if you're set on Naerys and I'll sheep it.

It's shocking to me that you are putting such store in the Ney case.

Rce is doing fine.

I'm not really sure what point I'm trying to get across, but I just want to show people my perspective on this. I had an early scumread on Bella and voted her, and she tried to discredit me by calling me shit at reading her, which is verifiably untrue across our games together. Also, the two games that we played together in August/September '22 were close enough together that I'm surprised she didn't remember or mention the Newbie game.

Since then my scumread on her has cooled off a bit and I've been unsure, but she's characterising that as 'refusing to engage'.

Again, this isn't meant to be a scumcase or anything. I'm just trying to display my own alignment.

[Gamma Emerald]

Hmm it looks like everyone on my wagon is 1) openly apathetic and 2) openly looking for a counterwagon to the only conftown's push.

It's hard to say whose involvement is the most egregious. I think I'll go for 'Lord of Darkness' RCEnigma. Calling me passive this game is such blinding hypocrisy, it has to be scum, right?

The thing is I don't know whether it's better to vote him or to just get on Naerys in the aim of 'playing optimally'.

Meuh, could you vote RC? Or give a shortlist of players you could vote? Or just tell me if you're set on Naerys and I'll sheep it.

>:/

[Bellaphant]

Your list of posts where you randomly sr me when I'm not here doesn't really match up with you only engaging wit the people who are hyper fixated on you.

The 3 thread game is the one that stands out to me because I was so obvious town in it and you still got it wrong.

[Bellaphant]

I just re-read that newbie and it rings very little bells, I was so ill! I did say I was fairly sure I was replacing into a scum slot though, which is fun.

[furtiveglance]

Ok well I've explained my perspective on things so far pretty much as best as I can.

[Meuh]

Hmm it looks like everyone on my wagon is 1) openly apathetic and 2) openly looking for a counterwagon to the only conftown's push.

It's hard to say whose involvement is the most egregious. I think I'll go for 'Lord of Darkness' RCEnigma. Calling me passive this game is such blinding hypocrisy, it has to be scum, right?

The thing is I don't know whether it's better to vote him or to just get on Naerys in the aim of 'playing optimally'.

Meuh, could you vote RC? Or give a shortlist of players you could vote? Or just tell me if you're set on Naerys and I'll sheep it.

How are you complaining about people not sheeping me and asking me to vote for someone else in the same breath

[Meuh]

UNVOTE: I can look towards an alternative option

[furtiveglance]

Hmm it looks like everyone on my wagon is 1) openly apathetic and 2) openly looking for a counterwagon to the only conftown's push.

It's hard to say whose involvement is the most egregious. I think I'll go for 'Lord of Darkness' RCEnigma. Calling me passive this game is such blinding hypocrisy, it has to be scum, right?

The thing is I don't know whether it's better to vote him or to just get on Naerys in the aim of 'playing optimally'.

Meuh, could you vote RC? Or give a shortlist of players you could vote? Or just tell me if you're set on Naerys and I'll sheep it.

How are you complaining about people not sheeping me and asking me to vote for someone else in the same breath

It's possible that if you choose a different vote then more people will sheep you