Open 338 Jungle Republic StefanBversion - FIN

[Sir Bastion]

Question for all; would you rather lynch a wolf or a mafia today?

You're begining to make me think your doing this on purpose as scum.

What exactly do you mean by this? What is he 'doing on purpose'?

VOTE: TheOtherFiction

Why did you take so long to confirm?

Hmm well as I said I looked at the example games and I explained how it went there. werewolf lynched first then the mafia won in their only example. And most, not all werewolf games won with a maf lynch first.

Which I guess makes sense to an extent.

I think it would be natural for us to want to kill wolves as quick as possible to get rid of the NK so if the seer survived up until that point he/she can reveal (as maf wont be able to NK, unless I misunderstand and they gain NK after wolves all die?) that way town can rely on them and no lynch (if we still have numbers) to force a win through. Otherwise if the seer dies then *blah* so many variables...

But the mafia have the numbers and organisation and can if left unchecked quickly control the vote.

Its hard and I assume thats how the game was designed. We could aim for the wolves and not be careless and perhaps be lucky?

Asking meta related questions that don't tell us anything about the player's playstyle or anything that they would have to take their alignment into consideration for. Scum would want to do this because again, they wouldn't need to take their alignment into consideration for the conversation while making it seem like they're posting a lot

I already explained my logic for questions above. I was mistaken on the level one can ask (and I should reconsider some of my actions elsewhere because of this) about other games and past games? I was trying to get the people to talk on a variety of areas so we get a feel for each other beyond who we RVS and what joke we threw in with it, I just thought the last game we all played might be an easy start that doesnt sound as far left as say *Who do you want to win the Rugby World Cup?"

[TheOtherFiction]

Question for all; would you rather lynch a wolf or a mafia today?

You're begining to make me think your doing this on purpose as scum.

What exactly do you mean by this? What is he 'doing on purpose'?

VOTE: TheOtherFiction

Why did you take so long to confirm?

Anime Weekend Atlanta. So I had to wait till Monday.

Townread on Sir Bastion. Though I'm not sure what good the question can do. Presumably the game isn't over so all he'd be able to say is whether he was lynched or killed.

Thanks for the brownie points?

No I am just trying to get people talking so we could move out of RVS quicker. This is only my 4th game (and I've only finished one where I was nightkilled the first night after I hammered a townie ) and so far out of the other 3, the 2 that stayed in RVS for quite a while ended up with really weak leads & for the first 3-4 pages & tunnelled scumhunting for most of day 1 while the 1 where we chatted for a bit and asked each other random questions and talked opened up a lot more options and helped get the game moving (a bit too moving we ended day one on 44pages)

For you Cobblerfone, I guess I cant ask you about 1148 so hmm Where you lynched or nightkilled in your last game? Or did you survive?

[bold]Vote Sir Bastion[/bold] and

Suspicion on Cobbler

Possible that Bastion is either scum trying to hide the fact Cobbler called him "townie" so early OR Bastion could be trying to make a townie look suspicious by quoting without actually acting on him. Either way, Bastion looks a little scummy. Plus, a little reasoned vote starts discussion better than RVs.

@Sir Bastion: It is public knowledge that in the game you reference I was lynched not long after replacing in on page 80. Can't say any more than that due to the game currently being ongoing.

@cobblerfone: you've now sucked up to both kondi and Bastion. I'm happy with where my vote is. It is a serious vote. Please explain your town read on Bastion. What has he done that makes you think he's distinctly town?

Agreed.


Meta-questions could be a mistake of a townie or scummy, but his newness is worn down a good 4 months or whatever, so it doesn't really hold. Either way, we should investigate Cobbler, but as I pointed out, I don't want Bastion to get away entirely. He seems a bit protective of Bastion, but it could just be because its my first read of the first few post.

[Sir Bastion]

Possible that Bastion is either scum trying to hide the fact Cobbler called him "townie" so early OR Bastion could be trying to make a townie look suspicious by quoting without actually acting on him.

Acting? I actually had to reread a few times to work out how you read my post. And I just clicked it. You are wondering why I didnt move off my RVS vote on to Cobbler despite pointing out that I recognise it as sucking up. Honestly I opted not to push because I didnt think it was worth it. My *brownie points* comment was mostly in jest rather then accusing him of sucking up with scum intent. As for not moving my vote yet, I already explained my thinking, I'm trying to get more dialogue flowing between players rather then get tunnelled in on a weak lead.

