[M] Newbie 1440: Maestro's Manic Mafia - DAY 3

[theslimer3]

Slimer your persistence with lecturing Naio is rather filling the thread with fluff. He is town and you are not. Having now read TAM vs Scot, Scot you are probably Town. TAM is doing exactly as Slimer is doing focusing on Naio at the expense of everything else,


Naio is town, noob town who is learning the game, he is 150% TOWN.

How exactly is proving my point filling this game? If anything you two are tag teaming me trying to lessen my argument, which once I defend, you're using against me so weakly.

HOWEVER, you've let go the 1 reason you had for voting me in the first place, so you have no reasons left, yet i'm still your target.

Slimer you had the chance to sit back and let me use you as bait, but obviously my cryptic hint was missed, that or, as you became uber defensive, you are in fact scum. Based on my observations and your reactions, tied to other reactions I am very much convinced you are scum and either Scot or TAM are probably your surviving buddy.

Yes, and as other people have pointed out, you keep refusing to defend yourself or talk about your actions. even in your post, yet again, it's either calling someone else's accusation crappy, or slinging an accusation at someone else for something they said.

that being said - when we break down your defense, its essentially "yeah i know i look scummy but it's just to let me see the scum" - that's pretty weak, in my opinion.

in my opinion, i'm your target because i'm talking out against you the most.

you haven't rescinded your vote and are still actively trying to find reasons to accuse me. none of what you are saying makes any one coherent string of thoughts or motivation.

I agree that Scot is town because of his interactions with TAM
and I clearly disagree with your opinion of me being mafia, but I'm leaning a more town read on Naio. But not enough to stop my pursuit. The fact that he's trying to get me off his tail so childishly makes me want to pursue harder.

[Smudger]

TAM if it was not a player of your experience making that last post I would have gone ape on it, but I am not going to as you have only confirmed my suspicions. He has not claimed Town, I have claimed him Town.

[Smudger]

Slimer your persistence in not seeing the wood for the trees is laughable, in fact, no its actually a sad indictment on your attempts to coerce the rest of the players in this game away from what is happening here and leaves only one simple fact you are scum and now it is clear that TAM is.

Both you and TAM are experienced players and yet you are deliberately ignoring what I have said from the beginning of D2 with regards to what I know and why I know it. If you had been town both of you, or at least one of you, the one who was town, would have steered us away from this and seen what was being said. But no, you both continue to play dumb, and even with Tams removal of his vote on Naio he continues to walk blindly down the road by asking why I believe Naio's claim?!

I would like to ask you Slimer why your pinion on Naio is now shifting? IO is shifting,as is TAMs, is it the fact that the easy lynch candidate that you and TAM had begun to set up is no longer such.

Naio does not have to defend himself to anyone.

Naio, you are town I can confirm you are town, you do not have to continue to explain yourself to Slimer or TAM at this point.

Lynch today is Slimer, tomorrow it is TAM.

[Smudger]

shoot that should read

"I would like to ask you Slimer why your opinion on Naio is now shifting? as is TAMs, is it the fact that the easy lynch candidate that you and TAM had begun to set up is no longer such."

[theslimer3]

shoot that should read

"I would like to ask you Slimer why your opinion on Naio is now shifting? as is TAMs, is it the fact that the easy lynch candidate that you and TAM had begun to set up is no longer such."

Because he's a newbie. You're not. If you're town, you'll be the first person i've ever black listed.

VOTE: smudger

I'm not talking to you.
Naio may speak for you if you need to ask anything else.

[Atlasblade]

Hmm give me a bit. I'll read and come back with my thoughts for the time being.

[Naio]

Naio may speak for you if you need to ask anything else.

This is stupid and unhelpful. even if you are town (which i highly doubt at this point), you are actively hurting town, which is extremely worthy of a lynch.

i already voted for you i'm just posting it again to make myself feel better

VOTE: thesmiler3

[Peabody]

Hey guys, quick prod dodge. I should be able to post this weekend.

