Mini 1414: Mafia and Werewolves - Game Over

[JacobSavage]

Wait no it's not we have 5 not 4 ...

[JacobSavage]

@Mod shouldn't it be 3 to lynch...

[the director]

Yeah it should be three to lynch.

[rapidcanyon]

It is 3 to lynch. My mistake, I had cut and pasted the previous table but forgot to change the number to lynch. Fixed now.

[YOLO]

So Director, this catch-up post with thoughts you promised. I don't see it. Well, it's not like I really care.

Vote: The Director

I'm delighted I survived so I can lynch The Director myself.

Just to make sure there are no misunderstandings, I am going to post the case against The Director again.

Revenus - Town is notorious for being limp-wristed when it comes time to hammer, so that is why I have to do it. You really think any of these ...men?... have the stones to hammer? Good god if people like me didn't exist scum would win by simply running out the deadline every game.

This post is where we first meet the dark side of The Director. Director tells us he's going to be hammer happy, setting up for his quickhammers later in the game.

@ AJ - The wagon and votes that was parked on your slot served its purpose. Glad to see that when the empty shell of your slot finally came alive it would bother it so much.

You spent most of your post talking about how bad the play was by Rev but then at the last minute you talk yourself into voting Hiraki.

Not that I wouldn't hammer Hiraki without question, the guy is without a doubt scum

, but it doesn't look good for you.

Director is hammer happy. Director thinks Hiraki is without a doubt scum. This can only lead to the conclusion that Hiraki will be hammered on sight...

intent

... but it doesn't happen. As we know by know, Director hammered Viomi on sight. He hammered Josh Lyman, who he barely talked about at all, on sight. But he doesn't hammer 'without a doubt scum' Hiraki.

As we now know, Hiraki was a Werewolf Goon. There is a very logical reason as to why Director hesitated to hammer Hiraki: Director and Hiraki were scumbuddies. And being just two in numbers, Director didn't want to hammer his buddy on sight.

In order to make up for this contradiction to his earlier statements, we get this post when Navarre is brought to L-1:

Having said that, I think we're ready to end the day. What I find very surprising though is that the player that has been so adamant about hammering has hesitated to do so not once, but twice.

I want to hammer right now, but I'd rather give Navarre a chance to claim. Director, I suggest you wait for his claim too. Anyone who hammers before Navarre has a chance to claim should be under extreme suspicion tomorrow.

I'm going to be honest, I really haven't been giving Navarre much attention, just have noticed a lot of people don't like him on some level and that he really doesn't contribute much. I'm ISOing him right now, and if I get a strong scum read from him, I am going to hammer tonight.

Director doesn't hammer Navarre either. How can this be explained? Well, we know that Director didn't lie about being hammer happy, he hammered Josh and Viomi after all. However, if he would hammer everyone except Hiraki, this would be way too obvious a connection in case one of them were to die. So Director doesn't hammer the person after Hiraki either, and that happens to be Navarre.
Notice that Director will only hammer if his ISO makes him think Navarre is strong scum.

Fast forward to Day 2.

While you do that, place a vote on Josh, will you? He needs to deliver some more info, regardless of whatever else is going on, and three votes apparently doesn't suffice to convince him of that. L-2 might help.

After reading Josh's ISO the best I can boil him down is to:

> dayvig reactionfish
> jumps on Hikari and Navarre wagons when they were hot
> prod skipping / prod dodging
> votes Mae with weak reasoning

I admit he could be in the scum realm based off of this.

Compare Navarre and Josh. Both were ignored by Director for the most part. Director said he would hammer Navarre if his ISO said 'strong scum'. On Josh's ISO, Director 'admits he could be in the sculm realm', which is very vague, but at least indicates Director doesn't have a strong scum read on Josh. But what happens?

VOTE: Josh Lyman

You lost the game of chicken.

Director hammers. Without any reason. Just like he said he would do at the beginning of the game.

VOTE: viomi

I've wanted to do that ever since D1.

And again, Director hammers without delay.

Director is being Director.

It's not a bad strategy, really. By making the impression that he was hammer happy by nature, Director would be able to excuse his scummy quickhammers during the game. At the same time, he would be able to dodge nightkills from the mafia team, since it's unlikely the mafia team would want to get rid of a player that is quickhammering anybody. However, he tripped when his scumbuddy was first in line to be quickhammered.

The Director / Hiraki - Werewolf team

[the director]

YOLO your reasoning circles around me not wanting to hammer Hiraki. When I said I was going to quickhammer Hiraki, he was under serious heat at the time. Why would I say I was going to quickhammer my scum buddy only to back out at the last minute? It doesn't make any sense.