Speaking of dialogue, one question that comes up a lot, is policy on day 1 lurkers...though it might be problematic with this game due to its unusual late start and we still havnt got 100% numbers yet so we could be seeing a lot of early swaps.

Either way, Bastion looks a little scummy. Plus, a little reasoned vote starts discussion better than RVs.

is the reasoned a dig at me?

Meta-questions could be a mistake of a townie or scummy, but his newness is worn down a good 4 months or whatever

Is this to me or Cobbler? Cause the meta questions I assume mean me, but I have not been here 4 months? Could you clarify please?

[Cobblerfone]

So... you're saying only town would express eagerness in moving the thread along?

Also, you're giving him town points for his eagerness to move the thread along, in the same post where you basically say his questions are doing nothing to move the thread along?

Eagerness =/= actually did.

Question for all; would you rather lynch a wolf or a mafia today?

Lynching a mafia gives them a smaller voting-block making them werewolf-lite. So I guess mafia.

Either way, we should investigate Cobbler,

Is this an order to the seer or to the town? And if the latter, why not ask me a question or something?

[Yosarian2]

Oh shoot, I forgot, 12 players. Do we no-lynch today or in mylo? Or do we not no-lynch with the way the setup is? I don't know what the usual procedure is in multiscum games with only one kill.

I don't think we no-lynch here. If we wipe out the warewolves first, then the game basically becomes a nightless game with no kill at all, which means that odds and evens don't matter, the more townies at that point the better. Also, cross-kills (the wolves killing the mafia) are fairly likely at this point.

There may be a point when we want to no-lynch in the future, based on how the numbers go (like if we wipe out the mafia first, we'll probably want to no-lynch to get on odds) but not now I think.

[Yosarian2]

Question for all; would you rather lynch a wolf or a mafia today?

Probably a wolf; bringing the warewolf group from 2 members down to 1 member hurts them more then lowering the mafia group from 3 members to 2 members hurts them. Dosn't really matter that much, though.

Mostly I want to lynch some kind of scum. I've been in jungle republic games before, and the biggest risk to the town is that if you lynch town day 1, then scum have a true majority of the game, and then the game starts to get...really weird. Scumhunting and voting themselves basically start to break down when the town is in the minority; it's still winnable for the town, but it psychologically and practically gets a hell of a lot harder.

On the bright side, we have a 50/50 chance of lynching scum today, so we can hopefully avoid that.

[Yosarian2]

Also,

Vote:primate

because he's said in the past that he's better at posting content when he feels pressured.

[scooby]

Question for all; would you rather lynch a wolf or a mafia today?

I think I'd rather get rid of the werewolf nk first. I also think that it's more easy to catch mafia when there are a lot of them because they interact more.

Arbitrary RVS reads:
People I like: Rhinox and iamasuername.
People I dont like: Cobblerfone and theotherfaction

I don't like the weakness of the accusations on this post:

Possible

that Bastion is either scum trying to hide the fact Cobbler called him "townie" so early OR Bastion

could be

trying to make a townie look suspicious by quoting without actually acting on him. Either way,

Bastion looks a little scummy

. Plus,

a little reasoned vote

starts discussion better than RVs.

Meta-questions

could be

a mistake of a townie or scummy, but his newness is worn down a good 4 months or whatever, so it doesn't really hold. Either way, we should investigate Cobbler, but as I pointed out, I don't want Bastion to get away entirely. He

seems a bit protective of Bastion

, but

it could just be because its my first read of the first few post

.

Vote: TheOtherFiction.

[Rhinox]

So... you're saying only town would express eagerness in moving the thread along?

Also, you're giving him town points for his eagerness to move the thread along, in the same post where you basically say his questions are doing nothing to move the thread along?

Eagerness =/= actually did.

That was my point. Do you think eagerness alone is enough for a town read?

You also didn't answer the first question.

[TheOtherFiction]

Question for all; would you rather lynch a wolf or a mafia today?

I think I'd rather get rid of the werewolf nk first. I also think that it's more easy to catch mafia when there are a lot of them because they interact more.