[The Acting Method]

TAM if it was not a player of your experience making that last post I would have gone ape on it, but I am not going to as you have only confirmed my suspicions. He has not claimed Town, I have claimed him Town.

I know. You have claimed him town. No where have I said Naio has claimed himself town. Did you read my last post at all? Let me bold for you a few key points.

Smudger, I was making sure Naio was saying what he was trying to say. Seeing as my chief scumspect is dead I need to check up on my reads and see if anything new has formed.

And

Smudger, You did read what I said about the n00b player who made what seemed to be a n00b mistake and managed to use that to win the game as scum?

So forgive me

if I take a bit of time to be sure it's a mistake and not something more sinister.

Though to be completely fair I once played a dethy with someone unfamiliar with dethy. He claimed random cop on the second day which I called him out for.

He managed to pull a win through stupidity. Stupidity of the other cop. He did not deserve that win.

So Smudger, when I tell you all of this.

Does this make you more wary of

your Naio is town claim?

I actually find your surety very alarming personally.

Mainly because as I have said, I have seen "n00b" scum make mistakes.
Hell half of my Naio push has been clearing up exactly what his second "Mistake" he was thinking of was.

He has responded in a town way so I will agree.

Just keep in mind that

I have made it quite clear why I'm not one to take an "Oh it's just a n00b town mistake" thing.

Let me explain to you each of the bolded.
First, I asked you "Did you read what I said about the game I played in which a n00b player managed to fool town into thinking he was town by making a "newb town" mistake?" You made that assertion, not he. This was addressed to you.
Second, I explain exactly why I didn't instantly say "Oh he's newb town. Confirmed town." like what you did. (I will quote it if you challenge me on that point.) Instead I voted and made sure that I wasn't being tricked.
And finally, after pointing out all of the reasons I was wary of the "newb town mistake" I conclude by asking you if you are still a hundred percent positive that he is practically confirmed town. In fact I even state (and I've underlined this) that YOU are the one claiming Naio is town. Also note the below, in particular what I said before I unvoted.

2) that you actually see the role of the person that dies

as i said in my original post, i'm used to live-action mafia, not forum, it's much different rules.

to answer your question from post 235, what i said in post 232 was that i didnt realize that you get this:

aphix has been Killed Night 1. They were a

Vanilla Townie

.

when someone dies. i didnt see that when i wrote my post about the possibility of aphix being a tracker/cop.

i dont know what you mean by "flipped" i'm guessing it means showing the role when someone dies? in that case, i didnt know that anyone was ever "flipped"

are we all on the same page now?

Thank you for confirming that you misspoke in 232 and meant to say that you didn't realize you got a flip (yes flip means revealing the players role) in Forum Mafia.

It actually clears up that post a lot. There are some games that won't show you the alignment. But you would never see that in a n00b game. Mainly because that is considered a bastard mechanic. (I'm actually surprised that the real life mafia you have watched doesn't do that either.)

I should really stop being lazy and look over aphix to see who is scum.

And Peabody, I can provide you with meta of me speculating why I was still alive the next day (and providing a detailed analysis of the reasoning) where I was town. Not sure if I have evidence of me doing that as scum. But apparently my IC style makes me very good at WIFOM. Mainly because I teach and play the game similtaniously so often I end up making posts that give both sides of an argument. (I can think of at least one town game where I did this for sure...) Is it WIFOM? Yes but it's also something that should be discussed as it may provide hints as to why aphix was killed. Something which I will probably analyzing in greater detail soon. Looking in particular at his reads. It's not as important as reading splash/mollie for scum cues, but something I think bares looking into. Especially if something can combine with the splash/mollie interaction hints.

Also
UNVOTE: Naio

I feel satisfied with his explanation.

And now will be looking at Aphix's reads and then Mollie/Splash's interactions.[/quote]
Look at the bolded, The whole problem I had was with what he was saying and how he was saying it. When he finally manages to put it to rights and explain what he meant to say, I thank him for admitting to misspeaking and proceed to give a bit of a lesson about mechanics. Which is part of my job.