I'm still looking through the remaining 4 players. Still leaning towards Revenus being the last goon, I really thought it was Mae but she just flipped town.

[YOLO]

YOLO your reasoning circles around me not wanting to hammer Hiraki. When I said I was going to quickhammer Hiraki, he was under serious heat at the time. Why would I say I was going to quickhammer my scum buddy only to back out at the last minute? It doesn't make any sense.

As long as you wouldn't hammer Hiraki, there would be a chance someone else would garner suspicion and Hiraki's wagon would fall apart. This isn't strange at all, especially if you consider Hiraki was at L-1 for a nonsense reason ('This game has stalled' from JacobSavage).
This is exactly what happened. Your actions make perfect sense.

[Revenus]

im still game for a the director lynch

vote the director

normally im against quickhammers but in this case i think it'd be poetic

[the director]

normally im against quickhammers but in this case i think it'd be poetic

Certainly would be. If anyone actually does it, good luck in lylo.

VOTE: YOLO

[Revenus]

why did u call me the last scum then vote yolo

[the director]

Because his case on me seems opportunistic. The base of what he has posted is from D1, meaning he has had all this time to bring it to light but instead saves it for now. Not only that, his argument doesn't make any logical sense. I was pushing for people to put Hiraki at L-1 and then said I was going to quickhammer, but then backed out. If I was scum that wouldn't make any sense.

Taking both of those thoughts into consideration, the case and the vote seem manufactured, which put him above you in scumminess.

[Revenus]

Are you serious?

If you were Hiraki's scumpartner it'd make perfect snse that you wouldn't quickhammer him. Furthermore, my recollection of d1 has you pushing for my death up until Hiraki was's wagon had gained a ton more steam.

Yolo's case makes perfect sense to me. Also, Hiraki got shot night 1, so any connections between him and his partner obviously end there; your defense that he is only using d1 is weak as fuck.

[JasonWazza]

Intent to hammer director

Also had there been 2 kills (i was keeping this out of the game because of the WIFOMing shit this involved) i would have basically thought that the mafia team had 3 people on it because of Viomi's fighting at there being only one scum team, thank fuck that didn't happen.

[the director]

I'm VT, I disagree with both Revenus and Hiraki. For what it is worth.

[Revenus]

you disagree with Hiraki? What?

[JasonWazza]

VOTE: Director

Just too many links there to be ignored, i made the case a few days ago i'm pretty sure and it's pretty much stock standard the same as it is now, you have been anti-town on top of the scummy behaviour and we definitely need you gone before tomorrow

Also i think it was good that we had a short day phase so that scum has less info on who to shoot

[the director]

Err I meant YOLO. Not that it matters anymore, good luck in lylo folks.

[rapidcanyon]

VOTE COUNT 4.1

JacobSavage

- 0/3 ()

JasonWazza

- 0/3 ()

YOLO

- 1/3 (the director)

the director - 3/3 (YOLO, Revenus, JasonWazza)

Revenus

- 0/3 ()

Not Voting (1)

: JacobSavage

the director - Vanilla Townie

has been lynched Day 4.

It is now Night 4.

Deadline

: February 20th, 7:30PM, PST.

Night 4 ends in (expired on 2013-02-20 19:30:00)

Please submit Night Actions.

[rapidcanyon]

Dead during Night 4:

Revenus - Vanilla Townie

[rapidcanyon]

VOTE COUNT 5.0

JacobSavage

- 0/2 ()

JasonWazza

- 0/2 ()

YOLO

- 0/2 ()

Not Voting (3)

: JacobSavage, JasonWazza, YOLO

Deadline

: March 5th, 9:30AM, PST.

Day 5 ends in (expired on 2013-03-05 09:30:00)

[YOLO]

Massive derp. I guess that serves me right for being so full of myself.

Anyway, first thoughts are that it's unlikely JacobSavage is the last werewolf. This is because of the following post:

Well this game has stalled...

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Hiraki

That's L-1 folks.
@Hiraki, who do you think is scum and.why. What do you think of the directors hammer threat on someone (possibly Revens? )

Normally I don't want to delve into WIFOM, but I can't really see Jacob putting his buddy at L-1 for such a shit reason.
But that would mean JasonWazza is not town, which I find hard to grasp because Jason has been very towny in my opinion.

So... I guess this asks for a reread and ISO's. I'll post my findings in a few hours.

[YOLO]

Actually i wouldn't mind bringing TheDirector's intent back into play.