Arbitrary RVS reads:
People I like: Rhinox and iamasuername.
People I dont like: Cobblerfone and theotherfaction

I don't like the weakness of the accusations on this post:

Possible

that Bastion is either scum trying to hide the fact Cobbler called him "townie" so early OR Bastion

could be

trying to make a townie look suspicious by quoting without actually acting on him. Either way,

Bastion looks a little scummy

. Plus,

a little reasoned vote

starts discussion better than RVs.

Meta-questions

could be

a mistake of a townie or scummy, but his newness is worn down a good 4 months or whatever, so it doesn't really hold. Either way, we should investigate Cobbler, but as I pointed out, I don't want Bastion to get away entirely. He

seems a bit protective of Bastion

, but

it could just be because its my first read of the first few post

.

Vote: TheOtherFiction.

whatever. I'm acknowledging this but since I voted someone on reasons I know are weak (which is your case?), I don't really have anything to say about your vote.

I would prefer lynching a wolf because one could still kill and it weakens the biggest threat to town.
/opinion

@cobbler: At the town. I don't really want to influence the seer onto anyone unless it's a significantly stronger read.
ALSO, please answer Rhinox's question.

@Bastion: You! but I did mentally place your join date as April instead of August (and even from that miscounted, hence the "4 months or WHATEVER" but yeah, you. I was supposing you might be breaking site rules just because of your newness to the game. (Which is like a meta defense of a real accusation, but I digress to avoid some sort of circular logic).

the "reasoned" is because I feel uncomfortable throwing in a RV when I could use something that's at least a little scummy to vote someone.

[StefanB]

Votecount 2:

Primate: Sir Bastion, Yosarian2 (L-5)
TheOtherFiction: iamausername, scooby (L-5)
Yosarian2: Cobblerfone (L-6)
Cobblerfone: Rhinox (L-6)

votingfailure: TheOtherFiction

Not Voting: Primate, kondi2424, princesskdw, MaxMontag, crypto

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline is now permanent in post 4.

Thanks to SirBastion for the correction. If you find another mistake please tell me.

[Sir Bastion]

there are two primates?

[crypto]

Vote: Yosarian2.

[crypto]

Man. That vote felt good.

Like, really good.

I've wanted the chance to do that for a long time.

[Sir Bastion]

@Bastion: You! but I did mentally place your join date as April instead of August (and even from that miscounted, hence the "4 months or WHATEVER" but yeah, you. I was supposing you might be breaking site rules just because of your newness to the game. (Which is like a meta defense of a real accusation, but I digress to avoid some sort of circular logic).

Ahh ok (how did I miss this post earlier?) To answer your question, I've always scanned posters activity outside the game so far (in a total of 3 games before this one) and I've never hidden that I've done so, but this is the first game that I've been told its against the rules (including a newbie game where I did it quite a bit initially.)

So far a lot of null reads the only one I have a tiny suspicions on are cobblerstone and Rhinox. Not enough for a vote (I like to see if what Yossarian says about primate is true first so will keep that pressure unless something tempts me otherways) So instead I have questions for both of you instead.

Cobblerstone for the reason rhinox laid out but like I already stated I dont think its a big read. Its just this game is still fresh and no one has done anything really scummy, so we look to things that out of the ordinary (hence naturally I've been pulled up on a few things by others). Really there's nothing more to it then like me he is a nail sticking up at the moment. Hence no vote.

But here's a question!!! You've told us who you like! But who is the closest to a scum read for you at the moment?


Speaking of unusual, about rhinox, its a tad wifomy. People make gut town/scum calls all the time, cobbler made one on me and rhinox seems to be pushing really hard for a wagon to form over it. Yes what Cobblerstone did was the most out of ordinary thing and one may think to put pressure on him to see how he reacts, but the crime vs the chase seems a bit dogged. Other people have said things in this thread but Rhinox has touched none of it and has tunnelled on cobblerstone. Its too early for tunnelling IMO.

So my question to you is obvious! Will you tell us your opinion on some other players that have posted?

BTW: Hi Crypto!

[crypto]

It's page 2. Stop spouting walls of text.

[Yosarian2]

Question for all; would you rather lynch a wolf or a mafia today?

I think I'd rather get rid of the werewolf nk first. I also think that it's more easy to catch mafia when there are a lot of them because they interact more.