I then unvote him because I am satisfied with the response he has given me. I'm not someone who backs off of scumreads easily or if I feel strongly about a read. And I never change my vote without saying something about my line of thought. Now you're beginning to look bad, and the only thing that's making me not want to vote you as it would be all too easy for scum to have killed aphix to frame you. Probably not what I would have done but scum might have.

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to read up on Mollie/Splash and Aphix.

[The Acting Method]

EBWODP: Ugh... coding mishaps.

so read through. Unless clever bussing was going on, Splash/mollie and Atlas and Smudger and Splash/mollie and Slimer and splash/mollie are probably not scumbuddies. But that seems wrong to me.

Also don't like smudger's lining up lynches. It's really bad. and I would probably lean him or slimer for my vote personally.

[Smudger]

shoot that should read

"I would like to ask you Slimer why your opinion on Naio is now shifting? as is TAMs, is it the fact that the easy lynch candidate that you and TAM had begun to set up is no longer such."

Because he's a newbie. You're not. If you're town, you'll be the first person i've ever black listed.

VOTE: smudger

I'm not talking to you.
Naio may speak for you if you need to ask anything else.

there is a very strong reason why I know he is town, do you have any idea how dumb you are looking right now?

and nice childish attitude


TAM what? it does not matter what you say or how you care to bold it it is irrelevant, based on what I know.

[theslimer3]

Done.

[The Acting Method]

shoot that should read

"I would like to ask you Slimer why your opinion on Naio is now shifting? as is TAMs, is it the fact that the easy lynch candidate that you and TAM had begun to set up is no longer such."

Because he's a newbie. You're not. If you're town, you'll be the first person i've ever black listed.

VOTE: smudger

I'm not talking to you.
Naio may speak for you if you need to ask anything else.

there is a very strong reason why I know he is town, do you have any idea how dumb you are looking right now?

and nice childish attitude


TAM what? it does not matter what you say or how you care to bold it it is irrelevant, based on what I know.

smudger, seeing as I do not know what you supposedly know. (Which by the way, you do NOT look good saying that you "KNOW" Naio is town.) Can you agree that with the evidence that I have shown you, it is logical that someone might be wary of such action as what he said. Do you have any idea of how scummy you're making yourself seem by what you are saying?

In case you haven't noticed only two people (maybe a third) put up votes for Naio, Of those two, one when Naio defended themself made an effort to make sure he was understanding the defense.

Show me how saying that you "know" Naio is town is pro-town. It is day two. Assuming that you "know" he is pro-town for the reason I think you are saying that, how is you saying that helpful to town? Because there are only two ways to know for certain Naio's alignment without a flip from him/her. And the way you're going about it doesn't fill me with confidence that you, yourself is town. As it is, you are one of my suspects after reading through a little. Unfortunately Splash/Mollie did a very good job of hiding who their partner was from me.

[scotpgot]

LOL. Should we divide the thread in half? Put a white line down the middle? Who owns the tv, because one side needs to be covered up in cardboard.

Meanwhile, I don't get a scum-read on either one. Even though this little feud is way more distraction than we need.

TAM, as the vet, who's your leading scum-read as of right now?

[theslimer3]

LOL. Should we divide the thread in half? Put a white line down the middle? Who owns the tv, because one side needs to be covered up in cardboard.

Meanwhile, I don't get a scum-read on either one. Even though this little feud is way more distraction than we need.

TAM, as the vet, who's your leading scum-read as of right now?

The head vet by 15 days, might I add. >.>


@aphix are you still alive?

[The Acting Method]

@ Scot. Right now, I'm really fucking confused. The nightkill of Aphix makes no sense to me unless Smudger did it.

However I can't really see Smudger and Splash/mollie as scumbuddies.

The other two options are Slimer and Atlas.

Of these we know very little about Atlas and again, Slimer and Splash/Mollie seem unlikely scum buddies.

Naio and Peabody look pretty town to me. (Especially now that Naio has cleared up the whole misunderstanding issue.) You seem like a possibility I shouldn't rule out as well.

Smudger in particular I'm having a hard time deciding if it's worth lynching him now or waiting for him to prove himself as town.