UNVOTE: JacobSavage
VOTE: Hiraki

L-1

Jason also put Hiraki at L-1 for no good reason. He's even calling out to Director.

Scratch those L-1 theories then.

[JacobSavage]

Well fuck.

VOTE: Revenus

[YOLO]

Ok, I'm ready.

Neither ISO gets me any substantial tells. JacobSavage has barely any content and JasonWazza seems town.
So that's why I'm approaching things from a different angle. Why am I alive? I've contributed a lot, made cases and have been part of the only scumlynch in the game. If I'm alive at 3-player lylo, there must be something I'm doing fundamentally wrong because scum doesn't consider me a threat. For that matter, why is JasonWazza alive? With the Town Doctor and the other scum team gone, why is the universally liked JasonWazza still alive? Why did Meanara die, a player that wasn't considered that townie at all?
I am of the opinion that nightkills should not be ignored. Because it is WIFOM territory, it is something that every player should analyze for themselves. I am posting above thoughts to give insight on how I've come to my decision.

However, I have found one tell that doesn't have to do with nightkills.

VOTE: Director

Just too many links there to be ignored, i made the case a few days ago i'm pretty sure and it's pretty much stock standard the same as it is now, you have been anti-town on top of the scummy behaviour

and we definitely need you gone before tomorrow

Also i think it was good that we had a short day phase so that scum has less info on who to shoot

Jason, in this post where you hammer Director, you talk about how we definitely need Director gone before tomorrow. Lynching Director quickly is good because it gives scum less information.
However, we already had three dead scum. I was under the impression that with lynching Director-scum, the game would be over. However, you talk about Director's lynch with your mind already set on tomorrow.

How did you know there would be another day?

The only way you would know there was going to be another day is if you knew Director wouldn't flip scum. And the only way you would know that is if you were the scum.

Vote: JasonWazza

Yes, I'm putting my vote down right away. This game is all I could think off for the past two hours and I want it out of my head. I have the choice between super towny player and super lurker who just voted someone that is already dead. If I'm wrong, I'm going to kick myself forever. But I've analyzed the situation carefully and this is what I've decided.

*crosses fingers*

[JasonWazza]

Ok, I'm ready.

Neither ISO gets me any substantial tells. JacobSavage has barely any content and JasonWazza seems town.
So that's why I'm approaching things from a different angle. Why am I alive? I've contributed a lot, made cases and have been part of the only scumlynch in the game. If I'm alive at 3-player lylo, there must be something I'm doing fundamentally wrong because scum doesn't consider me a threat. For that matter, why is JasonWazza alive? With the Town Doctor and the other scum team gone, why is the universally liked JasonWazza still alive? Why did Meanara die, a player that wasn't considered that townie at all?
I am of the opinion that nightkills should not be ignored. Because it is WIFOM territory, it is something that every player should analyze for themselves. I am posting above thoughts to give insight on how I've come to my decision.

However, I have found one tell that doesn't have to do with nightkills.

VOTE: Director

Just too many links there to be ignored, i made the case a few days ago i'm pretty sure and it's pretty much stock standard the same as it is now, you have been anti-town on top of the scummy behaviour

and we definitely need you gone before tomorrow

Also i think it was good that we had a short day phase so that scum has less info on who to shoot

Jason, in this post where you hammer Director, you talk about how we definitely need Director gone before tomorrow. Lynching Director quickly is good because it gives scum less information.
However, we already had three dead scum. I was under the impression that with lynching Director-scum, the game would be over. However, you talk about Director's lynch with your mind already set on tomorrow.

How did you know there would be another day?

The only way you would know there was going to be another day is if you knew Director wouldn't flip scum. And the only way you would know that is if you were the scum.

Vote: JasonWazza

Yes, I'm putting my vote down right away. This game is all I could think off for the past two hours and I want it out of my head. I have the choice between super towny player and super lurker who just voted someone that is already dead. If I'm wrong, I'm going to kick myself forever. But I've analyzed the situation carefully and this is what I've decided.

*crosses fingers*

Yay scum found without even trying, knew scum would leave me alive and try that uber early if i did that, JS be a smart boy and don't vote the guy who is dead vote this guy which is scum

VOTE: YOLO

a) Why would i address the vote on the basis that he is scum?

If that were the case he would be scum and the game would be over so it is a waste of breath doing so.

b) If that is seriously the only tell you can find how are you not going for the lurker who has contributed nothing over the person who has actted pro-town most of the game?

That's just poor reasoning

Longer secondary wall coming