Eh. If we just go after people in one scumgroup or the other for the first few days (say, if we lynch a warewolf, town, then another warewolf) we risk basically giving the game to the mafia. Ideally we want to winnow down both scum groups, rather then just wiping one of them out, if we can; lynching a warewolf today and a mafia tomorrow, or vice versa, would be ideal.

[Rhinox]

Speaking of unusual, about rhinox, its a tad wifomy. People make gut town/scum calls all the time, cobbler made one on me and rhinox seems to be pushing really hard for a wagon to form over it. Yes what Cobblerstone did was the most out of ordinary thing and one may think to put pressure on him to see how he reacts, but the crime vs the chase seems a bit dogged. Other people have said things in this thread but Rhinox has touched none of it and has tunnelled on cobblerstone. Its too early for tunnelling IMO.

So my question to you is obvious! Will you tell us your opinion on some other players that have posted?

If I wanted your answer to my questions I would have asked you and not cobbler.

What would you like my opinion on? Players are players getting into the game and some haven't even posted yet. If I haven't given an opinion on specific players or events its because I either don't have an opinion yet, or other opinions are more important for me to pursue.

[Sir Bastion]

If I wanted your answer to my questions I would have asked you and not cobbler.

I wasn't answering your question, I was making my observations and reads as the game currently stands.

[Rhinox]

If I wanted your answer to my questions I would have asked you and not cobbler.

I wasn't answering your question, I was making my observations and reads as the game currently stands.

Well I don't agree with your observations. cobbler didn't make a gut read, he made a read based on your attitude of wanting to progress the thread (his words). Then he said you might be scum for what was essentially the same reason he called you town - the backpedaling occurred after I started pressuring him. He's dodged my questions and been short with me in his responses which comes across as not wanting to bring too much attention on the issues I'm raising, or at least that he's uncomfortable being pressured and wants me to just go away.

I'm also not tunneling. I don't even think its possible to be tunneled already in the short time the thread's been open.

[Cobblerfone]

So... you're saying only town would express eagerness in moving the thread along?

Also, you're giving him town points for his eagerness to move the thread along, in the same post where you basically say his questions are doing nothing to move the thread along?

Eagerness =/= actually did.

That was my point. Do you think eagerness alone is enough for a town read?

You also didn't answer the first question.

For an early read, yes. As for the first question, town would, and scum might try to fake it since they have the other team to worry about. The mafia have to worry about the wolfkill and the wolves have to worry about the mafia voting block so being out and in the open would tend to be disadvantageous.

If I wanted your answer to my questions I would have asked you and not cobbler.

I wasn't answering your question, I was making my observations and reads as the game currently stands.

Well I don't agree with your observations. cobbler didn't make a gut read, he made a read based on your attitude of wanting to progress the thread (his words). Then he said you might be scum for what was essentially the same reason he called you town

Not really. The eagerness to move the thread in any way possible seemed town. The continuing of questions about ongoing games after it was said that people wouldn't be able to fully answer them seemed scummy.

[TheOtherFiction]

Maybe cobbler, but you didn't really flesh that out much.

[StefanB]

Since Kondi has not confirmed, there will be a replacement. Good news is I may already have it, stay tuned.

[Rhinox]

hmm... well I'm still not entirely saitisfied with cobbler but there is another thing I've noticed.

IIOA, IIOA, Random Vote?, IIOA.

Noticing this pattern here with Yos. Its still early and I can give a pass on the first 3 because collectively they're basically your first post and you were answering distinct questions, but the last 1 is starting to raise some red flags for me. Too much talk about theory*.

*And kinda irrelevant theory at that - especially early on, there's not going to be a way to discern which faction the scummy people we lynch will be, short of a claim. Even if its the ideal scenario, there's no way to plan to do that, we can just lynch scummy people and hope for the best, really. We're not going to get bogged down in trying to figure out which faction the ppl we want to lynch are on D1 and D2 and get into a situation where we're not lynching someone who's scum because they're the wrong faction, for example. Maybe if we get to the D3 situation you suggested where we've lynched werewolf, town, and on D3 there's a seer result on the other werewolf then we have to start thinking about factions, but thats a lot of hypothetical 'ifs' that have to happen first.

[StefanB]

Save hello to havingfitz who replaces kondi2424. Big thank you!