And Slimer, Aphix is confirmed to be dead by the mod. Why are you asking such a question in a n00b game?

I'll will happily accept a lynch of Slimer or Atlas, Smudger I wouldn't mind too much if I didn't have my own theories about his role.

[Smudger]

Sod this, I don't want to do this but I am going to:

I am the Cop and TAM and Slimer know that, they are trying to confuse the thread with this crap.

Naio was my investigation N1 because of his play prior to the lynch, I say as much in my opening post D2, he came back to me as Town.

so that means we are playing either against a mafia role blocker and there is a doc out there or we just have mafia goons to contend with, which is the way I am tending to go with this. Ask yourselves this. two experienced players are seeing what I am putting in the thread and know what I am saying and yet they continue to point FoS at Naio.

Your lynches are TAM and Slimer I am sure of it due to their play and the way they are trying to manipulate this thread.

When we go to lynch I expect to die tonight as they know who I am this is why I am claiming now. you then have a good idea who your targets are, should I actually live then I can give you a report on anyone you care to choose.

[Peabody]

I mean look at what your first post is. It was that you're keeping up with your read on me, yet all evidence moving you to thinking i'm scum is coming directly from.the end of the day and the beginning of this one. It's an entirely new logic point, especially the way you're presenting it.

Annnd your point here?

So does the Aphix murder on its own tell us anything?

This is too wifomy to really know for sure. From what I can guess, either Aphix suspected an actual scum, he appeared to be a power role, someone is trying to frame someone else who Aphix suspected, or scum simply didn't want Aphix to make it to lylo. Any case based on the death is going to be weak.

Scot - What do you make of the quote you pointed out here? Do you think Splash is implying his scum partner is a newer player like himself?

TAM - It would be helpful to read some of those speculation posts you were talking about.



----------------

I knew Smudger was cop or tracker from the beginning of day 2 when he claimed Naio was town. I did not want to draw attention to it hence my unvote. TAM appeared as if he -knew- Smudger was cop because honestly, that whole 'Naio' clearing stuff up thing looked like TAM's fake reason to unvote Naio so he didn't have to reveal that Smudger was a power role.

I was apparently wrong about that assumption when TAM has Naio as a town read and Smudger as a possible scum read??????? I thought TAM's whole assumption on Naio's alignment was based on Smudger's clearing Naio. Not on the 'clearing up' reasons he gave.

I don't see how Naio even cleared up the question well enough. The real question was how Naio knew aphix was dead without seeing 'vanilla townie' NEXT to his name. But Naio never answered that. Which makes me again think TAM's unvote of Naio wasn't authentic.

VOTE: TheActingMethod

[Peabody]

I'm feeling really confident about this one now, the more I think about this.

[theslimer3]

You're still a dick, Smudger

[theslimer3]

And besides, who claims just to prove one person innocent? Especially when there's only one scum left. It's as though you're wifoming this or something.


But I suppose if you're lying, you'll be easily caught do to the grid matrix setup.

But still, the claim makes absolutely no sense just to share your results, even the soft claim.

[Peabody]

And besides, who claims just to prove one person innocent? Especially when there's only one scum left. It's as though you're wifoming this or something.


But I suppose if you're lying, you'll be easily caught do to the grid matrix setup.

But still, the claim makes absolutely no sense just to share your results, even the soft claim.

Hmm.

[Smudger]

You're still a dick, Smudger

good job you know I have one, as for you I could call you Shemale, maybe?

[Smudger]

And besides, who claims just to prove one person innocent? Especially when there's only one scum left. It's as though you're wifoming this or something.


But I suppose if you're lying, you'll be easily caught do to the grid matrix setup.

But still, the claim makes absolutely no sense just to share your results, even the soft claim.

you questioned my ability to play and yet you are supposedly an SE and did not apparently see the soft claim? in fact I crumbed my role back in D1, but hey so what you are scum.

Peabody why are you voting TAM over Slimer?

[Smudger]

But still, the claim makes absolutely no sense just to share your results,

no sense?, you were preparing a wagon on Naio, it made every sense to me,